Jonah Williams

[NYDreamer]

Williams is my pick and so is every other offensive lineman available when we pick.

3: R1P3

 

OT JONAH WILLIAMS

ALABAMA

67: R3P3

 

G MICHAEL JORDAN

OHIO STATE

95: R3P31

 

RB RODNEY ANDERSON

OKLAHOMA

105: R4P3

 

G LESTER COTTON

ALABAMA

142: R5P3

 

C JESSE BURKETT

STANFORD

219: R7P3

 

EDGE CECE JEFFERSON

FLORIDA

[k-met57]

1 minute ago, NYDreamer said:

Williams is my pick and so is every other offensive lineman available when we pick.

3: R1P3

 

OT JONAH WILLIAMS

ALABAMA

67: R3P3

 

G MICHAEL JORDAN

OHIO STATE

95: R3P31

 

RB RODNEY ANDERSON

OKLAHOMA

105: R4P3

 

G LESTER COTTON

ALABAMA

142: R5P3

 

C JESSE BURKETT

STANFORD

219: R7P3

 

EDGE CECE JEFFERSON

FLORIDA

big fan of Rodney Anderson i think he could really help us in the passing game.

[ryu79]

How bad is Oklahoma's pass rush? They never even saw Tua tonight...

 

[section314]

Clemson's guys will be a great showcase for Williams. Either way.

[jetstream23]

There is no true franchise LT in this Draft.  Jonah Williams is the closes thing and will be drafted about 5-8 spots higher than he should IMO.  Reminds me of Andrus Peat, taken 13th in 2015.  Played LT at Stanford, now plays OG for the Saints.  Lots of similar guys out there like Brandon Scherff, Germain Ifedi, and most famously Robert Gallery of the Raiders.  All guys who played OT in college and moved to Guard in the NFL after being taken in the 1st round.

I like Jonah Williams but I really don't want him at #3.  Just seems like a reach to me but in draft thin at the Tackle spot he'll likely get overdrafted.  Probably doesn't last past Buffalo unless Buffalo goes with a WR.

[sec101row23]

8 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

There is no true franchise LT in this Draft.  Jonah Williams is the closes thing and will be drafted about 5-8 spots higher than he should IMO.  Reminds me of Andrus Peat, taken 13th in 2015.  Played LT at Stanford, now plays OG for the Saints.  Lots of similar guys out there like Brandon Scherff, Germain Ifedi, and most famously Robert Gallery of the Raiders.  All guys who played OT in college and moved to Guard in the NFL after being taken in the 1st round.

I like Jonah Williams but I really don't want him at #3.  Just seems like a reach to me but in draft thin at the Tackle spot he'll likely get overdrafted.  Probably doesn't last past Buffalo unless Buffalo goes with a WR.

Why do you assume Williams isn’t a franchise LT?   Because some draft pundits thinks his arms are a 1/2” shorter than ideal?   So let’s say if the Jets take Williams at 3, and he doesn’t make it at LT but moves to LG or RT and is a pro bowl caliber player for ten years.  Would that really be that bad?   Who cares if he was taken 5 spots ahead of some theoretical ranking.   That’s really not a “reach” especially given the need for quality O-linemen on this team.  

[Lith]

14 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Why do you assume Williams isn’t a franchise LT?   Because some draft pundits thinks his arms are a 1/2” shorter than ideal?   So let’s say if the Jets take Williams at 3, and he doesn’t make it at LT but moves to LG or RT and is a pro bowl caliber player for ten years.  Would that really be that bad?   Who cares if he was taken 5 spots ahead of some theoretical ranking.   That’s really not a “reach” especially given the need for quality O-linemen on this team.  

This. 

Drives me crazy every year when so called draft experts talk about a guy as not being good value in the top 5, but good value at 8 or 10.  Anywhere in the top 10 you want a very good, Pro Bowl claiber starter.  If Williams were to go 8, and is a very good starter in this league for he next decade and a very good pick at 8.  Then he is also a good pick at 3.  The only difference is the other guys you passed over at 3.  We are not talking about reaching for a 2nd or 3rd round caliber player at 3.  And if he is a bust at 3, he would probably still be a bust at 8.

