Chris & Woody's Butler Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 I'm still not sure where I fall with the Gase hire. Hiring Williams and retaining Boyer I'm very happy with. I'd like to see him not hire his buddy who coached with him in Miami and get a fresh voice as the OC. That said...what dawned on me today is we went from having Bowles, Bates and Rodgers to a staff that had two coaches that were HC's at the end of the season. You gotta have talent to win (not a fan of Macc's work) but you also need to have good coaches. We haven't had that in a while. We now have 2 guys that were HC's last year on our staff along with the guy that oversaw the best ST unit in the league. An improvement for sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornJetsFan1983 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 is better than one unless its QBs trying to get the starting job and your name is hackenberg and whatever those other guys names were Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New York Mick Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 minute ago, New York Mick said: Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? Doug Pederson has the same setup with the Eagles. He orchestrates the offense and leaves the defense solely in the hands of Jim Schwartz. Seems to have worked well for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge4Tide Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Chris and Woody share the same butler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nixhead Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 We went from ZERO head coaches to 2 and yes I like the set up of Gase worrying about the offense and Williams the defense. Might lead to some firey practices but that’s what the team needs. Just don’t be injuring each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New York Mick Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, Untouchable said: Doug Pederson has the same setup with the Eagles. He orchestrates the offense and leaves the defense solely in the hands of Jim Schwartz. Seems to have worked well for them. I don’t mind if the HC does one or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pac Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, Untouchable said: Doug Pederson has the same setup with the Eagles. He orchestrates the offense and leaves the defense solely in the hands of Jim Schwartz. Seems to have worked well for them. Rams too.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nico002 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 16 minutes ago, Untouchable said: Doug Pederson has the same setup with the Eagles. He orchestrates the offense and leaves the defense solely in the hands of Jim Schwartz. Seems to have worked well for them. And the saints, rams... and chiefs... and the 80s/90s 49ers... and essentially every team ever where the HC calls plays on either side of the ball. i fins it laughable that people are pumped about Williams but hesitant about Gase. Gase has been much more successful than Williams as both a HC and Coordinator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varjet Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Bowles was not a CEO. He should have been calling the plays. He fired himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freestater Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Sarge4Tide said: Chris and Woody share the same butler? I think that's the overlooked detail here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryu79 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Isn't this exactly what everyone wanted in the Mcvay/Phillips, Pederson/Schwartz mold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 6 hours ago, New York Mick said: Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? Not really. An offensive head coach is not going to tell their DC to give up more yards or points, BUT defensive head coaches tell OCs to go super conservative sacrifice pointsby running the ball excessively ALL THE TIME Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangerous Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 it'll be interesting how the rest of the hc duties shake out. i think the jet assistant coaches were relying on bowles to lead both sides of the ball and bowles didn't seem to be able to discipline the players that well. and it's tough to be an assistant who doesn't know if he has carte blanche regarding what goes on in his position. bowles was probably dictating game plans as opposed to letting bates or morton or gailey call the game the way they wanted. it may be a little different with gase because he apparently has very little experience with defense and has brought in a pretty alpha dc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 11 hours ago, New York Mick said: Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? Yes, but no. Defense is a nice to have. Offense is everything. From a division of labor standpoint it seems the same. From a prioritization standpoint it is not. Also, every time we’ve done this we’ve done it with low tier coaches. It’s different to use this model with established guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 12 hours ago, Chris & Woody's Butler said: I'm still not sure where I fall with the Gase hire. Hiring Williams and retaining Boyer I'm very happy with. I'd like to see him not hire his buddy who coached with him in Miami and get a fresh voice as the OC. That said...what dawned on me today is we went from having Bowles, Bates and Rodgers to a staff that had two coaches that were HC's at the end of the season. You gotta have talent to win (not a fan of Macc's work) but you also need to have good coaches. We haven't had that in a while. We now have 2 guys that were HC's last year on our staff along with the guy that oversaw the best ST unit in the league. An improvement for sure... I would add that for Gase, focusing on coaching and not personnel management is a plus. He was given too much to handle in Miami for a relatively new HC and that was