Boy, am I glad we didn't sign Cousins.

[Bruce Harper]

Think about it: 

On the one hand,

we would have had a slightly better than average QB, approaching 30, with a ceiling of being somewhere in the top 10 to 15 QBs in the league.  Also, 30 mil per year towards the salary cap for at least three years. 

Versus,

20 year old stud, signed at modest expense for five years.  Potential top 5 guy, who has had his best performances in huge games.  Likely to be with us for 10 to 15 years. 

Sure, we would have gotten someone good at 6 and we could have used those second rounders but, long term, we are extremely fortunate that things worked out the way they did.

 

 

[RutgersJetFan]

I mean we basically almost got stuck with Tina Turner at quarterback but instead we got Jesus Christ himself.

[CrazyCarl40]

I like Sam Darnold a lot. I think he has a chance to be the answer the franchise has been looking for. But if the choice is Sam Darnold vs. Kirk Cousins, Quenton Nelson, and two second round picks (edge rusher? running back?) then the choice is pretty clear. Especially when you consider they could have taken someone like Lauletta in the later rounds too. 

[Bruce Harper]

5 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I like Sam Darnold a lot. I think he has a chance to be the answer the franchise has been looking for. But if the choice is Sam Darnold vs. Kirk Cousins, Quenton Nelson, and two second round picks (edge rusher? running back?) then the choice is pretty clear. Especially when you consider they could have taken someone like Lauletta in the later rounds too. 

How many edge rushers do you get in the second?  Lauletta in the later rounds has a less than 5% chance of succeeding as a QB.  If Darnold ends up being just a solid starter then you are probably right.  But if he winds up being really good, it's a no-brainer, IMHO.

[Beerfish]

27 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I mean we basically almost got stuck with Tina Turner at quarterback but instead we got Jesus Christ himself.

I hope Tina did not break out in 'We don't need another hero' when Christ walked in....or Darnold for that matter.

[The Crusher]

27 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I mean we basically almost got stuck with Tina Turner at quarterback but instead we got Jesus Christ himself.

I would have used Ike there but ok.

[Ex-Rex]

40 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Think about it: 

On the one hand,

we would have had a slightly better than average QB, approaching 30, with a ceiling of being somewhere in the top 10 to 15 QBs in the league.  Also, 30 mil per year towards the salary cap for at least three years. 

Versus,

20 year old stud, signed at modest expense for five years.  Potential top 5 guy, who has had his best performances in huge games.  Likely to be with us for 10 to 15 years. 

Sure, we would have gotten someone good at 6 and we could have used those second rounders but, long term, we are extremely fortunate that things worked out the way they did.

 

 

And just watch Todd Bowles screw it all up. If Bowles gets his way - with Bridgewater declared healthy now - Darnold will not see the field at all this season. Bowles is all about playing the guy "who gives us the best chance to win." and that is not a rookie who needs playing time right away. If that happens I think Bowles is shown the door even if the Jets go 8-8.

[Bruce Harper]

1 minute ago, Ex-Rex said:

And just watch Todd Bowles screw it all up. If Bowles gets his way - with Bridgewater declared healthy now - Darnold will not see the field at all this season. Bowles is all about playing the guy "who gives us the best chance to win." and that is not a rookie who needs playing time right away. If that happens I think Bowles is shown the door even if the Jets go 8-8.

I'm inclined to agree, but there is no parallel in the past four years to look at.  Petty and Hack were nowhere near as good as Darnold.  He didn't necessarily not play those guys because they were young, but more likely because he had a good look at them and made the determination that they sucked.  I like to think that if Darnold is good enough that if he shows he's ready he will get to play.

[Warfish]

48 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Think about it: 

On the one hand,

we would have had a slightly better than average QB, approaching 30, with a ceiling of being somewhere in the top 10 to 15 QBs in the league.  Also, 30 mil per year towards the salary cap for at least three years. 

Versus,

20 year old stud, signed at modest expense for five years.  Potential top 5 guy, who has had his best performances in huge games.  Likely to be with us for 10 to 15 years. 

Sure, we would have gotten someone good at 6 and we could have used those second rounders but, long term, we are extremely fortunate that things worked out the way they did.

Well.....it'll sure be great if Sam Darnold can produce similar production to that expected/typical of Kirk Cousins.

To be specific, Darnold would have to produce approx. 4,200 Yards passing, 27 TD's vs 12 INT's and at least 8 wins per season to be approx. equal in production to Cousins.

If we get that from Darnold, I think we'll all agree and be very happy.

With that said, Darnold has yet to take a single snap, we don't know when, or what, we will get from him.  We all hope for the best, of course.

