Draft Elimination RND 1; L.I. LEPRECHAUN vs BigO

[BigO]

1 minute ago, nycdan said:

The secret to enjoying this is to try not to care too much.  Otherwise it will get frustrating.  

That’s not the point, caring or not caring. It’s about having fun and applying football knowledge. Hopefully it’s applied across the rounds. My votes will NOT be based on who’s bigger but who was more talented. 

[BigO]

4 minutes ago, nycdan said:

See that's where we see things differently.  Campbell in his first five or so years was better than any of those guys.  Just about as fast and so much stronger.  He ran through, over and around great players with equal ease and was as close to an unstoppable force as the game has seen outside of Jim Brown.  IF he lasted another 2-3 years at his early clip, he would have been compared to Brown as GOAT IMO. 

But he didn’t. I’d take Marcus Allen over Campbell because he had a longer more impacting career. I’d take Marcus over Emmitt Smith who IMO was totally overrated. Curtis Martin IMO was s better more versatile back. And if we’re going to look at just a few years, I’d take Bo in a heartbeat over anyone, even LT. 

[nycdan]

Not singling you out here at all, but I have never understood the myth of Bo Jackson as a great all-time RB.  He was a great all-time athlete and a very good RB but I wouldn't put him within sniffing distance of the top-10 all time, and really not even top-20.  Just my opinion but how do you take him over any of the other guys you mentioned (e.g. Dickerson, Barry)?  I saw him play.  I have no recollection of him being the second coming of Jim Brown but maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention?

[Edit:  To clarify, I don't doubt that if Bo played only Football he might have been a top-5 guy, but he didn't and I just don't think I can put a guy in the top based solely on what he *could* have done.  Those other guys all DID it at least for a few years, in some cases many more.]

 

[BigO]

1 hour ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Show me Thorpe's football stats... the decathalon is not pro football.

Thorpe, if you read football history, SAVED FOOTBALL. He was it’s ELITE star and became the NFL’s first President and ambassador. His statue is at the entrance in Canton’s Hall of Fame - not Earl Campbell not Jim Brown. Show me where Campbell played more than 1 sport. Bo did , Deion did, Thorpe played Football, baseball, basketball professionally AND destroyed the competition in the Olympics in SEVERAL events. No athlete has ever came close to being so versatile and dominant. He ran the 100 in 10 seconds in worn down shoes at the Olympics that didn’t even fit! He was 6’1  203 during an era that didn’t have the luxuries athletes are afforded today. I see him as an old skool version of Marcus Allen, fast, shifty, could run between the tackles and around the end. Questioning his greatness is ABSURD. 

[BigO]

9 hours ago, Paradis said:

and this is going to be a bit of trial here for next time or later rounds on what "looks neat and tidy"... 

If we had time, or if someone volunteered, the best case scenario is putting the Ds vs Os  (red vs green kind of thing)... you'd have two pics to post.

Ultimately we could input it into Madden and simulate the games - now that would be a hoot. 

[BigO]

3 hours ago, HessStation said:

Weird. I saw Big O’s team as stronger. Especially his DL and DB’s. Marino is the best QB of all time imo. I usually shuffle him, Manning and Elway around but this exercise made me realize if the teams are balanced and no coaching is involved I’m taking Marino first. Lep having Campbell made it close but O’s DL is the real deal. 

Insightful! You you you see exactly what I ventured to do. And, in a historical perspective, I’m sure I accomplished that BUT it takes a keen eye and a high IQ to figure that out! ?

[BigO]

3 hours ago, HessStation said:

Plus Marino throwing to Berry, maybe greatest hands ever, Alworth the ultimate weapon yards per catch and then Swann to make all the amazing tough ones. I don’t think Lep’s DBs would fair well. In contrast Willy Brown on Brown and Tunnell on Winslow could potentially neutralize the two stars well enough. Match up wise I’m really befuddled at the lopsided votes  

Generation X Jets fans. Go figure. 

[BigO]

1 hour ago, Obrien2Toon said:

Thorpe ran the 100 in 10 seconds

thats bo Jackson territory 

Most on here don’t know how legendary  Thorpe was. He was selected as the 3rd RB in the All Time NFL Legends team. He trained in the forest with the birds and the bees.