How about our GM recognize that BPA could or should be about getting the player that improves your team the most.  And that very well could be Jonah Williams (athough I will reserve judgement, at least until after I see how he handles your defensive front next week).

 

[maury77]

14 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Why do you assume Williams isn’t a franchise LT?   Because some draft pundits thinks his arms are a 1/2” shorter than ideal?   So let’s say if the Jets take Williams at 3, and he doesn’t make it at LT but moves to LG or RT and is a pro bowl caliber player for ten years.  Would that really be that bad?   Who cares if he was taken 5 spots ahead of some theoretical ranking.   That’s really not a “reach” especially given the need for quality O-linemen on this team.  

Remember when Joe Thomas was coming out for the draft and people were calling him T Rex because of his arms? @RobR pointed this out in another thread, but Williams is so accurate with his punch that I can deal with his arms being a 1/2" shorter than ideal. 

[sec101row23]

Just now, maury77 said:

Remember when Joe Thomas was coming out for the draft and people were calling him T Rex because of his arms? @RobR pointed this out in another thread, but Williams is so accurate with his punch that I can deal with his arms being a 1/2" shorter than ideal. 

Plus he has good feet, which is the most important skill set.   

[jetstream23]

56 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Why do you assume Williams isn’t a franchise LT?   Because some draft pundits thinks his arms are a 1/2” shorter than ideal?   So let’s say if the Jets take Williams at 3, and he doesn’t make it at LT but moves to LG or RT and is a pro bowl caliber player for ten years.  Would that really be that bad?   Who cares if he was taken 5 spots ahead of some theoretical ranking.   That’s really not a “reach” especially given the need for quality O-linemen on this team.  

With the history of this organization, I'd take a drafted Pro Bowl LG or RT in a second.  It's just that, similar to Safety, LG isn't really a premiere position and not worthy of the #3 overall pick.   It's not like we'd be getting a Quenton Nelson here and we'd be taking him 3 spots earlier than Nelson!  That just seems crazy to me in a Draft loaded with pass rushers which is also a HUGE need for this team.

[Untouchable]

2 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

With the history of this organization, I'd take a drafted Pro Bowl LG or RT in a second.  It's just that, similar to Safety, LG isn't really a premiere position and not worthy of the #3 overall pick.   It's not like we'd be getting a Quenton Nelson here and we'd be taking him 3 spots earlier than Nelson!  That just seems crazy to me in a Draft loaded with pass rushers which is also a HUGE need for this team.

I think it’s very possible (if not likely) that Bosa and Allen are the first two picks in the draft.

If that’s the case, I’m taking Jonah Williams all day everyday over someone like Ferrell, Q. Williams or Oliver, even if a guy like Williams or Oliver technically grades out higher.

Macc should really ditch his precious “BAP” philosophy this year, at least when it comes to pick #3.

Just give me a good offensive player to help out Darnold a bit. I wouldn’t even be against taking Brown/Metcalf that high.

[BCJet]

3 hours ago, Untouchable said:

I think it’s very possible (if not likely) that Bosa and Allen are the first two picks in the draft.

If that’s the case, I’m taking Jonah Williams all day everyday over someone like Ferrell, Q. Williams or Oliver, even if a guy like Williams or Oliver technically grades out higher.

Macc should really ditch his precious “BAP” philosophy this year, at least when it comes to pick #3.

Just give me a good offensive player to help out Darnold a bit. I wouldn’t even be against taking Brown/Metcalf that high.

Doesnt Arizona also need a LT?

**Sorry, I thought Arizona picked 2

[Untouchable]

1 minute ago, BCJet said:

Doesnt Arizona also need a LT?

No way in hell they’re taking Williams #1 overall.

It would be a shock so big it would send tremors through the f*cking ground if they don’t take Bosa.

[Paradis]

I think both views (Rob's & Co) and Jetstreamer have merit. 

I don't know LTs, but the community as a whole seems divided on Jonah's potential.. I dont' care about drafting some one 5-10 spots early. As others have pointed out, who cares. In 2-3 years, it means nothing... but I do care about passing on say Josh Allen for an OT who really should be going near the end of round 1... that's the definition of wearing blinders. 

Let's see how he fares in the N.T. game, and where things go from there. He's option #4 after Allen, Bosa, and trade back fall through. 

