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Defensive Scheme

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I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

- Since we are staying with a 3-4 base I would assume G. Williams will use Anderson & L. Williams
at DE and Q. Williams at NT.  Our depth would be McLendon, Shepherd and Fautakasi

- Will we trade Lee this weekend for a pick?  If we don't is it possible that we kick him outside
to OLB?  Since he "bulked" up to 245 it's not a crazy thought since everyone on the DLine would
be over 300 pounds and could keep him clean.  With his speed and athletic ability could he be
an effective edge rusher?

- Hopefully we draft an actual OLB/DE edge rusher this weekend.  It would help when we "morph" to
a 4 man line.  I could see the "Williams brothers" kicking inside to DT with the "draft pick" and
someone else at DE

- I've never seen G. Williams run a 3-4 base so its going to be interesting to see how he deploys
the personnel

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My main thought on Q is, I read a while ago that Williams' scheme has never had a big wide-body NT to clog up the middle, he prefers smaller more penetrating players at NT. So Anderson, Q and Leo could be one alignment we will see a lot of.

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4 minutes ago, jamesr said:

My main thought on Q is, I read a while ago that Williams' scheme has never had a big wide-body NT to clog up the middle, he prefers smaller more penetrating players at NT. So Anderson, Q and Leo could be one alignment we will see a lot of.

That would make sense because that picture someone show of Leo and Q Will side by side, Leo looked much larger.  

That said, I sure hope they're changing to the 4-3.  Taking a NT at #3 would be even more stupid than it already was. 

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24 minutes ago, KRL said:

I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

- Since we are staying with a 3-4 base I would assume G. Williams will use Anderson & L. Williams
at DE and Q. Williams at NT.  Our depth would be McLendon, Shepherd and Fautakasi

- Will we trade Lee this weekend for a pick?  If we don't is it possible that we kick him outside
to OLB?  Since he "bulked" up to 245 it's not a crazy thought since everyone on the DLine would
be over 300 pounds and could keep him clean.  With his speed and athletic ability could he be
an effective edge rusher?

- Hopefully we draft an actual OLB/DE edge rusher this weekend.  It would help when we "morph" to
a 4 man line.  I could see the "Williams brothers" kicking inside to DT with the "draft pick" and
someone else at DE

- I've never seen G. Williams run a 3-4 base so its going to be interesting to see how he deploys
the personnel

I think Q and Leo at DE in base and mclendon at NT.. with Anderson Being the main Rotation guy And coming in on 4 man fronts .  With Nickel defense being combination of Leo -Harry and Q. Which means this group will play a lot considering Nickel defense is on field most of the game . 

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I tend to think we will see a lot of 4 man fronts despite what has been said.  If Williams has been successful running the 4-3, why do we want him to all of a sudden change?  I am assuming they think leo or anderson can be one of the ends.  Otherwise, I really have no idea what they are thinking.  

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I have us playing a 3-3-5 Small base a lot and I think Greg Williams thinks he can do it without suffering big loses against the run.

DL: Anderson, and the Williams will be penetrators and are big enough to feel like 3 IDLs without losing pass rush

LB: Mosley, Williamson and Lee/ Jenkins will play read and react, outside support and blitzer/coverage roles respectively

DBs: safety/backer, Safety/Corner, 2CBs, 1 FS will be Adams, Poole, Johnson/ Roberts, and Maye respectively 

It could work but also I expect the Jets to draft a true center field safety with a 3rd or 4th.

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36 minutes ago, KRL said:

I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

- Since we are staying with a 3-4 base I would assume G. Williams will use Anderson & L. Williams
at DE and Q. Williams at NT.  Our depth would be McLendon, Shepherd and Fautakasi

- Will we trade Lee this weekend for a pick?  If we don't is it possible that we kick him outside
to OLB?  Since he "bulked" up to 245 it's not a crazy thought since everyone on the DLine would
be over 300 pounds and could keep him clean.  With his speed and athletic ability could he be
an effective edge rusher?

