JN Film Room: Nick Bosa

[maury77]

Hey, the Jets suck again and we are back to reviewing draft prospects. We already did one on Jonah Williams. Let's take a look at Nick Bosa. Yes, the Jets probably won't have a shot at him, but they said the same thing about Leo, Adams and Darnold. 

 

[maury77]

* Insanely quick off the snap

* twitchy athlete with adequate length and a good build

* really good awareness, you don't see him take a lot of false steps

* good hand usage when he remembers to

* very good upper body flexibility as you see him dip and narrow to get past blockers

* not super bendy off the edge, but gets the corner through hand usage and dipping his upper body

* has a couple of different pass rush moves, but didn't see a lot of countering when his first move didn't work (which, frankly, wasn't often)

* he looks leaner, quicker and stronger in his 2018 tape then he does in his 2017 tape (is he going to get even stronger and faster when he gets to the pros?)

* no footage of him dropping back, so that could be a weakness if he is asked to drop back 

Overall, I can see why so many are mocking him number one overall. The dude is a straight up beast. 

 

[Maxman]

3 hours ago, maury77 said:

* Insanely quick off the snap

* twitchy athlete with adequate length and a good build

* really good awareness, you don't see him take a lot of false steps

* good hand usage when he remembers to

* very good upper body flexibility as you see him dip and narrow to get past blockers

* not super bendy off the edge, but gets the corner through hand usage and dipping his upper body

* has a couple of different pass rush moves, but didn't see a lot of countering when his first move didn't work (which, frankly, wasn't often)

* he looks leaner, quicker and stronger in his 2018 tape then he does in his 2017 tape (is he going to get even stronger and faster when he gets to the pros?)

* no footage of him dropping back, so that could be a weakness if he is asked to drop back 

Overall, I can see why so many are mocking him number one overall. The dude is a straight up beast. 

 

The next head coach is going to be an offensive guy. That should be the only defensive question they as him.

If you had Bosa what would you ask of him coverage wise. If he says anything, he doesn't get the job. 

[sec101row23]

Yea, but he plays defense.  

The injury history of the Bosa boys is somewhat concerning   

 

 

[Larz]

He quit on his team

Yeah he might not have made it back but

yeah no thanks

[Bugg]

On 11/17/2018 at 5:32 PM, Larz said:

He quit on his team

Yeah he might not have made it back but

yeah no thanks

Unique situation; he knows he is going to be a top 3 pick, and All Pro his brother held out to start his career with the Bolts with no loss of income nor production. He is in fact injured, though whether it's really bad enough to not play against Michigan this weekend or in a bowl game in 6 weeks, who really knows. Clowney pulled the same thing. If OSU was a lock for the top 4 imagine he would be playing. Simply he's the only defender the Jets should even consider. If he is there, it's a no brainer. If not trade down and stockpile bodies. 

[Lith]

I think my worst draft nightmare right now is Bosa falling to us and we take him.  Not because I don't think he will be a great player, because he will.  It is just that coming off injury and the total neglect of OL and offensive playmakers over the last 4 years, we need to spend resource on offense. 

If we are picking 3 or 4 and Bosa does fall to us, I sure hope we can trade back.  Someone would likely be willing to give up a lot to come get him.  A team like the Packers would be an ideal partner.  They reportedly were in on the Mack sweepstakes but lost him to a Division rival.  They have a limited window with Rodgers to win in the next few years.  They have two 1s this year.  Perfect trade partner to come get Bosa.  Even if not the Packers -- I assume someone else would want to come up and get him.

But, assuming Macc is still our GM, he likely would be too good a value to pass on.

[Matt39]

21 minutes ago, Lith said:

I think my worst draft nightmare right now is Bosa falling to us and we take him.  Not because I don't think he will be a great player, because he will.  It is just that coming off injury and the total neglect of OL and offensive playmakers over the last 4 years, we need to spend resource on offense. 

