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Murray measurements

CTJetsFan

By CTJetsFan
in NY Jets Forum

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jetstream23

jetstream23

Posted
Posted

Bulk up for Combine.  Get height, weight, hand measured.  Everyone goes crazy.  He doesn't throw, run, bench or do any other physical activity.

Spends next 5 weeks working out, running, throwing.  Loses 10 lbs and then holds a Pro Day at his university where he runs a 4.2 40-yard dash and completes 35 of 35 passes to uncovered WRs.

With the 1st pick in the 2019 NFL Draft the Arizona Cardinals take....

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jetstream23

jetstream23

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Posted
4 hours ago, New York Mick said:

Arizona isn’t taking him

Not so sure.

You hire a new coach who runs a system that is perfect for this QB and then don't take Murray, but instead you force the guy you took last year on him?  I'm not sure Steve Keim operates that way.

My best guess is that if the Cardinals can get a pick no worse than a high 2nd rounder for Rosen then they will deal him.

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Jet9

Jet9

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Posted
1 hour ago, Patriot Killa said:

If Arizona traded Rosen, I wouldn’t be surprised if the Patriots were the ones to call up and get a trade in. They have some picks to use.

Was thinking the same thing actually. And if you're a QB with issues about getting hit then New England is the right place for you. 

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CanadaSteve

CanadaSteve

Posted
Posted
16 hours ago, CTJetsFan said:

Doug Flutie was listed as 5'10 but I don't think he was actually that tall

One mediocre NFL caliber QB in the past 40 years does not make for a bucking trend.

Unless the NFL is trending toward lineman/linebackers in the 5'11' range as well.

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CTM

CTM

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

If Arizona traded Rosen, I wouldn’t be surprised if the Patriots were the ones to call up and get a trade in. They have some picks to use.

Yeah, been thinking that too. Would be terrible imo

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Skeptable

Skeptable

Posted
Posted
19 hours ago, New York Mick said:

Arizona isn’t taking him

You are so sure of yourself... I say the opposite that they are absolutely taking him... maybe depending on what compensation they get for Rosen he doesn't go #1 but I highly doubt if they trade Rosen that they don't take him #1 overall

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Bruce Harper

Bruce Harper

Posted
Posted
15 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

Bulk up for Combine.  Get height, weight, hand measured.  Everyone goes crazy.  He doesn't throw, run, bench or do any other physical activity.

Spends next 5 weeks working out, running, throwing.  Loses 10 lbs and then holds a Pro Day at his university where he runs a 4.2 40-yard dash and completes 35 of 35 passes to uncovered WRs.

With the 1st pick in the 2019 NFL Draft the Arizona Cardinals take....

This is probably all true.  But I think he will be a better pro than a lot of people think.

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Skeptable

Skeptable

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, CanadaSteve said:

One mediocre NFL caliber QB in the past 40 years does not make for a bucking trend.

Unless the NFL is trending toward lineman/linebackers in the 5'11' range as well.

So you are telling me Russell Wilson at 5'11 is a completely ok and one of the top QBs in the league but if he was 5'10" he would fail??? come on now... thats just stupid.

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Bruce Harper

Bruce Harper

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Posted
7 hours ago, Jet9 said:

Was thinking the same thing actually. And if you're a QB with issues about getting hit then New England is the right place for you. 

The Pats have a sh*tload of picks this year.  And the rule has changed so that you can trade compensatory picks now.

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Skeptable

Skeptable

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Posted
9 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

If Arizona traded Rosen, I wouldn’t be surprised if the Patriots were the ones to call up and get a trade in. They have some picks to use.

So now you are starting to accept the theories around Rosen being traded and Murray going #1... Murray is a once in a generation talent. And you are absolutely right... Belicheck is going to make that call and get Rosen... Then unfortunately for the Jets the AFCE will be stacked with young QBs (After Miami tanks and picks up Tua, Herbert, or McSorley next year)

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Patriot Killa

Patriot Killa

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

So now you are starting to accept the theories around Rosen being traded and Murray going #1... Murray is a once in a generation talent. And you are absolutely right... Belicheck is going to make that call and get Rosen... Then unfortunately for the Jets the AFCE will be stacked with young QBs (After Miami tanks and picks up Tua, Herbert, or McSorley next year)

Accept? No. Mostly just speculating because I’m bored lol.

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CTM

CTM

Posted
Posted
46 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

Seriously. They have a good system fit for him too. That’s something I’m not prepared to deal with lol.

