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BREAKING: Jets going to hire Gase

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2 hours ago, BigO said:

Gase will win in NY with Sam who is, hands down, one of the best young QB’s in the league. He was hired to be Sam’s mentor which was sorely needed. That’s what was paramount. And the guy knows offense. Weren’t you all screaming for an offensive minded HC who has experience? Well you got what you asked for. Is he raw? Definitely. We can only hope he grows from the situation in Miami. Sam must have had an influence on his hiring as well. I have no doubt of this. And the guy will influence Macc’s choices in FA and the draft to rebuild it. The one concern is the defense. But didn’t Miami have a pretty fair defense? How Gase figured in that is an unknown to me but they kicked our ass time after time defensively. They won those games with their defense not thru Tannehill who is one of the worst QB’s in the league. This is definitely a move in the right direction, a 360 from a stiff like Bowles. 

this is a little bit of a reach because you downplay Mccarthy's success, Mccarthy has proven he won with a young qb and helped groom him to a mvp type player where Gase has a loosing a record. Blame what ever you want for the the injuries the players the fins, he still has a loosing record versus a superbowl winning coach that by reports wanted to be here. Mind you a superbowl winning coach with the  same offensive creds and a history of winning.

That is why hiring gase is big freaking question mark, I think Chris let himself be talked out of one coach and into another by the gm and by the Mehta. One hiring of McCarthy brings certain legitimacy to the team where Gase does not, if winning is everything then we just hired a looser when we had a chance to hire a proven winner. now what happened in Greenbay that does not translate to success here but it lean towards succeeds here. Where what happened in Miami doesn't either but history does have a tendency to repeat.

 

Put it this way I was torn on the GM but if he is behind this it is pretty simple it was a move by the gm to gain power. in the process they hired a known Ahole who at some point will have words with him, versus a known successful coach who could have had more power when it was shown the gm was screwing things up.

 

Sam more then likely met with the coaches and said yes I can work with all of them.

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9 hours ago, Skeptable said:

Not even close... Bowles is a first time HC... Gase has a history with QBs... He is not a great hire but he checks a lot of boxes that were issues with the Jets.  Especially Locker room sh*t

Gase is the offensive version of Bowles.  

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9 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Tanny, Brock, Kitna were all bad QB's. Blaming him for not developing these guys is like blaming Schotty for not developing Geno Smith. The only QB he had that was any good was Manning who had a career year under him throwing 55 TD's and 5477 yards. Peyton mostly choked in big games so losing the SB was not all on Gase. 

Just saying he isn't  all bad. Hopefully Sam has a uear like Manning  did. 

 

Like I just said above, any pessimism aside we all want it to turn out for the best because he's the coach like it or not. 

Good offensive HCs and OCs can get better production than others out of subpar QBs. The Geno Smith analogy is a poor one in particular because he hasn't played under Schotty and has barely seen the field since leaving the Jets anyway and was clearly worse than all 3 of those mentioned, including Brock. 

IMO the worst stinger in there is Tannehill. Not because he was a some great QB who only had meh/down seasons only with Gase or something like that. But rather because he got no better under Gase, even as his NFL experience grew and he entered the prime QB years (his one absent injury year of course has nothing to do with Gase). 

Compare Tannehill under not just Philbin, but to his production even under former TE and TE-coach-turned-interim HC Dan Campbell and interim OC Zac Taylor, who were handicapped with being nobodies who took over 5 games into the season.

Tannehill may not be a good QB, but he was and is quite obviously on a different level than Geno Smith, whom you curiously use for comparison. Really good or not, Tanny was at least a productive QB whose numbers rivaled the best seasons by any QB the Jets QB have ever had. Geno had 2 good games - more like Brock than Tannehill (or even Kitna) - and he did so under the guidance of that powerhouse offensive coach Rex Ryan while he was at times trying to tank just to show up the GM he hated for drafting and pushing a Sanchez replacement.

So in taking over for a TE coach temporarily playing HC, and his inexperienced interim OC (leaving the team without a dedicated QBC for 75% of the season for all I know), was there any demonstrable improvement under supposed QB/offense guru Gase who didn't have to take over midseason? No, there was not. 

I'm no great Tannehill fan for sure, but was it a foregone conclusion that his career path still wouldn't have gotten any better if he played under a superior coach? We'll never know, but claiming it to be so just because you personally believe it is hardly concrete proof. You only know the path he was put on as a QB, not the path he wasn't afforded. To suggest otherwise is to somewhat suggest there isn't much difference from one coach to another.