If we are picking 3 or 4 and Bosa does fall to us, I sure hope we can trade back.  Someone would likely be willing to give up a lot to come get him.  A team like the Packers would be an ideal partner.  They reportedly were in on the Mack sweepstakes but lost him to a Division rival.  They have a limited window with Rodgers to win in the next few years.  They have two 1s this year.  Perfect trade partner to come get Bosa.  Even if not the Packers -- I assume someone else would want to come up and get him.

But, assuming Macc is still our GM, he likely would be too good a value to pass on.

Taking Bosa I think would be fine as long as there's a total change in philosophy as it relates to the draft. Pass rushers are critical. I'd guess he's the best one available. Using resources on safeties and DT's just has to stop. The Nathan Shepherd pick was beyond outrageous. 

[JustInFudge]

5 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Taking Bosa I think would be fine as long as there's a total change in philosophy as it relates to the draft. Pass rushers are critical. I'd guess he's the best one available. Using resources on safeties and DT's just has to stop. The Nathan Shepherd pick was beyond outrageous. 

I dont think you force top 10 picks because of need.  You just have to take the premium positions and pass rusher is certainly one and if Bosa is the guy, you take him 100%.  

But if you do, every single other move this team makes should be revolved around offense.  FA $ and draft should be 100% totally devoted to offense.

 

[Matt39]

13 minutes ago, JiF said:

I dont think you force top 10 picks because of need.  You just have to take the premium positions and pass rusher is certainly one and if Bosa is the guy, you take him 100%.  

But if you do, every single other move this team makes should be revolved around offense.  FA $ and draft should be 100% totally devoted to offense.

 

Agreed. There are some decent under the radar WR's scheduled to hit FA. Overpay if you have to. Conley from the Chiefs and Humphries from the Bucs are proven to be at least decent targets. Sign them. Draft a couple of backs and load up on OL. Paying Bell would be insane imo.

[#27TheDominator]

21 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Agreed. There are some decent under the radar WR's scheduled to hit FA. Overpay if you have to. Conley from the Chiefs and Humphries from the Bucs are proven to be at least decent targets. Sign them. Draft a couple of backs and load up on OL. Paying Bell would be insane imo.

Conley?  I love the guy.  Athletic freak, good attitude, but he has never gotten more than 530 for a season or even 40 ypg. 

[Matt39]

9 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Conley?  I love the guy.  Athletic freak, good attitude, but he has never gotten more than 530 for a season or even 40 ypg. 

I think I he’d be a decent signing. Won’t break the bank. Good depth and better than the what the Jets are trotting out there for the most part. Humphries would be the week 1 slot starter.

[#27TheDominator]

11 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

I think I he’d be a decent signing. Won’t break the bank. Good depth and better than the what the Jets are trotting out there for the most part. Humphries would be the week 1 slot starter.

That's the thing.  I am not sure they are better than what we are trotting out there.  WR can be tough to analyze.  Is a guy producing because he is the only WR on the team and gets a ton of targets (2016 Terrelle Pryor) or is he being propped up by having a stud across from him drawing coverage?  Either would be okay, but certainly would not satiate this mobs ranting about getting a #1, though at least Conley looks the part.

[Matt39]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

That's the thing.  I am not sure they are better than what we are trotting out there.  WR can be tough to analyze.  Is a guy producing because he is the only WR on the team and gets a ton of targets (2016 Terrelle Pryor) or is he being propped up by having a stud across from him drawing coverage?  Either would be okay, but certainly would not satiate this mobs ranting about getting a #1, though at least Conley looks the part.

I think every effort needs to be made to improve the offense that’s not blindly handing Bell a black check. Signing Conely and/or Humphries shouldn’t preclude the Jets from drafting a receiver early, even though with this regime it certainly would, which is what has happened with running back.

[JustInFudge]

51 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Agreed. There are some decent under the radar WR's scheduled to hit FA. Overpay if you have to. Conley from the Chiefs and Humphries from the Bucs are proven to be at least decent targets. Sign them. Draft a couple of backs and load up on OL. Paying Bell would be insane imo.