Perhaps it's a bit early to be proclaiming Darnold a "Franchise QB" as many here have already started doing as if it were a settled documented fact, or to presume he will be a Top 10 QB before he's even attended his first rookie camp as an NFL player? 

[Bruce Harper]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Well.....it'll sure be great if Sam Darnold can produce similar production to that expected/typical of Kirk Cousins.

To be specific, Darnold would have to produce approx. 4,200 Yards passing, 27 TD's vs 12 INT's and at least 8 wins per season to be approx. equal in production to Cousins.

If we get that from Darnold, I think we'll all agree and be very happy.

With that said, Darnold has yet to take a single snap, we don't know when, or what, we will get from him.  We all hope for the best, of course.

Perhaps it's a bit early to be proclaiming Darnold a "Franchise QB" as many here have already started doing, or to presume he will be a Top 10 QB before he's even attended his first rookie camp as an NFL player? 

[RutgersJetFan]

19 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

I hope Tina did not break out in 'We don't need another hero' when Christ walked in....or Darnold for that matter.

 

19 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

I would have used Ike there but ok.

And where would we even be without Big Mac? Rollin’ down the river, that’s where we’d be. But instead we’re beyond Thunderdome.

[Kleckineau]

Trust me I am happy with having Darnold here. He should develop nicely if coached well and the o-line improves but OP you are selling Cousins short. He is very good, a top tier talent in his prime. Vikes will be tough to beat with him. 

[NYs Stepchild]

50 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I mean we basically almost got stuck with Tina Turner at quarterback but instead we got Jesus Christ himself.

Almost got Madonna but instead got Rihanna 

[Philc1]

Darnold > Cousins

[Jetsplayer21]

43 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I like Sam Darnold a lot. I think he has a chance to be the answer the franchise has been looking for. But if the choice is Sam Darnold vs. Kirk Cousins, Quenton Nelson, and two second round picks (edge rusher? running back?) then the choice is pretty clear. Especially when you consider they could have taken someone like Lauletta in the later rounds too. 

There is no way mac would have taken Nelson. I wish he had but he does not value OL at all to consider Nelson. Maybe they get Chubb, or they take next best defender. Mac has been horrible with post 1st round picks which makes me feel a little better on what we gave up. 

[nj meadowlands]

I wanted Cousins, because a bird in the hand beats two in the bush.  But drafting a QB (especially one like Darnold) was always the optimal outcome.

[JohnnyLV]

42 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I like Sam Darnold a lot. I think he has a chance to be the answer the franchise has been looking for. But if the choice is Sam Darnold vs. Kirk Cousins, Quenton Nelson, and two second round picks (edge rusher? running back?) then the choice is pretty clear. Especially when you consider they could have taken someone like Lauletta in the later rounds too. 

The choice is abundantly clear. You draft Darnold. How can anyone not see that this is the best thing to happen to the Jets in like, I dont know almost forever. Darnold's floor is close to what Cousins is now and he is a decade younger, plus costs less over the next five years than Cousins for 1 which means we have tons of cap space to selectively fill the "gap" we had by missing out on 2 2nd rounders. Some fans always wanting to try and win now with no thought of the future.

[Jetsplayer21]

7 minutes ago, NYs Stepchild said:

Almost got Madonna but instead got Rihanna 

Rihanna is already 100x hotter than Madonna ever was though.. lol

[Warfish]

17 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

Being a realist will always be better than being a utopian dreamer with ones heads int he proverbial clouds mate.

[Warfish]

3 minutes ago, nj meadowlands said:

I wanted Cousins, because a bird in the hand beats two in the bush.  But drafting a QB (especially one like Darnold) was always the optimal outcome.

I too wanted Cousins, he was by far the best option for Winning a Super Bowl over the next 2-3 seasons.

With that said, drafting the mostly-consensus #1 QB of this draft class is a very good outcome, and one we all hope will pay dividends equal to the costs (a 1st and three 2nds) and finally give us the home-grown Franchise QB we all dream of.

[Bruce Harper]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Being a realist will always be better than being a utopian dreamer with ones heads int he proverbial clouds mate.

I'm just teasing.  I'm allowing myself to get carried away a little bit -- as is my habit.  

[slimjasi]

I was never a Cousins guy and am very happy we didn't make him the highest QB in the league. 

[Warfish]

2 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

I'm just teasing.  I'm allowing myself to get carried away a little bit -- as is my habit.  

I'm happy for everyone who is happy.  I'm happy too.

But as everyone here knows, I AM a dedicated cynic.

