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Is Eli Manning overrated?


Patriot Killa

Is Eli overrated?  

61 members have voted

  1. 1. Yes or No

    • Yes
      31
    • No
      30


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12 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Let's discuss some "top 10" yardage QBs.

Eli: 0 AP teams, selected to 2 PBs, never led in any major category other than ints(3x), only won PO games in 2 seasons, player of the week just 4 times, never received a single league MVP vote.

He passed John elway in top 10 so that means he's better, right?

Elway: 3 AP teams, selected to 9 PBs, has led in completions and yards, won PO games in 6 seasons, pow 15 times, 1987 NFL MVP, 1990s all decade team 1st team

 

See the difference btw an all time great and a compiler?

 

Nobody is arguing if John Elway is overrated. However, you discrediting everything Eli does proves he is in fact, underrated.

It's like you're doing my work for me.  

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8 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

The other great QBs have led in major categories, made many more pro bowl teams, made all pro teams, won more awards and have demonstrated great play on a consistent basis.  

He's a compiler, nothing more

Yep, you do a good job attacking me but unfortunately you struggle countering my arguments

You've been proven factually incorrect on countless occasions.  Your attempts to ignore facts don't make them magically disappear.  It is actually you that you have not provided one single shred of evidence that actually supports the idea that Eli is overrated.  There have been multiple arguments saying otherwise, which you have responded to without actually disputing a single point made in Eli's favor.  Rather, you've relied on ranting about something that could happen 6+ years from now, using that as the sole basis for assigning your own fabricated opinions to everyone else today, which you then still fail to dispute while declaring victory.  Meanwhile, if you would apply the same backwards logic to Eli that you do to another that shall not be named, you'd have him ranked as the greatest of all time.

You never actually present arguments.  Quite literally never.  What you present are a stream of excuses for why your predetermined opinions lack any factual support.  It is the only thing you contribute to the discussion.

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1 minute ago, JiF said:

Nobody is arguing if John Elway is overrated. However, you discrediting everything Eli does proves he is in fact, underrated.

It's like you're doing my work for me.  

Yeah, let's follow that logic.  The masses think Elway was better than Eli, and the stats suggest Elway was better than Eli.  Junk's conclusion?  This obviously proves that stats don't count and Eli is overrated.  Got it?

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2 minutes ago, JiF said:

Nobody is arguing if John Elway is overrated. However, you discrediting everything Eli does proves he is in fact, underrated.

It's like you're doing my work for me.  

In properly rate him, he's incredible overrated. The fact that people act like he's a lock HOFer proves that.

1 minute ago, Bleedin Green said:

You've been proven factually incorrect on countless occasions.  Your attempts to ignore facts don't make them magically disappear.  It is actually you that you have not provided one single shred of evidence that actually supports the idea that Eli is overrated.  There have been multiple arguments saying otherwise, which you have responded to without actually disputing a single point made in Eli's favor.  Rather, you've relied on ranting about something that could happen 6+ years from now, using that as the sole basis for assigning your own fabricated opinions to everyone else today, which you then still fail to dispute while declaring victory.  Meanwhile, if you would apply the same backwards logic to Eli that you do to another that shall not be named, you'd have him ranked as the greatest of all time.

You never actually present arguments.  Quite literally never.  What you present are a stream of excuses for why your predetermined opinions lack any factual support.  It is the only thing you contribute to the discussion.

It's not my fault you struggle with reading comprehension. Nowhere has anything been proven against what I have written but please keep bashing me, you do an excellent job countering my points ?

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1 minute ago, pointman said:

How can Eli be overrated if just about anyone that didn't dawn the blue and gray get up says he is mid tier? Guy won 2 super bowls as a mid tier level QB. 

The problem is many, including Jet fans, say he is a Hall of famer.

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4 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

The fact that people act like he's a lock HOFer proves that.

He's one of 5 players in the history of the world to be a two time super bowl MVP. Regardless of what you, me, or the pigeon on the street thinks about the validity of his accomplishments or failures, he's 100% a lock for the HoF.

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10 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

In properly rate him, he's incredible overrated. The fact that people act like he's a lock HOFer proves that.

It's not my fault you struggle with reading comprehension. Nowhere has anything been proven against what I have written but please keep bashing me, you do an excellent job countering my points ?

