2019 Senior Bowl News and Invites.

[CTJetsFan]

10 hours ago, RobR said:

Finally getting some time to look through these practices and the first person that jumps out is Deebo Samuel. He's smooth, quick and can gain separation.

@Paradis So far I've watched two bad reps from your guy Howard but I like him. QB>TE>LT and now he's huge and measured great. I need to watch some more of him during the week but he looks like someone a good staff could develop.  He needs coaching but the feet are there.   

Samuel reminds me of a Laveranues Coles

[Paradis]

12 hours ago, RobR said:

Finally getting some time to look through these practices and the first person that jumps out is Deebo Samuel. He's smooth, quick and can gain separation.

@Paradis So far I've watched two bad reps from your guy Howard but I like him. QB>TE>LT and now he's huge and measured great. I need to watch some more of him during the week but he looks like someone a good staff could develop.  He needs coaching but the feet are there.   

Yea, Samuel really reminded us the gap between someone of his talent level and some of these other guys just trying to prove they belong in the NFL:... I think Samuel just got forgotten about a little, because he looks to be on the rise... (but, that's perceived draft media rise, he's probably always been in the top 5 for most "actually" team scouting departments.

+OG Nate Davis. Forgot he was attending. Watch for him and share thoughts. 

[#27TheDominator]

This is what I am talking about when reading reports instead of watching. @RobR and @KRL describe Samuel as "smooth" and then @CTJetsFan compares him to Coles.  I liked Coles, but one thing he wasn't, was smooth.  Guess I will have to see for myself.

[CTJetsFan]

59 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

This is what I am talking about when reading reports instead of watching. @RobR and @KRL describe Samuel as "smooth" and then @CTJetsFan compares him to Coles.  I liked Coles, but one thing he wasn't, was smooth.  Guess I will have to see for myself.

#27TheDominator - my comparison was based more on build and the way he catches the ball, not so much on his route running. Also just based on what I saw from first SB practice. In my mind, Lav was a small but physical receiver who seemed to play bigger than his size but  a little slower than his 40 time

[JustInFudge]

On 1/22/2019 at 3:38 PM, Paradis said:

 

Anthony Johnson is turning heads early as well. Maybe after the SB he'll recapture the day 2 grade that seemed to inexplicably disappear in 2019. 

 

I'd like to see that 1st route at a different angle.  It looks like he put something on the defender but you cant tell specifically because that corner also looks Dee Milliner-ish with his technique or lack there of.

That 2nd video is scary.   Sure it's great he wins the hands battle/positioning here but that's a dangerous sloppy route vs. a legit NFL corner. 

[JustInFudge]

4 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

This is what I am talking about when reading reports instead of watching. @RobR and @KRL describe Samuel as "smooth" and then @CTJetsFan compares him to Coles.  I liked Coles, but one thing he wasn't, was smooth.  Guess I will have to see for myself.

As Deebo's personal JN agent, I dont see the Coles comparison really at all.

In my thread about him, there is some footage and a couple of clips from today.  Dude has some crazy footwork and can put guys on a tilt quick.  He's a game breaker with ball in hands too.  My high end comparison was Anquan Boldin.  We mentioned Stefon Diggs too. 

After watching the Pats the other night, I could see him killing a Julian Edelman like role in NE. 

I love the guy.  He's my fav.

[BCJet]

11 hours ago, KRL said:

First impression is the OLine class may not be top heavy but it appears deep.  Should be

able to get starter type talent in rounds 2-4

I read a Giants draft breakdown of BC guard Chris Lidstrom and at the end Pauline said he had him as a fourth round pick.  

I may be biased as a BC grad but the 4th round is preposterous for a kid with Lidstrom’s ability and experience in a pro-style, run based offense. In my opinion he is a plug and play RG and would be a steal if we got him in the 3rd. 

[RobR]

8 hours ago, Paradis said:

Yea, Samuel really reminded us the gap between someone of his talent level and some of these other guys just trying to prove they belong in the NFL:... I think Samuel just got forgotten about a little, because he looks to be on the rise... (but, that's perceived draft media rise, he's probably always been in the top 5 for most "actually" team scouting departments.

+OG Nate Davis. Forgot he was attending. Watch for him and share thoughts. 

