Adams Says Some ’17 Jets “Wanted to do the bare minimum”

[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, prime21 said:

You don't but he was drafted so it is what it is.  Dislike the GM or the pick, not the player.

I've said as much previously in this thread. 

Sheesh, people get awfully defensive over this stuff.  We're coming off an era where there was all talk, little productivity (Rex Ryan), yet people wonder why Jamal Adams gets flack for talking a lot after a 0 INT season?

[Jetsfan80]

11 minutes ago, BCJet said:

Interesting - so MCCaffrey was "highly productive" as a rookie - 117 rushes  435 yards  3.7 average and 2 tds (that was behind jonathon stewart btw)

So my question is, if a "box safety" isnt worth the 6th pick, due to their "limitations at one particular skill set" how exactly is a third down, pass catching back, who cant run between the tackles worth the 8th pick, cause mccaffrey sure seems limited when it comes to ya know, running the ball 

 

 

^^^ Casually ignores the part where he caught 80 passes, putting him 3rd among RB's behind Bell and Kamara.  Had more yards per catch and receiving TD's than Bell as well.

Let me put this to you in a clear way you can understand.  The passing game has never been more important.  So yes, a RB who can catch a lot of passes is far more valuable than a safety who can only tackle. 

Both are one-trick ponies.  Problem for us is that McCaffrey's trick is very valuable in 2018.  Adams' is not.

[UntouchableCrew]

15 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

McCaffrey was highly productive as a rookie.  Not sure how you can do enough mental gymnastics to suggest a guy who caught 80 passes, contributed over 1,000 yards of rushing/receiving, and scored 7 TD's makes him a bad pick. 

True, we didn't pass on a LT or EDGE to take Jamal Adams.  But we did pass on Mahomes and DeShaun Watson.  It may work out there decently now that we have Darnold.  But I'd sure love to have McCaffrey as a weapon for Darnold to utilize, at least.

Mahomes might suck. I feel like when people talk about the guy they operate under the assumption he's going to be good -- he's another guy that had gaudy stats in a conference where everyone produces gaudy stats but never turns into good NFL QBs.

I wanted Watson too but another ACL later I'm pretty excited about Darnold.

[Jetsfan80]

Just now, UntouchableCrew said:

Mahomes might suck. I feel like when people talk about the guy they operate under the assumption he's going to be good -- he's another guy that had gaudy stats in a conference where everyone produces gaudy stats but never turns into good NFL QBs.

I wanted Watson too but another ACL later I'm pretty excited about Darnold. 

 

I think we can lean towards trusting Andy Reid's judgment when it comes to QB's, no?  Dude has done nothing but get solid productivity out of the QB position for his entire career, and he decided he'd seen enough out of Mahomes to move on from Alex Smith after a career year. 

[Grandy]

In this decade the Jets have drafted guys like Kyle Wilson, Coples, Milliner, Pryor, and Lee in the 1st round. 

But people get their panties in a wad over the All Rookie safety that led the league in TFLS at his position.

The Jamal hate was kinda justifiable when we passed on Mahomes and Watson, but now we have a QB who's a much better prospect than they ever were.

[UntouchableCrew]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

I think we can lean towards trusting Andy Reid's judgment when it comes to QB's, no?  Dude has done nothing but get solid productivity out of the QB position for his entire career, and he decided he'd seen enough out of Mahomes to move on from Alex Smith after a career year. 

That's somewhat fair in the sense that Andy Reid has gotten good production out of mediocre QBs. Doesn't mean he's good at picking them, considering many of the guys who play well under him stink elsewhere.

Frankly, if Mahomes isn't good for the Chiefs (in a QB friendly Andy Reid system with the best offensive weapons in all off football) it's pretty telling.

[Jetsfan80]

3 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

That's somewhat fair in the sense that Andy Reid has gotten good production out of mediocre QBs. Doesn't mean he's good at picking them, considering many of the guys who play well under him stink elsewhere.