[nycdan]

3 hours ago, HessStation said:

Weird. I saw Big O’s team as stronger. Especially his DL and DB’s. Marino is the best QB of all time imo. I usually shuffle him, Manning and Elway around but this exercise made me realize if the teams are balanced and no coaching is involved I’m taking Marino first. Lep having Campbell made it close but O’s DL is the real deal. 

Curious Hess, and BigO.  Where would you put Rodgers in comparison to Marino?  To me, Rodgers' numbers are historically staggering.  Probably best of all-time from a pure stats perspective but of course different eras.  I ask because in Rodgers I see someone very like Marino, also with lack of elite talent around him but incredible arm talent, poise under pressure and ability to elevate the team around him.  Rodgers was fortunate enough to have won one SB and when his career is over, I can't imagine he won't be in the big-boys room for GOAT consideration.

[BigO]

25 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Not singling you out here at all, but I have never understood the myth of Bo Jackson as a great all-time RB.  He was a great all-time athlete and a very good RB but I wouldn't put him within sniffing distance of the top-10 all time, and really not even top-20.  Just my opinion but how do you take him over any of the other guys you mentioned (e.g. Dickerson, Barry)?  I saw him play.  I have no recollection of him being the second coming of Jim Brown but maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention?

[Edit:  To clarify, I don't doubt that if Bo played only Football he might have been a top-5 guy, but he didn't and I just don't think I can put a guy in the top based solely on what he *could* have done.  Those other guys all DID it at least for a few years, in some cases many more.]

 

Bo football career was short lived but he was an amazing RB. A combination of power, speed and shiftiness I’ve never seen: A Hershel Walker/Jim Brown/Jim Thorpe robot. Had he stayed healthy, he would have had an incredible place atop of football history like Jim Brown did.

[BigO]

6 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Curious Hess, and BigO.  Where would you put Rodgers in comparison to Marino?  To me, Rodgers' numbers are historically staggering.  Probably best of all-time from a pure stats perspective but of course different eras.  I ask because in Rodgers I see someone very like Marino, also with lack of elite talent around him but incredible arm talent, poise under pressure and ability to elevate the team around him.  Rodgers was fortunate enough to have won one SB and when his career is over, I can't imagine he won't be in the big-boys room for GOAT consideration.

I like Rodgers ALOT. More so than Farve who was just to reckless. I even consider him even better than Brady. But outstanding for you to link him to Marino and compare the two. I give the edge to Marino solely on his ability to throw ropes in between zone coverages much like Namath was able to do. Marino was Namath with good knees and better protection. 

[BigO]

1 hour ago, HessStation said:

Man...looks like O’s old timer team just ain’t gonna cut it for people. I’m his only vote?

No biggie. I stayed true to my beliefs and strategy. I’ve never put much faith in what others think who don’t investigate matters thoroughly. 

Spencer Principle

There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all argument and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance. This principle is contempt prior to examination.

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, BigO said:

Generation X Jets fans. Go figure. 

There's a narrative here. There's a significant drop off in saliency in most things after about 30 years (prior). That's roughly the cut off for when you can take a large group of people and assume familiarity/attitudes/awareness etc...

I'm probably average/middle of the road for the forum, late 30s, been following football to some extent since i was a youth... Anything before 85-88? Man, i'm just going off of reference and street cred... which is fine for respect, but i can't picture Unitas the same way i can picture Manning... whatever is more familiar and salient, eventually wins that battle. 

I assumed this would reveal itself in voting.

[BigO]

43 minutes ago, Paradis said:

There's a narrative here. There's a significant drop off in saliency in most things after about 30 years (prior). That's roughly the cut off for when you can take a large group of people and assume familiarity/attitudes/awareness etc...

I'm probably average/middle of the road for the forum, late 30s, been following football to some extent since i was a youth... Anything before 85-88? Man, i'm just going off of reference and street cred... which is fine for respect, but i can't picture Unitas the same way i can picture Manning... whatever is more familiar and salient, eventually wins that battle. 

I assumed this would reveal itself in voting.

