Jets have the 26th ranked defense

[FidelioJet]

9 hours ago, NoBowles said:

You guys act like Bowles has been asking for OL and WR with premium picks and Mac said, no, you will get safeties, interior Dlmen and Inside LBers and like it, too bad Bowles. Get real guys, Bowles has set the tone of this roster, MAC is no help, but the design which is piss poor is on Bowles 

I have no idea how much say Bowles has over the roster but I do know Mac is in charge of those decisions and he's hasn't built a very good team.

Now, if Bowles is actually making the choices it's even more of reason to get rid of Mac.

[NoBowles]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

I have no idea how much say Bowles has over the roster but I do know Mac is in charge of those decisions and he's hasn't built a very good team.

Now, if Bowles is actually making the choices it's even more of reason to get rid of Mac.

You realize that the stupid owners setup the power structure right? And historically, Woddy has always wanted the coach to have most input into the roster, and let the chef pick the groceries. They both should absolutely go, they both suck, but the notion that Bowles is better at his job than mac is is absolute bs

[Philc1]

On 12/25/2018 at 7:07 PM, Jetsfan80 said:

  

False.

 

Jets D in 2013: 16th

Jets D in 2014: 22nd

Bills D in 2015: 28th

Bills D in 2016: 28th

 

And the year before Rex took over in Buffalo, the D was # 2.

 

The Jets D the year after Rex was # 6 under Bowles in 2015.

 

This disgusting nostalgia for Rex Ryan needs to end immediately.

 

Jets replaced a bunch of nobodies with Revis, Cro and Gilchrist and had the league’s easiest schedule in 2015 that’s why the ranking improved

[Philc1]

10 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

You realize that the stupid owners setup the power structure right? And historically, Woddy has always wanted the coach to have most input into the roster, and let the chef pick the groceries. They both should absolutely go, they both suck, but the notion that Bowles is better at his job than mac is is absolute bs

No woody calls the shots See Tim Tebow 

[Creepy Lurker]

7 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

You realize that the stupid owners setup the power structure right? And historically, Woddy has always wanted the coach to have most input into the roster, and let the chef pick the groceries. They both should absolutely go, they both suck, but the notion that Bowles is better at his job than mac is is absolute bs

What I don’t understand is that if Mac is getting a lot of input and actually drafting defense and players that Bowle’s wants, where is the disconnect?

My argument for this power structure has been that if coach and GM have equal say, the GM will flex his muscles every now and then and maintain the “big picture” approach. It seems like Mac has catered to Bowles ALOT (especially according to his defenders). If this is the case than WTF Bowles? 

I don’t trash Bowles nearly enough since he’s as good as gone and have focused on Mac for obvious reasons. Don’t get me wrong, Bowles is the worst coach that I’ve ever seen and deserves as much if not more blame than Mac. 

If Mac truly went out of his was to accommodate Bowles (he clearly didn’t have to because of structure and it would have been his only power play), then Bowles is COMPLETELY worthless. I can give credit for Mac’s good moves but I honestly can’t name 1 single thing that Bowles has done well. Can anyone here honestly say 1 good thing about this coach or what he has done?

[FidelioJet]

19 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

You realize that the stupid owners setup the power structure right? And historically, Woddy has always wanted the coach to have most input into the roster, and let the chef pick the groceries. They both should absolutely go, they both suck, but the notion that Bowles is better at his job than mac is is absolute bs

Honestly, I don't want to go back and forth with you on this but - Mac is responsible for building the roster, that's his sole job - regardless of who you or anyone else wants to blame - and the talent is bottom 5 in the league.  

If someone else is actually doing his job for him then it's even worse for him as he then has little to no role. 

They both need to go but, IMO Mac is worse.  and I do not believe that opinion is absolute BS.  

[nyjunc]

16 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Honestly, I don't want to go back and forth with you on this but - Mac is responsible for building the roster, that's his sole job - regardless of who you or anyone else wants to blame - and the talent is bottom 5 in the league.  

If someone else is actually doing his job for him then it's even worse for him as he then has little to no role. 

They both need to go but, IMO Mac is worse.  and I do not believe that opinion is absolute BS.  

The Jets have top 10 talent on D and are nowhere near bottom 5 talent overall.  There's still a lot of work to be done w/ this team(mostly on O) but there's no excuse why this D has been as bad as it has been.  It's all on the coaches

[Jetster]

13 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

The Jets have top 10 talent on D and are nowhere near bottom 5 talent overall.  There's still a lot of work to be done w/ this team(mostly on O) but there's no excuse why this D has been as bad as it has been.  It's all on the coaches

ABSOLUTELY! Give this same defensive roster to Williams, Schwartz, Phillips, Pees, probably 10 other DCs in this league and I believe they would be better. 