I’d pay for Bell.  Mainly becasue the repercussions of another colossal failure this offseason from Mac could be absolutely devastating to the development of Darnold (or whatever QB is out there). And quite frankly, as a fan, this team is boring me to death and Bell is one of my favorite players ever to watch.  He’s amazing, you rarely find RBs with his patience and vision coupled with elite receiving skills.  Basically, I’d rather pay for the real deal rather than go cheap and hope to find that emerging player who never develops into more than a JAG or trust Mac in the draft.

Or another way of looking at it is:

1 Bell >>>>> a Crowell, Pryor, Long and whatever JAG you want to add who ultimately sucks 

[Matt39]

1 minute ago, JiF said:

I’d pay for Bell.  Mainly becasue the repercussions of another colossal failure this offseason from Mac could be absolutely devastating to the development of Darnold (or whatever QB is out there). And quite frankly, as a fan, this team is boring me to death and Bell is one of my favorite players ever to watch.  He’s amazing, you rarely find RBs with his patience and vision coupled with elite receiving skills.  Basically, I’d rather pay for the real deal rather than go cheap and hope to find that emerging player who never develops into more than a JAG or trust Mac in the draft.

Or another way of looking at it is:

1 Bell >>>>> a Crowell, Pryor, Long and whatever JAG you want to add who ultimately sucks 

Yeah I don’t love Bell enough to pay him what he wants. He’s got great patience at the line but doesn’t have breakaway speed nor would he be the receiving threat here. Plus I don’t trust him. If the Jets would just stop ignoring the position outright they’d be fine.

[JustInFudge]

36 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

I think I he’d be a decent signing. Won’t break the bank. Good depth and better than the what the Jets are trotting out there for the most part. Humphries would be the week 1 slot starter.

This is actually case in point why I want Bell.  History has been very unkind to these types of FA signings.  

When was the last JAG type offseason signing ever that went somewhere else and their career blossomed?  I'm not sure I can think of a single example, most of the time, they end up being the same exact dude or worse.

Like I look at these dudes as no more or less than a JAG like Donte Moncrief.  Homeboy got 10 mil on the open market this season.  10 million dollars for Donte freaking Moncrief.  F that.

[JustInFudge]

9 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Yeah I don’t love Bell enough to pay him what he wants. He’s got great patience at the line but doesn’t have breakaway speed nor would he be the receiving threat here. Plus I don’t trust him. If the Jets would just stop ignoring the position outright they’d be fine.

That I disagree with wholeheartedly.  

What, you're not a fan of Crowell, Cannon and McGuire?...because trust me with Mac's track record, you're not getting anything better. 

[Matt39]

12 minutes ago, JiF said:

That I disagree with wholeheartedly.  

What, you're not a fan of Crowell, Cannon and McGuire?...because trust me with Mac's track record, you're not getting anything better. 

I mean how hard is it to draft Nick Chubb if you watch any college football?

Bells longest run in 2017 was 27 yards fwiw

[maury77]

54 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Yeah I don’t love Bell enough to pay him what he wants. He’s got great patience at the line but doesn’t have breakaway speed nor would he be the receiving threat here. Plus I don’t trust him. If the Jets would just stop ignoring the position outright they’d be fine.

Why would he not be a receiving threat here?

[JustInFudge]

31 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

I mean how hard is it to draft Nick Chubb if you watch any college football?

Bells longest run in 2017 was 27 yards fwiw

Kamara, Hunt, Chubb, Cook, Johnson, etc etc..the list goes on.

Bell has an 80 yarder and multiple +40 in his career both in the passing game and running game as recent as last year.  He can break away plenty.

Crow has break away runs of 50+ and he's absolutely one of the worst RB's I've ever seen in my life. 

[Matt39]

6 minutes ago, maury77 said:

Why would he not be a receiving threat here?

Because the Jets and he’s been fed the ball in Pittsburgh. I don’t think Bells an overly dynamic receiver like Kamara or even Gurley.

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

Because the Jets and he’s been fed the ball in Pittsburgh. I don’t think Bells an overly dynamic receiver like Kamara or even Gurley.

Even if he's not Kamara or Gurley in your estimation, so what?  He's not good enough because he's not the best? 

I dont know man, getting someone that is going to give you 2k+ in yards and 10 TD's+ a year seems like a dream come true around these parts.  

