More Draft Talk: Top 3 players you want and dont not want the Jets to draft

[#27TheDominator]

50 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think I’d literally cry if my team drafted Rashan Gary

It's Thursday night.  You usually cry during Grey's Anatomy. 

[CTM]

Thread title is a mouthful 

[Paradis]

3 hours ago, joenamathwouldn'tcry said:

. How do you explain that 40% of the tackles made by this "run stuffer" were made for a loss or sack.  That is elite.  .

 

Uhhhh I can tell you that. Anyone who’s watched a couple games could  

theres this thing call “the score”. ..

And When one team gets significantly ahead of the other team, well… That team starts to throw the ball on every down. Predictably so… In fact so predictably that the DTs can abandon their assignments, and ignore the run. They can aimlessly chase around quarterbacks all day because the other team is down by 40 points. 

 That’s how that happens. 

[Larz]

Nope 

We obviously have no control here 

why poison your opinion of the next jet?

we know next to nothing about how the new staff feels about veterans, what the new head of scouting is all about , or a single scouting report 

I have some basic opinions of course but whoever they pick I will support 

[#27TheDominator]

3 minutes ago, Larz said:

Nope 

We obviously have no control here 

why poison your opinion of the next jet?

we know next to nothing about how the new staff feels about veterans, what the new head of scouting is all about , or a single scouting report 

I have some basic opinions of course but whoever they pick I will support 

I get where you are coming from, but the new head of scouting?  You mean Jon Carr replacing Barzigian?  I think you can safely say that the philosophy will be the same.  both came and went from the Texans, where Maccagnan comes from. 

[T0mShane]

6 minutes ago, Larz said:

I have some basic opinions of course but whoever they pick I will support 

The raw essence of Larz 

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, New York Mick said:

Want - 

J Williams 

Of course you do.

[New York Mick]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

Of course you do.

You forgot don’t want

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

You forgot don’t want

Oh, I noticed.

[Jetsfan80]

50 minutes ago, CTM said:

Thread title is a mouthful 

JiF had to read it out loud to himself while gargling.  

[CTM]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

JiF had to read it out loud to himself while gargling.  

Top three players I draft not dont want sad and want not draft happy. You?

[Jetsfan80]

Top three players I draft not dont want sad and want not draft happy. You?

[CotcheryifyouCan]

if we stick at 3:

want-bosa, allen, oliver in no particular order

dont want- Q williams, gary, J williams (if we trade I dont mind the williams boys)

 

Also would love some offense in the later rounds:

Deboo, ridley, hakeem butler, hurd.   any would be sweet

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

44 minutes ago, CTM said:

Top three players I draft not dont want sad and want not draft happy. You?

There's also the fact that we're talking about Maccagnan here so I don't know that there are six plausible picks to even answer the question.

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, RobR said:

I promised myself a few years back that I would never participate in this type of thread ever again. The reasoning is one of the three or more likely the top one that I didn't want to draft, we always ending up drafting. So I'm not jinxing it ever again.

BTW I like your list with the exception of Jonah Williams. 

 

2 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

Lol...me too.  Ever since absolutely despising Calvin Pryor and to see him selected by the Jets, I’ve stopped making a do not draft list.  

Mine were Sanchez and Kyle Wilson but it’s still fun! 

[nycdan]

It seems like there are people who want Oliver and therefore despise QW to help justify it, while the people who like QW don't have much of an opinion on Oliver one way or the other.  I haven't seen much of anything from anyone who would be happy with either, even though both are actually great prospects.  

Not just the lying season, it's the batsh-t crazy season. 

[Untouchable]

Want: Bosa, Oliver, Allen

Don’t want: Gary...anyone else I would be really down on I don’t think would be in real consideration at #3. But in a trade down scenario...Gary, Greedy, Wilkins, Ferrell

Meh: Q. Williams 

[Jetsfan80]

11 minutes ago, nycdan said:

It seems like there are people who want Oliver and therefore despise QW to help justify it, while the people who like QW don't have much of an opinion on Oliver one way or the other.  I haven't seen much of anything from anyone who would be happy with either, even though both are actually great prospects.  

