The Giants are 1 and 5

[Paradis]

The rams didnt have a strategy of taking a rb then a qb.  The rams took a rb because winston and marriota were off the board by the time they picked.

We can actually thank tom brady for sam darnold in a way.  Because of what brady is doing, GMs are thinking 37 is not old anymore.  10 years ago, teams would have moved on from a guy like manning at 35.  Giants got sucked in to thinking hes not washed up at 37.  Hahahaha.  Thanks Tom!!!!

 

Not saying the situations are identical but I have to imagine the way it worked out for LA semi-inspired the giants with some confidence .

 

*insert gratuitous “should have been us taking Gurley” remark.

 

 

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[Paradis]

The Giants OL make me appreciate the Jets OL. 

I don’t think our two Olines are much different. Eli stuck in the headlights and showing no pocket awareness is a big part of what you’re seeing. He’s eroding completely before our eyes.


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[Augustiniak]

5 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

All 3 of those players are superior qbs compared to Eli.  

Eli has a career like no other qb i can think of.  Hes pretty much responsible for 2 super bowls, but was never an elite qb.  

my point is, there are guys his age playing at a very high level.  eli on the other hand is toast.  

[Jetsplayer21]

1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

2019 is supposed to be a good draft for pass rushers

I heard. Looking forward to seeing the prospects in their final yr.. we know that is what Bowles is making Mac pick if he is still here. What do you think the giants do ?

[bostonmajet]

28 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

If im the giants, im calling around and seeing what i can get for beckum.  

What a talent he is but his mouth just ruins everything.  

Didn't he just sign a huge deal with something like 20 million in signing bonus? Aren't the Giants up against the cap anyway? They have like 30 million in dead cap and like 5 million available. How are they going to trade Beckum? They are stuck with Beckum and Solder for at least another year or 2.

I think between Eli, Beckum and Solder they have like 100 million in dead cap this year, and 65 million next year. Yeah, this FO has really messed up this team good.

[nyjunc]

Eli has been done for many years, it was foolish to bring him back. McAdoo was 100% correct in wanting to move on but he was fired because crazy fans who once wanted Eli gone even after winning a SB formed a social media mob and the Giants listened to them.

This will be 8 of the last 10 seasons missing the playoffs despite playing in a weak division. Eli was never great, he was once decent but those days are long gone.

It's been fun watching the Giants act like the old Jets in recent years 

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

Didn't he just sign a huge deal with something like 20 million in signing bonus? Aren't the Giants up against the cap anyway? They have like 30 million in dead cap and like 5 million available. How are they going to trade Beckum? They are stuck with Beckum and Solder for at least another year or 2.

I think between Eli, Beckum and Solder they have like 100 million in dead cap this year, and 65 million next year. Yeah, this FO has really messed up this team good.

the defense also looks like crap.  they need players everywhere.  

they could have drafted taco charlton or tj watt but they took evan engram.  that's the philosophical problem with this team.  not only have they bet the farm on eli, but he has influenced the top picks.  

[detectivekimble]

5 hours ago, edscuba said:

AS announcers said last night Eli's passes are mostly short connections making his stats look better but not much down field threats. Plus they were 0-15 on third down trys before getting one last night. Probably like 4-10 last night. Good news for them is a good OB is coming out of Oregon.

Maybe because he has no time to throw?  Dude is on pace to get sacked like 60 times.

[bostonmajet]

1 hour ago, King P said:

The Giants at this rate will be able to draft Justin Herbert and pair him with Barkley. 

If so, we might not be able to say the Giants made a mistake passing on a QB for Saquon

The most important position on the team is QB. When you are picking at #2 you don't pass up a potential franchise QB (15 year career) for a franchise RB (3-5 year career) when you need both. Also, last year was the year of the QB, you don't skip the QB in the year of the QB only to draft one the next year.

IF, and that is a big IF, the Giants are in a position to draft a QB in the same group and they end up getting their QB the year after they get their RB, it will be pure luck. You don't give a FO credit for being stupid, but lucky. Consider this, had the team been as good as they thought and this year's FA and draft paid off at all, they would be drafting no better then 15-20 and you don't get your QB.

Better lucky than good, I guess, but it doesn't make them smart and it doesn't mean the FO should stick around.

[Bruce Harper]

Yea, not going for Darnold or Rosen was a huge mistake.  Mistakes like that are  firable offenses for a general manager.
They seem to have massively overestimated their talent on D and on the Oline, bc even with Drew Brees at qb I see a .500 team at best.  The entire interior of their Oline is a turnstyle.
It doesn’t really make sense, did they really expect to beat the Rams, Saints and Philly with the addition of Barkley?
 