part of the problem. Having the GM handle personnel/drafting is a better organizational arrangement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 11 hours ago, Untouchable said: Doug Pederson has the same setup with the Eagles. He orchestrates the offense and leaves the defense solely in the hands of Jim Schwartz. Seems to have worked well for them. Belichick is the only successful coach I know who seems to grasp both sides well enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 17 minutes ago, rangerous said: it'll be interesting how the rest of the hc duties shake out. i think the jet assistant coaches were relying on bowles to lead both sides of the ball and bowles didn't seem to be able to discipline the players that well. and it's tough to be an assistant who doesn't know if he has carte blanche regat the fact that Williams knows a lot more defense than he does.rding what goes on in his position. bowles was probably dictating game plans as opposed to letting bates or morton or gailey call the game the way they wanted. it may be a little different with gase because he apparently has very little experience with defense and has brought in a pretty alpha dc. I am sure they will have discussions. Gase is just up front about the fact that Williams knows a ot more defense than he does. In game tactical decisionswill still rest with Gase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 11 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said: I would add that for Gase, focusing on coaching and not personnel management is a plus. He was given too much to handle in Miami for a relatively new HC and that was part of the problem. Having the GM handle personnel/drafting is a better organizational arrangement. Payton, Reid and McVay are all geeked up on their offenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenFish Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 11 hours ago, Pac said: Rams too.. Bears too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesr Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 The key for Gase in this situation, IMHO, is to ensure standards are applied equally across units. You can't have the defensive players running gassers in practice because of penalties and not have the offense doing the same. That's how divisions occur, when one unit seems to get preferential treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 15 hours ago, Chris & Woody's Butler said: I'm still not sure where I fall with the Gase hire. Hiring Williams and retaining Boyer I'm very happy with. I'd like to see him not hire his buddy who coached with him in Miami and get a fresh voice as the OC. That said...what dawned on me today is we went from having Bowles, Bates and Rodgers to a staff that had two coaches that were HC's at the end of the season. You gotta have talent to win (not a fan of Macc's work) but you also need to have good coaches. We haven't had that in a while. We now have 2 guys that were HC's last year on our staff along with the guy that oversaw the best ST unit in the league. An improvement for sure... ANDRE ROBERTS... we need to re-sign this guy. Boyer did a good job this year, but Roberts actually made us remember what it was like to have something other than horrible returners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 14 hours ago, Sarge4Tide said: Chris and Woody share the same butler? Yes. They are cheap. Haven’t you heard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
More Cowbell Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 15 hours ago, Chris & Woody's Butler said: I'm still not sure where I fall with the Gase hire. Hiring Williams and retaining Boyer I'm very happy with. I'd like to see him not hire his buddy who coached with him in Miami and get a fresh voice as the OC. That said...what dawned on me today is we went from having Bowles, Bates and Rodgers to a staff that had two coaches that were HC's at the end of the season. You gotta have talent to win (not a fan of Macc's work) but you also need to have good coaches. We haven't had that in a while. We now have 2 guys that were HC's last year on our staff along with the guy that oversaw the best ST unit in the league. An improvement for sure... I was actually just thinking about this. For once the Jets seem to be making very good moves at least on paper. In the past with most of our coaches there has been no HC experience, now we seem to have a lot of this kind of experience. I'm trying to keep myself tempered but for once I am really excoted about the makeup of this staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNuuFaaolaExperience Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 18 hours ago, New York Mick said: Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? The difference is clock management and controlling the flow, and tempo of the game. I'm not sure how to explain it, but letting another coach call the defensive plays isn't the same as letting another coach call the offense. I hope that someone else can explain what I'm trying to say, so I can agree with it and say "yeah, that's what I was trying to say." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 18 hours ago, New York Mick said: Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? there are dozens if not hundreds of alarming details with the Gase hire. I still haven't gotten a satisfying answer how Gase could let a Chris Foerster situation manifest itself if he was really paying attention to the whole team Bowles benches Sheldon Richardson for a quarters it's bedlam but Adam Gase had one his coaches on TMZ making a stripper cocaine video and no one cares. or another good one the offensive team rankings that we all used to justify firing Bowles should be ignored when it comes to Gase. He's a QB whisperer from the league's 30th ranked offense. the reality is most Jets fans are NOT processing anything negative right now. it's all candy land and super bowls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsons Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 18 hours