- Hopefully we draft an actual OLB/DE edge rusher this weekend.  It would help when we "morph" to
a 4 man line.  I could see the "Williams brothers" kicking inside to DT with the "draft pick" and
someone else at DE

- I've never seen G. Williams run a 3-4 base so its going to be interesting to see how he deploys
the personnel

If we can't get good compensation for Lee put him at OLB and let him try and get to the QB we literally have nothing to lose. Jachai Polite in the 2nd would be nice we just need to start filling these holes man we can keep going BPA but until we fix up Edge,OL,CB and WR we are never going to win ball games

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Williams said he’s going to use multiple sets so I’m guessing they’ll be moving guys all over the place and doing a lot of rotations to keep them fresh. 

 

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The Pats are turning into a running team.  They will have trouble running on this Jet team with the D Line & the ILBers we have.

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43 minutes ago, KRL said:

I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

- Since we are staying with a 3-4 base I would assume G. Williams will use Anderson & L. Williams
at DE and Q. Williams at NT.  Our depth would be McLendon, Shepherd and Fautakasi

- Will we trade Lee this weekend for a pick?  If we don't is it possible that we kick him outside
to OLB?  Since he "bulked" up to 245 it's not a crazy thought since everyone on the DLine would
be over 300 pounds and could keep him clean.  With his speed and athletic ability could he be
an effective edge rusher?

- Hopefully we draft an actual OLB/DE edge rusher this weekend.  It would help when we "morph" to
a 4 man line.  I could see the "Williams brothers" kicking inside to DT with the "draft pick" and
someone else at DE

- I've never seen G. Williams run a 3-4 base so its going to be interesting to see how he deploys
the personnel

I have seen so much criticism about how Q is not a scheme fit.  I don't really get it.  The guy played a lot of nose and played it very well at Alabama.  That could be a very good front three.  If he can put pressure from the Nose should really help Leo.  Sure. no elite edge pass rusher (yet) but one more good CB and this could be a pretty good D.  (If we draft Greedy maybe we can petition the league to have the three Williams all wear number 92.)

But if we don't draft OL in the remainder of the draft I will be unhappy.  You win in the trenches, but not just one side of the trenches.

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2 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

Williams said he’s going to use multiple sets so I’m guessing they’ll be moving guys all over the place and doing a lot of rotations to keep them fresh. 

 

Worked for Clemson.😎  Are you as bummed out as me about last night? The only thing that consoles me right now is the contrarian view....since so many of us really hate this pick and, at best, are ambivalent about it , it probably means that this guy will wear the gold jacket one day.

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not really worried.  it's not like the jets picked that jones kid from duke. they got a really good player and if williams is the coach we think he is he'll figure out a way to use him.  obviously it would've been great to use the 3 pick on oline or parlay it for some decent picks but it doesn't make any sense to pick a significantly lower rated oline player when there's a much better, at his position, player even if it's on the dline.

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4 minutes ago, section314 said:

Worked for Clemson.😎  Are you as bummed out as me about last night? The only thing that consoles me right now is the contrarian view....since so many of us really hate this pick and, at best, are ambivalent about it , it probably means that this guy will wear the gold jacket one day.

I’m fine with it. They couldn’t trade down and they didn’t draft Allen. I think they’ll have a solid defensive base for the next few years.

I would be happy if they could trade up into the 2nd and pick up a OT or C but I don’t see how they could. 

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1 minute ago, New York Mick said:

I’m fine with it. They couldn’t trade down and they didn’t draft Allen. I think they’ll have a solid defensive base for the next few years.

I would be happy if they could trade up into the 2nd and pick up a OT or C but I don’t see how they could. 

LOL. I bet you bought a round for the boys when that happened.

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Just now, section314 said:

LOL. I bet you bought a round for the boys when that happened.

I was sitting at my bar with my 2 year old running around. She didn’t understand my happiness but joined in on the celebration and my wife just looked at me and said “seriously?” 

The best was when the Giants drafted Jones and all the G fans started texting and calling freaking out lol. 

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Q Williams better be like Donald, Sapp or Randle

also glad the Giants passed on Josh Allen because if he went there and became the next Khahlil Mack that would be hard to take

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1 hour ago, KRL said:

I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

We're trying out the new 5-1-5 scheme.