But, he is a lock for the HOF.  The fact you think he isnt, shows how he's underrated. 

You're basically the beacon of Eli being underrated. 

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Just now, nyjunc said:

In properly rate him, he's incredible overrated. The fact that people act like he's a lock HOFer proves that.

It's not my fault you struggle with reading comprehension. Nowhere has anything been proven against what I have written but please keep bashing me, you do an excellent job countering my points ?

Actually, it happens in your very own posts.  You do as good of a job proving yourself wrong than anyone.  It's quite the skill you have.

Your claim is that although no one regards Eli as even one of today's top QBs, never mind an all-time great, he is overrated based solely on the fabricated opinions you are assigning to others.

Your entire proclamation is dependent on the following line of thinking:  You guess that in 6+ years from now, a group of 50 or so people will decide to have Eli recognized among a group of literally hundreds of former NFL players.  You then proceed to draw conclusions of the opinions of those 50 people in this imaginary land of yours (that he is considered a GOAT, despite no evidence to suggest any person currently holds such an opinion).  You then go back in time and assign this opinion to everyone but yourself, proclaiming victory based on the opinion that you have assigned to others being "wrong", simply because you say so.

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

With a 10-0 lead in title game his D gave up 23 pts in final qtr and a half.  Eli never had a year like Vinny 98. It's not his fault his teammates didn't show up and he had a classic belichick big game defense

Even Vinny himself would tell you Eli was a better qb

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53 minutes ago, JiF said:

But, he is a lock for the HOF.  The fact you think he isnt, shows how he's underrated. 

You're basically the beacon of Eli being underrated. 

Eli is the Derek Jeter of the nfl.  He has the rings he just doesn’t have the consistently great regular season stats.  People either over or underrate him depending on agenda

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3 hours ago, nyjunc said:

They were better because they had better QBs. Philly's D didn't play anywhere near by as well in their SB run as NYGs D's did.

The Giants defense was much better in postseason, our rbs and ol were comparable to those Giants teams but jet fans love to overrate them.

Eli played well in those runs and his D was great throughout. Sanchez played well in his runs and his D was great until title games where they folded. Switch the QBs and the team results stay the same

No, no one is overrating the jets running game and defense.  They lead the NFL.  It's you that tries to convince people that it's meaningless, forget the No 1 standings, we weren't as good as you say.  Sanchez didn't p,as well in the Jets run, you overrate him.  You actually believe he won the SD game with his 100 yards passing.  

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3 hours ago, nyjunc said:

Neither does Dan Marino, Brett favre, Jim Kelly, Johnny Unitas, Peyton Manning, etc...  

 

Eli is a modern a day Jim plunkett who did less in his SB runs than plunkett

 

Peyton has two rings.  

Now the really stupid part, Unitas won 3 NFL Championships and a SB.  

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4 hours ago, nyjunc said:

I love you guys that attack me rather than the topic at hand. None of you guys can't present a decent argument or counter what I write. You just attack me.

I love that you throw something out there, everyone, to a man disagrees and you insist you're 100% right, we're re all stupid jets fans who are dead wrong.  

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17 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

He's one of 5 players in the history of the world to be a two time super bowl MVP. Regardless of what you, me, or the pigeon on the street thinks about the validity of his accomplishments or failures, he's 100% a lock for the HoF.

That's a one game award and he didn't deserve either one.  Let's compare just SBs w/ the other 2 time(or more) SB MVPs:

Just in the SB years where they were named MVPs.

Bart Starr:

21-6-1 reg record, 78% win %

led O to 30.5 PPG

 

Terry Bradshaw:

26-6, 81%

led O to 33 PPG

 

Joe Montana:

42-6, 88%

led O to 39.7 PPG

 

Tom Brady:

51-13, 80%

26.8 PPG

 

Eli Manning:

19-13, 59%

led o to 18 PPG

 

 

One of these guys doesn't belong w/ the others.  B/c he got 2 undeserved MVP awards for ONE game each time does not make him a HOFer.  The HOf is earned by playing great consistently over time.

 

 

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17 hours ago, JiF said:

But, he is a lock for the HOF.  The fact you think he isnt, shows how he's underrated. 

You're basically the beacon of Eli being underrated. 

this is exactly why he is overrated.