Just watched some more from Howard and he is a project. I think the athletic ability is there but he needs a ton of work and it looks like he is almost in over his head right now. I think he went offsides on every individual drill they showed. 

Other guys that flashed to me (remember I'm a day behind on these practices) was Dillard who showed good feet and Daylon Mack the interior DLineman from A+M......what a load in the middle. 

[RobR]

3 hours ago, JiF said:

As Deebo's personal JN agent, I dont see the Coles comparison really at all.

In my thread about him, there is some footage and a couple of clips from today.  Dude has some crazy footwork and can put guys on a tilt quick.  He's a game breaker with ball in hands too.  My high end comparison was Anquan Boldin.  We mentioned Stefon Diggs too. 

After watching the Pats the other night, I could see him killing a Julian Edelman like role in NE. 

I love the guy.  He's my fav.

Good stuff here but I don't get the Boldin comparison. They have similar builds but Boldin was much taller and probably slower and used mostly on the outside during his career.

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, RobR said:

Just watched some more from Howard and he is a project. I think the athletic ability is there but he needs a ton of work and it looks like he is almost in over his head right now. I think he went offsides on every individual drill they showed. 

Other guys that flashed to me (remember I'm a day behind on these practices) was Dillard who showed good feet and Daylon Mack the interior DLineman from A+M......what a load in the middle. 

Don't want to come off as a contrarian, because I don't have the bandwidth presently to "digest" all the practice footage, but some of the thoughts you're sharing is counter to what i'm seeing and in some cases reading. Howard's been well received by most, and looked good for the most part in the clips i saw.

This is the kind of stuff that's circulating about him-- 

Quote

Draft Analyst's Tony Pauline writes that Alabama State T Tytus Howard was "as good as advertised" on Tuesday's Reese's Senior Bowl practice.

Howard measured in at 6-foot-5, 322-pounds on Tuesday, and then went on to have one of the better offensive lineman performances at practice in Pauline's eyes. "Lining up exclusively at right tackle, he looked explosive and athletic and blocked with great fundamentals," he writes. "For the most part, he got the better of the top-rated talent he faced off against including Montez Sweat, Oshane Ximines and Carl Granderson." There are going to be questions about Howard's lack of play against quality opponents, but those questions are going to get a lot of answers this week in Mobile. So far, so good.

Where as on the other hand, Dillard's been getting mixed reviews. Good looking feet, but got worked over good by some of the better pass rushers.

Anyway, take it for what it's worth.

1 hour ago, RobR said:

Good stuff here but I don't get the Boldin comparison. They have similar builds but Boldin was much taller and probably slower and used mostly on the outside during his career.

I thought of Boldin too btw for Samuel. Don't think he's a slot guy. I think he's a Z and he plays like Boldin. Not the 30 something year old bruiser, but the younger ARZ boldin shared some similarities with Samuel IMO. 

 

[RobR]

29 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Don't want to come off as a contrarian, because I don't have the bandwidth presently to "digest" all the practice footage, but some of the thoughts you're sharing is counter to what i'm seeing and in some cases reading. Howard's been well received by most, and looked good for the most part in the clips i saw.

This is the kind of stuff that's circulating about him-- 

Where as on the other hand, Dillard's been getting mixed reviews. Good looking feet, but got worked over good by some of the better pass rushers.

Anyway, take it for what it's worth.

I thought of Boldin too btw for Samuel. Don't think he's a slot guy. I think he's a Z and he plays like Boldin. Not the 30 something year old bruiser, but the younger ARZ boldin shared some similarities with Samuel IMO. 

 

Even though we are able to watch the practices we can't see every rep like the writers out there. What they showed of Howard was him jumping offsides, getting bullrushed, and generally playing off balance. I still don't hate the prospect and would like to see how he rebounds tomorrow. I like the size, I like his feet,.......after that I can work with him as a prospect.

 

Still not getting the Boldin comparisons but you and Jif have watched him much more than I have so I'll defer to your evaluations. Watching him at the SB I don't think I can come up with a comparison.....maybe a jacked up Cooks with less speed.

[HelenOfTroy]

On 1/23/2019 at 5:24 AM, KRL said:

First impression is the OLine class may not be top heavy but it appears deep.  Should be

able to get starter type talent in rounds 2-4

Look at Chuma Edoga out of USC in the later rounds.  