I think they were taken aback by how much flack they caught for benching Manning last year and became concerned about the thought of phasing out the franchise icon before he was ready.


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[detectivekimble]

3 hours ago, nj meadowlands said:

yeah 7-9 is an obscene assumption.  You're way more likely to get Arian Foster than you are Frank Gore.

And to your second point, Saquon's contract is for 4 years.  They're 1-5 now, and the season is over. Next year they will likely be bad again. So they'll have what, 2 years of him before he's getting handed the bag by some team?

Hopefully the Giants keep his workload reasonable.  Then he can come join his favorite team (the Jets).

[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, Bruce Harper said:

I think they were taken aback by how much flack they caught for benching Manning last year and became concerned about the thought of phasing out the franchise icon before he was ready.


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the problem is, he IS ready, WAS ready last year.  and even though the giants have a great rb they still have trouble scoring, that's how much more important the qb is than rb.  giants have, arguably, the most talented rb/wr in the game, yet they scored 1 td last night.  wentz is so much more valuable than barkley.

[Joe W. Namath]

Maybe they think they got their guy in lauletta.  But he wont be ready till next year.  

[leonwashington2]

people underestimate how hard it is to get a top qb in the draft, for two reasons:

-you need to be, really, REALLY, bad. we've been *SO* bad and havent had a top 2 pick in decades...last two years were bad. 2014 was terrible and we had the 6th pick. 2007 we were atrocious and had the 6th pick. 2005 we were atrocious and had the 4th pick. you need to be terrible AND have other teams steal some wins to get a top 2 pick. I doubt the giants end up there. odds say they win a few more. you go 4-12 theres no shot of a top 2 pick.

-there needs to be a qb worth taking! lets look at the past 10 drafts (before this one):

-2017: Trubisky? Top 2 pick but would you really spend a #2 pick on him? i wouldn't. and don't say mahomes and watson - when players get past the 10th pick it means nobody thought they would be crazy good...if they did, they'd trade into the back half of the top 10. russell wilson scenario.

-2016: Goff and Wentz. You werent top 2? (like 4-12 san diego)...good luck. nothing for you.

-2015: winston and mariota: you go 3-13 (like Jax did)? not enough. 

-2014: Blake bortles? in hindsight you spending a top 3 pick on him?

-2013: first two qbs off the board were ej manuel and geno. lol.

-2012: luck and rg3: one was a disaster. the other great, but the rams went 2-14 and didnt pick #1

-2011: cam. only one qb there.

-2010: bradford. only one qb. most would say he wasnt worth it

-2009: stafford. sanchez and freeman werent worth 1s.

-2008: matt ryan slipped to 3. but youll never see that again. the game has changed too much.

 

so to recap:

-last 10 drafts, only 5 of them had WORTHWHILE qbs go in the top 2 (goff/wentz, winston/mariota- MAYBE, luck, cam, stafford, matt ryan)

-there were years where even if you only won 3 you still werent in the top 2

 

this is why, when you get the #2 pick AND have a qb there thats worth taking, you have to take it!

also, it is SO early in the 2019 process - check out this article if you want to go down the glory road

http://grantland.com/features/a-hierarchy-hypocrites/

if you don't want to search, its a mid october article from 2012 citing how teams should "torpedo for geno":

 

Meanwhile, in last week’s column, a reader wondered what this year’s “Suck for Luck” quest should be called, offering us “Torpedo for Geno” (for Geno Smith, the likely no. 1 pick). My readers sprang into action and sent in a slew of suggestions, including Whiff-for-Smith, 0-and-Sixteen-O for Geno, Submarino for Geno, The Human Geno Project, Gen0 and 16, Droppin’ a Steamo for Geno, Geno-schneid, Petrino for Geno and The Geno Tank-a-reno. The three best ideas in reverse order …

3. “Pacino for Geno”
Explained by Steve from Hoboken as “A tribute to someone who was once great like the Cleveland Browns, but now completely mails it in.” Solid.

2. “sh*tty for Smitty”
My favorite idea (suggested by multiple readers), only I can’t really see Peter King and Chris Berman using this one. What a shame.

1. “Geno-Schneid”
The most common suggestion was actually “Geno-Cide,” which we’re avoiding for obvious reasons because it crosses every line and about 10 other lines beyond all the other lines. But “Geno-Schneid” (first suggested by Haverhill reader Ernie Bassi) — now that’s comedy! And it actually works! Should Jacksonville and Kansas City start printing “Geno-Schneid” T-shirts right now, or should they wait a few weeks?