This defense is LOST. They rush when they should cover, they cover when they should rush. Guys blitz from 15 yards from the LOS? They've blown leads as soon as they get them, guys seem to always be out of position, show terrible technique, no one gets off blocks, or shoot gaps. Top WRs are never double covered with over & under play. Every single teams top WR rips us a new A hole. It's bad scheme & the inability to teach that is making this defense worse than it should be.

[Philc1]

On 12/26/2018 at 3:22 AM, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Adding a future HOF pass rusher has a lot to do with that. Per FO they were the # 14 defense last season, and are # 1 this year.

 

But yes, Nagy has done a very good job helping Trubisky in his 2nd season.

Its not like Mack wasn’t available to the jets via trade last offseason 

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

The Jets have top 10 talent on D and are nowhere near bottom 5 talent overall.  There's still a lot of work to be done w/ this team(mostly on O) but there's no excuse why this D has been as bad as it has been.  It's all on the coaches

Top 10 talent?  Where?

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

Honestly, I don't want to go back and forth with you on this but - Mac is responsible for building the roster, that's his sole job - regardless of who you or anyone else wants to blame - and the talent is bottom 5 in the league.  

If someone else is actually doing his job for him then it's even worse for him as he then has little to no role. 

They both need to go but, IMO Mac is worse.  and I do not believe that opinion is absolute BS.  

We have zero pass rushers and our CBs are atrocious 

 

Hackenberg could throw for 300 yards against this D

[56mehl56]

3 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

We have zero pass rushers and our CBs are atrocious 

 

Hackenberg could throw for 300 yards against this D

 and our CBs are atrocious because we have no pass rush and our superstar HC  blitzes and plays soft coverage with the CB's 10 yards off the ball, making the opposing QB's hot read an easy target everytime.

[section314]

7 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

We have zero pass rushers and our CBs are atrocious 

 

Hackenberg could throw for 300 yards against this D

Phil....ironically, the one part of the D that actually got better. I agree with you, though, we still need the stud who teams have to account for every play. And this seems to be the year to get him.

[Jetster]

4 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

 and our CBs are atrocious because we have no pass rush and our superstar HC  blitzes and plays soft coverage with the CB's 10 yards off the ball, making the opposing QB's hot read an easy target everytime.

Did you see Rogers on the winning TD? He never took his eyes off of Adams, he was going there directly on the snap. 1 on 1 coverage, zero help, it was pitch & catch! How often do you see guys that open in the endzone? Adams was 4' ahead of Clairborne, that's WIDE OPEN in this league especially for Rogers! Make SOMEONE ELSE BEAT YOU! 

My god, it's right out of any good DCs playbook! Hmm, so Adams is Green Bay's best WR, let's single him up & let Mo (toasty) Clairborne cover him one on one, because he had such a great day doing that with Hopkins. MORONS! These coaches are so bad, that opposing offenses don't even have to work for anything in the 4th quarter, or the end of the 1st half for that matter, it's always SO FREAKING EASY! What was the Titans winning drive? 4/5 plays from inside the 15? The idea that Todd Bowles punts at all once past his own 45 with this horrifically coached defense tells you everything you need to know about these idiots! 

Instead of trying to WIN THE GAME last week, he pussies out & tries to kill the clock! At 4-10! He's 4-10 and he still doesn't have the gumption to try to win the game when his young rookie QB is having the best game of his career, obviously we're at the end of the 4th when the opposing defense is not nearly as spry as the 1st quarter. Just mind boggling how poor Bowles is at being a head coach, no feel, no advanced thinking, I'm telling you guys Bowles is no doubt not a good chess player! 

[56mehl56]

7 minutes ago, Jetster said:

Did you see Rogers on the winning TD? He never took his eyes off of Adams, he was going there directly on the snap. 1 on 1 coverage, zero help, it was pitch & catch! How often do you see guys that open in the endzone? Adams was 4' ahead of Clairborne, that's WIDE OPEN in this league especially for Rogers! Make SOMEONE ELSE BEAT YOU! 

My god, it's right out of any good DCs playbook! Hmm, so Adams is Green Bay's best WR, let's single him up & let Mo (toasty) Clairborne cover him one on one, because he had such a great day doing that with Hopkins. MORONS! These coaches are so bad, that opposing offenses don't even have to work for anything in the 4th quarter, or the end of the 1st half for that matter, it's always SO FREAKING EASY! What was the Titans winning drive? 4/5 plays from inside the 15? The idea that Todd Bowles punts at all once past his own 45 with this horrifically coached defense tells you everything you need to know about these idiots! 

