Jets minicamp - Day 1

[Jetster]

1 hour ago, NYJ37/12 said:

Haha, that was proven long before this thread.

How can that have been proven since we haven't had improvement from a young QB since Pennington & then he got hurt in a silly preseason game vs the Giants?

Sanchez never got better, Richard Todd never got better, Ken Obrien peaked early but kept holding the ball too long later in his career because his feet were like cement shoes. Jets fans can't recognize improvement at QB because we've NEVER SEEN IT! ?

[Jetster]

46 minutes ago, ChuckkieB said:

I don't think you can compare the Rodgers situation to this.  The rules of practice have changed over the years and now there are limits to the amount of practice time teams have, particularly for backup and 3rd string players.  In the modern NFL, the only way to truly develop is to play in real games.  Assuming he's ready, I think it's important for Darnold to get as many starts under his belt as he can this year when team expectations are not high. This way, he can can go through his growing pains with as little pressure as possible in 2018 so he can come out guns blazing in 2019. 

I love how people cite the Packers & Rogers as a window into what we should do with Darnold, lol. Sam Darnold has 39 year old journeyman Josh McCown in his way & a 25 year old Teddy Bridgewater whose injury was so gruesome teammates threw up & he almost lost his leg. Aaron Rogers had BRETT FAVRE in front of him, BRETT FAVRE!!! Be like a 17 year old pirate trying to take Blackbeards place. 

[Savage69]

3 minutes ago, Jetster said:

I love how people cite the Packers & Rogers as a window into what we should do with Darnold, lol. Sam Darnold has 39 year old journeyman Josh McCown in his way & a 25 year old Teddy Bridgewater whose injury was so gruesome teammates threw up & he almost lost his leg. Aaron Rogers had BRETT FAVRE in front of him, BRETT FAVRE!!! Be like a 17 year old pirate trying to take Blackbeards place. 

That's why Rogers didn't get the starting gig till his 4th year.. Steve Young had the same problem sitting behind Montana..

[Jetster]

12 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

That's why Rogers didn't get the starting gig till his 4th year.. Steve Young had the same problem sitting behind Montana..

Damn right. Even Brady sat behind Bledsoe who had all of the physical tools but lacked quick decision making BB likes, Belichick still waited until Mo Lewis crushed Drew before he made a change & still wavered a bit until Brady just soared.

[jgb]

4 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

If darnold is ready to start, there’s still no reason to trade bridgewater.  There are a lot of teams the past few years who have drafted qbs and wouldn’t play him over their new guy and there are a bunch of other teams with established starters, so barring injury there are only a handful of spots for bridgewater to be in a better position than the jets.  

Besides, the jets can always use bridgewater as the backup qb if darnold starts and keep mccown inactive but have him on the bench as a coach.  I know he’s being paid a lot of money, but that was done before the jets drafted darnold and before they signed bridgewater and had an opportunity to work him out and really test his knee.  And it’s also possible that in 2019 the jets can have darnold and bridgewater as their 2 qbs and mccown is purely a coach.  So i wouldn’t be in a rush to trade bridgewater unless there’s a desperate team with a bad injury which offers the jets a compelling offer.  As soon as the jets get a few decent qb options i don’t want to think we’re burning a hole in our pocket with them.

Look if Bridgewater outplays Darnold then you unload Darnold. We have been waiting too long for a franchise QB. That being said Macc is a guy who hung onto Hack 1.9 years too long when everyone else knew he was a nobody. So he would rather die with Darnold than fly with Bridgewater. Guy has some ego on him. 

We have no choice but to pray Darnold has the goods because Macc would cut Tom Brady to give Darnold a chance.

[CTJetsFan]

6 minutes ago, jgb said:

Look if Bridgewater outplays Darnold then you unload Darnold. We have been waiting too long for a franchise QB. That being said Macc is a guy who hung onto Hack 1.9 years too long when everyone else knew he was a nobody. So he would rather die with Darnold than fly with Bridgewater. Guy has some ego on him. 