I would be Jetsy for Rosen to become an all pro there and Darnold has a middling career

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JoJoTownsell1

JoJoTownsell1

Posted
Posted

Not sure if this was mentioned, but the Chargers had Brees and when the chance to draft Rivers (supposedly a better QB prospect) they abandoned ship on Brees. Obviously, Brees was a FA and not in year 2 of a rookie contract, but he was also a pretty good QB with SD. Rosen hasn't proven anything yet. 
Since they have a new HC in town, it's not crazy to think the Cards would switch directions and go with Murray and trade Rosen while he still has pretty good value. 

 

Mayfield and Mahomes success has opened the door for these gun slinger/spread offense/athletic QBs to get drafted #1 overall. Murray still hasn't proven to me that he can do what Mayfield/Mahomes can do in the pocket. But Murray may be the better all around athlete. It's a tough spot for Arizona to be in. 

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joenamathwouldn'tcry

joenamathwouldn'tcry

Posted
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28 minutes ago, CTM said:

I would be Jetsy for Rosen to become an all pro there and Darnold has a middling career

I don't understand what's going on with you guys here.  We're hand wringing over the "prospect" of the Patriocheats trading for Josh Rosen?  First of all, what has Josh Rosen done to make you think that he is to be a  feared adversary? The "system" calls for quick play recognition, quick release, and a knack for reading defenses, pre snap.  Rosen has shown a capability in none of these areas. 

Secondly, there is no chance, in my opinion that Sam Darnold will have a middling career, by any stretch of the imagination.  In the remote possibility that is  true, it would only be because of continued Jet ineptitude, and if that were the case, he is young, will move on, and surely find success elsewhere.

Lastly, who ,besides Cindy Brady, have the Patriocheats developed as a quarterback?  The exception possibly  being Garoppolo, who the jury's still out on.  This is the impressive list.  Rohan Davey, {who?] , Ryan Mallette, Brian Hoyer, and journeyman and failed starter Matt Cassel.  Not a success story in the bunch.  Bellicheat is not going to be around forever, who knows if he'll go out the door with Cindy.

Point is, if the trade for Rosen and spend big draft capitol, it weakens their team next year and in successive years too.  Good luck to both of them.

1 hour ago, Patriot Killa said:

Seriously. They have a good system fit for him too. That’s something I’m not prepared to deal with lol.

 

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Patriot Killa

Patriot Killa

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Posted
31 minutes ago, joenamathwouldn'tcry said:

The "system" calls for quick play recognition, quick release, and a knack for reading defenses, pre snap.  Rosen has shown a capability in none of these areas. 

This is not entirely true. Quick release, playing a pro style offense and reading coverages were his bread and butter at UCLA. They regarded him as a traditional drop back passer who’s strength is to beat you with his mind. 1.) his OL was damn near historically bad and2.) he was a rookie so he was going to look that skiddish at some point or another, it just so happened that he had it behind a Grade D Offensive Line.

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chirorob

chirorob

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Posted
53 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Not sure if this was mentioned, but the Chargers had Brees and when the chance to draft Rivers (supposedly a better QB prospect) they abandoned ship on Brees. Obviously, Brees was a FA and not in year 2 of a rookie contract, but he was also a pretty good QB with SD. Rosen hasn't proven anything yet. 
Since they have a new HC in town, it's not crazy to think the Cards would switch directions and go with Murray and trade Rosen while he still has pretty good value. 

 

Mayfield and Mahomes success has opened the door for these gun slinger/spread offense/athletic QBs to get drafted #1 overall. Murray still hasn't proven to me that he can do what Mayfield/Mahomes can do in the pocket. But Murray may be the better all around athlete. It's a tough spot for Arizona to be in. 

Brees actually hadn't done a ton with SD when they drafted Rivers, and actually was coming off his 3rd season in football, where his record was 2-9 with more interceptions than touchdowns. (His 2nd season was decent though).   The only  reason Brees got one more shot was Rivers held out and missed training camp.  

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14 in Green

14 in Green

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Posted
40 minutes ago, joenamathwouldn'tcry said:

I don't understand what's going on with you guys here.  We're hand wringing over the "prospect" of the Patriocheats trading for Josh Rosen?  First of all, what has Josh Rosen done to make you think that he is to be a  feared adversary? The "system" calls for quick play recognition, quick release, and a knack for reading defenses, pre snap.  Rosen has shown a capability in none of these areas. 