Instead of trying to WIN THE GAME last week, he pussies out & tries to kill the clock! At 4-10! He's 4-10 and he still doesn't have the gumption to try to win the game when his young rookie QB is having the best game of his career, obviously we're at the end of the 4th when the opposing defense is not nearly as spry as the 1st quarter. Just mind boggling how poor Bowles is at being a head coach, no feel, no advanced thinking, I'm telling you guys Bowles is no doubt not a good chess player! 

And missing two starters that went out in game. 

[Jetster]

4 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

And missing two starters that went out in game. 

I bet you Bowles didn't even know who was out, he's that unaware during games. Opposing teams lose Olineman & he doesn't attack those spots. I have never seen a coach literally NOT CHANGE WHAT HES DOING when it's obviously not working! He is the most stubborn SOB I've ever witnessed. Definitely believes he's smarter than he is, and blames everything on everyone else. Why he's so respected is beyond me? Coaches are supposed to be leaders! No one follows this idiot, his players sh*t all over him every year. Every year, someone on his defense gives up. And he'll keep rolling them out there. He's a disgrace to the coaching profession.

[NoBowles]

57 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Honestly, I don't want to go back and forth with you on this but - Mac is responsible for building the roster, that's his sole job - regardless of who you or anyone else wants to blame - and the talent is bottom 5 in the league.  

If someone else is actually doing his job for him then it's even worse for him as he then has little to no role. 

They both need to go but, IMO Mac is worse.  and I do not believe that opinion is absolute BS.  

 

58 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

What I don’t understand is that if Mac is getting a lot of input and actually drafting defense and players that Bowle’s wants, where is the disconnect?

My argument for this power structure has been that if coach and GM have equal say, the GM will flex his muscles every now and then and maintain the “big picture” approach. It seems like Mac has catered to Bowles ALOT (especially according to his defenders). If this is the case than WTF Bowles? 

I don’t trash Bowles nearly enough since he’s as good as gone and have focused on Mac for obvious reasons. Don’t get me wrong, Bowles is the worst coach that I’ve ever seen and deserves as much if not more blame than Mac. 

If Mac truly went out of his was to accommodate Bowles (he clearly didn’t have to because of structure and it would have been his only power play), then Bowles is COMPLETELY worthless. I can give credit for Mac’s good moves but I honestly can’t name 1 single thing that Bowles has done well. Can anyone here honestly say 1 good thing about this coach or what he has done?

If you have paid any attention under Woody's ownership, and realize that the first football presence under his tenure was Bill Parcells, you would realize that Woody has always tried to have Bill's philosophy of the chef picks the groceries. The reason he promoted an accountant to GM when Mangini came in was to give Mangini chef powers. The reason he hired both Bowles and Maccagnan rather than Maccagnan first and let him choose a coach was because he wanted the HC to have chef powers.

Now, make no mistake, Maccagann has been absolutely awful at his part of the job, and is a weak puppet worthless GM who is more of Bowles admin assistant than GM, but that does not take away from the fact that the reason we have focussed on Bowles defense with all of our premium picks has been becasue Bowles has that kind of say, or at least did up until the last draft. Hell, if you listened to Bowles after each and every draft he tells you why they made the picks they did, and he tells you as if they were his choice.

Why do you think we caved to Fitzpatrick? After Bowles named him the starter when he wasn't signed?

Did you hear Bowles tell you why we didn't pick Paxton Lynch? Which was the right move for the wrong reason. He told you its because he doesnt want to pick 1st round draft picks who can't contribute on day 1. 

The answers are all right there if you listen to them. 

[peebag]

2 hours ago, nyjunc said:

The Jets have top 10 talent on D and are nowhere near bottom 5 talent overall.  There's still a lot of work to be done w/ this team(mostly on O) but there's no excuse why this D has been as bad as it has been.  It's all on the coaches

What talent?

[ChuckkieB]

On 12/25/2018 at 1:45 PM, Jetsbb said:

With our draft history of drafting exclusively defensive players in the first round for 10 years and only defensive head coaches for 20 years this is very embarrassing.

THIS!  Hopefully the Johnson boys are paying attention and realize that the tides have turned and offense is king in the NFL and the team needs to be run by a GM and HC that can pick and coach the sh!t out of that side of the ball.  

[Jetster]

24 minutes ago, ChuckkieB said:

THIS!  Hopefully the Johnson boys are paying attention and realize that the tides have turned and offense is king in the NFL and the team needs to be run by a GM and HC that can pick and coach the sh!t out of that side of the ball.  