We have no choice but to pray Darnold has the goods because Macc would cut Tom Brady to give Darnold a chance.

Say what????????

[Joe Jets fan]

4 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

If darnold is ready to start, there’s still no reason to trade bridgewater.  There are a lot of teams the past few years who have drafted qbs and wouldn’t play him over their new guy and there are a bunch of other teams with established starters, so barring injury there are only a handful of spots for bridgewater to be in a better position than the jets.  

Besides, the jets can always use bridgewater as the backup qb if darnold starts and keep mccown inactive but have him on the bench as a coach.  I know he’s being paid a lot of money, but that was done before the jets drafted darnold and before they signed bridgewater and had an opportunity to work him out and really test his knee.  And it’s also possible that in 2019 the jets can have darnold and bridgewater as their 2 qbs and mccown is purely a coach.  So i wouldn’t be in a rush to trade bridgewater unless there’s a desperate team with a bad injury which offers the jets a compelling offer.  As soon as the jets get a few decent qb options i don’t want to think we’re burning a hole in our pocket with them.

This is completely not true unless the Jets use the franchise tag in him.  There is zero change Teddy comes back next year to back up Darnold.  Zero. 

Saying anything else is just being blind to the truth.  You get the best pick you can and say good by.  

[jgb]

1 minute ago, CTJetsFan said:

Say what????????

Yep

[MaxAF]

I don’t get all  the talk of trading Terry for some unknown draft pick IF he is the best QB on the Jets. I doesn’t make ANY sense. Sam is still unproven and some want to crown him the Jets QB for the next 10 years. When was the last time a great QB came out of USC? Not saying he can’t be great but I’m not putting all my eggs in this 21 yr old’s basket yet. For a team starving for a QB star for a generation we MIGHT have one in TB, so what do we do... trade him??? Nonsensical! I’m not punch drunk on Sam Darnold yet. Not until he proves he can play and play great in the NFL. Not just looking good throwing the football around in shorts. So the Jets trade Terry for a second rounder. The Jets have a curse on 2nd round DP’s. Might as well trade TB for a Yugo.

USC QB’a that played in the NFL:

Mark Sanchez, Carson Palmer, Matt Leinart, Sean Salisbury, Rodney Peete, Pat Haden, Matt Cassel, Bill Nelsen, Pete Beathard, Vince Evans, Paul McDonald, Todd Marinovich, Rob Johnson AND John David Booty

[CTJetsFan]

5 minutes ago, jgb said:

Yep

I guess I'll just leave it as "I strongly disagree".

[BurnleyJet]

2 hours ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

Little children and big children want to take  the brand new car cross country. They don’t care about breaking it in, don’t care about hurting it,  they just want it now.. Darnold is going to be a very good qb, but he still needs work. If he was ready from the start I’d be surprised he would have fell to 3. He is a bit of a project, just turnded 21, doesn’t have a whole lot of college starts under him. Johnny boy guaranteed he will start from the beginning, I don’t see it. They will let McCown take the early hits with this O. And I do mean hits.. mid season we will see Sam. Hopefully we get a decent pick for teddy. We need picks  

 

[Jetster]

If the line can play just good enough & Sam has the innate skills to protect himself & the ball, I think he should start out of the gate. Brady has 2 years MAX unless the Texans, Jags, or Lions take him out early in the year. 

Who cares about 2018 overall record compared to getting Darnold the experience he needs, and the leadership skills in the huddle. The Division blows compared to previous years, the Bills are rebuilding, the Fins are starting an oft injured QB in Tannyhill, lost Suh & Landry. The Pats are still the Kings of the AFC east until someone knocks them off but we almost beat them with much worse QBs (Sanchez, Geno) playing as rookies, and the Patriots were a MUCH BETTER TEAM than they are now. Gronks 29 & has had 3 back surgeries, a blown ACL, their QB is 41 in August, Edelman is suspended the 1st 4 games (hopefully off the juice & earthly again), Hogan? slow. Mathews? slow. No Solder, Amendola, Lewis. 