Hmmm very good point. I myself am subject to just word of mouth prior to ‘67. I first really started understanding the game at 10.  I got into football with the Giants and Tarkenton, The Packers, and then Namath skyrocketed into the scene. I was a Jet for life. I recall the game vs. Unitas where they played dueling banjos. It was historic and Johnny U was at the tail end of his legendary career. What a game! Can’t really imagine what he was like in his prime but word of mouth says HE WAS THE BEST. I’d have to conjecture Johnny U was better than Manning. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

5 hours ago, BigO said:

Thorpe, if you read football history, SAVED FOOTBALL. He was it’s ELITE star and became the NFL’s first President and ambassador. His statue is at the entrance in Canton’s Hall of Fame - not Earl Campbell not Jim Brown. Show me where Campbell played more than 1 sport. Bo did , Deion did, Thorpe played Football, baseball, basketball professionally AND destroyed the competition in the Olympics in SEVERAL events. No athlete has ever came close to being so versatile and dominant. He ran the 100 in 10 seconds in worn down shoes at the Olympics that didn’t even fit! He was 6’1  203 during an era that didn’t have the luxuries athletes are afforded today. I see him as an old skool version of Marcus Allen, fast, shifty, could run between the tackles and around the end. Questioning his greatness is ABSURD. 

I know the history. That's why I believe you made a mistake in going this route. You're quoting his general influence on the sport andhow many sports he played, but not his measurable play on the field. Football was a mess when he was playing and his stats are a mess too. He played for a bunch of teams that don't even register in the modern game and you're relying on what he might have done, given his obviously remarkable physical traits. You should have gone with someone for whom a better case could be made... even a guy like Joe Perry would have been a vastly better choice. JMHO.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

5 hours ago, BigO said:

But he didn’t. I’d take Marcus Allen over Campbell because he had a longer more impacting career. I’d take Marcus over Emmitt Smith who IMO was totally overrated. Curtis Martin IMO was s better more versatile back. And if we’re going to look at just a few years, I’d take Bo in a heartbeat over anyone, even LT. 

Wait, so you're saying you would take Marcus Allen and Curtis Martin over Campbell in his prime? Sorry, but that's just ridiculous.

[Doggin94it]

1 hour ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Wait, so you're saying you would take Marcus Allen and Curtis Martin over Campbell in his prime? Sorry, but that's just ridiculous.

Agreed.  Used to do these over on JI so I'm very familiar with the old-timers on both teams, and I try to normalize "size/speed" to era (so that players who were comparable outliers over the baseline player of their day are compared as equals, even if that means one played at 250 and the other at 315) - but even with that, Lep's team wins this game.  Marino is a pocket statue and your OL isn't great at OG, which is a bad combination for a guy whose best asset is the deep ball.  Add that to Lep's run game dominance and quick passing game, and it wasn't too tough a call

[HessStation]

7 hours ago, nycdan said:

Curious Hess, and BigO.  Where would you put Rodgers in comparison to Marino?  To me, Rodgers' numbers are historically staggering.  Probably best of all-time from a pure stats perspective but of course different eras.  I ask because in Rodgers I see someone very like Marino, also with lack of elite talent around him but incredible arm talent, poise under pressure and ability to elevate the team around him.  Rodgers was fortunate enough to have won one SB and when his career is over, I can't imagine he won't be in the big-boys room for GOAT consideration.

Just for me, personally, it’s hard to fit current players in from a historical perspective. And Rogers has too much time left. But I agree, Rogers will be up there. Right now he’s in his own category for me. Right after my top 3 guys on par w all timers like Montana and Brady. Just imo.

[T0mShane]

8 hours ago, HessStation said:

Man...looks like O’s old timer team just ain’t gonna cut it for people. I’m his only vote?

It’s sort of not fair because Jets fans almost universally view Marino as a career loser and a jerk besides. Guaranteed half the votes against BigO are anti-Marino votes.

[Obrien2Toon]

29 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

It’s sort of not fair because Jets fans almost universally view Marino as a career loser and a jerk besides. Guaranteed half the votes against BigO are anti-Marino votes.

Not good for whoever has Brady

[Lith]

33 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

It’s sort of not fair because Jets fans almost universally view Marino as a career loser and a jerk besides. Guaranteed half the votes against BigO are anti-Marino votes.

I also think a lot of it is name recongition.  Stydahar, Wienmeister, Bright Path, George, Tunnell.  That is a lot of guys most people on this board never heard of and never saw play.  I had no idea Bright Path refers to Thorpe, had to look up the rosters (and google Bright Path).  These guys may have been great plyers -- and for me at least, I try to judge players relative to their era, but how many people are going to stop and research players they have not heard of before voting.