Frankly, if Mahomes isn't good for the Chiefs (in a QB friendly Andy Reid system with the best offensive weapons in all off football) it's pretty telling. 

Well that's the thing.  Seeing how much juice Reid was able to squeeze out of Smith, it would have been my expectation they would have decided to hold onto him.  I mean, what harm would there be in keeping him around another year or 2 while Mahomes is on a cheap rookie deal?  After all, Reid isn't young, and if he wants a title, a veteran QB would seem like the best way to go after that title. 

But nope, he put all his chips to the center with Mahomes.  Maybe its because he has the equity in this league to make a risky call like that, but I tend to think Reid believes he can win with him.  And if he believes, we probably should as well. 

[munchmemory]

13 hours ago, Bruce Harper said:

This guy talks way too damn much.

Word.  Especially as he has earned exactly jack-shyte so far in his career.

[prime21]

13 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I've said as much previously in this thread. 

Sheesh, people get awfully defensive over this stuff.  We're coming off an era where there was all talk, little productivity (Rex Ryan), yet people wonder why Jamal Adams gets flack for talking a lot after a 0 INT season?

Because zero interceptions does not define his overall play.  Yes you want him to have more but the way he is utilized in the defense will give him less opportunities for interceptions.  I would be more concerned if Mayes didn't have any picks because of how he is used in the secondary.  Like it has been said before, Marcus Williams had several picks but what eles did he do.  You ave to look at the overall game play and how the player is being utilized.  

[Jetsfan80]

3 minutes ago, prime21 said:

Because zero interceptions does not define his overall play.  Yes you want him to have more but the way he is utilized in the defense will give him less opportunities for interceptions.  I would be more concerned if Mayes didn't have any picks because of how he is used in the secondary.  Like it has been said before, Marcus Williams had several picks but what eles did he do.  You ave to look at the overall game play and how the player is being utilized.   

That's cool and all, but guys with Adams' skillset are fairly common.  Ball-hawking, turnover causing safeties are very valuable.  So yes, just another example of our GM just "not getting it" when it comes to the draft.

Adams should be on a defense where he's the 4th-5th best player out there.  Not on one where he's supposed to be a centerpiece because of lack of talent elsewhere.  And you never, ever use a top 10 pick on a player with that skillset.

[JetFaninMI]

44 minutes ago, prime21 said:

 

The anti-Adams people bring up the same plays over and over to prove their point of what?  He wasn't worthy of the 6th pick or that their personal preference is not liking players that talk a lot?    Wilkerson had more picks than Adams becomes a laughing point for the anti Adams group yet do they say Adams had the same amount of sacks as Leonard Williams?  Are they a part of an Anti Leonard group too or are two sacks  for a 6th pick in the draft is acceptable?   The losing culture does affect fans in different ways but the outpouring of hatred towards this player is just sad. 

  

 

I'm not anti Adams, I'm anti bullsh*t. The guy is a motor mouth safety on a 5-11 team with a defense that finished in the bottom third of the League in almost every category. I don't hate the guy I just wish he would shut-up and play. He is digging a huge hole for himself if he can't produce on a PRO-BOWL level. I am all for confidence but when you guarantee you will make the PRO-BOWL and talk as if you already did it can become a problem. Especially if you fall short. Adams is young and brash but he is putting a huge target on his back in the media and around the League. Why not ascend naturally to that higher level instead of constantly telling us he is going to get there? You can talk all you want but unless you do it on the field its just that, talk.

[BigRy56]

Adams is the face of the defense and will be for a long time. We've all been pointing out Mo Wilk dogging it all over the field for years - he just came out and said it. This is really not a big deal.

[prime21]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

That's cool and all, but guys with Adams' skillset are fairly common.  Ball-hawking, turnover causing safeties are very valuable.  So yes, just another example of our GM just "not getting it" when it comes to the draft.

Adams should be on a defense where he's the 4th-5th best player out there.  Not on one where he's supposed to be a centerpiece because of lack of talent elsewhere.  And you never, ever use a top 10 pick on a player with that skillset.