17 hours ago, Bleedin Green said:

Actually, it happens in your very own posts.  You do as good of a job proving yourself wrong than anyone.  It's quite the skill you have.

Your claim is that although no one regards Eli as even one of today's top QBs, never mind an all-time great, he is overrated based solely on the fabricated opinions you are assigning to others.

Your entire proclamation is dependent on the following line of thinking:  You guess that in 6+ years from now, a group of 50 or so people will decide to have Eli recognized among a group of literally hundreds of former NFL players.  You then proceed to draw conclusions of the opinions of those 50 people in this imaginary land of yours (that he is considered a GOAT, despite no evidence to suggest any person currently holds such an opinion).  You then go back in time and assign this opinion to everyone but yourself, proclaiming victory based on the opinion that you have assigned to others being "wrong", simply because you say so.

once again attacking me rather than the argument.  you really are good at this.

16 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Even Vinny himself would tell you Eli was a better qb

No, no he wouldn't.

14 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

No, no one is overrating the jets running game and defense.  They lead the NFL.  It's you that tries to convince people that it's meaningless, forget the No 1 standings, we weren't as good as you say.  Sanchez didn't p,as well in the Jets run, you overrate him.  You actually believe he won the SD game with his 100 yards passing.  

They were #1 in yards in 2009 which included 2 300 yd games against awful run Ds to skew #s.  Our run game was good, it was not great.  In the playoffs our run game was about one run the first 2 rds then when that RB left the title game w/ an injury we didn't even have those one runs. 

The D was really good in 2009 but blew a double digit lead in the championship game and blew late leads 3 times during the reg season.

I rate him properly.  I never said he was great, never called him a top QB but he was vital to those runs including the SD game.  I have always said we made both title games b/c of the D first that doesn't mean Mark wasn't a major contributor.

14 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

 

Peyton has two rings.  

Now the really stupid part, Unitas won 3 NFL Championships and a SB.  

Yeah except he wrote 2 SB rings AND MVP Trophies(trophIES means more than 1, show me more than one for those players and I'll concede the point). 

14 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I love that you throw something out there, everyone, to a man disagrees and you insist you're 100% right, we're re all stupid jets fans who are dead wrong.  

I love that none of you can prove anything and all you do is hurl insults.  If I am so easily proven wrong then please do it.  I love to learn new things.

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16 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Eli is the Derek Jeter of the nfl.  He has the rings he just doesn’t have the consistently great regular season stats.  People either over or underrate him depending on agenda

Derek is an absolute lock for the HOF, Derek Jeter was consistently one of the best players in the league the majority of his career. Derek Jeter was a consistent postseason performer, Derek won awards for more than just one game(ROY, GGs, Silver sluggers).  Derek was a 14 time AS, was there almost every year.  he wasn't selected to just 2 and then became an injury replacement like Eli. He led in major categories(WAR, runs, hits, SBs, ...) while the only major category Eli led in was INts(3x).  the equivalent for that would be errors for Jeter and he was only in top 10 2x in his career and never led. 8 times Jeter was in the top 10 in league MVP voting, 4 times in the top 5.  Eli Manning never received a single league MGVP vote.

 

There is literally no comparison btw the 2, you can think Jeter is overrated but he's still an all time great.  Eli is nowhere near an all time great. You know who Eli would be as a baseball player?  Not Jeter but Scott Brosius. Brosius was a solid player, won a WS MVP award, was an all star though he also won a gold glove which Eli never won any award but if there is a comparison to a baseball player that would be it.

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43 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

That's a one game award and he didn't deserve either one.  Let's compare just SBs w/ the other 2 time(or more) SB MVPs:

Just in the SB years where they were named MVPs.

Bart Starr:

21-6-1 reg record, 78% win %

led O to 30.5 PPG

 

Terry Bradshaw:

26-6, 81%

led O to 33 PPG

 

Joe Montana:

42-6, 88%

led O to 39.7 PPG

 

Tom Brady:

51-13, 80%

26.8 PPG

 

Eli Manning:

19-13, 59%

led o to 18 PPG

 

 

One of these guys doesn't belong w/ the others.  B/c he got 2 undeserved MVP awards for ONE game each time does not make him a HOFer.  The HOf is earned by playing great consistently over time.