 

 

[BigO]

4 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Wait, so you're saying you would take Marcus Allen and Curtis Martin over Campbell in his prime? Sorry, but that's just ridiculous.

No not in prime. Only Bo’s couple of years compares to Campbell 5 magnificent ones.  Over the long haul, both Marcus and Martin were just way more productive. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

16 minutes ago, BigO said:

No not in prime. Only Bo’s couple of years compares to Campbell 5 magnificent ones.  Over the long haul, both Marcus and Martin were just way more productive. 

But that's clearly not what this whole draft was about. Compiling is useless here. Otherwise nobody would take Bo Jackson or Gayle Sayers or Earl Campbell. Allen and Martin are frankly the epitome of above average backs with longevity.

[BigO]

2 hours ago, Lith said:

I also think a lot of it is name recongition.  Stydahar, Wienmeister, Bright Path, George, Tunnell.  That is a lot of guys most people on this board never heard of and never saw play.  I had no idea Bright Path refers to Thorpe, had to look up the rosters (and google Bright Path).  These guys may have been great plyers -- and for me at least, I try to judge players relative to their era, but how many people are going to stop and research players they have not heard of before voting.

 

 

Uh I did. I was looking at fielding the best possible LEGEND team. I thought that was the point.  I looked at each position available according to the strategy I developed. To me certain positions are more valuable than others. As we went down the road, the quality of players began diminishing halfway through the roster. Thus, I compared careers, impact, their dominance during their eras and experts viewpoints on respective players and pulled triggers on these choices. I didn’t configure any one player’s era into another. Yes, I could have gone the easy way out and taken better known names or more modern players. I guess I’m an old timer here but I have great respect for tradition. When the football community says Jim Brown was the greatest RB EVER that’s a BOLD statement considering the competition. I for one never saw him play, just film clips. Would have taken him 1st? No. To me QB was more important and to me, Marino was the greatest. But no one can argue his greatness, his dominance, his impact. He’s the best BECAUSE of that. All the ole skool guys I took were off the hook at their positions in their eras. It’s a LEGEND team, I used my knowledge, researched deeply and dug into my imagination. For instance, Jif took Les Richter. I was going to. After reading about that guy I concluded he was no joke. I mean just viscous. But I saw Bill George available who essentially CREATED the MLB spot and was top 5 on most MLB lists. If you have time or even want to check these guys out. Amazing grit, talented, and had resounding impact on the history of football.

[BigO]

5 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

But that's clearly not what this whole draft was about. Compiling is useless here. Otherwise nobody would take Bo Jackson or Gayle Sayers or Earl Campbell. Allen and Martin are frankly the epitome of above average backs with longevity.

Not arguing that point. Campbell was a beast. I’d only take Bo over him. Bo, Campbell, Sayers, Sanders, Dickerson in a draft like this. 

[BigO]

5 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

I know the history. That's why I believe you made a mistake in going this route. You're quoting his general influence on the sport andhow many sports he played, but not his measurable play on the field. Football was a mess when he was playing and his stats are a mess too. He played for a bunch of teams that don't even register in the modern game and you're relying on what he might have done, given his obviously remarkable physical traits. You should have gone with someone for whom a better case could be made... even a guy like Joe Perry would have been a vastly better choice. JMHO.

Again you’re CONFIGURING Thorpe into the ‘modern’ game. That’s fine. But I plugged him into the RB spot given his place in history AND his, as you say remarkable physical traits. Thorpe was a once in a liftetime athlete who excelled at various sports. Even old time experts say he would have been legendary given his achievements. He’s ranked 37 on the All Time NFL Legend list. I don’t care what others think. You just don’t fling a guy’s name on a list like that because it looks ‘good’. According to your thinking, a guy like Red Grange would have been a better choice. Red was the Babe Ruth of football in the 20’s. But Thorpe was The Godfather, and in reading about the two, Thorpe was hands down the better athlete. 