[cant wait]

1 hour ago, Paradis said:

I think both views (Rob's & Co) and Jetstreamer have merit. 

I don't know LTs, but the community as a whole seems divided on Jonah's potential.. I dont' care about drafting some one 5-10 spots early. As others have pointed out, who cares. In 2-3 years, it means nothing... but I do care about passing on say Josh Allen for an OT who really should be going near the end of round 1... that's the definition of wearing blinders. 

Let's see how he fares in the N.T. game, and where things go from there. He's option #4 after Allen, Bosa, and trade back fall through. 

as of right now allen is the betting favorite to go #2. 49ers fans seem to agree too

[Paradis]

4 minutes ago, cant wait said:

as of right now allen is the betting favorite to go #2. 49ers fans seem to agree too

that's going to be a real pickle to predict... in recent years, they've invested in the 2 Oregon DE/DTs + the overrated Soloman Thomas - do they really go OLB?.. I guess the same could be said about us. 

I'm also not sold on Bosa being the defacto number 1 yet. 

[cant wait]

20 minutes ago, Paradis said:

that's going to be a real pickle to predict... in recent years, they've invested in the 2 Oregon DE/DTs + the overrated Soloman Thomas - do they really go OLB?.. I guess the same could be said about us. 

I'm also not sold on Bosa being the defacto number 1 yet. 

thomas is the key, I thought he was supposed to be their edge guy but he’s been such an epic bust that popular opinion is that SF needs to turn him into a 5-tech in order to save face on him. at least according to my one friend who’s a fan lol. plus I think drafting allen would let them walk away from armstead and save $9M on the cap

[sec101row23]

8 minutes ago, cant wait said:

thomas is the key, I thought he was supposed to be their edge guy but he’s been such an epic bust that popular opinion is that SF needs to turn him into a 5-tech in order to save face on him. at least according to my one friend who’s a fan lol. plus I think drafting allen would let them walk away from armstead and save $9M on the cap

Agreed.  SF needs a true 3-4 OLB as bad as the Jets do (provided they stay as a base 3-4 defense).   He would be ideal for both teams.  Maybe Allen is even in play for Arizona if they switch schemes with their new staff.   

[cant wait]

13 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Agreed.  SF needs a true 3-4 OLB as bad as the Jets do (provided they stay as a base 3-4 defense).   He would be ideal for both teams.  Maybe Allen is even in play for Arizona if they switch schemes with their new staff.   

I think AZ follows the bears model and loads up on QB killers to attack their division with bosa + jones. best case scenario for jets IMO is either jax or NYG trades into the top 3 for their QB

[Paradis]

22 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Agreed.  SF needs a true 3-4 OLB as bad as the Jets do (provided they stay as a base 3-4 defense).   He would be ideal for both teams.  Maybe Allen is even in play for Arizona if they switch schemes with their new staff.   

Let’s say we flip schemes (about 4 years too  late)... does that change our board. Is Q. Williams suddenly something we can stomach? 

[sec101row23]

6 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Let’s say we flip schemes (about 4 years too  late)... does that change our board. Is Q. Williams suddenly something we can stomach? 

Ugghhhhh.  He probably should be, but I don’t know if I could handle that...Lol..

 

[sec101row23]

14 minutes ago, cant wait said:

I think AZ follows the bears model and loads up on QB killers to attack their division with bosa + jones. best case scenario for jets IMO is either jax or NYG trades into the top 3 for their QB

Sure trading back is ideal, but I see that as pretty unlikely considering this class.  

[artemusclyde]

On 12/31/2018 at 5:44 AM, maury77 said:

Remember when Joe Thomas was coming out for the draft and people were calling him T Rex because of his arms? @RobR pointed this out in another thread, but Williams is so accurate with his punch that I can deal with his arms being a 1/2" shorter than ideal. 

Joe Thomas is 6'6-6'7, he has the height/frame to make up for short arms. I doubt Jonah Williams is even 6'5 when it's all said and done.

[jetstream23]

On 12/31/2018 at 2:04 PM, Paradis said:

I think both views (Rob's & Co) and Jetstreamer have merit. 

I don't know LTs, but the community as a whole seems divided on Jonah's potential.. I dont' care about drafting some one 5-10 spots early. As others have pointed out, who cares. In 2-3 years, it means nothing... but I do care about passing on say Josh Allen for an OT who really should be going near the end of round 1... that's the definition of wearing blinders. 

