Wild and Crazy Idea...

[NYallDay]

9 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Randy Moss, in his prime, wasn't able to win a championship with the greatest QB of all time throwing to him.  What makes you think that Chad Pennington, Kellen Clemens, one year of Favre, where he blew out his arm, or Mark Sanchez would have yielded a different result?

football is a team sport. and you play against another team. in the superbowl, usually it is the two best teams at that time. not only did moss and Brady set the record (at the time)for td's in a season, they also went 17-0 in the regular season. to say that he wasn't able to win a championship is a poor argument (sun my eyes) as you have to play another team. I am so happy they lost (granted giants won which sucks) but to try and take negatives away from that season for moss is comical. 

[HawkeyeJet]

I'm not sure there is a bigger discrepancy but what fans want and actual ways to build a winning team then a highly paid # 1 WR.

[Mogglez]

8 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

The Patriots cut Moss when he was washed up. That has nothing to do with his personality.

Who cares if the Giants won another superbowl without Plax? That's completely irrelevant to the argument you're trying to make. Why bring it up? Your argument is that diva players don't help teams win which quite clearly to anyone watch Plax did.

The Cowboys replaced Owens when he was washed up. When he was in his prime he was one of the premier WR's in the league and made every offense he played in better.

Holmes was a diva in Pittsburgh when he won Superbowl MVP. He was a diva when he arrived here and helped us get to an AFCCG his first season. 

Braylon Edwards was a diva too. But you cool w/him?

Beckham Jr is in his prime bro.

The Patriots traded Moss fresh off of a year where he posted 83 catches for 1,264 yards and 13 TDs so you can get out of here with that " they cut him when he was washed up" nonsense.  They traded him because he started b*tching about his role in the offense when his numbers through 4 games were less than any other year previous with the Pats.  This led to friction between him and Brady, and guess who is gonna win that battle 10 times out of 10?  Moss was traded to Minnesota right after the reports of the two of clashing came out.  So yeah, Moss not finishing his career with New England absolutely had to do with his attitude.   Following up on that, the reason he was traded from the Vikings to the Titans, the very same season, is because he b*tched even more in Minnesota.  Then he capped that year off by b*tching in Tennessee, even getting into an argument with reporters.

My point regarding Plaxico was that he wasn't an off the rails diva until after winning that championship and getting his payday.  When he didn't have to keep himself in line, his true colors came out and he, literally, shot himself in the foot.  I said multiple times that this is similar to Odell's situation, because he has gotten worse since getting paid and he had Plaxico-esque issues before getting his big contract.

TO is the poster boy of the "can't win with him" player.  That is his legacy.  The Cowboys got better when they replaced him. All those numbers, and absolutely nothing to show for it.  I don't need to go further into this one.

Holmes wasn't a diva his first year here.  Cotchery is even on record saying that the guy he saw in 2010 was quiet, reserved, and nothing like the guy that he heard all the news about after he left.  Just like Plaxico, Holmes was waiting for his big payday to show everyone what he was really like.  We were dumb enough to give it to him, and got what we deserved.  But hey, at least we got our AFC Championship Game participation trophy, Holmes put up big numbers when the game was out of reach so people can pretend that he had a big playoff performance for us in that game, and then completely ignore the fact that he was completely invisible for most of the game!

Edwards was somewhat of diva in Cleveland, but he grew into a team first guy with us because he wasn't a sh*t human being like the guy we got from Pittsburgh.  Unlike Holmes, he bought in.  You didn't see him fighting with the QB/teammates on the sidelines or being a d*ckhead in the media.  Yeah, I was fine with Braylon.  He showed me a good reason why I could feel comfortable with feeling that way.

Brandon Marshall, who I absolutely love, is another perfect example of this type of player I'm describing.  He was a phenomenal talent as recently as 2015, has NEVER sniffed the playoffs, and has been a part of 7 teams.  That's not a coincidence.  Him being traded (twice) in his prime, when he was, arguably, the best receiver in football, didn't mean sh*t.