[BigO]

12 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

 

Louis Wright

·  5× Pro Bowl (1977–1979, 1983, 1985)

·  2× AP First-team All-Pro (1978, 1979)

·  3× NEA First-team All-Pro (1978, 1979, 1983)

·  3× PFW First-Team All-Pro (1978, 1979, 1984)

·  Football Digest NFL Defensive Back of the Year (1977)

·  NFL 1970s All-Decade Team

26 INT

Cornell Green

·  Super Bowl champion (VI)

·  5× Pro Bowl (1965, 1966, 1967, 1971, 1972)

·  3× First-team All-Pro (1966, 1967, 1969)

·  Second-team All-Pro (1968)

·  Dallas Cowboys 25th Anniversary Team

34 INT

Did you SEE these guys play? I did. And if you didn’t, you did the same thing I did In taking players you never saw play and am being lambasted for. They were very good But they wouldn’t hold up against Marino and were not In the same class as Willie Brown and Parrish. Personally though, where you took them and what was available, OUTSTANDING picks. 

Brown 

• 3× Super Bowl champion (XI, XV, XVIII)
• 4× Pro Bowl (1970–1973)
• 2× First-team All-Pro (1971, 1973)
• AFL champion (1967)
• 5× AFL All-Star Game (1964, 1965, 1967–1969)
• 3× First-team All-AFL (1964, 1968, 1969)
• AFL All-Time Team
• 54 INT

HOF

Parrish

• 8× Pro Bowl (1970, 1971, 1974–1977, 1979, 1980)
• 3× First-team All-Pro (1976, 1979, 1980)
• 2× Second-team All-Pro (1974, 1975)
• Football Digest NFL Defensive Back of the Year (1979)
• 47 INT

[BigO]

4 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

Agreed.  Used to do these over on JI so I'm very familiar with the old-timers on both teams, and I try to normalize "size/speed" to era (so that players who were comparable outliers over the baseline player of their day are compared as equals, even if that means one played at 250 and the other at 315) - but even with that, Lep's team wins this game.  Marino is a pocket statue and your OL isn't great at OG, which is a bad combination for a guy whose best asset is the deep ball.  Add that to Lep's run game dominance and quick passing game, and it wasn't too tough a call

Nonsense utter nonsense. Marino had the quickest release in history. And his pocket ‘statue’ stance never was a factor for him. The guards I chose are more than adequate. Schreff has played just 3 years and has been All Pro the last 2 years, drafted 5th in 1st round - dude is a monster. he’s already considered the best guard in football by many.  Talamini is an ole skool AFL All Pro every year who finished his career with the JETS and protected Namath in winning our only Super Bowl against the LEGENDARY DL.  So according to your logic, we’d lose that 1969 Super Bowl. 

[BigO]

3 hours ago, T0mShane said:

It’s sort of not fair because Jets fans almost universally view Marino as a career loser and a jerk besides. Guaranteed half the votes against BigO are anti-Marino votes.

Wow I never for one second even thought of that. Marino is my all time favorite QB. Born on my birthday ? And I never cared he torched the Jets. In fact, every time he did, I threw pillows at the TV in frustration towards the GM for passing on him. So if you swing half those prejudice votes over and base them on talent, scheme etc I’d be winning 13-12 ?

[BigO]

4 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

Agreed.  Used to do these over on JI so I'm very familiar with the old-timers on both teams, and I try to normalize "size/speed" to era (so that players who were comparable outliers over the baseline player of their day are compared as equals, even if that means one played at 250 and the other at 315) - but even with that, Lep's team wins this game.  Marino is a pocket statue and your OL isn't great at OG, which is a bad combination for a guy whose best asset is the deep ball.  Add that to Lep's run game dominance and quick passing game, and it wasn't too tough a call

Every team on here has a weak point. But your analysis is just skewed and lacks credibility or proof. 

Hall of Famers George Blanda and Billy Cannonbenefited from his blocking as the Oilers won the first two AFL Championships. Talamini made first-team All-AFL in 1962 and was a regular at American Football League All-Star games, selected to six straight, through 1967. He anchored an offensive line that gave Blanda time to set passing records that would last for decades and opened holes for the likes of Cannon, Charlie Tolar, Sid Blanks and Hoyle Granger to run through. Talamini, Don Floydand Jim Norton were the last of the original Oilers.

After two AFL crowns and three Eastern Division titles, Talamini watched the club rebuild and win the division again in 1967. The Oilers fell one game short in 1967, but Talamini got to realize his dream the following year when he was released and picked up by the New York Jets. Opening holes for Matt Snell and blocking defenders away from Joe Namath. Talamini was selected to the All-Time All-AFL second team.