For today, we're as good as can be at QB.  I eagerly await till tomorrow.

[CrazyCarl40]

10 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

The choice is abundantly clear. You draft Darnold. How can anyone not see that this is the best thing to happen to the Jets in like, I dont know almost forever. Darnold's floor is close to what Cousins is now and he is a decade younger, plus costs less over the next five years than Cousins for 1 which means we have tons of cap space to selectively fill the "gap" we had by missing out on 2 2nd rounders. Some fans always wanting to try and win now with no thought of the future.

I hope you’re right. I really do. But I’m more of a fan of the devil you know vs the devil you don’t. And this team has so many holes, those extra picks would have come in handy moving forward and they’d have a chance at contending this year. 

[chirorob]

1 hour ago, Bruce Harper said:

Think about it: 

On the one hand,

we would have had a slightly better than average QB, approaching 30, with a ceiling of being somewhere in the top 10 to 15 QBs in the league.  Also, 30 mil per year towards the salary cap for at least three years. 

Versus,

20 year old stud, signed at modest expense for five years.  Potential top 5 guy, who has had his best performances in huge games.  Likely to be with us for 10 to 15 years. 

Sure, we would have gotten someone good at 6 and we could have used those second rounders but, long term, we are extremely fortunate that things worked out the way they did.

 

 

Not exactly.

We would have Cousins, Nelson the guard, maybe a stud young center and tight end/running back, and a second rounder for next year.  While Cousins would be very expensive for next year, the other 4 would be on much cheaper contracts.

I'm not being negative, but it's not Cousins or Darnold, it's Cousins + 4 other picks or Darnold.

[PepPep]

1 hour ago, Bruce Harper said:

Think about it: 

On the one hand,

we would have had a slightly better than average QB, approaching 30, with a ceiling of being somewhere in the top 10 to 15 QBs in the league.  Also, 30 mil per year towards the salary cap for at least three years. 

Versus,

20 year old stud, signed at modest expense for five years.  Potential top 5 guy, who has had his best performances in huge games.  Likely to be with us for 10 to 15 years. 

Sure, we would have gotten someone good at 6 and we could have used those second rounders but, long term, we are extremely fortunate that things worked out the way they did.

 

 

No, no, no. This is a completely skewed statement. We have no idea what Darnold will turn into, if anything. He could still be a complete bust.

I can just as easily phrase this as on the one hand we have a proven, veteran QB who can win now and threw for over 4,000 yards his last 3 seasons on a below average team. On the other hand, we have a top QB prospect we gave up an extra 3 second round picks for, who has proven nothing and may not be able to contribute at all this year. 

Also, likely to be with us for 10-15 years??? How do you know that?! 

The Jets wanted Cousins. They felt if they got Cousins, they would still have enough cap room to add key FAs and with the draft picks they had could surround him with young blue chip talent. Cousins turned them down. Credit Macc for immediately bringing in vet QBs to hold the fort, credit Macc for making a ballsy trade to move up to 3 and thank the football Gods that the consensus #1 QB prospect fell to the Jets. 

Jets got lucky that they got Darnold when Cousins decided to sign with the Vikes. Hopefully he turns into a HOFer and/or wins us a SB. That is all.     

[Bruce Harper]

2 minutes ago, PepPep said:

No, no, no. This is a completely skewed statement. We have no idea what Darnold will turn into, if anything. He could still be a complete bust.

I can just as easily phrase this as on the one hand we have a proven, veteran QB who can win now and threw for over 4,000 yards his last 3 seasons on a below average team. On the other hand, we have a top QB prospect we gave up an extra 3 second round picks for, who has proven nothing and may not be able to contribute at all this year. 

Also, likely to be with us for 10-15 years??? How do you know that?! 

The Jets wanted Cousins. They felt if they got Cousins, they would still have enough cap room to add key FAs and with the draft picks they had could surround him with young blue chip talent. Cousins turned them down. Credit Macc for immediately bringing in vet QBs to hold the fort, credit Macc for making a ballsy trade to move up to 3 and thank the football Gods that the consensus #1 QB prospect fell to the Jets. 

Jets got lucky that they got Darnold when Cousins decided to sign with the Vikes. Hopefully he turns into a HOFer and/or wins us a SB. That is all.     

Why don't we reassess in a couple of years.  There is no assurance that Cousins would have produced for us the way he did for Washington.  And he had a habit of losing against good teams.  I'm very optimistic about Darnold.

[freestater]

13 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Being a realist will always be better than being a utopian dreamer with ones heads int he proverbial clouds mate.

At first I was like, OoooOo. 

But then j remembered. You don't get bant for saying mate around here...?