 

 

 

[Creepy Lurker]

1 hour ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Its true.  Looking back, macadoo got to the playoffs year 1.  And Eli washed up fast in his second year and he made the right call to move on.  

Macadoo could be a hot canidate next year. The guy was right!

Let’s hire Macadoon and his awesome hair!!!!

 

im totally kidding. He’s still a doofus and not head coach material despite being right about Eli. 

[UntouchableCrew]

1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

I have a feeling the Giants won't win another game this year. The OL is so bad, Eli will get hurt most likely and they play out the season with whoever the backup is. Eli will retire after this year and they will have to draft a QB

I think you're being too harsh. They probably should have beaten the Panthers last week barring some bad calls by the refs and a 63 yard field goal. I think they end up 4-12 at worst.

[nycdan]

9 minutes ago, leonwashington2 said:

 

-2008: matt ryan slipped to 3. but youll never see that again. the game has changed too much.

 

I agree with your post overall, but oddly enough, you could actually see this scenario happen in next year's draft.  It's a weird time in the NFL where almost every really bad team already has a QB.  The only teams that are bad enough to draft top-10 and probably should think about drafting a QB are NYG, TB and maybe DEN.  OAK is a possibility because Gruden.  All the other crappy teams either have a young guy they recently drafted (e.g. ARI) or a veteran who isn't ready to go away (e.g. ATL).  

Now look at the draft and there are so many great DL that will be need picks for those same crappy teams.  As things stand, Bosa should go #1.  It gets interesting at #2 with guys like Oliver and Ferrell could easily go ahead of any QB, barring a huge trade up.  A smart team might be able to land the top QB (assuming its Hebert for now) anywhere in the 3-5 range if they are comfortable that Bosa and one other DL will go 1-2.  

[RoadFan]

8 hours ago, bealeb319 said:

Eli won two super bowls the old man might not be the best qb in the league but he isn't terrible. Football is a team sport and their defense is not playing well.

Sent from my [device_name] using http://JetNation.com mobile app
 

He is terrible now.  A QB's best friend is the running game.  How much more of a running game could he have?  Barkley ran for 100+ and caught like 9 balls for another 100.

Eli is making poor decisions, and  inaccurate even when a guy is open.  He's finished.

[JetBlue]

8 hours ago, Lizard King said:

It’s easy to say that about Eli in retrospect but Barkeley is insane 

As it was once stated, regarding Barkley, "We can go 1-5 without you".    They could have gotten a quality running back in the 2nd or 3rd round or even through FA (Isiah Crowell to name one).  They are going to miss passing over Darnold and Rosen for a long time. 

[JetBlue]

5 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I honestly wish they were a little better -- I don't want them drafting in the top three and having a shot at Herbert. Would definitely prefer they go 5-11 and wI foully expect them ander in the QB wilderness for a decade.

I fully expect them to win 4 - 6 games before it is all said and down.  They will probably pick in the 10 ten but probably not top 5. At least I hope not.  Even so, there are no quarterbacks rated highly rated as Darnold, Rosen or Baker.   Time will tell who distinguishes himself from the pack and someone will go top 5 or 10 just because of the importance of the position.  Besides, maybe Kyle L. turns out to be legit...  NOT! 

[Thai Jet]

2 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

If im the giants, im calling around and seeing what i can get for beckum.  

What a talent he is but his mouth just ruins everything.  

Comical watching him last nite. It's all about HIM. !  Dehydrated my a$$.

[Apache 51]

The Giants have 4 Lombardi's.

[Thai Jet]

20 minutes ago, RoadFan said:

He is terrible now.  A QB's best friend is the running game.  How much more of a running game could he have?  Barkley ran for 100+ and caught like 9 balls for another 100.

Eli is making poor decisions, and  inaccurate even when a guy is open.  He's finished.

Not going to argue with you after last nites game . 95% of his passes seemed to be at the LOS or no more than 2 yds. past it.

[Augustiniak]

21 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

As it was once stated, regarding Barkley, "We can go 1-5 without you".    They could have gotten a quality running back in the 2nd or 3rd round or even through FA (Isiah Crowell to name one).  They are going to miss passing over Darnold and Rosen for a long time. 

unless they somehow find a good qb quickly, they would have been better off drafting darnold, sitting him for half the season until the fans/media understood that eli was done and it was time to move on, then played darnold the 2nd half of this year.  they still could have drafted a rb in another round or signed someone like mckinnon or crowell.  as amazing as barkley is, how powerless was he to affect the outcome of the game compared to wentz last night?  