It's crazy. Our coach was brought here because he was supposed genius with secondaries, meanwhile we can't stop QBs that were on their couches prior to playing us! Look how fast the Vikings canned Defilipo when the Vikings offense sputtered, but we've fired 3 OCs while our defense under his pal Rogers gets WORSE every year despite adding so many players from high In the draft & free agency.

[rangerous]

On 12/25/2018 at 2:11 PM, Nixhead said:

McCarthy for head coach. Bring back Rex as D coordinator - let Rex do what he does best. Bears won one with Ditka head coach and Rex’s Dad as D coordinator so I think Rex would go for it. 

just say no to rex.  on the other hand match mccarthy with greg wolliams  and maybe it gets really interesting.

[Philc1]

3 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

 and our CBs are atrocious because we have no pass rush and our superstar HC  blitzes and plays soft coverage with the CB's 10 yards off the ball, making the opposing QB's hot read an easy target everytime.

No both things I said were true.  Skrine, Claiborne and Trumaine are AWFUL and we can’t sniff the qb

[Philc1]

2 hours ago, Jetster said:

Did you see Rogers on the winning TD? He never took his eyes off of Adams, he was going there directly on the snap. 1 on 1 coverage, zero help, it was pitch & catch! How often do you see guys that open in the endzone? Adams was 4' ahead of Clairborne, that's WIDE OPEN in this league especially for Rogers! Make SOMEONE ELSE BEAT YOU! 

My god, it's right out of any good DCs playbook! Hmm, so Adams is Green Bay's best WR, let's single him up & let Mo (toasty) Clairborne cover him one on one, because he had such a great day doing that with Hopkins. MORONS! These coaches are so bad, that opposing offenses don't even have to work for anything in the 4th quarter, or the end of the 1st half for that matter, it's always SO FREAKING EASY! What was the Titans winning drive? 4/5 plays from inside the 15? The idea that Todd Bowles punts at all once past his own 45 with this horrifically coached defense tells you everything you need to know about these idiots! 

Instead of trying to WIN THE GAME last week, he pussies out & tries to kill the clock! At 4-10! He's 4-10 and he still doesn't have the gumption to try to win the game when his young rookie QB is having the best game of his career, obviously we're at the end of the 4th when the opposing defense is not nearly as spry as the 1st quarter. Just mind boggling how poor Bowles is at being a head coach, no feel, no advanced thinking, I'm telling you guys Bowles is no doubt not a good chess player! 

Claiborne has been getting picked on like a red headed stepchild last several weeks.  He cannot cover a #1 WR ever

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, peebag said:

What talent?

[56mehl56]

40 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Claiborne has been getting picked on like a red headed stepchild last several weeks.  He cannot cover a #1 WR ever

And shouldn't have to , at least by himself . 

[ScarletKnight89]

How many draft picks over the years have we used on the defensive side of the football? And i'm not even just talking about this regime, just in general? And when have we ever had a truly great defense...

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, 56mehl56 said:

And shouldn't have to , at least by himself . 

Claiborne is a mediocre 2nd Cb at best

[Philc1]

49 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

How many draft picks over the years have we used on the defensive side of the football? And i'm not even just talking about this regime, just in general? And when have we ever had a truly great defense...

The problem isn’t drafting defense it’s drafting certain positions.  We love to draft DBs and interior DL but have never taken a shot an edge outside of Gholston the past 18 years 

[56mehl56]

1 minute ago, Philc1 said:

Claiborne is a mediocre 2nd Cb at best

Agree he should not be asked to cover #1's by himself.  But our HC head clown often has him 1 on 1 against the likes of Devante Adams. 

[Hael]

This is the one part of this season that I find inexcusable.  Struggles on O I can understand, given the criminal neglect of the Oline and skill positions in the draft and FA, but to have garbage D with a defensive minded coach after all of our money spent there and huge draft capital...  well it should be a fireable offense.  

We’ve lost about four or five games this season that were winnable games where our D let us down in the 4th quarter.  It’s almost inconceivably bad.  From a GM point of view, this might be historically inept levels of bad FA spending, draft misses and players playing in the wrong systems for their skill sets.  It’s the 90s jets revisited.

  

[Beerfish]

Just think we are going to draft a CB named 'Greedy' with our 1st pick next year.

[nyjunc]

22 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Top 10 talent?  Where?

Look at the roster, if you can't see the talent I can't help you.  you will see a dramatic improvement in the D next year when we get a better defensive staff.