 

[Philc1]

This guy is why I’m rooting for everyone to beat the jets rest of the way

 

 

 

[Matt39]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

Even if he's not Kamara or Gurley in your estimation, so what?  He's not good enough because he's not the best? 

I dont know man, getting someone that is going to give you 2k+ in yards and 10 TD's+ a year seems like a dream come true around these parts.  

 

Im extremely doubtful Bell would come close to putting up those numbers with the Jets. He never was a jump off the page type of back like Gurley or Kamara to me. Zeke too.

[JustInFudge]

7 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Im extremely doubtful Bell would come close to putting up those numbers with the Jets. He never was a jump off the page type of back like Gurley or Kamara to me. Zeke too.

Right on.  Agree to disagree.  I doubt we get him anyway because things that I want to happen with the Jets from a player attraction stand point never come true.  So I totally jinxed this one.

[Lith]

19 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Taking Bosa I think would be fine as long as there's a total change in philosophy as it relates to the draft. Pass rushers are critical. I'd guess he's the best one available. Using resources on safeties and DT's just has to stop. The Nathan Shepherd pick was beyond outrageous. 

Most years, I would agree with you.  But given where we are right now.  With a promising young QB who is struggling.  There is no greater priority in my mind than taking care of that young QB and putting him in a position to succeed.  I am not suggesting that we reach for an OT just for the sake of taking an OT, but if a guy like Jonah Williams is available, then I would prefer to take him ahead of the pass rusher, even if Bosa may be the better player.  If a a legit Top 10 OT is not there, I wouldn't reach for a late first round talent.  I would rather see us trade back and buld the offense than take Bosa.

We can't be sitting here next year saying we still don't know what we have in Sam -- no weapons, bad OL, coaching, etc.  Protect him, surround him with weapons and if he still does not succeed, then at least we know it is on him.

[Philc1]

Bomb 4 Bosa

 

lets go Cindy and Belicheat put 100 points on us in your 2 games

[Bruce Harper]

You guys are the experts, so I will take your word for it that this guy is worthy of a top 3 pick.  But am I crazy that it looks to me like he doesn't finish a lot of plays?  I know it's hard for 300 lb guys to run hard all the time but it looks to me like he goes hard until it becomes apparent that he is not going to get a sack or a TFL.  There was one goal line stand in particular when Ohio State was pushing the RB back and he seemed to be standing there looking rather than trying to help push the guy back.

[Thai Jet]

On 11/16/2018 at 7:24 PM, maury77 said:

* Insanely quick off the snap

* twitchy athlete with adequate length and a good build

* really good awareness, you don't see him take a lot of false steps

* good hand usage when he remembers to

* very good upper body flexibility as you see him dip and narrow to get past blockers

* not super bendy off the edge, but gets the corner through hand usage and dipping his upper body

* has a couple of different pass rush moves, but didn't see a lot of countering when his first move didn't work (which, frankly, wasn't often)

* he looks leaner, quicker and stronger in his 2018 tape then he does in his 2017 tape (is he going to get even stronger and faster when he gets to the pros?)

* no footage of him dropping back, so that could be a weakness if he is asked to drop back 

Overall, I can see why so many are mocking him number one overall. The dude is a straight up beast. 

 

Thanks Maury

[Jerichoholic]

I mean how hard is it to draft Nick Chubb if you watch any college football?
Bells longest run in 2017 was 27 yards fwiw

Or Keryon Johnson. The list of available rbs was not small.

What has, in hindsight, pushed me over the edge on Mac is the Stewart/Hansen picks. Both of these picks were clearly just crap shoots ... hope one out of the two is good enough to contribute ( only reason you take both back to back).

If you’re treating the draft with that kind of mentality you suck at drafting.

Time for a gm who has a plan for the players they draft rather than hopes of desperation.


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[Philc1]

The biggest problem with our defense besides Bowles is we haven’t had a legit pass rush in 13 freakin years

 

draft Bosa at 1 or Allen if we end up picking at 3 or 4

[Jetmech]

Some people had Joey Bosa as a fraud during the draft and probably will do the same with Nick.

I never did get the hate...

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