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31 minutes ago, long time suffering Jets f said:

You got that right. The way I look at it after my initial outburst after the Gase signing is that Jet fans are in a win-win situation. If he proves everyone wrong and turns the Jets into a contender, more power to him. If he runs the franchise into the ground, Macc will be shown the door and all Jet fans will celebrate in unison.

 But.  He could possibly ruin Darnold - like he did Tannehill. 

That’s a HUGE loss, Loss. 

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15 minutes ago, RichardTodd27 said:

Historically speaking, Gase was the right pick.

Look at most of the Super Bowl winning coaches over the past 10 years (Bellichek, Carrol, Coughlin & Kubiak). What do they all have in common? They succeeded their 2nd time around (and never one a championship during their first gig).

Like it or not, there is a learning curve for coaches. Jets figured that out and made the right pick.

Hopefully that is the case, but you make it sound as though improving to SB winning coach is some sort of norm. The overwhelming norm is for an unsuccessful HC for one team to become an unsuccessful HC thereafter.

Also none of the 4 you mentioned followed Gase's path:

Only one of those coaches actually jumped right from one failed HC job into SB winning HC in his next job: Coughlin. With more than twice as much HC experience as Gase before their respective 2nd HC jobs, even Coughlin took a year off in between. A year is a lot of time for a coach to reflect on what he'd do differently instead of jumping right into his next gig.

Two others (Belichick & Kubiak) took a year or more marinate as coordinators in between HC jobs (under recent Super Bowl coaches, quite coincidentally), where they could reflect on what they did wrong. Gase obviously hasn't done this.

Lastly, Carroll won a SB in his 3rd NFL HC gig not his 2nd, and Seattle was his 4th gig as a HC outright when you consider how long he was at USC. After his first HC job he then spent a couple more years as just a coordinator (like Kubiak/Belichick, under a recent SB HC). Also you make it sound like Carroll failed with the Jets and then jumped right over to Seattle where he won a SB. Far, far from it. There were 2 decades of coaching experience you've glossed over, in between getting fired from his first NFL HC job and winning his first SB. That's not even close to Gase's career path.

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A lot of you guys made the same mistake in the draft

You picked a guy and took sides, dug in and argued about it every day

considering in both circumstances you had less than 20% chance of being happy, maybe the problem is arguing with strangers on the internet?

 

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11 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Like I just said above, any pessimism aside we all want it to turn out for the best because he's the coach like it or not. 

Good offensive HCs and OCs can get better production than others out of subpar QBs. The Geno Smith analogy is a poor one in particular because he hasn't played under Schotty and has barely seen the field since leaving the Jets anyway and was clearly worse than all 3 of those mentioned, including Brock. 

IMO the worst stinger in there is Tannehill. Not because he was a some great QB who only had meh/down seasons only with Gase or something like that. But rather because he got no better under Gase, even as his NFL experience grew and he entered the prime QB years (his one absent injury year of course has nothing to do with Gase). 

Compare Tannehill under not just Philbin, but to his production even under former TE and TE-coach-turned-interim HC Dan Campbell and interim OC Zac Taylor, who were handicapped with being nobodies who took over 5 games into the season.

Tannehill may not be a good QB, but he was and is quite obviously on a different level than Geno Smith, whom you curiously use for comparison. Really good or not, Tanny was at least a productive QB whose numbers rivaled the best seasons by any QB the Jets QB have ever had. Geno had 2 good games - more like Brock than Tannehill (or even Kitna) - and he did so under the guidance of that powerhouse offensive coach Rex Ryan while he was at times trying to tank just to show up the GM he hated for drafting and pushing a Sanchez replacement.

So in taking over for a TE coach temporarily playing HC, and his inexperienced interim OC (leaving the team without a dedicated QBC for 75% of the season for all I know), was there any demonstrable improvement under supposed QB/offense guru Gase who didn't have to take over midseason? No, there was not.

Sperm, you really should be in politics.  You made a post about Gase not having talent to work with to one about Geno Smith. Smith was merely an example of a QB that wouldn't  improve no matter who the coach was which i believe is what Tanny was or any other QB he worked with not named Manning. 

My main point was when Manning was his QB, Manning had stunning numbers, better than he ever had. Tanny was just a name thrown in with Brock and Kitna, and Geno was an exaggeration used to make a point that some QBs won't  excel no matter who was the coach, just like Tanny. 

Since your posting seems to be in prime spin cycle, im going to leave my point at this. If you still think im comparing Geno to Tanny, have at it.

And to the the point you broight up that Tanny didn't  improve under Gase, Tanny is what he is as we see him. He's  not getting any better which is why the Fins are looking to replace him. 