[Bruce Harper]

5 minutes ago, chirorob said:

Not exactly.

We would have Cousins, Nelson the guard, maybe a stud young center and tight end/running back, and a second rounder for next year.  While Cousins would be very expensive for next year, the other 4 would be on much cheaper contracts.

I'm not being negative, but it's not Cousins or Darnold, it's Cousins + 4 other picks or Darnold.

I mentioned the picks.  And I don't think we can necessarily assume we would get any studs in the second round, as that goal has been elusive for us in the recent past.  I just think that a young franchise QB (which I think he is) is worth what we paid for him and then some.

[jetstream23]

Signing Cousins would have jumpstarted the Jets into contention, which would have been great.  No learning curve or bust risk and we'd have drafted some guys likes Quentin Nelson, Ronald Jones II and Harold Landry.  BUT there would be immediate expectations and a quickly closing 3-year window to win now.  The ceiling is higher with Darnold, the potential longevity is longer with Darnold.  I'm willing to wait the 1-2 years it takes for him to develop and let the Jets build around him. 

[Untouchable]

I was a big proponent of signing Cousins, but that was because we were picking at #6 and I was convinced that we would wind up with someone like Mayfield or Jackson if we didn’t get him.

Now that the football gods finally smiled down upon us for the first time in nearly 50 years and delivered Darnold, I agree.

Cousins will be a borderline Top 10 QB for another 3-4 years in my estimation. He’s a very good, efficient player at the most important position in team sports.

But Darnold has the talent and potential to be a Top 5-8 QB in the league for the next 15 years and will essentially be making peanuts for the first 4.

Obviously that wins out in the end

[joewilly12]

@SAR I  Even after we draft a franchise QB there is still Kirk Cousins threads.....

[Charlie Brown]

18 minutes ago, PepPep said:

No, no, no. This is a completely skewed statement. We have no idea what Darnold will turn into, if anything. He could still be a complete bust.

I can just as easily phrase this as on the one hand we have a proven, veteran QB who can win now and threw for over 4,000 yards his last 3 seasons on a below average team. On the other hand, we have a top QB prospect we gave up an extra 3 second round picks for, who has proven nothing and may not be able to contribute at all this year. 

Also, likely to be with us for 10-15 years??? How do you know that?! 

The Jets wanted Cousins. They felt if they got Cousins, they would still have enough cap room to add key FAs and with the draft picks they had could surround him with young blue chip talent. Cousins turned them down. Credit Macc for immediately bringing in vet QBs to hold the fort, credit Macc for making a ballsy trade to move up to 3 and thank the football Gods that the consensus #1 QB prospect fell to the Jets. 

Jets got lucky that they got Darnold when Cousins decided to sign with the Vikes. Hopefully he turns into a HOFer and/or wins us a SB. That is all.     

This is 100% correct.......THANK YOU!!!!!

Things are fine but for folks to argue somehow that the Jets would have sucked with Cousins is neither fair nor demonstrable. 

Lets Go Jets!!

[Snell41]

I'm inclined to agree, but there is no parallel in the past four years to look at.  Petty and Hack were nowhere near as good as Darnold.  He didn't necessarily not play those guys because they were young, but more likely because he had a good look at them and made the determination that they sucked.  I like to think that if Darnold is good enough that if he shows he's ready he will get to play.

Exactly. Everyone wants to blast Bowles for not starting young QB’s but no one wants to give credit and admit the young QB’s are downright awful. Bryce Petty has no business on an NFL field. The trade rumors were laughable. The only thing Petty has proved in his career is you sure as hell don’t want him as your #2, and he’s too old to really invest developing him as a 3. I give him less than a 50% chance of even being on a roster day one.

And as bad as Petty is, Hack is even worse. So Bowles hasn’t proven that he won’t play a young QB, he’s proven he won’t play a sh*tty young QB. In fact, we drafted 2 safeties last year and he plugged him as starters right away. Bowles background is on D and he’s shown no issue starting a rookie. In fact the only stubbornness I see are the fans unwilling to admit Bowles was right in not starting two guys that are an embarrassment On the field. If Darnold shows he’s ready, he’ll start day one. If he doesn’t he won’t, and there’s nothing wrong with that.


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[kelticwizard]

19 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

 But I’m more of a fan of the devil you know vs the devil you don’t. And this team has so many holes, those extra picks would have come in handy moving forward and they’d have a chance at contending this year. 

Let's face it-most good QBs in the league were taken with the team's #1 draft selection.  You run the risk of the kid busting, but putting your money on someone you believe in coming out of college is the way most teams succeed.