Secondly, there is no chance, in my opinion that Sam Darnold will have a middling career, by any stretch of the imagination.  In the remote possibility that is  true, it would only be because of continued Jet ineptitude, and if that were the case, he is young, will move on, and surely find success elsewhere.

Lastly, who ,besides Cindy Brady, have the Patriocheats developed as a quarterback?  The exception possibly  being Garoppolo, who the jury's still out on.  This is the impressive list.  Rohan Davey, {who?] , Ryan Mallette, Brian Hoyer, and journeyman and failed starter Matt Cassel.  Not a success story in the bunch.  Bellicheat is not going to be around forever, who knows if he'll go out the door with Cindy.

Point is, if the trade for Rosen and spend big draft capitol, it weakens their team next year and in successive years too.  Good luck to both of them.

 

I don't know enough about Rosen, except that he was put in the worst position of all the rookie QBs last year. I'm not ready to give up on a guy who played under a worse HC then Bowles, and possibly a worse OL then the Jets. I do think he'll show rapid improvement under KK if he stays in Arizona, or if he goes to a well run organization like New England.

Personally I don't understand this certainty so many here feel about Darnold achieving stardom, along with the oft stated belief that if he doesn't, it will be the Jets fault. Lets not forget Darnold was well on his way to setting a record for ints by a rookie (not sure, but I think he still ended up leading the league) before he got a much needed 4 week break midseason.

I'm going to say something here that I know I'll get killed for, but I truly believe. The foot injury Darnold had was not one severe enough that he should've missed as much time as he did. I'm of the belief that Bowles/Bates made the decision that things were spiraling out of control for him and the 4 int game cemented that for them. I think they helped him more then we'll ever know by keeping him out those 4 weeks. He came back looking like a different guy the next 3 weeks, until he, along with the rest of the team, stunk up the joint against New England in the final game.

I think he showed enough those 3 weeks though that we can feel better about him going forward, and I think he will become a solid starting QB. Of course I hope he becomes better then that, but I'm not as sure he will as most of you are.

Jet fans are so quick to overlook the bad in Darnold's rookie year, and cling to the good. Yet they are equally quick to decide Allen, Rosen and Jackson will never become the QB our guy will. Its very strange to me that so many feel that way. The only reason I can think of is the relief that so many feel to finally have a good young prospect at QB has clouded any sense of reality when it comes to their evaluation of him and his peers.

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#27TheDominator

#27TheDominator

Posted
Posted

People ripping the Pats development of QBs are a bit misguided.  Who, since Brady have they drafted high?  Garoppolo was a 2nd. Brissett and Mallet were 3rds that other teams have deemed worthy of starting.  Cassel was a 7th that teams have handed the starting job on opening day. Hoyer an UDFA that has been a starter  How many teams have had that kind of record, all while starting an all-time great HOF'er and having no need to actually locate a QB?

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nico002

nico002

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Posted
3 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

I don't know enough about Rosen, except that he was put in the worst position of all the rookie QBs last year. I'm not ready to give up on a guy who played under a worse HC then Bowles, and possibly a worse OL then the Jets. I do think he'll show rapid improvement under KK if he stays in Arizona, or if he goes to a well run organization like New England.

Personally I don't understand this certainty so many here feel about Darnold achieving stardom, along with the oft stated belief that if he doesn't, it will be the Jets fault. Lets not forget Darnold was well on his way to setting a record for ints by a rookie (not sure, but I think he still ended up leading the league) before he got a much needed 4 week break midseason.

I'm going to say something here that I know I'll get killed for, but I truly believe. The foot injury Darnold had was not one severe enough that he should've missed as much time as he did. I'm of the belief that Bowles/Bates made the decision that things were spiraling out of control for him and the 4 int game cemented that for them. I think they helped him more then we'll ever know by keeping him out those 4 weeks. He came back looking like a different guy the next 3 weeks, until he, along with the rest of the team, stunk up the joint against New England in the final game.

I think he showed enough those 3 weeks though that we can feel better about him going forward, and I think he can become a solid starting QB. Of course I hope he becomes better then that, but I'm not as sure he will as most of you are.

Jet fans are so quick to overlook the bad in Darnold's rookie year, yet are equally quick to decide Allen, Rosen and Jackson will never become the QB our guy will. Its very strange to me that so many feel that way. The only reason I can think of is the relief that so many feel to finally have a good young prospect at QB has clouded any sense of reality when it comes to their evaluation of him and his peers.