If not now, when? He looks like the best QB out there already as far as physical talent, arm strength, movement skills. If Bates is such a genius put together an offense that follows some of the best minds in the game, some RPO stuff, some quick WCO stuff, some playaction on 1st down, bombs to Robby A to loosen the middle. Most NFL defenses are just not that good anymore, especially in the secondary & just a few teams have great pass rushers, Broncos, Jags, how many others? I think we could go 6-10 with Darnold, as we could with Josh, so why not get him going out of the gate. 

Its very rare that a young rookie QB has someone like Josh McCown to mentor him. Josh knows he's grooming Sam & probably himself for a coaching role when his career is over & Sam is entering an NFL with unprecedented protections put in regarding hitting the QB, Olines holding inside is ignored, defenders can barely touch offensive skill players downfield, the game is completely different now than its ever been. This guy could be deadly in 2/3 years. Why waste time?

[jgb]

12 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

I guess I'll just leave it as "I strongly disagree".

Been chasing waterfalls my entire life when it comes to QB. If I gotta chose, I take the guy who performs best. If it's Bridge, so be it. Macc's ego means nothing to me.

[CTJetsFan]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

Been chasing waterfalls my entire life when it comes to QB. If I gotta chose, I take the guy who performs best. If it's Bridge, so be it. Macc's ego means nothing to me.

I get that (keeping Bridgewater for 2018 and maybe beyond if he outplays Darnold this summer) but IMO in no way does that mean you give up on a 21 year old #3 pick before he ever sets foot on the field for you.

[jgb]

3 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

I get that (keeping Bridgewater for 2018 and maybe beyond if he outplays Darnold this summer) but IMO in no way does that mean you give up on a 21 year old #3 pick before he ever sets foot on the field for you.

I want to keep both. But if I can only keep one and Bridge is lighting it up, adios Darnold. Again, I want to keep Bridge even if Darnold starts. After years of garbage at QB, why not.

[HelenOfTroy]

If Sam even makes this a close competition, while making steady progress, you know the franchise is going to go with Sam.

this may sound stupid, but don't you think you folks should wait till after training camp to declare who the starter should be?

Don't know why the QB position turns reasonable men into overreacting, hyperbolic fanboys.  Same with my Trojan guys...

[Jetster]

33 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

Say what????????

LMAO! oh, those crazy Jet fans.

[CTJetsFan]

4 minutes ago, jgb said:

I want to keep both. But if I can only keep one and Bridge is lighting it up, adios Darnold. Again, I want to keep Bridge even if Darnold starts. After years of garbage at QB, why not.

I'm with you on wanting to keep both Darnold and Bridge for 2018 and beyond (hoping this is McCown's last year). I just can't think of any justification for giving up on Darnold that soon

[C Mart]

45 minutes ago, jgb said:

Look if Bridgewater outplays Darnold then you unload Darnold. We have been waiting too long for a franchise QB. That being said Macc is a guy who hung onto Hack 1.9 years too long when everyone else knew he was a nobody. So he would rather die with Darnold than fly with Bridgewater. Guy has some ego on him. 

We have no choice but to pray Darnold has the goods because Macc would cut Tom Brady to give Darnold a chance.

How much are you getting paid for writing  this? 

[redlichtie]

2 hours ago, ChuckkieB said:

I don't think you can compare the Rodgers situation to this.  The rules of practice have changed over the years and now there are limits to the amount of practice time teams have, particularly for backup and 3rd string players.  In the modern NFL, the only way to truly develop is to play in real games.  Assuming he's ready, I think it's important for Darnold to get as many starts under his belt as he can this year when team expectations are not high. This way, he can can go through his growing pains with as little pressure as possible in 2018 so he can come out guns blazing in 2019. 