Kid had three different OL coaches at USC, showing well at the SB.  Former 5* player, familiar with Sam.  Good developmental player.

[Lith]

A little late to this party -- jsut got to watching some of the first day footage last night, but one small school guy that really jumped out at me in the 1 on 1s was Penny Hart, Wr from Georgia State.  Undersized at 5'8 180, but his quickness off the line looked elite.  No DBs could stay with the kid.  Not sure how he will do if a DB gets his hads on him at the line, but he was uncoverable in 1 v 1s.

Another guy that jumped out at me that I didn't know mucha bout was Keelan Doss -- ran soem really nice, crisp routes.  

[Lith]

4 hours ago, HelenOfTroy said:

Look at Chuma Edoga out of USC in the later rounds.  

Kid had three different OL coaches at USC, showing well at the SB.  Former 5* player, familiar with Sam.  Good developmental player.

A lot of guys talking him up today in twitter.  Sounds like he is having a good week.  Seen quite a few tweets like these:

 

[CTJetsFan]

4 hours ago, Lith said:

A little late to this party -- jsut got to watching some of the first day footage last night, but one small school guy that really jumped out at me in the 1 on 1s was Penny Hart, Wr from Georgia State.  Undersized at 5'8 180, but his quickness off the line looked elite.  No DBs could stay with the kid.  Not sure how he will do if a DB gets his hads on him at the line, but he was uncoverable in 1 v 1s.

Another guy that jumped out at me that I didn't know mucha bout was Keelan Doss -- ran soem really nice, crisp routes.  

+1 on Penny Hart. Made me say "Wow" a few times with his quickness and burst. If only he were 2 inches taller. Arms seem a little short too so small catch radius. Would still take a flyer on him late.

[CTJetsFan]

Dexter Williams (RB - ND) looked really good in team drills today. Seems like a solid 1 cut runner with good burst and some breakaway speed.

[Paradis]

4 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

Dexter Williams (RB - ND) looked really good in team drills today. Seems like a solid 1 cut runner with good burst and some breakaway speed.

Its gotten straight up absurd how the draft community is neglecting that man. He's Dalvin Cook lite, and i'm even sure he's that much lighter.

[Paradis]

4 hours ago, Lith said:

Another guy that jumped out at me that I didn't know mucha bout was Keelan Doss -- ran soem really nice, crisp routes.  

[CTJetsFan]

2 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Its gotten straight up absurd how the draft community is neglecting that man. He's Dalvin Cook lite, and i'm even sure he's that much lighter.

Any idea why?

[Paradis]

4 hours ago, Lith said:

A little late to this party -- jsut got to watching some of the first day footage last night, but one small school guy that really jumped out at me in the 1 on 1s was Penny Hart, Wr from Georgia State.  Undersized at 5'8 180, but his quickness off the line looked elite.  No DBs could stay with the kid.  Not sure how he will do if a DB gets his hads on him at the line, but he was uncoverable in 1 v 1s.

Another guy that jumped out at me that I didn't know mucha bout was Keelan Doss -- ran soem really nice, crisp routes.  

 

10 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

+1 on Penny Hart. Made me say "Wow" a few times with his quickness and burst. If only he were 2 inches taller. Arms seem a little short too so small catch radius. Would still take a flyer on him late.

I gotta tell you guys -- well actually i was trying the world, but you two will do.

It seems like every year, these twitchy 5'9 Sterling Shepards become the apple of the scouting community's eyes with their pinball ability to cut and dash all over the place...  Yet, like 5% of them make any kind of significant impact in the NFL IMO. 

I guess what i'm saying is, that today's NFL just doesn't support having that many Sterlings. There's just not a lot of need. Between what teams get out of James Whites and Kamaras, and the explosion of Flex/Joker TEs.... and we're seeing more and more Eric Decker sized slot WRs... 

There's just not that much demand for Penny Hart. Or Andy Isabella... and I'm not motivated to change that trend. Give me Josh Oliver instead. Mike Weber. Parris Campbell. etc. 

[CTJetsFan]

38 minutes ago, Lith said:

A lot of guys talking him up today in twitter.  Sounds like he is having a good week.  Seen quite a few tweets like these:

 

Showed great movement today. Very light on his feet. Probably needs to get a little stronger

[Paradis]

4 minutes ago, CTJetsFan said:

Any idea why?