5 DT's, 1 MLB, 2 CB, 3 Safeties

It's gonna be a blast!

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Williams has like 100,000 formations in his playbook and we’ll be in our sub package majority of the time anyways....

3-4/4-3 doesn’t matter as much as some make it out to be but for argument’s sake I would just switch the D to a true Base 4-3. 

DE Copeland

DT Q. Williams 

DT L. Williams 

DE Jenkins 

SLB Williamson

MLB Mosley

WLB Lee 

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1 hour ago, KRL said:

I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

- Since we are staying with a 3-4 base I would assume G. Williams will use Anderson & L. Williams
at DE and Q. Williams at NT.  Our depth would be McLendon, Shepherd and Fautakasi

- Will we trade Lee this weekend for a pick?  If we don't is it possible that we kick him outside
to OLB?  Since he "bulked" up to 245 it's not a crazy thought since everyone on the DLine would
be over 300 pounds and could keep him clean.  With his speed and athletic ability could he be
an effective edge rusher?

- Hopefully we draft an actual OLB/DE edge rusher this weekend.  It would help when we "morph" to
a 4 man line.  I could see the "Williams brothers" kicking inside to DT with the "draft pick" and
someone else at DE

- I've never seen G. Williams run a 3-4 base so its going to be interesting to see how he deploys
the personnel

Key words. Greg Williams has never run a 3-4. I imagine he will use 4-3 principals when he does. 

Lee or Hewitt will be the Will. Williamson will be the Sam. There is no Jack. We have 4 guys which are poor backups in my mind. 

Most people don't know how different these philosophies are. 

Opposite to the way Bowles used  4-3 personnel with 3-4 LB responsibilities. 

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8 minutes ago, carlito1171 said:

Williams has like 100,000 formations in his playbook and we’ll be in our sub package majority of the time anyways....

3-4/4-3 doesn’t matter as much as some make it out to be but for argument’s sake I would just switch the D to a true Base 4-3. 

DE Copeland

DT Q. Williams 

DT L. Williams 

DE Jenkins 

SLB Williamson

MLB Mosley

WLB Lee 

I'm pretty sure we move Leo to left end and swap in Anderson or Shepard at DT depending on down. 

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1 hour ago, Integrity28 said:

We don't have the appropriate personnel for a 3-4 or a 4-3. So, it's super good that we've spent the decade drafting for defense.

I think at this point the Jets should pick the scheme they are best suited to running and adapt to it, biting the bullet as necessary.

To me, that is a 4-3 with Henry doing his best to fit and finding someone to rush the passer with their hand in the ground.

The Jets have had 10+ years to find a 3-4 EDGE, and have failed.  Its time to move on.  

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7 minutes ago, NYs Stepchild said:

I'm pretty sure we move Leo to left end and swap in Anderson or Shepard at DT depending on down. 

I can see that. With Gregg I’m sure we’ll see all types of alignments 

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1 hour ago, KRL said:

I'll leave all the name calling and "bleep you Maccagnan's" to the other threads.  Let's kick
around some defensive scheme issues:

- Since we are staying with a 3-4 base I would assume G. Williams will use Anderson & L. Williams
at DE and Q. Williams at NT.  Our depth would be McLendon, Shepherd and Fautakasi

- Will we trade Lee this weekend for a pick?  If we don't is it possible that we kick him outside
to OLB?  Since he "bulked" up to 245 it's not a crazy thought since everyone on the DLine would
be over 300 pounds and could keep him clean.  With his speed and athletic ability could he be
an effective edge rusher?

- Hopefully we draft an actual OLB/DE edge rusher this weekend.  It would help when we "morph" to
a 4 man line.  I could see the "Williams brothers" kicking inside to DT with the "draft pick" and
someone else at DE

- I've never seen G. Williams run a 3-4 base so its going to be interesting to see how he deploys
the personnel

there is zero evidence that Lee can rush the passer. Tom Brady knocked him on his ass ffs

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3 minutes ago, carlito1171 said:

I can see that. With Gregg I’m sure we’ll see all types of alignments 

Just imagine trading with the Redskins at 15 and 26 and having a line of 

Sweat Leo Anderson Burns

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26 minutes ago, NYs Stepchild said:

Key words. Greg Williams has never run a 3-4. I imagine he will use 4-3 principals when he does. 