That is a fair point well made. There is no question it’s a factor and your view holds water. I still think if anything that makes it just as important not to rush an undercooked rookie into action too soon. In my opinion it works both ways and we still see young QB’s start off well but then get somewhat found out after a couple of years. I’m of the view a year or 8-10 games at least before being handed the reins is still no impediment to progress if the talent is there but your view makes a lot of sense and definitely an alternate viewpoint to consider 

[ChuckkieB]

If I had to go all in long term, I'd go all in on the best QB prospect we've had in 40 years over a QB who is two years removed from playing NFL games due to a gruesome knee injury, regardless of how great Bridgewater might look in mini camp and the preseason.  In a best case scenario for the Jets, Bridgewater impresses enough to start a few games to open the season, does, well, and then is unloaded for a good draft pick in 2019.  This team has waited soooooo long for a young franchise QB like Darnold, but they would choose to go with Bridgewater long term over him?  NO WAY.  Not in a million years.  The likelihood is that Bridgewater doesn't take a regular season snap for this team, but impresses enough to be traded at some point this season. 

[The Crusher]

Unload Darnold what? Haha 

[BCJet]

55 minutes ago, jgb said:

I want to keep both. But if I can only keep one and Bridge is lighting it up, adios Darnold. Again, I want to keep Bridge even if Darnold starts. After years of garbage at QB, why not.

Ive been reading this site for a long time, going back to jetsinsider.com days and I can honestly say this is the most ridiculous take Ive ever read

Sam Darnold, the best QB prospect to come out in years, a guy who never should have been available at our pick and who, if he starts opening day, wil be the youngest starting QB in NFL history.....should be traded if Teddy Bridgewater, a good, but far from great player, has a good preseason and training camp.

Literally insane

[Jetster]

15 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Unload Darnold what? Haha 

Now I can understand how we forgave Macc for taking a 2nd round flyer on Christian, no big whoop considering we've drafted guys like Geno Smith, Devin Smith, Vlad Ducasse, Stephen Hill, Jace Amaro, Mike Nugent in the 2nd round but could you imagine his legacy of unloading Darnold for Bridgwater? LMFAO! 

OMG, just the thought of it makes me tremble. Then Sam goes on to have a Steve Young like career, lol. 

[IndianaJet]

Does anyone know if the media has access to watch on field activities for day 2?

[slats]

4 hours ago, redlichtie said:

Can’t agree with this, Aaron Rodgers sat for two years and it didn’t stop him developing. There’s no hard and fast or one size fits all route to development.

Put the best QB on the field, if that's Darnold then all well and good but Teddy has the trump card of actual pro game experience and has actually led a team to postseason, SD will have to be considerably better to have earned it over Bridgewater IMO

edit: being purely pragmatic it makes a ton of sense to talk up Teddy B as the starter too, all talk of how good he looks will just make him a more attractive proposition on the trade market...it’s win-win either way

Teddy is no Brett Favre. He's a guy who's played two seasons in the NFL and neither of them was as good, statistically, as the season Josh McCown just put up for the Jets. This is a guy who decided that the Jets, already having named McCown the starter and sure to be drafting a QB high in the first round, was his best opportunity. Sounds like a guy who didn't have many opportunities. @Philc1 is probably closest when he says the Jets won't trade Bridgewater because there might not be a market for him. 

I continue to be in favor of starting McCown for the first crappy month of the schedule, letting the zone blocking and new offense settle in, and then inserting Darnold. And that would be as the best QB. Darnold may not be the most polished or productive QB coming out of the gate, but I'm pretty confident that the fact that he has the most raw ability (and some polish and production, too) of anyone in that QB room. 

As for your pragmatic edit, the Jets aren't even pretending that Bridgewater is a part of the starter discussion. Darnold is getting the most reps and plenty with the starters. McCown is getting all of his reps with the starters and Bridgewater didn't get any seen by any reporter until yesterday. They're clearly planning to start McCown, and preparing Darnold to take over. 