 

 

You’re not understanding. No one gives a sh*t whether anyone on a message board thinks he deserves it. Terry Bradshaw is a mook who rode the steel curtain to 4 rings. Guess what? He’s in the hall.

No matter how much time and energy you waste on these boards posting the same nonsense over and over (which btw, is mostly tl;dr for everyone), you will never convince the people that matter (the voters) that a 2 time SBMVP is not a lock for the hall, because you can’t luck your way into that.

There’s a reason Eli is one of only 5 guys in the history of the world to have earned that accolade. He’s a lock for the hall the second he calls it quits, and no amount of Brady/Sanchez/Dungy loving, Peyton/Eli/Favre/Montana/Belichick bashing unc fanboy message board spewing is going to change that. 

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29 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

You’re not understanding. No one gives a sh*t whether anyone on a message board thinks he deserves it. Terry Bradshaw is a mook who rode the steel curtain to 4 rings. Guess what? He’s in the hall.

No matter how much time and energy you waste on these boards posting the same nonsense over and over (which btw, is mostly tl;dr for everyone), you will never convince the people that matter (the voters) that a 2 time SBMVP is not a lock for the hall, because you can’t luck your way into that.

There’s a reason Eli is one of only 5 guys in the history of the world to have earned that accolade. He’s a lock for the hall the second he calls it quits, and no amount of Brady/Sanchez/Dungy loving, Peyton/Eli/Favre/Montana/Belichick bashing unc fanboy message board spewing is going to change that. 

You don't understand that I don't care what others think of my opinions. I post them, back them up with facts and people can decide on their own whether they agree.

 

That may be true about Bradshaw but he was a league mvp, 2nd team all 70s, a 1st team all pro, led in TDs twice, won a SB where his D allowed 31 pts.  All things Eli has never done.

There is a reason Eli is one of 5 guys with multiple SB MVPs: his DEFENSE.  When you only have to score 17 & 19 and make 1-2 plays a game it's a lot easier to win.  He did not it in tebow style.

I continue to wait for adult responses attacking my argument rather than just attacking me. You know what that tells me? You can't do it.

 

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4 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

You don't understand that I don't care what others think of my opinions. I post them, back them up with facts and people can decide on their own whether they agree.

 

That may be true about Bradshaw but he was a league mvp, 2nd team all 70s, a 1st team all pro, led in TDs twice, won a SB where his D allowed 31 pts.  All things Eli has never done.

There is a reason Eli is one of 5 guys with multiple SB MVPs: his DEFENSE.  When you only have to score 17 & 19 and make 1-2 plays a game it's a lot easier to win.  He did not it in tebow style.

I continue to wait for adult responses attacking my argument rather than just attacking me. You know what that tells me? You can't do it.

 

tl;dr

Eli is a lock for the HoF. Whether you agree or disagree on his merits are of no consequence. I’m done here.

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

this is exactly why he is overrated.

once again attacking me rather than the argument.  you really are good at this.

No, no he wouldn't.

They were #1 in yards in 2009 which included 2 300 yd games against awful run Ds to skew #s.  Our run game was good, it was not great.  In the playoffs our run game was about one run the first 2 rds then when that RB left the title game w/ an injury we didn't even have those one runs. 

The D was really good in 2009 but blew a double digit lead in the championship game and blew late leads 3 times during the reg season.

I rate him properly.  I never said he was great, never called him a top QB but he was vital to those runs including the SD game.  I have always said we made both title games b/c of the D first that doesn't mean Mark wasn't a major contributor.

Yeah except he wrote 2 SB rings AND MVP Trophies(trophIES means more than 1, show me more than one for those players and I'll concede the point). 

I love that none of you can prove anything and all you do is hurl insults.  If I am so easily proven wrong then please do it.  I love to learn new things.

So the jets didn't have the leagues number 1 running game because they had 2 300 yard games that year?  This is your excuse for knocking the number 1 running team down a few notches?  this is your logic?  

Peyton won 5 league MVPs and 2 SBs.  Unitas 3 NFL championships, a SB and 3 MVP.  Argue all you want.  

Everyone proves you wrong.  You just ignore the argument you set and spin in a different direction.  