No, that's why it's absurd. While you'll see his game film praised by deep divers like Matt Waldman -- the cosmetic draft community throws around these ambiguous concerns about agility or easy to tackle... or something... I'm like, child please. Are you blind? Watch him against anyone. Motherfcker is quick and has great feet (repeat, great feet) and when he cuts? Boom

[CTJetsFan]

2 minutes ago, Paradis said:

 

I gotta tell you guys -- well actually i was trying the world, but you two will do.

It seems like every year, these twitchy 5'9 Sterling Shepards become the apple of the scouting community's eyes with their pinball ability to cut and dash all over the place...  Yet, like 5% of them make any kind of significant impact in the NFL IMO. 

I guess what i'm saying is, that today's NFL just doesn't support having that many Sterlings. There's just not a lot of need. Between what teams get out of James Whites and Kamaras, and the explosion of Flex/Joker TEs.... and we're seeing more and more Eric Decker sized slot WRs... 

There's just not that much demand for Penny Hart. Or Andy Isabella... and I'm not motivated to change that trend. Give me Josh Oliver instead. Mike Weber. Parris Campbell. etc. 

Fair points. He may just be too small.....but from what I saw, no comparison between him and Isabella with regards to speed and cutting/breaks. No sure what Hart will run for a 40, but my first impression was a shorter Tyreek Hill. Again, may not be able to overcome his physical limitations (height and arm length) to make it, but IMO worth a 7th rounder or priority FA if he falls that far.

[HelenOfTroy]

 

[CTJetsFan]

7 minutes ago, Paradis said:

No, that's why it's absurd. While you'll see his game film praised by deep divers like Matt Waldman -- the cosmetic draft community throws around these ambiguous concerns about agility or easy to tackle... or something... I'm like, child please. Are you blind? Watch him against anyone. Motherfcker is quick and has great feet (repeat, great feet) and when he cuts? Boom

That is crazy. His YPC at ND the last 2 seasons is very impressive. I love them 1 cut runners that can plant and go.

[KRL]

Andre Dillard OT (Wash. St.) reminds me of Brick, long athletic but needs to increase his strength

David Sills WR (W. Va) not impressed at all, ton of college production but has had trouble getting
off press and has poor balance.  A lot of stumbling around coming out of his breaks

Hunter Renfrow WR (Clemson) not impressive physically but catches everything and gets open against
better athletes.  Will he be the next Welker, Edelman type of WR

Ben Banogu OLB/DE (TCU) very slippery getting to the QB all week, can he hold up as a 4-3 undersized
DE? 

[Lith]

50 minutes ago, Paradis said:

 

I gotta tell you guys -- well actually i was trying the world, but you two will do.

It seems like every year, these twitchy 5'9 Sterling Shepards become the apple of the scouting community's eyes with their pinball ability to cut and dash all over the place...  Yet, like 5% of them make any kind of significant impact in the NFL IMO. 

I guess what i'm saying is, that today's NFL just doesn't support having that many Sterlings. There's just not a lot of need. Between what teams get out of James Whites and Kamaras, and the explosion of Flex/Joker TEs.... and we're seeing more and more Eric Decker sized slot WRs... 

There's just not that much demand for Penny Hart. Or Andy Isabella... and I'm not motivated to change that trend. Give me Josh Oliver instead. Mike Weber. Parris Campbell. etc. 

I do not disagree with you at all.  He was a lot of fun to watch in drills--but the 1v1s are really set up so that these little, quick guys can shine.  The only way I would even consider him for NYJ would be as a returner if we can't re-sign Roberts.  He did return kicks and punts at Gerogia State.  If I knew he could contribute on special teams as returner/gunner, then anything he could give us on offense is a bonus.   If we re-sign Roberts, then give me a bigger WR who can play outside instead of a Hart/Isabella type.

[nyjbuddy]

3 hours ago, Lith said:

A lot of guys talking him up today in twitter.  Sounds like he is having a good week.  Seen quite a few tweets like these:

 

Has tremedous talent but a few red flags with Edoga.  Really inconsistent.  Got thrown out of the Utah State game for taking a swing at a player and then pushing the ref.  He was very emotional at the time but did not look good.  Faced a few injuries late in the seasons.  Also got suspended for violating team rules.