28 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

I get that (keeping Bridgewater for 2018 and maybe beyond if he outplays Darnold this summer) but IMO in no way does that mean you give up on a 21 year old #3 pick before he ever sets foot on the field for you.

What kind of a contract are you going to entice Bridgewater to stay with the Jets after this season? Or are you just slapping him with the franchise tag? 

Bridgewater is here as an insurance policy against a McCown injury and/or a draft pick flop. If McCown stays healthy and Darnold looks viable, Bridgewater is trade bait. If the Jets can't move him, there's next to no chance he sticks with the team. He'll be looking for a starting opportunity, and the Jets won't have one for him. 

5 minutes ago, ChuckkieB said:

If I had to go all in long term, I'd go all in on the best QB prospect we've had in 40 years over a QB who is two years removed from playing NFL games due to a gruesome knee injury, regardless of how great Bridgewater might look in mini camp and the preseason.  In a best case scenario for the Jets, Bridgewater impresses enough to start a few games to open the season, does, well, and then is unloaded for a good draft pick in 2019.  This team has waited soooooo long for a young franchise QB like Darnold, but they would choose to go with Bridgewater long term over him?  NO WAY.  Not in a million years.  The likelihood is that Bridgewater doesn't take a regular season snap for this team, but impresses enough to be traded at some point this season. 

4

This is what they're doing. The odd Bridgewater fan club doesn't get that he was not in demand this past offseason, isn't a part of the starting conversation on the Jets, and really never did anything overly impressive before he got hurt. 

McCown and Darnold will be getting the early reps in the preseason. They'll both start between games one & three, with Darnold getting the bulk of the work with the starters overall, while Bridgewater gets cleanup duty and a lot (all?) of the work in game four. He's not a part of the Jets long-term plans, and the Jets aren't a part of his. Someone offers a decent pick -and McCown and Darnold are fine- Teddy's gone. 

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, Savage69 said:

That's why Rogers didn't get the starting gig till his 4th year.. Steve Young had the same problem sitting behind Montana..

Steve Young had 20 NFL starts and a season or two in the USFL before he even got to the 49ers.

There will be a bid difference in perception.  Rodgers was the 24th pick in the draft, selected to backup a sure HOF.  Brady was 199 a 6th round comp selected to backup a 28 year old former #1 overall that had been to the super bowl and led the NFL in passing yards.. The idea that they equate with #3 overall  sitting behind McCown and a guy who hasn't completed a pass in anger since January of 2016 is laughable.

It is a different world.  I can understand not rushing Darnold and that letting him start out as the backup and slowly working him in saves some mental pressure and lets you play him and sit him without acting like he lost the job, OTOH the idea he has to sit for years is insanity. The Pack had the balls to extend Rodgers after 7 starts - If the Jets do that with Darnold, that extension will cost $30M+ a season.  Are you prepared to do that?  I'm not. 

[#27TheDominator]

Bridgewater and McCarron are two guys that were not in demand. They both signed short deals.  If they prove to be starter material they will be looking for huge raises.  IF they don't, why discuss them?  

[CTJetsFan]

12 minutes ago, slats said:

Teddy is no Brett Favre. He's a guy who's played two seasons in the NFL and neither of them was as good, statistically, as the season Josh McCown just put up for the Jets. This is a guy who decided that the Jets, already having named McCown the starter and sure to be drafting a QB high in the first round, was his best opportunity. Sounds like a guy who didn't have many opportunities. @Philc1 is probably closest when he says the Jets won't trade Bridgewater because there might not be a market for him. 

I continue to be in favor of starting McCown for the first crappy month of the schedule, letting the zone blocking and new offense settle in, and then inserting Darnold. And that would be as the best QB. Darnold may not be the most polished or productive QB coming out of the gate, but I'm pretty confident that the fact that he has the most raw ability (and some polish and production, too) of anyone in that QB room. 