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Well he wasn’t my first choice here. However I was in favor of him over Bowles at the time of that hiring. I guess we got what we got so let’s move forward with him. Here we go again. Rebuild 3.0.

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12 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

The Jets got their third choice of this hiring process. They missed out on the first because god knows why, missed out on the second because the GM made completely unprecedented demands, and we got the third because he was fired from the Miami Dolphins and nobody else wanted him. Let that sink in.

What was the first choice?

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So it was good to take a night to sleep on it, get past the initial emotional reaction, and look at it from a more logical perspective. And I must admit, after revaluating it a bit in a level-headed manner, I came to a realization........ I still hate every single thing about this hire.

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2 hours ago, themeangreenkillingmachine said:

Also I see a similiar personality between Darnold and Gase. I think those 2 are goin to click

That’s actually the least of my concern me I think Sam and Gase will work very well together 

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

 But.  He could possibly ruin Darnold - like he did Tannehill. 

That’s a HUGE loss, Loss. 

Tannehill was ruined the day he was born

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1 hour ago, RichardTodd27 said:

Historically speaking, Gase was the right pick.

Look at most of the Super Bowl winning coaches over the past 10 years (Bellichek, Carrol, Coughlin & Kubiak). What do they all have in common? They succeeded their 2nd time around (and never one a championship during their first gig).

Like it or not, there is a learning curve for coaches. Jets figured that out and made the right pick.

Good point

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57 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Sperm, you really should be in politics.  You made a post about Gase not having talent to work with to one about Geno Smith. Smith was merely an example of a QB that wouldn't  improve no matter who the coach was which i believe is what Tanny was or any other QB he worked with not named Manning. 

My main point was when Manning was his QB, Manning had stunning numbers, better than he ever had. Tanny was just a name thrown in with Brock and Kitna, and Geno was an exaggeration used to make a point that some QBs won't  excel no matter who was the coach, just like Tanny. 

Since your posting seems to be in prime spin cycle, im going to leave my point at this. If you still think im comparing Geno to Tanny, have at it.

And to the the point you broight up that Tanny didn't  improve under Gase, Tanny is what he is as we see him. He's  not getting any better which is why the Fins are looking to replace him. 

I don't have a twitter account, so your first sentence is out the door ;).

I disagree with your rewording of my stance. Tannehill was a young top 10 pick QB who was steadily improving from year 1 through year 3. He even continued improving through an interim HC and interim OC who were handicapped with being handed the jobs after Philbin got fired after week 4. 

You take it as a foregone conclusion and fact that his improvement - which came to a halt with Gase's arrival - would have been the same outcome with anyone. You keep coming back to this as thought it is a destiny that could not have been changed. 

In contrast, Geno Smith didn't show anything close to Tannehill's production. He is as poor an example as you could have selected, unless you wanted to choose Hackenberg, who was infinitely worse than Geno Smith. 

One showed serious potential and steady improvement pre-Gase. Geno did not. The idea that this makes both equally bad dead ends as QB prospects, just because neither became great, is nonsensical. That Miami is now looking to move on is irrelevant; neither the QB nor the team is in the same situation they were in when Gase arrived on the scene, making this yet another false equivalence. 

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I'm just happy we aint getting an inexperienced college coach or another former defensive coordinator.

McCarthy, Monken & Gase were the only 3 choices for me. Preferred the first 2, but I'll happily take Gase.

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3 hours ago, Bowles Movement said:

Probably the biggest and most important job of a head coach, so why worry????

I didn't say there were no worries.

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1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I don't have a twitter account, so your first sentence is out the door ;).

I disagree with your rewording of my stance. Tannehill was a young top 10 pick QB who was steadily improving from year 1 through year 3. He even continued improving through an interim HC and interim OC who were handicapped with being handed the jobs after Philbin got fired after week 4. 

You take it as a foregone conclusion and fact that his improvement - which came to a halt with Gase's arrival - would have been the same outcome with anyone. You keep coming back to this as thought it is a destiny that could not have been changed. 

In contrast, Geno Smith didn't show anything close to Tannehill's production. He is as poor an example as you could have selected, unless you wanted to choose Hackenberg, who was infinitely worse than Geno Smith. 

One showed serious potential and steady improvement pre-Gase. Geno did not. The idea that this makes both equally bad dead ends as QB prospects, just because neither became great, is nonsensical. That Miami is now looking to move on is irrelevant; neither the QB nor the team is in the same situation they were in when Gase arrived on the scene, making this yet another false equivalence. 

I give up. There really is no reasoning with some people.  

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Just now, More Cowbell said:

I give up. There really is no reasoning with some people.  