Let's see how he fares in the N.T. game, and where things go from there. He's option #4 after Allen, Bosa, and trade back fall through. 

I think that’s exactly where I am. Bosa, Allen, trade back or Jonah Williams.

With Shell’s injury and Williams’ flexibility I like the idea of Jonah at RT next year before moving him in to replace Beachum at LT in 2020.

My concern with Williams is that he just doesn’t scream Top 3 to me. I don’t see an Orlando Pace, Joe Thomas or Jonathan Ogden type prospect in him. 

[Greenseed4]

Can anyone tell me just how long his arms are, or are we just parroting what ONE guy said one time?!

 

[Chrebetfan80]

12 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I think that’s exactly where I am. Bosa, Allen, trade back or Jonah Williams.

With Shell’s injury and Williams’ flexibility I like the idea of Jonah at RT next year before moving him in to replace Beachum at LT in 2020.

My concern with Williams is that he just doesn’t scream Top 3 to me. I don’t see an Orlando Pace, Joe Thomas or Jonathan Ogden type prospect in him. 

Shell is only going to be shut down for the next 6 weeks, so he'll be a full go for OTA's and TC.  Doesnt effect the offseason as much now.

 

For me I agree with you and Paradis, I need to get my hands on a little more tape from some of my college coaching connections, but allen so far from just games I've watched is my number 1.  Especially if we stay as a 3-4, if we go to a 4-3 then yea bosa flops with him.  But as a 3-4 team, we havent seen a prospect that can drop as naturally or rush as well as allen in a while.  

 

I would love jonah if we were sitting at like say 6. at 3 I can take it but i wont love it especially if we passed up on allen for it. 

[jetstream23]

10 minutes ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

Shell is only going to be shut down for the next 6 weeks, so he'll be a full go for OTA's and TC.  Doesnt effect the offseason as much now.

 

For me I agree with you and Paradis, I need to get my hands on a little more tape from some of my college coaching connections, but allen so far from just games I've watched is my number 1.  Especially if we stay as a 3-4, if we go to a 4-3 then yea bosa flops with him.  But as a 3-4 team, we havent seen a prospect that can drop as naturally or rush as well as allen in a while.  

 

I would love jonah if we were sitting at like say 6. at 3 I can take it but i wont love it especially if we passed up on allen for it. 

I hate to get nitpicky on where to take guys, I just have hard time with Jonah Williams as a Top 3 pick in an NFL Draft with all this talent.  Regardless of position and based purely on projection as a NFL player, most evaluators seem to at least 5 - 7 guys in front of Jonah Williams.

He looks to be an excellent player and the best OT but just doesn't seem like a Top 3 guy.  I'd love to trade down a few spots and still get him, but I think that would be risky and somebody could jump in front of the Jets if they did something like trade back from 3 to 7 with Jacksonville.

[Chrebetfan80]

2 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

I hate to get nitpicky on where to take guys, I just have hard time with Jonah Williams as a Top 3 pick in an NFL Draft with all this talent.  Regardless of position and based purely on projection as a NFL player, most evaluators seem to at least 5 - 7 guys in front of Jonah Williams.

He looks to be an excellent player and the best OT but just doesn't seem like a Top 3 guy.  I'd love to trade down a few spots and still get him, but I think that would be risky and somebody could jump in front of the Jets if they did something like trade back from 3 to 7 with Jacksonville.

I dont like getting nitpicky either but when youre the jets you cant just pigeon hole a need and say WE MUST FILL THIS!!! which a lot of people are doing with williams.  

 

Yes we need OL, yes we need to draft them, BUT I'm not drafting Williams no matter what.  thats just lunacy, i think he's a really great college lineman, extremely technically sound, good athlete for the position, only downside is he's not as big really as youd want.  Thats really where the pundits stumble on where to play him, its not that he's not good enough to play LT its more that people arent sure he'll be able to thrive there like he possibly may be able to at guard.  Personally i think he can be a good LT in the league.. Do i think he's a Tyron smith, Dbrick, Ogden type? No i do not, but I think he can be a very Solid LT at the pro level. 