I'm fine with the pick BUT i get the argument about him not being picked.  But he was and I don't understand the hate that some have for him. The guy plays hard.  He's in on plays that had him on the opposite side of the field.  If anything, his hard work and hustle is an example for the other players to follow.  

[Losmeister]

11 hours ago, RSJ said:

Yeah I mean Adams and Lee are going to find out the same thing Rex found out. Having a big mouth is cool when you are winning but if you start losing it can get real ugly

if someone already beat me tyo this sorry, i havent waded my way all the way through.

garbage argument cos all Lee and Adams know in the NFL is losing.

[prime21]

4 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

I'm not anti Adams, I'm anti bullsh*t. The guy is a motor mouth safety on a 5-11 team with a defense that finished in the bottom third of the League in almost every category. I don't hate the guy I just wish he would shut-up and play. He is digging a huge hole for himself if he can't produce on a PRO-BOWL level. I am all for confidence but when you guarantee you will make the PRO-BOWL and talk as if you already did it can become a problem. Especially if you fall short. Adams is young and brash but he is putting a huge target on his back in the media and around the League. Why not ascend naturally to that higher level instead of constantly telling us he is going to get there? You can talk all you want but unless you do it on the field its just that, talk.

Do you watch him play?  He PLAYS on every down.  He probably is the hardest working guy on the field.  Yes he is a motor mouth but who cares.  I'd rather him have high aspirations for himself and the team than not.  At the end of his career will be the time to determine how much sh*t he talked or how he lived up to his expectations.

[munchmemory]

5 minutes ago, prime21 said:

Do you watch him play?  He PLAYS on every down.  He probably is the hardest working guy on the field.  Yes he is a motor mouth but who cares.  I'd rather him have high aspirations for himself and the team than not.  At the end of his career will be the time to determine how much sh*t he talked or how he lived up to his expectations.

I'd argue Williams plays harder and with more intensity.  

[prime21]

1 minute ago, munchmemory said:

I'd argue Williams plays harder and with more intensity.  

Its a good argument.  But does he dance better? ?

[PepPep]

14 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Wilkerson had more INTs than Jamal Adams. Kony Ealy has more passes defensed than Jamal Adams. Adams gave up, conservatively, 8 TDs via the pass. Good on Jamal that he likes football and the halfwit beat kids have fallen in love with his sh*t-talking and dancing, but my dude needs to be a better player before he points the finger at veterans, or else he’ll get rolled in the locker room. 

I agree. As a rookie especially, you need to have some respect for the veterans around you and be careful about what you say. That's just how it goes. HOWEVER, regardless of how well he played or what numbers he put up, Adams is talking about EFFORT here. He is simply saying theeffort was not there and the energy was not there. And he's probably right. 

[JetFaninMI]

4 minutes ago, prime21 said:

Do you watch him play?  He PLAYS on every down.  He probably is the hardest working guy on the field.  Yes he is a motor mouth but who cares.  I'd rather him have high aspirations for himself and the team than not.  At the end of his career will be the time to determine how much sh*t he talked or how he lived up to his expectations.

You're missing the point. No one is questioning his work ethic. When you constantly brag about how great you are and don't live up to it you become a distraction. Especially when you're supposed to be a team leader. If you run your mouth and don't live up to it your teammates eventually tune you out. Is that what a team leader does? Adams needs to match his play with his mouth and he can talk all he wants. Hell I want the guy to succeed but at this point he needs to focus on the field and the rest will come. Until then STFU and play Jamal.

[Freemanm]

Hopefully he backs up his mouth with his play this year. I'll always cut some slack for rookies when it comes to their play, but he's gotta have a break out sophomore year to justify the sixth overall.