Lol you're the one who introduced Geno Smith as a comparison, not me.

Geno Smith didn't improve, therefore Gase is blameless for Ryan Tannehill failing to improve.

I think we all get the dots you're trying to connect. My point is you are taking the results with Gase and presuming those would have been the results with him or anyone. If that's reasoning, it's flawed at best. 

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13 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Ladies and Gentlemen RELAX Adam Gase is not that bad of a HC he will do well with Darnold he's young energetic and had some success in Miami with a very bad team. 

He's 1000x better than Todd Bowles. 

Mike McCarthy was never the answer here, he couldn't win in recent years with Aaron Rodgers it seems the NFL has passed him by. 

Lets all give Adam Gase a chance. 

joewilly12

Agreed. I don't know why people are jumping off bridges. You know one thing about Gase, he knows how to beat every team in the division and has, with sh*t QBs.

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11 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Lol you're the one who introduced Geno Smith as a comparison, not me.

Geno Smith didn't improve, therefore Gase is blameless for Ryan Tannehill failing to improve.

I think we all get the dots you're trying to connect. My point is you are taking the results with Gase and presuming those would have been the results with him or anyone. If that's reasoning, it's flawed at best. 

The fact that you keep using Geno Smith as a comparison  to Tanny really has me questioning your ability to comprehend anything Im saying, i don't  know how much more clear I can make it. It could have been Geno Smith, Jeff George, Ryan Leaf, or any other QB that was not ever going to become a quality starter no mater who the coach was. I said blaming Gase for not improving Tanny is like blaming schotty who you pointed out correctly wasn't  the OC so insert OC of your choice for not improving Smith. Can you understand that was an example of a QB that has no chance of becoming a quality leader at his position? It was an exageration in terms of Tanny but the premise  holds up. Tanny is not top QB material and any improvement he made over the first three years is all he will ever be imo. You keep making this into an argument of Geno vs. tanny and you are totally  ignoring the point that Peyton had his best year ever as a QB under Gase which is actually the point im trying to make. The larger point is he got the most out of Peyton. More than anyone in terms of stats. 55 TD's and almost 5500 yards. 

He can be the guy that gets the most out of Sam as well.  

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22 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

Is everyone ready for Beningo?!?!? HAHAHAHA!!!!!

he didn't explode like i thought he would...honestly...i'm a little let down

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34 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

The fact that you keep using Geno Smith as a comparison  to Tanny really has me questioning your ability to comprehend anything Im saying, i don't  know how much more clear I can make it. It could have been Geno Smith, Jeff George, Ryan Leaf, or any other QB that was not ever going to become a quality starter no mater who the coach was. I said blaming Gase for not improving Tanny is like blaming schotty who you pointed out correctly wasn't  the OC so insert OC of your choice for not improving Smith. Can you understand that was an example of a QB that has no chance of becoming a quality leader at his position? It was an exageration in terms of Tanny but the premise  holds up. Tanny is not top QB material and any improvement he made over the first three years is all he will ever be imo. You keep making this into an argument of Geno vs. tanny and you are totally  ignoring the point that Peyton had his best year ever as a QB under Gase which is actually the point im trying to make. The larger point is he got the most out of Peyton. More than anyone in terms of stats. 55 TD's and almost 5500 yards. 

He can be the guy that gets the most out of Sam as well.  

You are using Geno Smith not me. The idea is one QB - Geno Smith - didn't work out, therefore it is a foregone conclusion that another wouldn't have easier no matter who took over coaching him. 

You're also drawing a conclusion re Peyton that may or may not be true, which is that the improvement was specifically and primarily due to Gase (an issue with assuming correlation = causation, as though it was an otherwise identical split test and further that favorable comparisons to Mike McCoy are all that is required out of an OC). 

It seems you'd like to selectively say when Gase's presence mattered and when it didn't, purely out of whichever makes the more convenient argument. When it's a QB who'd previously been getting better, and then that improvement stopped suddenly, it has nothing to do with Gase.

That's a pretty ridiculous logic to follow and refer to as reasoning. When Manning has a higher statistical year, then and only then you want to point to Gase's influence even though: he's never had a serious/sustained impact on any QB or offense before or since then; plus Denver had the #1 offense before he got there even with Mike McCoy as OC; plus they replaced Brandon Stokley and Joel Dreesen with Wes Welker and Julius Thomas; plus Manning attempting another 70 passes and putting his missed neck-injury season another year behind him. All this had little to nothing to do with Manning's or Denver's rise in stats. The real significant improvement on offense was just Adam Gase, whom you feel is instantly worth another TD per game over what was already the #1 offense.