Not just the lying season, it's the batsh-t crazy season. 

Considering there's a decent chance we'll have our choice of both when we pick at 3, it makes some sense.

I prefer Oliver to Quinnen Williams.  So if we took Q with Oliver on the board, I'd be pretty pissed.  

They're not all that similar, either.  Oliver projects to be a pass-rushing DT.  Quinnen is more of an all-around DT, like a Gerald McCoy type.  I want the pass-rusher.

[nycdan]

7 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Considering there's a decent chance we'll have our choice of both when we pick at 3, it makes some sense.

I prefer Oliver to Quinnen Williams.  So if we took Q with Oliver on the board, I'd be pretty pissed.  

They're not all that similar, either.  Oliver projects to be a pass-rushing DT.  Quinnen is more of an all-around DT, like a Gerald McCoy type.  I want the pass-rusher.

I freely admit I have no idea which one will be a better fit for us over the next 5-10 years.  I am just naturally wary of over-drafting a guy who projects a few picks lower.  Regardless, while I have some opinions, there are a few players I'll be roughly equally excited about, including both of them, Allen and Bosa.  If they really reached down for a guy like Sweat or Gary, then yeah, I'd be pissed too, but I just can't see being 'pissed' about QW.  

[RobR]

19 minutes ago, nycdan said:

It seems like there are people who want Oliver and therefore despise QW to help justify it, while the people who like QW don't have much of an opinion on Oliver one way or the other.  I haven't seen much of anything from anyone who would be happy with either, even though both are actually great prospects.  

Not just the lying season, it's the batsh-t crazy season. 

I don't know about that. Being the first and one of the most vocal supporters of Oliver I've always said QW is a good prospect and I think he'll do well in the NFL. My problem with QW is he doesn't move that proverbial needle like you would want with the third overall pick and I don't see him as a game changer.

Oliver is the type of prospect that could be considered the best defensive player in the league because of his production and off the charts athleticism. QW doesn't have that upside, at least IMO and the metrics are bearing that out. The fact that he also refused to partake in any of the drills that measure athleticism is another red flag on him. Just going off of his tape you can see the potential, just not game changing potential. 

[nycdan]

Just now, RobR said:

I don't know about that. Being the first and one of the most vocal supporters of Oliver I've always said QW is a good prospect and I think he'll do well in the NFL. My problem with QW is he doesn't move that proverbial needle like you would want with the third overall pick and I don't see him as a game changer.

Oliver is the type of prospect that could be considered the best defensive player in the league because of his production and off the charts athleticism. QW doesn't have that upside, at least IMO and the metrics are bearing that out. The fact that he also refused to partake in any of the drills that measure athleticism is another red flag on him. Just going off of his tape you can see the potential, just not game changing potential. 

This is a great response.  It makes solid sense.  I want to be excited about Oliver, but the size does concern me a little.  If we do take him, I hope I'm wrong.  If someone else takes him, then not so much

 

[Jetsfan80]

8 minutes ago, nycdan said:

I freely admit I have no idea which one will be a better fit for us over the next 5-10 years.  I am just naturally wary of over-drafting a guy who projects a few picks lower.  Regardless, while I have some opinions, there are a few players I'll be roughly equally excited about, including both of them, Allen and Bosa.  If they really reached down for a guy like Sweat or Gary, then yeah, I'd be pissed too, but I just can't see being 'pissed' about QW.  

Oliver was projected lower by the so-called experts.  The GM's across the league had him as a top 5 guy all along, in all likelihood.  His rapid rise up the board according to the so-called experts is evidence of that.

Oliver wouldn't be a reach at 3.