[Embrace the Suck]

Was Adams a ballhawk last year? No. Did I see him running step for step with Gronk and in good position to make a play on the ball a couple times? Yes, but it's Gronk. I think Adams has the potential to be a prototype safety who can do it all, but the guy was a rookie on a generally bad team. Yes, he talks a lot, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. He seems to want to be a leader on the team, an attitude that many on the board used to wish Revis had earlier in his career but never portrayed. Hopefully he steps it up and no one will care that he's bold. I also generally hate loud mouths such as say Rex, but I think Adams is trying to play a role to help the team as opposed to being interested in personal glory.

[munchmemory]

5 minutes ago, prime21 said:

Its a good argument.  But does he dance better? ?

lol  Part two of this Williams "dance" always makes me laugh.  He picks up Lee like he's a rag doll.

 

[PepPep]

1 minute ago, JetFaninMI said:

You're missing the point. No one is questioning his work ethic. When you constantly brag about how great you are and don't live up to it you become a distraction. Especially when you're supposed to be a team leader. If you run your mouth and don't live up to it your teammates eventually tune you out. Is that what a team leader does? Adams needs to match his play with his mouth and he can talk all he wants. Hell I want the guy to succeed but at this point he needs to focus on the field and the rest will come. Until then STFU and play Jamal.

Right, but the point of this particular statement he made is that there were a number of veterans that did not show effort. So you're not questioning his work ethic and you believe he needs to be a better leader, yet you're questioning him calling out former teammates for NOT having good work ethic? I thought that's what leaders did- call out poor attitude, work ethic and lack of effort? He didn't specify anyone in particular, and it seems like there is no problems in the locker room right now, so I would guess others have the same feelings and the person in question probably IS Wilkerson- who is gone now. 

So sure, declaring you will be a Pro Bowler and this and that and the other gets annoying and can cause locker room issues. But there ARE no locker room issues right now. And Adams has only been in the league ONE season, so we can't even know whether he will live up to his bluster or fall short. SO what's the problem? And why all the concern over this particular statement, which is what this thread is about. 

[JetFaninMI]

Just now, PepPep said:

Right, but the point of this particular statement he made is that there were a number of veterans that did not show effort. So you're not questioning his work ethic and you believe he needs to be a better leader, yet you're questioning him calling out former teammates for NOT having good work ethic? I thought that's what leaders did- call out poor attitude, work ethic and lack of effort? He didn't specify anyone in particular, and it seems like there is no problems in the locker room right now, so I would guess others have the same feelings and the person in question probably IS Wilkerson- who is gone now. 

So sure, declaring you will be a Pro Bowler and this and that and the other gets annoying and can cause locker room issues. But there ARE no locker room issues right now. And Adams has only been in the league ONE season, so we can't even know whether he will live up to his bluster or fall short. SO what's the problem? And why all the concern over this particular statement, which is what this thread is about. 

No my response was not about his calling out of his teammates but his overall boasting this off-season. This has been a long running debate over multiple pages of this thread.

[BCJet]

44 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

^^^ Casually ignores the part where he caught 80 passes, putting him 3rd among RB's behind Bell and Kamara.  Had more yards per catch and receiving TD's than Bell as well.

Let me put this to you in a clear way you can understand.  The passing game has never been more important.  So yes, a RB who can catch a lot of passes is far more valuable than a safety who can only tackle. 

Both are one-trick ponies.  Problem for us is that McCaffrey's trick is very valuable in 2018.  Adams' is not.

I didnt casually leave out his receiving any more then you casually left out Adam's play against the run.

The thing that you clearly need explained to you is that while the passing game has never been more important, RBs who can catch AND run are the ones who are valuable.  Mccaffery isnt a threat to run the ball between the tackles, which is why he is a true one trick pony who needs to be put in select plays to be effective.  Kamara averaged 6 yards per run, not 3.7.  

Adams, actually can cover - which is why if you see where he actually spent time last year, you and everyone else who use the team "box safety" could see what he actually brings to the defense.  

