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Lupz27

Bowles, or Bates, or both?

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I am going to go against the grain here and say I think the game plan going into the game was flawless, our defense came out looking sharp, young and fresh. Our offense was designed to keep the stress of a highly talented pass rush off of our rookie qb and put it in the hands of our veteran runners. The plan was not flashy but it was very logical and highly effective until our defense played too hard and knocked tyrod out of the game. We did not adjust and that is why we lost but the game plan going into the game was solid

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2 hours ago, Jets723 said:

The Bridgewater trade wasn’t for peanuts.  It was fair value. But I agree not working on the oline was bad

Maybe, but I would prefer to have Teddy on the team, he would have had some playing time under Bowles and maybe taken some of the pressure off Darnold, Sam did great for a rookie but no reason to start his career that way, 3 games in 10 days, he regressed and it's not his fault 

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On 9/22/2018 at 1:42 PM, Jetsplayer21 said:

100% Todd Bowles. He fired Morton because he took too many shots down field, like quick touchdowns are bad? Bowles complained he passed too much on “ running downs “ ?🤔 Bowles even had a talk with Morton about this but Morton didn’t follow Bowles’s orders. Who would ?

Bowles said he wanted to be more involved this yr with the O. We all know that meant more running, short conservative passing. Bates sure doesn’t want to be canned like Morton for ignoring what Bowles wants. 

Exactly correct. Now let’s quick talking about it and let’s do something about it. Somebody start a fire Bowles site or billboard or newspaper ad or whatever. I will gladly donate. I’ve had enough. 

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2 hours ago, kelly said:

Jets : 2018 might be audition for Jeremy Bates         https://nflspinzone.com/2018/09/24/new-york-jets-jeremy-bates-audition-2018/ 

I believe and I’ve heaed rumblings, (maybe @Mogglez has heard something similiar?) that Bates is a potential replacement for Bowles and Heirmdinger for Mac. It will all depend on how the offense is this year. If Bowles handcuffs Bates from calling his offense, and they keep losing games then Bowles might be on his way out.

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On 9/21/2018 at 10:16 PM, Beerfish said:

This one is easy, mccagnan.  No oline, no impact WRs, lousy TE, meh backs.

The oc will always take the blame though. 

Right now our talent level on offense is awful and has been for a few years.  Both gailey and morton were miracle workers to get anything out of the qbs and what they had to work with.  Their thanks?  Fired by Bowles. 

Jets after 3 weeks are 19th in total offense, 21st in passing offense, 14th in rushing offense.

If the Jets are really THAT devoid of offensive talent, our offensive coaching staff has been among the best in the league this year.

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I was skeptical of Bates to begin with. Yes, he's still an improvement over Gailey, Morninwhig, Sparano (RIP), etc. but he FLAMED out as 1 and done OC TWICE in consecutive years (2009 w/USC & 2010 w/SEA in Carrol's 1st year). Then he was out of football for 2 years until being a QB coach for McCown in 2012 and then he went off the radar for another 4 years until landing with us. 

It was a surprising hire without the greatest of "Track records" but the hire definitely had a sufficient side of " . . . but he's (insert Old Ball Coach Name here) son and is a natural at understanding the game." 

The constant and predictable bubble screens are infuriating and will get our WRs KILLED. Robbie Anderson is USELESS as a YAC WR unless you hit him DEEP and IN STRIDE. Enunwa will be beaten to death by LBers on all the short outlet passes he catches since he's the only WR who can get separation.

 

And all this is at the behest of a PLAY NOT TO LOSE Defensive HC who is the 2nd incarnation of Herm Edwards but without the pulpit lectures and media pandering. 

NO ES BUENO! 

 

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I thought the game plan was to lose this year to land another stud, OLB, OT, whatever.

You can't land a great draft pick without losing. Certainly Todd Bowles is living up to his part in achieving that objective by being conservative--not getting the franchise killed--and not winning games that might be winnable if an more imaginative and daring coaching demeanor were assumed.

Todd Bowles: even when he loses, he loses...

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20 hours ago, Ohio State NY Jets fan said:

Maybe, but I would prefer to have Teddy on the team, he would have had some playing time under Bowles and maybe taken some of the pressure off Darnold, Sam did great for a rookie but no reason to start his career that way, 3 games in 10 days, he regressed and it's not his fault 

They were playing Darnold no matter what, so long as he didn't look completely clueless in August. If they didn't want him out there game 1 they still had another QB who could have easily started 3 games. 

It still would have been Sam on the field and Teddy on the bench. Except then they'd have the added pressure of Sam looking over his shoulder at a QB who understandably wants his career resurrected, as opposed to just McCown who knows his place and has embraced it. There could have been a real locker room rift. Right now, even with some obvious rookie mistakes, there is none. 