ago, New York Mick said: Doesn’t everyone get angry when a defensive HC only worries about the D? Isn’t this pretty much the same? not really... it all depends on who's running the other side... if he's competent & has a successful resume ala Philips/Rams or Schwartz/Eagles you let them do what they do best... as long as the HC communicates well with them & both are on the same page (w/no ego trips) then it should be alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 19 hours ago, Untouchable said: Doug Pederson has the same setup with the Eagles. He orchestrates the offense and leaves the defense solely in the hands of Jim Schwartz. Seems to have worked well for them. What worked for the Eagles was having a SB-caliber roster. A handful of legit receiving targets, 3+ probowl/allpro OLmen (started with 4), and a pair of QBs good enough to deliver if needed. On D it wasn't as simple as Schwartz's presence or orchestrated pairing. Having a DL with Cox in the middle and a legit edge rusher alone make things easier for those behind them. It's curious how they were able to get that far without a single drafted safety in the starting lineup (nor even on the roster for that matter, so far as I can tell at a glance). Pederson + Schwartz + recent Jets rosters = 0 superbowls. One would have an uphill battle arguing with this. It's the roster 10-fold more than the coaching. Schwartz has coached top 5 ranked defenses and #32-ranked defenses (even in back to back seasons). No one's fool enough to say coaching doesn't matter at all, but if you don't have at least a legitimate contender roster overall, it won't matter. In terms of importance, it's certainly nowhere near on an equal level to the roster. If the contention is otherwise, then we had no business hiring Gase or Williams - let alone both - since both had been overseeing bottom-10 units in their respective areas of expertise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangerous Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 9 hours ago, jack48 said: I am sure they will have discussions. Gase is just up front about the fact that Williams knows a ot more defense than he does. In game tactical decisionswill still rest with Gase. i'm certainly hoping so. if these guys get along then this could be a really good coaching staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 2 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: What worked for the Eagles was having a SB-caliber roster. A handful of legit receiving targets, 3+ probowl/allpro OLmen (started with 4), and a pair of QBs good enough to deliver if needed. On D it wasn't as simple as Schwartz's presence or orchestrated pairing. Having a DL with Cox in the middle and a legit edge rusher alone make things easier for those behind them. It's curious how they were able to get that far without a single drafted safety in the starting lineup (nor even on the roster for that matter, so far as I can tell at a glance). Pederson + Schwartz + recent Jets rosters = 0 superbowls. One would have an uphill battle arguing with this. It's the roster 10-fold more than the coaching. Schwartz has coached top 5 ranked defenses and #32-ranked defenses (even in back to back seasons). No one's fool enough to say coaching doesn't matter at all, but if you don't have at least a legitimate contender roster overall, it won't matter. In terms of importance, it's certainly nowhere near on an equal level to the roster. If the contention is otherwise, then we had no business hiring Gase or Williams - let alone both - since both had been overseeing bottom-10 units in their respective areas of expertise. So true. You cannot coach up an average team to a division championship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 If they could sign a FA edge rusher and draft Quinnen, I think Greg Williams would be dancing in the street. They will know whether they have that rusher before the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tfine Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 LOL We killed Rex when he only cared about the D and was hands off on the O....but this is ok.Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmajet Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 16 hours ago, johnnysd said: Not really. An offensive head coach is not going to tell their DC to give up more yards or points, BUT defensive head coaches tell OCs to go super conservative sacrifice pointsby running the ball excessively ALL THE TIME Agreed. Also, in this case, the DC is a strong enough coach - he can run the defense without much guidance. Our OC not only needed guidance, but he got it from someone who plays not to loose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joenamathwouldn'tcry Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 23 hours ago, BornJetsFan1983 said: 2 is better than one unless its QBs trying to get the starting job and your name is hackenberg and whatever those other guys names were You mean Hackenburg was trying to get the starting job? It's worse than I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Jet Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Eagles fans I know want Schwartz gone and blame him for losing the playoff game against the Saints because his defence was so predictable. The issue with bifurcating the responsibilities on offence and defence like the way the Jets are going is that it looks fantastic when it works, but when it doesn't work, the head coach may not have the capacity to understand where it's going wrong and where to make changes (short of firing the defensive coordinator). It might be my naivety but I would think a head coach should know what's happening on both sides of the field, not just his bread and butter. As noted above, we killed Rex for only caring about defence and Bowles was the same, but we're going to cut Gase some slack because he coordinated Denver's offence the season where Manning called his own plays from the huddle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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