[CTJetsFan]

2 hours ago, Lith said:

I do not disagree with you at all.  He was a lot of fun to watch in drills--but the 1v1s are really set up so that these little, quick guys can shine.  The only way I would even consider him for NYJ would be as a returner if we can't re-sign Roberts.  He did return kicks and punts at Gerogia State.  If I knew he could contribute on special teams as returner/gunner, then anything he could give us on offense is a bonus.   If we re-sign Roberts, then give me a bigger WR who can play outside instead of a Hart/Isabella type.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2019-senior-bowl-penny-hart-overshadows-andy-isabella-on-thursday-l-j-collier-dalton-risner-shine/

[Paradis]

3 hours ago, Lith said:

I do not disagree with you at all.  He was a lot of fun to watch in drills--but the 1v1s are really set up so that these little, quick guys can shine.  The only way I would even consider him for NYJ would be as a returner if we can't re-sign Roberts.  He did return kicks and punts at Gerogia State.  If I knew he could contribute on special teams as returner/gunner, then anything he could give us on offense is a bonus.   If we re-sign Roberts, then give me a bigger WR who can play outside instead of a Hart/Isabella type.

*edit, i thought it read i disagree with you

I hear you. but seems like every year smaller quick twitch guys destroy these types drills and practices and such - then disappear into obscurity on sunday. I dunno. Maybe it's my perception.  

[Paradis]

FTR -- i'm not saying anything specific about any one prospect. I've spend zero time looking at Hart

[Paradis]

unrelated/related -- Although the Draft Network crew bring a whole new level of accessibility, their social media party boy culture is wearing thin on me. More sensationalizing, more tag lines and today i saw Cro make a remark and the dude got all twitter-douchebag on him..

It's like, man - what kind of example are you setting. Grow up.  

 

[Lith]

46 minutes ago, Paradis said:

*edit, i thought it read i disagree with you

I hear you. but seems like every year smaller quick twitch guys destroy these types drills and practices and such - then disappear into obscurity on sunday. I dunno. Maybe it's my perception.  

One of the reasons I love the Senior Bowl is that it gives us a chance to see some of these small school guys.  I know you were big on Wes HIlls for the last few weeks, but this is my first chance to see him.  Love the fact that a kid like Hart who dominated at GA State gets a chance to go up against the big boys.  Keelan Doss is another guy - I have seen you talk about him in other threads, but never saw him until yesterday on the Sr Bowl highlights.  Dax Raymond is another guy I want to see more of.  I have got about 2 more days of footage to get through -- guess I will see who else jumps out at me

We all know about the Deebo Samuel's of the world and it is no surprise when he dominates.  The fun part of this week is the under the radar guys that get a chance to shine.

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, Lith said:

One of the reasons I love the Senior Bowl is that it gives us a chance to see some of these small school guys.  I know you were big on Wes HIlls for the last few weeks, but this is my first chance to see him.  Love the fact that a kid like Hart who dominated at GA State gets a chance to go up against the big boys.  Keelan Doss is another guy - I have seen you talk about him in other threads, but never saw him until yesterday on the Sr Bowl highlights.  Dax Raymond is another guy I want to see more of.  I have got about 2 more days of footage to get through -- guess I will see who else jumps out at me

We all know about the Deebo Samuel's of the world and it is no surprise when he dominates.  The fun part of this week is the under the radar guys that get a chance to shine.

yes, we are on the same page. The explosion of draft media has made some things more accessible, but nothing replaces seeing a FCS guy in a group like this... And i don't want to be a negative know-it-all... i'm just being a bit reactionary. No offense to Andy, he's talented and may be the next Edelman for all i know -- but guys like him are a dime a dozen. The ability to be shifty at 5'9 190 is not the ark of the covenant and they're not in high demand... 

So when we've got Doss, and Anthony Johnson lining up against future NFL corners, thats a story. Those are guys who may be lining up as WR1 or WR2 on the outside... i wanna hear about that, not everyone drooling over the pint-size WRs running between ppl's legs like it was an action sequence in Lord of the Rings.

Anyway. now that i'm a dick.. I should actually make some time for this Penny Hart. 

[Paradis]

Dexter Williams - RB of the week pin from Nagy and friends. Still they be sleeping...

you know what, that’s fine. Great even. Let him sit there, leave him for us in the middle rounds.