It's laughable that Gase was the one coach you and pretty much all Jets fans had at the top of their lists, and whom they had in mind when the Jets boasted they were going to go big at the HC position. People were thinking proven SB head coaches with the last name Harbaugh or McCarthy or from the next shiny new thing from the college ranks; not a guy who got fired after 3 years with the Dolphins, with his crowning achievement there being the team getting humiliated in his only playoff game. 

If Gase is good here then he's good here, and we all want that. His track record is pretty meh, though, and this would be the first sustained success of his career.

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35 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You are using Geno Smith not me. The idea is one QB - Geno Smith - didn't work out, therefore it is a foregone conclusion that another wouldn't have easier no matter who took over coaching him. 

You're also drawing a conclusion re Peyton that may or may not be true, which is that the improvement was specifically and primarily due to Gase (an issue with assuming correlation = causation, as though it was an otherwise identical split test and further that favorable comparisons to Mike McCoy are all that is required out of an OC). 

It seems you'd like to selectively say when Gase's presence mattered and when it didn't, purely out of whichever makes the more convenient argument. When it's a QB who'd previously been getting better, and then that improvement stopped suddenly, it has nothing to do with Gase.

That's a pretty ridiculous logic to follow and refer to as reasoning. When Manning has a higher statistical year, then and only then you want to point to Gase's influence even though: he's never had a serious/sustained impact on any QB or offense before or since then; plus Denver had the #1 offense before he got there even with Mike McCoy as OC; plus they replaced Brandon Stokley and Joel Dreesen with Wes Welker and Julius Thomas; plus Manning attempting another 70 passes and putting his missed neck-injury season another year behind him. All this had little to nothing to do with Manning's or Denver's rise in stats. The real significant improvement on offense was just Adam Gase, whom you feel is instantly worth another TD per game over what was already the #1 offense.

It's laughable that Gase was the one coach you and pretty much all Jets fans had at the top of their lists, and whom they had in mind when the Jets boasted they were going to go big at the HC position. People were thinking proven SB head coaches with the last name Harbaugh or McCarthy or from the next shiny new thing from the college ranks; not a guy who got fired after 3 years with the Dolphins, with his crowning achievement there being the team getting humiliated in his only playoff game. 

If Gase is good here then he's good here, and we all want that. His track record is pretty meh, though, and this would be the first sustained success of his career.

Actually.I wanted MM. There are plenty of posts here to support that. 

Look, if you don't  want to give Gase credit and say Peyton would have had the year he had with or without him, fine, but saying it may or may not be true as far as football and stats go can be said aout every good or bad player in the league when it comes to coaching. .

So can we stop the Geno vs Tanny comparison.  It's a strawman arguement and I never made that a point of my post. It seems when you spot something that makes your argument or gives you something to argue no matter how insignificant  the starement was, its all you want to talk about. Geno was a micro point and Peyton was macro. 

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I slept on it: Gase was really the only logical choice to make out of the pool we interviewed:

 

McCarthy was in San Fran when they chose Alex Smith over ARod. He hasn’t developed anyone behind ARod- their backups have all stunk. He has never had an offense ranked above 19th in the NFL. He’s burned out. He’s rigid and inflexible. We just got rid of a rigid and inflexible coach.

 

Kingbury is talking about trading Josh Rosen and drafting The diminutive Lilliputian Kyler Murray. Imagine if we hired him and he decided to trade Darnold and draft KylerMurray?

 

Rhule couldn’t have put together an NFL staff. A Rhule hire would be essentially Tomsula in San Fran where he was pulling guys off broadcast tv and radio to join his staff.

 

Gase won with Tannehill his first year. Tannehill has been an injured porcelain wreck since. He’s young with NFL experience.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

 

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16 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

He did win with osweiler....

tumblr_my0yq0F2dk1t8quc8o1_500.gif?fbcli

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16 hours ago, prime21 said:

Apparently Peyton Manning spoke to Mac and spoke very highly of Gase

I think Manning spoke to C. Johnson.

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11 hours ago, Vader said:

Bellichick does it with less “affect” so to speak 

Gase is definite on the spectrum 

Reminds me more of Ryan Leaf.  This guy won't last.  Terrible hire.

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I don't believe Gase was their first choice.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

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what happened to the poll on this? last I saw of it, 80 percent of the fans here voted against the hire. 

was it deleted so that all the people who disapprove of Gase can hide that they were wrong, years from now when the Jets are actually a success?

 

I smell COLLUSION 

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Congrats to everyone who knew this was a terrible hire from the get go and refused to sugar coat it. 

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