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15 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Maybe.  And yes, he is on the decline.  But give me an overrated guy who will win me two Superbowls anytime.  I'll sign up for that.  And beat Brady twice?  I'll take it.

Yeah but Eli doesn't deserve credit for 2 SB wins, he did nothing.  Sanchez on the other hand, with 100 yards passing in SD was VITAL.  

See the difference?  

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37 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

So the jets didn't have the leagues number 1 running game because they had 2 300 yard games that year?  This is your excuse for knocking the number 1 running team down a few notches?  this is your logic?  

Peyton won 5 league MVPs and 2 SBs.  Unitas 3 NFL championships, a SB and 3 MVP.  Argue all you want.  

Everyone proves you wrong.  You just ignore the argument you set and spin in a different direction.  

You can look at blind numbers all you want.

 

AGAIN, the other poster mentioned QBs that won TWO super bowls AND TWO super bowl MVPs.  Please try to keep up

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34 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Maybe.  And yes, he is on the decline.  But give me an overrated guy who will win me two Superbowls anytime.  I'll sign up for that.  And beat Brady twice?  I'll take it.

He didn't win the Giants 2 SBs, he helped them win but without GREAT defense they don't have either of those SB apps or wins.

16 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Yeah but Eli doesn't deserve credit for 2 SB wins, he did nothing.  Sanchez on the other hand, with 100 yards passing in SD was VITAL.  

See the difference?  

I realize reading comprehension isn't a strength of yours but I have always credited Eli for playing well in both SB runs. The problem is 2 good/very good months of football doesn't overcome the overall mediocrity of his career and this is a QB that has NEVER won a playoff game when his D allowed more than 20 pts and only has playoff wins in those 2 postseasons.  True greatness ?

 

So when Mark had almost 300 yds the next week at Indy I guess you were saying how great he was?  You should watch more football.

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48 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

You can look at blind numbers all you want.

 

AGAIN, the other poster mentioned QBs that won TWO super bowls AND TWO super bowl MVPs.  Please try to keep up

No one mentioned SB MVPs.  Are you saying that a one game MVP award is more impressive or important than a MVP season? 

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49 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

He didn't win the Giants 2 SBs, he helped them win but without GREAT defense they don't have either of those SB apps or wins.

I realize reading comprehension isn't a strength of yours but I have always credited Eli for playing well in both SB runs. The problem is 2 good/very good months of football doesn't overcome the overall mediocrity of his career and this is a QB that has NEVER won a playoff game when his D allowed more than 20 pts and only has playoff wins in those 2 postseasons.  True greatness ?

 

So when Mark had almost 300 yds the next week at Indy I guess you were saying how great he was?  You should watch more football.

You're going to have the nerve to talk about reading comprehension?  You started this whole thing with Eli wound because of D/STs.  You did.  You continue to pull asinine numbers out of your ass like how many wins he has when the D allows more than 20 points.  But it's a reading comprehension issue when someone takes that as he did nothing to win games.  

A typical, a$$hole nyjunc circle jerk argument.  

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52 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

No one mentioned SB MVPs.  Are you saying that a one game MVP award is more impressive or important than a MVP season? 

You may want to go back and read the post I quoted.

48 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

You're going to have the nerve to talk about reading comprehension?  You started this whole thing with Eli wound because of D/STs.  You did.  You continue to pull asinine numbers out of your ass like how many wins he has when the D allows more than 20 points.  But it's a reading comprehension issue when someone takes that as he did nothing to win games.  

A typical, a$$hole nyjunc circle jerk argument.  

Eli would not have won without great D/STs, that doesn't mean Eli didn't contribute. He absolutely did and I have always given him credit. I just give him proper credit, I don't say Eli was the reason. Eli helped them win but the main reason they won was because of great D.

Asinine numbers that also happen to be correct. What does it say about a QB that he can only win when he is supported by great defense? Does that sound like a great, HOF type QB?

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56 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

You're going to have the nerve to talk about reading comprehension?  You started this whole thing with Eli wound because of D/STs.  You did.  You continue to pull asinine numbers out of your ass like how many wins he has when the D allows more than 20 points.  But it's a reading comprehension issue when someone takes that as he did nothing to win games.  

A typical, a$$hole nyjunc circle jerk argument.  

Do you realize you are verbally sparring with a spambot?

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