[nycdan]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Oliver was projected lower by the so-called experts.  The GM's across the league had him as a top 5 guy all along, in all likelihood.  It wouldn't be a reach at 3.

What source do you have to back that up?  I mostly see him projected in the 6-10 range and find it hard to believe that most GMs have him higher but none of the pundits seem to have caught on to that.  Possible, sure...but that would be a rare disconnect.

[RobR]

2 minutes ago, nycdan said:

but the size does concern me a little.  If we do take him, I hope I'm wrong. 

He's almost the same exact size as Donald except he's a bit taller. We're talking a pound here and an inch there.

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, nycdan said:

What source do you have to back that up?  I mostly see him projected in the 6-10 range and find it hard to believe that most GMs have him higher but none of the pundits seem to have caught on to that.  Possible, sure...but that would be a rare disconnect.

His meteoric rise up the "expert" draft boards is evidence of that.  Notice all the articles saying "Oliver could go in the top 5"?  That's them covering their tracks to hide their mistake.  

[JustInFudge]

3 hours ago, T0mShane said:

What I’d like to see from the Jets in this draft is to show a little backbone and innovation. They’re a moribund franchise that nobody respects and I think we all thought that might change when we drafted the big, young QB. But it hasn’t, and that’s because the owner and GM are tools that could **** up a wet dream. Show some life. Don’t be sitting there at 9:30 tomorrow night mumbling about how “WethoughtQuinnenwasthebestplayerandwewereveryexcitedwhenhewasavailableand.” It’s boring. Nobody believes Maccagnan and nobody believes in Maccagnan and he’s a terrible spokesman for the franchise. Get out there at 3 and do something for the fans. Trade out. Draft Oliver. Draft Hockenson or DK Metcalf. Whatever. Don’t just sit there like they do every year and wait for other GMs to allow you to draft a guy they didn’t want, only to find out three or four years later why that scrub was available in the first place. Bottom line, don’t do Maccagnan stuff. Do whatever it was they did last year when they moved up for Darnold. Send Maccagnan to the West Coast while the few smart people in the building make some sh*t happen to move the team forward—not incrementally by drafting safeties and lumbering DEs—but by having some guts and putting guys on the roster who can play exciting football. Don’t be soft. Don’t be weak. Reach for the brass ******* ring for once in your life, Jets.

Agreed which was a lot of the motivation behind this thread.  Oliver and Hockenson maybe not so much in the case of Allen but I do think he's going be an exciting player at the next level.  

[RobR]

7 minutes ago, nycdan said:

What source do you have to back that up?  I mostly see him projected in the 6-10 range and find it hard to believe that most GMs have him higher but none of the pundits seem to have caught on to that.  Possible, sure...but that would be a rare disconnect.

He's been considered a top 5 pick since his freshman season. Nothing has changed since then but the talking heads shoving their heads up their asses.

[jetstream23]

I’ll assume no trade down as @JiF did...

Want: (Stop me if you’ve heard this before)...

Josh Allen, Quinnen Williams, Nick Bosa

Why: Pass rush. I think Allen is a Khalil Mack-lite who can also cover. I think Williams is well-rounded, has big upside and will be what Leo should have been. Bosa has a high floor but injury concerns have him 3rd for me. He’s an animal, all motor, a QB hunter and that’s what I want. Anybody who has seen some of my recent posts around here knows my motto of taking what the Draft gives you. This year it gives us pass rushers. Take one!

Do Not Want:

No offense at 3. This isn’t the Draft for that despite my craving for OLine and another weapon for Sam. Go offense, offense in the 3rd if you want.

Also, hold your breath (I’ll duck from the tomatoes), no Ed Oliver. Not at 3. He’ll likely be very good, could be the best in 3 years....but also has a low floor and downside. Two concerns - Size and level of competition. He disappeared in some games vs. inferior talent. There’s a chance he’ll be Dewayne Robertson. 