 

Like I said if Allen is there, I dont know how you can pass on him for Williams.  He's just that much better of a prospect regardless of position. On top of that Allen also fills a Need. To me it just doesnt make sense to take Williams over Allen at this point. 

[nycdan]

Let's make it more challenging.  What if Bosa and Allen go 1-2 and you are looking at Quinnen Williams vs. Jonah Williams?  Or do you go another way?

[RobR]

6 hours ago, nycdan said:

Let's make it more challenging.  What if Bosa and Allen go 1-2 and you are looking at Quinnen Williams vs. Jonah Williams?  Or do you go another way?

I would draft Jonah 100 times out of 100. It's so early in the process but I believe once everything gets fleshed out Jonah will be considered a Top 5 pick on almost every board.

[jetstream23]

Is there any way to get a camera iso on the Jonah Williams vs. Clelin Ferrell matchup in the CFB Championship Game?  I know ESPN does different things on different channels (like a coach's room, a field level cam from behind the QB, etc.)

Are we expecting that will be the matchup for most of the game or does Ferrell move around a lot?

My guess is that this game causes one of these guys to rise and one to fall.  If Clelin gets two sacks vs. Jonah Williams he could solidify himself a spot in the Top 5.  If Jonah largely shuts him out or makes Clelin just a minor factor then I think we're looking at our #3 pick.

Am I overstating the importance of this game?  It's real football with high stakes, not a Combine, not a Senior Bowl, etc.  To me, this is the best evaluation window we might get on both of these men.

[sec101row23]

52 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Is there any way to get a camera iso on the Jonah Williams vs. Clelin Ferrell matchup in the CFB Championship Game?  I know ESPN does different things on different channels (like a coach's room, a field level cam from behind the QB, etc.)

Are we expecting that will be the matchup for most of the game or does Ferrell move around a lot?

My guess is that this game causes one of these guys to rise and one to fall.  If Clelin gets two sacks vs. Jonah Williams he could solidify himself a spot in the Top 5.  If Jonah largely shuts him out or makes Clelin just a minor factor then I think we're looking at our #3 pick.

Am I overstating the importance of this game?  It's real football with high stakes, not a Combine, not a Senior Bowl, etc.  To me, this is the best evaluation window we might get on both of these men.

I think you might be overstating it a little.  Sure it’s good for either one to beat the other, but it’s still one game.  Williams handled  Ferrell last year.  I wouldn’t expect to see a Williams/Ferrell match up on every snap though, CU will move around their ends and you’ll see Bryant and Thomas go up against Williams.   Still good tests for Williams though.  

Also, I’m pretty sure ESPN has one of their channels with a 4 camera view, not sure there is an iso on just the LT though.  

[bigalbarracuda]

On 1/3/2019 at 3:42 PM, nycdan said:

Let's make it more challenging.  What if Bosa and Allen go 1-2 and you are looking at Quinnen Williams vs. Jonah Williams?  Or do you go another way?

That's my biggest question. At what point do you just take the best trade down offer? At which point is trading down not worth it? In this draft my appetite for trading down is pretty high, so much so that I would take a less than ideal package in order to net more picks. 

Ideally we'd trade back into the higher single digits (7, 8, 9) and net at least a 2nd rounder.... but I would absolutely take #15 from the Redskins along with their 2nd (#46). They need a long term QB so I'm looking at them as a strong target. 

[nycdan]

22 minutes ago, bigalbarracuda said:

That's my biggest question. At what point do you just take the best trade down offer? At which point is trading down not worth it? In this draft my appetite for trading down is pretty high, so much so that I would take a less than ideal package in order to net more picks. 

Ideally we'd trade back into the higher single digits (7, 8, 9) and net at least a 2nd rounder.... but I would absolutely take #15 from the Redskins along with their 2nd (#46). They need a long term QB so I'm looking at them as a strong target. 

We used 3 2nd round picks to go from 6 to 3.  There is no way we can trade from 3 to 15 for only a second round pick the following year.  Under-chart is one thing.  That's GM suicide.

[bigalbarracuda]

Well that's the question... at what point is it worth it for the GM to gain an extra pick because he doesn't like his options at #3? IMO the value in this draft is so different than last years that you can't really compare. 

I'd personally be much more upset with Macc if he stayed at #3 and took Quinnen or Greedy.