Not bad for a scrub huh. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

42 minutes ago, BigO said:

Did you SEE these guys play? I did. And if you didn’t, you did the same thing I did In taking players you never saw play and am being lambasted for. They were very good But they wouldn’t hold up against Marino and were not In the same class as Willie Brown and Parrish. Personally though, where you took them and what was available, OUTSTANDING picks. 

Brown 

• 3× Super Bowl champion (XI, XV, XVIII)
• 4× Pro Bowl (1970–1973)
• 2× First-team All-Pro (1971, 1973)
• AFL champion (1967)
• 5× AFL All-Star Game (1964, 1965, 1967–1969)
• 3× First-team All-AFL (1964, 1968, 1969)
• AFL All-Time Team
• 54 INT

HOF

Parrish

• 8× Pro Bowl (1970, 1971, 1974–1977, 1979, 1980)
• 3× First-team All-Pro (1976, 1979, 1980)
• 2× Second-team All-Pro (1974, 1975)
• Football Digest NFL Defensive Back of the Year (1979)
• 47 INT

I'm old enough to have seen them, but they don't stand out for me like someone like Gayle Sayers, who I do remember from my youth in Minnesota. When the Vikings played the Bears back in the sixties, I remember how absolutely electric Sayers was. I suffered through all those sad superbowl runs of the Vikes too, so am very familiar first hand with Page, Eller, Marshall, Krause, and company.

My point about my corners is that they were actually top 5-6 defenders in their time. There are many outstanding players who aren't in the HOF, as we all know. And of course I picked them through research. Of the four, Willie Brown would be my favorite -- he was tall and atheletic and he could punish receivers. Elite CB.

[BigO]

5 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

I'm old enough to have seen them, but they don't stand out for me like someone like Gayle Sayers, who I do remember from my youth in Minnesota. When the Vikings played the Bears back in the sixties, I remember how absolutely electric Sayers was. I suffered through all those sad superbowl runs of the Vikes too, so am very familiar first hand with Page, Eller, Marshall, Krause, and company.

My point about my corners is that they were actually top 5-6 defenders in their time. There are many outstanding players who aren't in the HOF, as we all know. And of course I picked them through research. Of the four, Willie Brown would be my favorite -- he was tall and atheletic and he could punish receivers. Elite CB.

I hate you! Vikings ugh. They ruined the Rams chances time and time and time again in those damn frigid playoff games in Minnesota in the 70’s. Rams would have win multiple SB’s if not for that damn ice cube team. And I wanted Sayers bad. I remember him in his prime,  he was different than any RB I’ve ever seen. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

2 minutes ago, BigO said:

I hate you! Vikings ugh. They ruined the Rams chances time and time and time again in those damn frigid playoff games in Minnesota in the 70’s. Rams would have win multiple SB’s if not for that damn ice cube team. And I wanted Sayers bad. I remember him in his prime,  he was different than any RB I’ve ever seen. 

Funny, I really liked the Rams when I was a kid because I loved their uniforms and helmets. Thought they looked cool. Liked the Vikings gear too. Rams were bad-ass in those days. Fearsome foursome vs. Purple People Eaters. LOL. P.S. whatever happened to Rosey Grier?

[BigO]

3 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Funny, I really liked the Rams when I was a kid because I loved their uniforms and helmets. Thought they looked cool. Liked the Vikings gear too. Rams were bad-ass in those days. Fearsome foursome vs. Purple People Eaters. LOL. P.S. whatever happened to Rosey Grier?

Awesome rivalry. Rams were my 2nd favorite team ever. Just classic classic old time football between those 2 teams. Two of the best DL in history. Rosy? Still alive and living the dream. Original DL on Fearsome Foursome - was by Bobby Kennedy’s side when he was assassinated. Grier has had a fascinating life.

[Long Island Leprechaun]

1 minute ago, BigO said:

Awesome rivalry. Rams were my 2nd favorite team ever. Just classic classic old time football between those 2 teams. Two of the best DL in history. Rosy? Still alive and living the dream. Original DL on Fearsome Foursome - was by Bobby Kennedy’s side when he was assassinated. Grier has had a fascinating life.

Lions also had a nasty defense back in the early to mid 60's. Karras, Roger Brown, Night Train Lane and company. Do you remember Big Daddy Lipscomb... became a wrestler after football... LOL.