[JustInFudge]

16 minutes ago, RobR said:

I don't know about that. Being the first and one of the most vocal supporters of Oliver I've always said QW is a good prospect and I think he'll do well in the NFL. My problem with QW is he doesn't move that proverbial needle like you would want with the third overall pick and I don't see him as a game changer.

Oliver is the type of prospect that could be considered the best defensive player in the league because of his production and off the charts athleticism. QW doesn't have that upside, at least IMO and the metrics are bearing that out. The fact that he also refused to partake in any of the drills that measure athleticism is another red flag on him. Just going off of his tape you can see the potential, just not game changing potential. 

This is perfectly said.

[jetstream23]

2 hours ago, RobR said:

I don't know about that. Being the first and one of the most vocal supporters of Oliver I've always said QW is a good prospect and I think he'll do well in the NFL. My problem with QW is he doesn't move that proverbial needle like you would want with the third overall pick and I don't see him as a game changer.

Oliver is the type of prospect that could be considered the best defensive player in the league because of his production and off the charts athleticism. QW doesn't have that upside, at least IMO and the metrics are bearing that out. The fact that he also refused to partake in any of the drills that measure athleticism is another red flag on him. Just going off of his tape you can see the potential, just not game changing potential. 

Great post. Fair opinion. Lots of comps for Oliver to Aaron Donald....but they’re always inexact. Donald went 13 (too low). If Oliver goes 3 I think it will be too high. Level of competition and, to some degree, his size concern me.

(By the way, how awesome are these internet debates?....because they’re going on real-time in team exec offices and draft war rooms right now.....and guys get fired over there outcomes. We fans just end up suffering with a sh!tty team. ? )

[Wonderboy]

3 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Nobody believes Maccagnan and nobody believes in Maccagnan and he’s a terrible spokesman for the franchise. 

Actually he’s an outstanding spokesman for the team, meaning he’s very articulate and gives the impression he knows what he’s doing. The problem is he doesn’t have a freaking clue what he’s doing. The proof as they say is in the pudding. I agree wholeheartedly with you that drafting yet another DT in Williams will be brutal considering the numerous other players that could ignite some excitement on this mediocre roster. At 3 Allen or Oliver would be fantastic. Ideally, trading back is the best case scenario.  there are numerous players I’d be thrilled to get: Sweat, Burns, Bradbury, Risner, Taylor, Metcalf, Dillard, Baker, WR Brown. This draft is make or break for Macc.

[RobR]

13 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Great post. Fair opinion. Lots of comps for Oliver to Aaron Donald....but they’re always inexact. Donald went 13 (too low). If Oliver goes 3 I think it will be too high. Level of competition and, to some degree, his size concern me.

I think the posters that are on the fence about Oliver always neglect the fact that he played NT every single year he was in college. That won't be the case at the NFL level. 

[RobR]

15 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

(By the way, how awesome are these internet debates....because they’re going on real-time in team exec offices and draft war rooms.....and guys get fired over their outcomes. We fans just end up suffering with a sh!tty team. ? )

They get fired all of the time and then we get to watch these experts on NFL Network. ?

[adb280z]

There really isn't anyone I want @3 I want them to trade down.  Allen, Bosa, Williams etc. I feel like we've been down that road before, any of them could be great or meh.  None really excites me.

[jetstream23]

1 hour ago, RobR said:

I think the posters that are on the fence about Oliver always neglect the fact that he played NT every single year he was in college. That won't be the case at the NFL level. 

True.  He played mostly in the 0 (zero) position on DLine, but I'd be more interested in Oliver if we played a 4-3 and could line him up at 3-Technique.  That's really what he is.  Ed should be lined up between a Guard and Tackle (or maybe Center and Guard) and next to a fat run-stuffing NT.  Absent of that configuration the only other place I'd like him in a 3-4 is at DE....and we have both Leo and a re-signed $25M Henry Anderson in those 2 spots.

Question - How would you use Ed Oliver, where would you put him and what would your vision be for the DLine around him?