Look, I think it's clear that we're not going to agree on this.  You hold your opinion and I can respect it.  At the end of the day, I'll root for the laundry.  I can call a trade for Beckham a horrible decision that will only bring bad things to the team, but I'll still root to be wrong.  That all being said, the reason why I think it would insanely stupid to make such a move is because I have just seen too many players come of his nature come into this league, and for one reason or another, they never "get it done".  I just don't buy into the idea that there are all these supremely talented malcontents and it's just a coincidence that they all seem to end up on losing squads, end up disappearing in the biggest moments when they're needed most, or end up becoming such a an awful presence, you find any way you can to get rid of him.  I'll use one example that gets my point across regarding Odell, and then I'm out:

Beckham has been to one playoff game in his entire career and he spent the week before his big debut with his other teammates, including a rookie Sterling Shepard, who he was supposed to take under his wing, smoking pot, drinking and hanging out on a boat in Miami.  Then, when it came to be game time, he dropped balls, was completely unfocused, couldn't get open, and, quite frankly, looked horrible out on the field.  This was all before he got paid.  He has never owned up to this mistake and, since then, his attitude has gotten progressively worse.  The scariest part is that he's shown no signs of changing anytime soon.  That isn't a guy I want around this team or Sam.  Ever.  I don't care how good he is.  Do I want someone with similar talent?  Yea, guys like him are special.  No doubt about it.  I'd just rather it be with someone who doesn't have the baggage.  It's possible to find guys like that too.  Brandin Cooks was taken the same year.  Michael Thomas might be the best Wide Receiver in football right now.  Antonio Brown is up there too.  Mike Evans, who I mentioned earlier, might actually be available next year.  These are all guys on Odell's level, close to it, or better.  They just don't have the issues he does (to our knowledge, of course).  Those are the types guys I would target in the draft, or actually trade for in Evans's case.

[Mogglez]

8 hours ago, NYallDay said:

football is a team sport. and you play against another team. in the superbowl, usually it is the two best teams at that time. not only did moss and Brady set the record (at the time)for td's in a season, they also went 17-0 in the regular season. to say that he wasn't able to win a championship is a poor argument (sun my eyes) as you have to play another team. I am so happy they lost (granted giants won which sucks) but to try and take negatives away from that season for moss is comical. 

That's great.  On a personal note, Moss did have a great season.  That will never change the fact that, despite all of the talent, and the greatest QB of all time throwing to him, they never won anything in New England with him.  Not only that, but New England dumped him, got better, won 2 rings and went to 4 more, without him.  That '07 Patriots team was 17-0.  Their defense was amazing, the offensive line was otherworldly, the skill positions were loaded, they had Tom Brady under center, and Bill Belichick was, well, Bill Belichick. 

You're also right in saying that football is a team game.  The '07 Patriots on paper, and talent-wise, the better team.  They were also the better coached team.  That offense, Moss included, completely laid an egg out there.  Moss is on record saying that he has huge regrets over his performance in SB42 and that he would trade every record set that season for a ring.  I don't have to "take negatives away" for Randy, he already did that for me. 

I never like to call something a "choke job" because I think it's disrespectful to the team that "came back" or pulled off the upset, but what New England did in Super Bowl 42 is the closest you'll ever hear me come to actually saying that phrase in regards to a performance.  After what they did to teams in the regular season, the Giants included, and post-season games prior to the Super Bowl, they shouldn't have lost that game.  Still, kudos to the Giants though.  They did their job and took care of business.  Personally, I just think it's because every player checked their egos at the door, believed in each other, and worked hard to accomplish something as a team.  Believe it or not, those clichés are a real thing in sports. I will never forget the video of Brady laughing at Plaxico's (ironic that it was him, of all people, considering the argument at hand, and his role in it) score prediction that had New England only scoring 17 points.  Brady, Moss, and co. would go on to only put up 14.

[Mogglez]

9 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Answer the question. Would you have wanted Randy Moss in his prime on the Jets? 

I did answer the question.

No I would not have traded for a malcontent Randy Moss like New England did when they snagged him from the Raiders.  He was b*tching every single day in Oakland, and they traded him for a measly 4th round pick.  History and hindsight says that he wouldn't have fared any better here so, again, we'll agree to disagree.  

[Matt39]

Since that playoff game and the contract his career has taken a weird turn. He never plays. He flat out has dogged it this season. No thanks. Massive headache. 

[Mogglez]

42 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Since that playoff game and the contract his career has taken a weird turn. He never plays. He flat out has dogged it this season. No thanks. Massive headache. 

We disagree on a lot, but occasionally our opinions cuddle up next to one another.  Would you look a that?  Spot on.

[jgb]

16 hours ago, Bleedin Green said:

No, OBJ is the one off his rocker, and that's the entire point.  It has literally nothing to do with the Giants.  Sorry you don't get to give yourself a round of applause this time for some nonsense that only actually exists in your own mind.

Observe this response ladies and gentlemen: as I said, this is an emotional and not logical issue for jets fans.

[ljr]

football is a team sport. and you play against another team. in the superbowl, usually it is the two best teams at that time. not only did moss and Brady set the record (at the time)for td's in a season, they also went 17-0 in the regular season. to say that he wasn't able to win a championship is a poor argument (sun my eyes) as you have to play another team. I am so happy they lost (granted giants won which sucks) but to try and take negatives away from that season for moss is comical. 