As for your pragmatic edit, the Jets aren't even pretending that Bridgewater is a part of the starter discussion. Darnold is getting the most reps and plenty with the starters. McCown is getting all of his reps with the starters and Bridgewater didn't get any seen by any reporter until yesterday. They're clearly planning to start McCown, and preparing Darnold to take over. 

What kind of a contract are you going to entice Bridgewater to stay with the Jets after this season? Or are you just slapping him with the franchise tag? 

Bridgewater is here as an insurance policy against a McCown injury and/or a draft pick flop. If McCown stays healthy and Darnold looks viable, Bridgewater is trade bait. If the Jets can't move him, there's next to no chance he sticks with the team. He'll be looking for a starting opportunity, and the Jets won't have one for him. 

This is what they're doing. The odd Bridgewater fan club doesn't get that he was not in demand this past offseason, isn't a part of the starting conversation on the Jets, and really never did anything overly impressive before he got hurt. 

McCown and Darnold will be getting the early reps in the preseason. They'll both start between games one & three, with Darnold getting the bulk of the work with the starters overall, while Bridgewater gets cleanup duty and a lot (all?) of the work in game four. He's not a part of the Jets long-term plans, and the Jets aren't a part of his. Someone offers a decent pick -and McCown and Darnold are fine- Teddy's gone. 

No, I think the franchise tag would be prohibitive unless, by some miracle, he started all year and took us to the playoffs. Assuming neither of those things happen, I would start by offering Teddy the same $ McCown got this year: $10 million per. Years/guarantees/signing bonus TBD based on 2108 performance

[Saul Goodman]

I LOVE that we as Jet fans can even have this debate. Which QB to keep or trade? Must be dreaming! 

[rammagen]

4 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

He can definitely play, how ironic we've not a young good QB for 50 years, and we have two at once

 

we have had some good young qbs but few and far in between, Richard Todd was not bad neither was O'Brien,  then Chad that is three that had good careers but god that position has been a void of talent for a long time

[Lith]

30 minutes ago, IndianaJet said:

Does anyone know if the media has access to watch on field activities for day 2?

Yes.  I am pretty sure all three sessions this week are open to media.

[Tony MaC]

Darnold is the future and will not be going anywhere unless he flames out big time. And let me tell ya even if he did something bad off the field or got hurt or just plain sucked he'd be given a long rope.

That said those who are completely dismissing Teddy's chances of starting confuse me. There's every chance he does, whether for a short time while the schedule is erratic (My ideal scenario) or hell even for the full season if he's got a hot enough hand. Darnold is the main focus but he's also very young and not going anywhere, he can wait a bit.

And if he didn't start? there's every possibility he stays as a backup for the year. This strikes me as a pretty good year to have three QB's anyway.

I'm not all that sure he'll be traded, for one we don't know that anybody will need him to start because of an injury, or going further that a team who does have an injured QB1 wouldn't be happy with their backups anyway. We just assume that we'll play the 2016 Eagles to somebody else's 2016 Vikings and trade an extra piece to a team that thinks of itself as a contender. There are a lot of variables where that doesn't happen.

[batman10023]

2 hours ago, jgb said:

Look if Bridgewater outplays Darnold then you unload Darnold. We have been waiting too long for a franchise QB. That being said Macc is a guy who hung onto Hack 1.9 years too long when everyone else knew he was a nobody. So he would rather die with Darnold than fly with Bridgewater. Guy has some ego on him. 

We have no choice but to pray Darnold has the goods because Macc would cut Tom Brady to give Darnold a chance.

given how solid Sam looks so far, could we get multiple first rounders for him?  maybe two firsts and two seconds.  we could rebuild our line with those 4 picks for the bridge. 

[j4jets]

23 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

I need a job that asks me to put on 25lbs and be paid millions!