Lee or Hewitt will be the Will. Williamson will be the Sam. There is no Jack. We have 4 guys which are poor backups in my mind. 

Most people don't know how different these philosophies are. 

Opposite to the way Bowles used  4-3 personnel with 3-4 LB responsibilities. 

That's an interesting take when Williams himself has said he uses the 3-4 all the time. It's just not his base defense. 

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A few years back I read some stuff about how Wade Phillips' version of a 3-4 (1 gap) is different than the traditional 3-4 (ex. Parcells version 2 gap) that Bowles ran. Here's an article from 2017 that goes into it a bit more when Phillips took over for Williams. If Williams runs a 1 gap 3-4 (since he's never run a 3-4), we may have the right personnel.:

http://www.espn.com/blog/los-angeles-rams/post/_/id/32938/wade-phillips-3-4-scheme-may-not-be-a-big-adjustment-for-rams

A 3-4 that acts like a 4-3

A lot has been made about the Rams going from four down linemen to three under Phillips, but Phillips himself has stressed that "those who can rush are going to rush."

Under Phillips these last two years, the Broncos used three pass-rushers on only 41 offensive snaps, lower than all but four teams during that time. ESPN Stats & Info has the Broncos ranking fourth in the amount of times they utilized five pass-rushers during that stretch, slightly more than Gregg Williams' defense with the Rams. But ESPN Broncos reporter Jeff Legwold, who charts every defensive play, will tell you that Phillips used four pass-rushers the vast majority of the time, continually varying which linebacker he used to get to the quarterback.

For the Rams, it seems like that extra rusher will mainly be Robert Quinn, a two-time Pro Bowler who will probably transition from defensive end to outside linebacker. In all likelihood, Quinn will still spend most of his time trying to get around the edge to get to the quarterback. And nothing will change for Donald; he will remain a three-technique, which means he will continue to line up on the outside shoulder of the opposing guard.

Below are a couple of looks at how Phillips lined his defense up early in Week 4 against the Buccaneers this past season. The first is a first-down situation early in the game, where you'll notice a three-technique down lineman and two outside linebackers at the line of scrimmage ready to rush.

NFL

It's pretty easy to picture the four to the left being Quinn, Donald, Michael Brockers and William Hayes, respectively. On the very next play, 2nd-and-9, Bucs quarterback Jameis Winston set up in the shotgun and Phillips used one of his linebackers in coverage. He still had a rushing linebacker, a three-technique and two other down linemen, essentially serving the purpose of a 4-3.

NFL
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8 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

That's an interesting take when Williams himself has said he uses the 3-4 all the time. It's just not his base defense. 

3-4 just means we stand up and/or replace the DE. 

It doesn't necessarily change the other player's responsibilities. 

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1 hour ago, Bruce Harper said:

I have seen so much criticism about how Q is not a scheme fit.  I don't really get it.  The guy played a lot of nose and played it very well at Alabama.  That could be a very good front three.  If he can put pressure from the Nose should really help Leo.  Sure. no elite edge pass rusher (yet) but one more good CB and this could be a pretty good D.  (If we draft Greedy maybe we can petition the league to have the three Williams all wear number 92.)

But if we don't draft OL in the remainder of the draft I will be unhappy.  You win in the trenches, but not just one side of the trenches.

I get this. But if Macc drafts a developmental OT late in the draft and swings a trade for a legit veteran C will that make you feel better? If he draft a LT in the first round next year to replace Beachum, will that make you feel better? Point is, theres different ways of improving the O-line. You don;t have to draft someone early.  

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I think our base will look more like a big Nickel.  People would go nuts, and he might not be there in round 3 anyway, but Amari Hooker for Iowa would make a lot of sense in a defense like that.  Technically he's a safety, but he played a Safety/LB/Slot hybrid role Iowa calls the "Cash" position.  

That's the type of defense I would try to implement if I were them.  But I'm not

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