Jetsfan80 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Quote Mississippi State’s Montez Sweat was the clear winner on the day. The 6-foot-6, 260-pound edge rusher clocked an official 4.41 in the 40—a record for defensive linemen. Times for the 40 can get overblown for pass rushers, but Sweat’s 1.5-second 10-yard split was the second best among edge defenders (TCU’s Ben Banogu, who also dominated virtually every test, finished with a 1.47) and indicates an excellent initial burst. To go along with that performance, Sweat recorded a broad jump that landed in the 92nd percentile among edge rushers since 1999 and a three-cone drill time in the 83rd percentile. Sweat was already considered a potential first-round pick heading into the combine, and he likely moved up a few draft boards on Sunday. Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdels62 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? Mediocre production and then a heart condition. Brian Burns is a safer pick at this point. Allen and Bosa are much safer choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Smith Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 13 minutes ago, kdels62 said: Mediocre production and then a heart condition. Brian Burns is a safer pick at this point. Allen and Bosa are much safer choices. 30 TFL and 22.5 sacks over the last 2 years in the SEC is mediocre production? If so, we can use some more mediocre performers.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRL Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, J_Smith said: 30 TFL and 22.5 sacks over the last 2 years in the SEC is mediocre production? If so, we can use some more mediocre performers.... Someone who did research Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdels62 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 Just now, J_Smith said: 30 TFL and 22.5 sacks over the last 2 years in the SEC is mediocre production? If so, we can use some more mediocre performers.... Playing next to Jeffery Simmons who, if not for being a bad human and having torn an ACL, would be a top 10 pick. Sweat is good and there’s a lot to like about his profile but he’s far from polished especially in comparison to Allen or Bosa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardTodd27 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 31 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? If it means getting a couple of extra 2nd rounders and future 1st rounder, than I'll sum up my feelings about Sweat in 2 words: SIGN MEUP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetFreak89 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 28 minutes ago, kdels62 said: Mediocre production and then a heart condition. Brian Burns is a safer pick at this point. Not that I place all trust in this guy as I don't know for sure how he comes up exactly with these metrics but according to him, Sweat's production is at least that of former Pro Bowlers but not as much as All Pros. Definitely better than your average starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 33 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? I think hes viewed pretty much as a base 4-3 DE in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Smith Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 8 minutes ago, kdels62 said: Playing next to Jeffery Simmons who, if not for being a bad human and having torn an ACL, would be a top 10 pick. Sweat is good and there’s a lot to like about his profile but he’s far from polished especially in comparison to Allen or Bosa. Bosa played on a defensive line full of future nfl players, as did Q Williams, so I’m not sure how that negativity effects your view of sweat? one of the reasons I’m so impressed with Josh Allen, is because he was the only player offenses had to game plan around. He still put up huge numbers. Looked good in coverage too the couple times i watched him play i think sweat would be a great pickup in a trade down scenario. I don’t think he’s polished either, which make his numbers more impressive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdels62 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 24 minutes ago, J_Smith said: Bosa played on a defensive line full of future nfl players, as did Q Williams, so I’m not sure how that negativity effects your view of sweat? one of the reasons I’m so impressed with Josh Allen, is because he was the only player offenses had to game plan around. He still put up huge numbers. Looked good in coverage too the couple times i watched him play i think sweat would be a great pickup in a trade down scenario. I don’t think he’s polished either, which make his numbers more impressive Let me be clear about Sweat. I really like him but he’s definitely not Allen or Bosa and is more likely to bust than either. If we trade down into the teens and get Sweat plus a second rounder or 2 then I’m all for it. Allen is underrated in my mind. He’s excellent in coverage and as a pushrusher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? He didn't hit either of the Waldo numbers. I'd be interested to see what his pSPARQ is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? heart issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantasy Island Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? Had to google him, no thanks. Montez Sweat: 'I've matured a lot' since getting kicked out of Michigan State' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 Only guy I’d be willing to trade down for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 19 minutes ago, Fantasy Island said: Had to google him, no thanks. Montez Sweat: 'I've matured a lot' since getting kicked out of Michigan State' So? Randy Moss got kicked out of college he turned out ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New York Mick Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 49 minutes ago, jack48 said: heart issue? Yes. He never made it to the end of the yellow brick road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, New York Mick said: Yes. He never made it to the end of the yellow brick road. I thought I read that he had an actual physical heart issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philc1 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 minute ago, jack48 said: I thought I read that he had an actual physical heart issue No one knows due HIPPAA rules but supposedly people were aware of it before he even went to college and doctors always cleared him to play If Sweat falls to round 2 because of this trade back into the 2nd rd and snatch him up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 57 minutes ago, dbatesman said: He didn't hit either of the Waldo numbers. I'd be interested to see what his pSPARQ is. 145. He has an insane wingspan/arm length. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New York Mick Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 11 minutes ago, jack48 said: I thought I read that he had an actual physical heart issue They can’t tell us and it should never been leaked but he played in college and did good at the combine. I think his heart will be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 35 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: 145. He has an insane wingspan/arm length. Thanks--that is impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, dbatesman said: He didn't hit either of the Waldo numbers. I'd be interested to see what his pSPARQ is. High https://3sigmaathlete.com/sparq-rankings-2019/edge/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 9 minutes ago, dbatesman said: Thanks--that is impressive. I should add that this is a purely academic discussion, since there is no universe in which Maccagnan would take Sweat at 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdels62 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 2 hours ago, dbatesman said: He didn't hit either of the Waldo numbers. I'd be interested to see what his pSPARQ is. Which metrics does he miss? (A genuine question) Everything points to Josh Allen being a very good but not great athlete. Then he also has the production and skillset that makes him a usage metric darling. It makes sense to choose Allen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Lonelyhearts Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 The best end in this class might have spent the past three years playing nose tackle for a red-assed moron. Just look at the stupid tape. He turned down every program in the country to stay home for that? The NFL is bad enough. The NCAA is a criminal cartel and there's something wrong with a world where Houston doesn't so much as get called out for all of the ******* money they cost this kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 3 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said: The best end in this class might have spent the past three years playing nose tackle for a red-assed moron. Just look at the stupid tape. He turned down every program in the country to stay home for that? The NFL is bad enough. The NCAA is a criminal cartel and there's something wrong with a world where Houston doesn't so much as get called out for all of the ******* money they cost this kid. Might be, trade down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 16 minutes ago, kdels62 said: Which metrics does he miss? (A genuine question) Everything points to Josh Allen being a very good but not great athlete. Then he also has the production and skillset that makes him a usage metric darling. It makes sense to choose Allen. 3 cone too slow, didnt jump far enough and didnt even attempt to jump high What hes referring to is an old forum poster who found certain athletic benchmarks correlate very well with success for edge (linked below, second post in thread has details), both bosa and Allen fall in mid/low risk based on my calcs. Oliver, who lonely farts is referring to above, hit the explosive power benchmark to make him low risk by this criteria https://247sports.com/nfl/browns/Board/103068/Contents/INSANE-DE-amp-OLBs-Pass-Rusher-Metrics-and-Stats-70894318/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 9 minutes ago, CTM said: 3 cone too slow, didnt jump far enough and didnt even attempt to jump high What hes referring to is an old forum poster who found certain athletic benchmarks correlate very well with success for edge (linked below, second post in thread has details), both bosa and Allen fall in mid/low risk based on my calcs. Oliver, who lonely farts is referring to above, hit the explosive power benchmark to make him low risk by this criteria https://247sports.com/nfl/browns/Board/103068/Contents/INSANE-DE-amp-OLBs-Pass-Rusher-Metrics-and-Stats-70894318/ Didnt Oliver quit this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetspenguin Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 3 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? heart issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelScott Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 3 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? There is a Sweat thread in the draft forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Lonelyhearts Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 52 minutes ago, CTM said: Oliver, who lonely farts is referring to above, hit the explosive power benchmark to make him low risk by this criteria Wow. How long you been holding on to that one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, CTM said: 3 cone too slow, didnt jump far enough and didnt even attempt to jump high What hes referring to is an old forum poster who found certain athletic benchmarks correlate very well with success for edge (linked below, second post in thread has details), both bosa and Allen fall in mid/low risk based on my calcs. Oliver, who lonely farts is referring to above, hit the explosive power benchmark to make him low risk by this criteria https://247sports.com/nfl/browns/Board/103068/Contents/INSANE-DE-amp-OLBs-Pass-Rusher-Metrics-and-Stats-70894318/ Who are you talking about? You mean Allen. I am pretty sure that @kdels62 was asking what metrics caused Sweat to miss the Waldo numbers. I was asking the same thing. His 3 cone, vert and broad were all better than solid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdels62 Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, CTM said: 3 cone too slow, didnt jump far enough and didnt even attempt to jump high What hes referring to is an old forum poster who found certain athletic benchmarks correlate very well with success for edge (linked below, second post in thread has details), both bosa and Allen fall in mid/low risk based on my calcs. Oliver, who lonely farts is referring to above, hit the explosive power benchmark to make him low risk by this criteria https://247sports.com/nfl/browns/Board/103068/Contents/INSANE-DE-amp-OLBs-Pass-Rusher-Metrics-and-Stats-70894318/ Yeah but it’s not possible to find most of the Waldo metrics without a high jump. Also most of those metrics are impossible to draw a real conclusion from without the high jump. Also, yes, Ed Oliver is pretty awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobR Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Matt39 said: Didnt Oliver quit this year? No, hurt his knee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeptable Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said: Posted this in a Josh Allen thread: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2019/3/3/18249222/combine-five-thoughts-day-5-pass-rushers-nick-bosa-josh-allen Is there any compelling reason why Sweat wouldn't be a solid option, either at 3 or after trading down a few spots? Health issues... Heart Problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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