Cards OL is bad but the weapons are better than Jets. They also play in a Dome. 

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CTM

CTM

Posted
Posted
40 minutes ago, joenamathwouldn'tcry said:

I don't understand what's going on with you guys here.  We're hand wringing over the "prospect" of the Patriocheats trading for Josh Rosen?  First of all, what has Josh Rosen done to make you think that he is to be a  feared adversary? The "system" calls for quick play recognition, quick release, and a knack for reading defenses, pre snap.  Rosen has shown a capability in none of these areas. 

Secondly, there is no chance, in my opinion that Sam Darnold will have a middling career, by any stretch of the imagination.  In the remote possibility that is  true, it would only be because of continued Jet ineptitude, and if that were the case, he is young, will move on, and surely find success elsewhere.

Lastly, who ,besides Cindy Brady, have the Patriocheats developed as a quarterback?  The exception possibly  being Garoppolo, who the jury's still out on.  This is the impressive list.  Rohan Davey, {who?] , Ryan Mallette, Brian Hoyer, and journeyman and failed starter Matt Cassel.  Not a success story in the bunch.  Bellicheat is not going to be around forever, who knows if he'll go out the door with Cindy.

Point is, if the trade for Rosen and spend big draft capitol, it weakens their team next year and in successive years too.  Good luck to both of them.

 

All I said is that it would be very Jetsy, and it would.

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JoJoTownsell1

JoJoTownsell1

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Posted
7 minutes ago, chirorob said:

Brees actually hadn't done a ton with SD when they drafted Rivers, and actually was coming off his 3rd season in football, where his record was 2-9 with more interceptions than touchdowns. (His 2nd season was decent though).   The only  reason Brees got one more shot was Rivers held out and missed training camp.  

I think you missed a couple of years of his career.

Brees was very good his last two years completing roughly 65pct of his passes and having a 27-7 and 24-15 TD/Int ratio those two years. The Chargers actually went 12-4 in 2004 with Brees and 9-7 in 2005. He was small and that made some think he was never going to be a true franchise QB. 

 

In the Chargers defense, Rivers has been great so I don't think they made the wrong decision even if Brees has a SB. 

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joenamathwouldn'tcry

joenamathwouldn'tcry

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Posted
6 minutes ago, Patriot Killa said:

This is not entirely true. Quick release, playing a pro style offense and reading coverages were his bread and butter at UCLA. They regarded him as a traditional drop back passer who’s strength is to beat you with his mind. 1.) his OL was damn near historically bad and2.) he was a rookie so he was going to look that skiddish at some point or another, it just so happened that he had it behind a Grade D Offensive Line.

Agreed. I liked him out of UCLA.  Thought he was going to be our pick. I also have stated many times that I thought the Cardinals Offensive Line was the worst in football.  Actually defended him yesterday, in discussing the Murray "swap". 

That being said last year, in the games that I watched, he showed little pocket presence, didn't "slide" well, appeared to be slow reading the defense, and forced the ball often.  Sam was under duress nearly as much, had a center who couldn't even snap the ball, and had a receiving corps that got no separation from the defense until late in the year. On top of that, Bilal Powell, the only running back who could actually block blitzing defenders, missed the second half of the season.

In spite of similar challenges to Rosen, Sam handled the rush, and adverse conditions much better, with superior results.

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14 in Green

14 in Green

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Posted
2 minutes ago, nico002 said:

Cards OL is bad but the weapons are better than Jets. They also play in a Dome. 

His WRs were old and/or injured They no longer are what their "names" said they were. The CS was historically bad. Wilks and his staff shouldn't even have been given the one full season they were. Everyone who saw what was going on down there was more concerned about Rosen surviving the season in one piece then anything else. He barely made it.

I didn't realize playing in a dome assured greatness in a QB, but if that's a thing, there have been an awful lot of outliers over the years.

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nico002

nico002

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Posted
1 minute ago, 14 in Green said:

His WRs were old and/or injured They no longer are what their "names" said they were. The CS was historically bad. Wilks and his staff shouldn't even have been given the one full season they were. Everyone who saw what was going on down there was more concerned about Rosen surviving the season in one piece then anything else. He barely made it.

I didn't realize playing in a dome assured greatness in a QB, but if that's a thing, there have been an awful lot of outliers over the years.

You don't know that playing QB in a Dome is easier? You're joking? 

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