You know football is a team sport

When Odell learns that a football team is 53 players working together towards a common goal to succeed, instead of only caring about what’s good for 1 player ... perhaps this question could be revisited





Oh yeah ... and as long as he’s on lithium



Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[joewilly12]

The Giants aren't parting with OBJ just like Eli will probably have to suffer a career ending injury (God forbid I like Eli) or retire on his own for them to be done with him. 

The Giants organization lives in the past and has no vision of the future. 

 

[Bleedin Green]

22 minutes ago, jgb said:

Observe this response ladies and gentlemen: as I said, this is an emotional and not logical issue for jets fans.

Your inability to comprehend the arguments that don't concede to your personal opinion, leading to your baseless assignment of supposed feelings to others is the only "emotional and not logical issue" here.

I have far less of an issue with the Giants than the vast majority of Jets fans (because seriously, who the hell cares about a team they play once every 4 years?), but it doesn't change the fact that Beckham is a raging lunatic that follows the locker room poisoning trend of many of his predecessors that countless teams have regretted betting wouldn't be that problem for them, as recently as the Jets just a few years ago with Marshall.  Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.  Short of low cost of acquisition and lots of team protection, neither of which would ever come with Beckham, it's nowhere near the risk for a team that's a far, far away from being anything close to a contender.

But hey, what's a little thing like logic, when you can just play your own game of make-believe, as opposed to providing even a single coherent thought, right?

[Thai Jet]

On 12/21/2018 at 12:09 PM, joenamathwouldn'tcry said:

  No and nothing

[roscoeword]

16 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

The Patriots cut Moss when he was washed up. That has nothing to do with his personality.

Who cares if the Giants won another superbowl without Plax? That's completely irrelevant to the argument you're trying to make. Why bring it up? Your argument is that diva players don't help teams win which quite clearly to anyone watch Plax did.

The Cowboys replaced Owens when he was washed up. When he was in his prime he was one of the premier WR's in the league and made every offense he played in better.

Holmes was a diva in Pittsburgh when he won Superbowl MVP. He was a diva when he arrived here and helped us get to an AFCCG his first season. 

Braylon Edwards was a diva too. But you cool w/him?

Beckham Jr is in his prime bro.

There is a big difference in the behavior of beckham and the other divas, probably due to the difference in generation, but odel beckam is way over the top, his attitude makes Owens and moss seem humble in comparison. He is a cancer ready to spread.. 

[jgb]

2 hours ago, Bleedin Green said:

Your inability to comprehend the arguments that don't concede to your personal opinion, leading to your baseless assignment of supposed feelings to others is the only "emotional and not logical issue" here.

I have far less of an issue with the Giants than the vast majority of Jets fans (because seriously, who the hell cares about a team they play once every 4 years?), but it doesn't change the fact that Beckham is a raging lunatic that follows the locker room poisoning trend of many of his predecessors that countless teams have regretted betting wouldn't be that problem for them, as recently as the Jets just a few years ago with Marshall.  Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.  Short of low cost of acquisition and lots of team protection, neither of which would ever come with Beckham, it's nowhere near the risk for a team that's a far, far away from being anything close to a contender.

But hey, what's a little thing like logic, when you can just play your own game of make-believe, as opposed to providing even a single coherent thought, right?

Very passionate

[Bleedin Green]

6 hours ago, jgb said:

Very passionate

Thanks!

[BigO]

Trade Odell to the Browns. He and Baker were made for each other.

[Barry McCockinner]

[joenamathwouldn'tcry]

1 hour ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Please note that none of the other players on this list are "known assholes"

[Barry McCockinner]

51 minutes ago, joenamathwouldn'tcry said:

Please note that none of the other players on this list are "known assholes"

Please note that IDGAF.

[GREENBEAN]

As talented as he is, I would only consider it if it was for a minimal price. He could literally ruin Sam and the team chemistry with his BS. have you ever worked with a person who just sucks the life out of you and the organization ? That's what Odell does. 

I'd consider it but at the lowest risk possible. 

[Fantasy Island]

Trade him to the 49ers.

[HawkeyeJet]

Schefter just wondered aloud on countdown if the Giants might look to trade him this offseason because of some language in his contract that would save them 5 million if they do.

Which means someone in the Giants camp or the Beckham camp planted this with Schefter to get the potential ball rolling on an offseason trade.

I bet he does get traded.  To the Jets?  I doubt it, for multiple reasons.