What if we started out 1-2 still, but Teddy looked pretty good? What if that continued right through to the point where Bowles couldn't really justify benching Teddy and then Darnold's rookie season ended up being just December?

No, once it was decided he was starting they had to get rid of Teddy if anyone was offering up anything decent. A day 2 pick is decent, and it was correctly accepted.

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There both to blame as far as the coaches. Bates calls the plays, but we don’t know how much input Bowles has. As the HC, you would like to think he’s in the offensive room overseeing the gameplan. If not, then he really has to go. I think the gameplan vs the browns was not good. From the outside looking in, the Jets seem like they have no identity on offense and the 2 of them need to get it going.


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2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

They were playing Darnold no matter what, so long as he didn't look completely clueless in August. If they didn't want him out there game 1 they still had another QB who could have easily started 3 games. 

It still would have been Sam on the field and Teddy on the bench. Except then they'd have the added pressure of Sam looking over his shoulder at a QB who understandably wants his career resurrected, as opposed to just McCown who knows his place and has embraced it. There could have been a real locker room rift. Right now, even with some obvious rookie mistakes, there is none. 

What if we started out 1-2 still, but Teddy looked pretty good? What if that continued right through to the point where Bowles couldn't really justify benching Teddy and then Darnold's rookie season ended up being just December?

No, once it was decided he was starting they had to get rid of Teddy if anyone was offering up anything decent. A day 2 pick is decent, and it was correctly accepted.

Great post, I just would have preferred they found a way to ease Sam into the starting lineup, agree they could have done this with Uncle Josh and also agree there could have been locker room issues if Teddy did well to start but the fact remains that our FQB got kicked in the shorts last Thursday night and it showed on his face and in his performance as he watched Mayfield show (for a moment) why he was the #1 pick over Sam - that's a slap to the ego of any man, let alone a 21 year old

That is mismanagement of a very rare talent, let's just hope he uses the 10 days to recover and understand that he was put in a very difficult position to start his career, he recovered from the pick six on his first throw, stood strong vs Miami and then regressed vs Cleveland...

Hope he takes the next step but concerned about "Quicksand" since I think it could have been avoided   

 

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On 9/21/2018 at 5:10 PM, Lupz27 said:

Who do you think is to blame for the horrendous offensive game plan?

IMO the game plan was good. I guess I’m in the minority here but until 4 minutes left Darnold had led the Jets to 17 points (only 1 less than Drew Brees led his team to) and no INTs. The defense collapsed in the 2nd half. The O had bad field position all night except for after the Browns turnover. I thought Bates managed his rookie QB and gameplanned this thing really well....again, until our backs were against the wall with 4 minutes left in obvious desperation mode. At 14-14 when we needed a drive we pressed and Darnold took us to the 10 where we kicked a FG. He had the game winning drive!!! We did it! That is UNTIL we couldn’t stop a 75 yard drive when it mattered most. 

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I don't know....I keep flashing back to the USC Bates....horrible.  Seeing some of his tendencies here.  He called one good play in his time there, one.  That's it.

The single great playcall at USC.

 

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14 hours ago, JetsYanks13 said:

Also, I think if Darnold gives his stamp of approval, then bates is the next HC. I’m not saying I agree, but I think his voice looks large for management and ownership.


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Just keep Bates as OC.  Bring back Rex he is salivating to work with our corners

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3 hours ago, Ohio State NY Jets fan said:

Off topic, but word around here is USC is interested in Ryan Day as next HC, any talk out there?

Who?

EDIT:  looked him up, haven't heard that.  Left a message for my friend who is the publisher of a USC site, and a second generation Trojan inside as a writer.  

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3 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Bowles conservative soft zone D bs sucks.  People here bash the S out of Rex but the guy knew how to make defensive adjustments 

That is my biggest complaint about Bowles, lack of adjustments. Mike Westhoff criticized Bowles of the same thing in 2015 when he was a Coach of the Year canidate. He is too stubborn on sticking to the gameplan. Its a very simple-minded/ 2-D vision, which is alarming, because even at his best with a loaded roster, I can’t see Todd Bowles winning a super bowl as a coach.

If anything he’d be a better scout. He seems to know a lot of these guys Mac drafted suck, and don’t even deserve playing time. 

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On 9/21/2018 at 8:10 PM, Lupz27 said:

Who do you think is to blame for the horrendous offensive game plan?  Now I know Bates calls the plays, and his play calling was real bad.  On that do you think he was under strict orders to play a pussy conservative don’t let Darnold do a god damn thing game plan?  Or do you think this is what Bates really thought was right for where Darnold is vs a talented G Williams exotic Defense?

The Captain of the Ship, who goes through OCs like a knife through butter

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