[Thai Jet]

4 minutes ago, Apache 51 said:

The Giants have 4 Lombardi's.

So ?

[Philc1]

7 minutes ago, Thai Jet said:

Comical watching him last nite. It's all about HIM. !  Dehydrated my a$$.

C’mon it’s not like he could have simply drank a bottle of water on the sidelines?

[BroadwayRay]

2 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Its true.  Looking back, macadoo got to the playoffs year 1.  And Eli washed up fast in his second year and he made the right call to move on.  

Macadoo could be a hot canidate next year. The guy was right!

Everyone saw that Eli was washed up. It didn't take a football savant. The Mara's were blinded to that fact because they were more concerned about keeping their idiot fans happy.

[Thai Jet]

2 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

unless they somehow find a good qb quickly, they would have been better off drafting darnold, sitting him for half the season until the fans/media understood that eli was done and it was time to move on, then played darnold the 2nd half of this year.  they still could have drafted a rb in another round or signed someone like mckinnon or crowell.  as amazing as barkley is, how powerless was he to affect the outcome of the game compared to wentz last night?  

Barkley looks like he's gonna be a great RB but most of the better RB's were NOT drafted in the 1st round. They could have nailed a good one later on draft day 2.

[Thai Jet]

2 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

C’mon it’s not like he could have simply drank a bottle of water on the sidelines?

Maybe it wasn't the divas preferred brand. lol

[Augustiniak]

28 minutes ago, Thai Jet said:

Barkley looks like he's gonna be a great RB but most of the better RB's were NOT drafted in the 1st round. They could have nailed a good one later on draft day 2.

barkley is a stud but with a crappy qb so what.  this game is all about passing.  crowell set a franchise record for rushing yards last week and he was a FA.  look what the eagles did with rbs last night, no ajai, no sproles.  you can win with jag rbs.

[UntouchableCrew]

1 hour ago, JetBlue said:

I fully expect them to win 4 - 6 games before it is all said and down.  They will probably pick in the 10 ten but probably not top 5. At least I hope not.  Even so, there are no quarterbacks rated highly rated as Darnold, Rosen or Baker.   Time will tell who distinguishes himself from the pack and someone will go top 5 or 10 just because of the importance of the position.  Besides, maybe Kyle L. turns out to be legit...  NOT! 

I generally agree, I see them as 4-12. My guess is they don't have a shot at THE top QB but you never know. I like Herbert, personally. Haven't seen Finley play much, don't really like Grier or Lock.

[bostonmajet]

2 hours ago, leonwashington2 said:

people underestimate how hard it is to get a top qb in the draft, for two reasons:

-you need to be, really, REALLY, bad. we've been *SO* bad and havent had a top 2 pick in decades...last two years were bad. 2014 was terrible and we had the 6th pick. 2007 we were atrocious and had the 6th pick. 2005 we were atrocious and had the 4th pick. you need to be terrible AND have other teams steal some wins to get a top 2 pick. I doubt the giants end up there. odds say they win a few more. you go 4-12 theres no shot of a top 2 pick.

-there needs to be a qb worth taking! lets look at the past 10 drafts (before this one):

...

so to recap:

-last 10 drafts, only 5 of them had WORTHWHILE qbs go in the top 2 (goff/wentz, winston/mariota- MAYBE, luck, cam, stafford, matt ryan)

-there were years where even if you only won 3 you still werent in the top 2

This is a great recap. Yes, fortunately the Giants messed up and QBs went 1 and 3, not 1 and 2. It is still way too early to tell, but Cleveland pulled a Jet move IMO in passing on Darnold.

You could look at this analysis another way; when you aren't that bad, you have to roll the dice on QBs until you hit on one (especially when you don't have one). I can't blame Mac for Petty or even rolling the dice on Hack (except that he waaaaaay reached) - if Mac had drafted Hack in the 4th I don't think he would have gotten so much slack for it. Getting a franchise QB is the most important think to do - if you don't suck for several years in a row in a good QB draft you have to hope, trade, beg for one. Can't blame a GM for not getting a franchise QB; but you can blame a GM for passing on one...

[Charlie Brown]

12 hours ago, Lizard King said:

It’s easy to say that about Eli in retrospect but Barkeley is insane 

In truth I would have taken Mahomes last year and moved up to try and get Barkley this year. 

That is how I saw the last two years if I was the Jets GM. 

So yes I think that Barkley is that good!!

[ZachEY]

3 hours ago, Apache 51 said:

The Giants have 4 Lombardi's.

How many of these photos do you have?

[Apache 51]