[ZachEY]

22 minutes ago, PepPep said:

Right, but the point of this particular statement he made is that there were a number of veterans that did not show effort. So you're not questioning his work ethic and you believe he needs to be a better leader, yet you're questioning him calling out former teammates for NOT having good work ethic? I thought that's what leaders did- call out poor attitude, work ethic and lack of effort? He didn't specify anyone in particular, and it seems like there is no problems in the locker room right now, so I would guess others have the same feelings and the person in question probably IS Wilkerson- who is gone now. 

 So sure, declaring you will be a Pro Bowler and this and that and the other gets annoying and can cause locker room issues. But there ARE no locker room issues right now. And Adams has only been in the league ONE season, so we can't even know whether he will live up to his bluster or fall short. SO what's the problem? And why all the concern over this particular statement, which is what this thread is about. 

Leadership is doing this in the season and getting results.  Talking about it to the media the following training camp is not the same thing.

[ZachEY]

1 hour ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I just think the "Jamal Adams sucks" camp is being very harsh on a rookie who by pretty much all objective accounts had a good rookie year. He was on the All Rookie Team and was graded well by PFF and other entities.

Would we like to have seen more turnovers? Of course. Did he have bad games against the best tight ends in football, Gronk and Kelce? Yeah... But he really wasn't bad at all last year. He was pretty good and I think there's a strong possibility he has a 2nd year leap just like Landon Collins did a few years ago.

No one (or at least not that I've seen) is actually saying he "sucks," at least seriously.

[pajet]

6 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

Johnny Manziel?

 

Fair, but that is why Johnny Manziel is a punchline.   Kink of illustrates the point that it is talking vs production as opposed to race.

[flgreen]

14 hours ago, Spoot-Face said:

What it's like to see through @T0mShane's eyes:

LOl

One of my favorite movies.  Loved Piper

[Jack Straw]

15 hours ago, Matt39 said:

fake hustle...it's rampant

100%. I can't wait to see Leonard Williams, Nathan Shepard, and Henry Anderson deftly positioning themselves in front of TV cameras this Friday to run "wind sprints" in the 3rd quarter of the 1st pre-season game...

 

[prime21]

48 minutes ago, JetFaninMI said:

You're missing the point. No one is questioning his work ethic. When you constantly brag about how great you are and don't live up to it you become a distraction. Especially when you're supposed to be a team leader. If you run your mouth and don't live up to it your teammates eventually tune you out. Is that what a team leader does? Adams needs to match his play with his mouth and he can talk all he wants. Hell I want the guy to succeed but at this point he needs to focus on the field and the rest will come. Until then STFU and play Jamal.

Luckily he never talked crap about getting interceptions last year.   Lets see what happens this year.  I'm rooting for the kid.  He can talk all he wants as long as he doesn't make excuses and owns up to any false prophecy!

[kelly]

15 hours ago, sourceworx said:

Mo Wilkerson

4 sure..

?

[flgreen]

12 hours ago, CTM said:

Hackenbergs job label said Nfl QB ..

"former" NFL QB

[sourceworx]

I get that people want him to stop talking so much. I kind of do too. He hasn't accomplished anything to warrant his mouth to run the way it does.

That said, I don't have a problem with what he said in this instance. All he said was that some people became complacent after years of losing, and the younger guys want to change that. 

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, prime21 said:

 

The anti-Adams people bring up the same plays over and over to prove their point of what?  He wasn't worthy of the 6th pick or that their personal preference is not liking players that talk a lot?    Wilkerson had more picks than Adams becomes a laughing point for the anti Adams group yet do they say Adams had the same amount of sacks as Leonard Williams?  Are they a part of an Anti Leonard group too or are two sacks  for a 6th pick in the draft is acceptable?   The losing culture does affect fans in different ways but the outpouring of hatred towards this player is just sad. 

The problem starts with calling out "anti-Adams" people.  I can see saying that about some guys, but I am pretty vocal on the topic and I would never be part of a group that would have T0m Shane as a member.  To the extent that we are a group, most of us would complain about Williams' sacks. We aren't anti-Leonard either and I he no hatred toward either player.  OTOH, both are emblematic of a bigger problem - not prioritizing athleticism and higher value positions in the draft. .