CTM Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said: They all suck, we're just arguing over which sucks least. Idzik is better than Macc because at least Idzik had a plan, he just executed it poorly. And while Mangini was a terrible coach, he at least understood personnel to a degree. Rex's scheme got figured out by the league after 2 seasons AND he sucked at evaluating talent. Just because my views match Shane's on this one doesn't mean they're wrong. What was Idzik's plan? Seemed to me it was to go into the season with as much cap space and as little talent as possible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 1 minute ago, CTM said: What was Idzik's plan? Seemed to me it was to go into the season with as much cap space and as little talent as possible Now if we build a giant badger.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 1 minute ago, CTM said: The reality is all 3 coaches had a tremendous influence. Tannenbaum had a decent draft under Rex and a terrible one under Mangini. Manigini had a terrible one in Cleveland. You are basically talking about a handful of picks either way, hard to rely on that as a pattern of behavior. Sure. But those "handful of picks" contained our greatest CB ever, one of our top 2 or 3 greatest Centers ever, one of our best ILB's ever, and a true franchise LT. Plus other useful pieces like Brad Smith and Leon Washington. I'd love to have drafts like that once ever few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, CTM said: What was Idzik's plan? Seemed to me it was to go into the season with as much cap space and as little talent as possible Cap space + as many draft picks as possible. He just f**ked up the 2014 draft, unfortunately. If only Mangini could have made those picks, lol. 2013 wasn't a bad draft, either. Sheldon Richardson was a solid pick, plus he got us Brian Winters, and took a shot on the top-rated QB in that weak class in Geno. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said: Sure. But those "handful of picks" contained our greatest CB ever, one of our top 2 or 3 greatest Centers ever, one of our best ILB's ever, and a true franchise LT. Plus other useful pieces like Brad Smith and Leon Washington. I'd love to have drafts like that once ever few years. Also drafted one of our biggest busts ever. Must of been a tannenbaum pick I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, CTM said: Also drafted one of our biggest busts ever. Must of been a tannenbaum pick I guess. People love to excuse Macc for there not being anyone on the board when he took Leo. Tannenbaum/Mangini tries to get a true pass rusher to replace John Abraham and gets hammered a lot harder for it, with even less available to him (there was no Todd Gurley in that draft). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: People love to excuse Macc for there not being anyone on the board when he took Leo. Tannenbaum/Mangini tries to get a true pass rusher to replace John Abraham and gets hammered a lot harder for it, with even less available to him (there was no Todd Gurley in that draft). You are twisting yourself into a pretzel to prop up Mangini for picking players while at the same time asserting Mac's poor drafts were all Mac. It's inconsistent. All of these guys are turds but I'm willing to acknowledge that Mangini was likely a positive influence on Tanny's drafting while also understanding Bowles was likely a negative influence. Rex clearly was also a negative influence outside of some free agents. All of these picks and moves involve a ton of collaboration and I can assure you the HC has a huge amount of influence in almost every war room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 6 minutes ago, CTM said: You are twisting yourself into a pretzel to prop up Mangini for picking players while at the same time asserting Mac's poor drafts were all Mac. It's inconsistent. All of these guys are turds but I'm willing to acknowledge that Mangini was likely a positive influence on Tanny's drafting while also understanding Bowles was likely a negative influence. Rex clearly was also a negative influence outside of some free agents. All of these picks and moves involve a ton of collaboration and I can assure you the HC has a huge amount of influence in almost every war room. Duos that suck at drafting: Macc/Bowles, Idzik/Rex, Tannenbaum/Rex. Duos that are good at drafting: Tannebaum/Mangini. Better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 Just now, Jetsfan80 said: Duos that suck at drafting: Macc/Bowles, Idzik/Rex, Tannenbaum/Rex. Duos that are good at drafting: Tannebaum/Mangini. Better? If Darnold, Adams, Leo and Herndon combine for more pro bowls than Revis, Mangold, Brick and Harris what do you say then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 10 minutes ago, CTM said: If Darnold, Adams, Leo and Herndon combine for more pro bowls than Revis, Mangold, Brick and Harris what do you say then? I don't care that much about Pro Bowls (Adams getting there with only 1 INT is a bit of a farce), but in the unlikely event that happens, I'd certainly give him credit. Given that Leo is likely to be gone next year and Herndon is a good but not "special" TE, it all likely comes down to Darnold and Adams. And Adams can never, ever have even half the impact on a team that Revis had during those "shut down" years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said: I don't care that much about Pro Bowls (Adams getting there with only 1 INT is a bit of a farce), but in the unlikely event that happens, I'd certainly give him credit. Given that Leo is likely to be gone next year and Herndon is a good but not "special" TE, it all likely comes down to Darnold and Adams. And Adams can never, ever have even half the impact on a team that Revis had during those "shut down" years. Revis was by far the best player of the lot, and considering we moved up, the best pick. On the flip side, Gholston was the worst pick (followed by Hack) I think Leo has a similiar career to Brick if he stays healthy. Adam's could have a similiar career to Mangold and I do believe Darnold has a punchers chance to be a very special QB. Both tandems had the luxury of numerous early picks and were able to grab the consensus top prospect at thier respective position. Neither were grabbing all pros on day 2 or 3, so maybe I'm just not as impressed with Tangini as you In any event my main goal was to troll you on your inconsistency and I'm way off that path so gfy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 1 minute ago, CTM said: In any event my main goal was to troll you on your inconsistency and I'm way off that path so gfy lol. I'll chalk this one up as a W. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted May 6, 2019 Share Posted May 6, 2019 On 5/3/2019 at 5:52 PM, slats said: I wasn’t a fan of signing Favre, but this is nonsense. They only won games that last season after going 4-12 the previous year because Brett Favre was doing what he wanted to do until his arm broke and Mangini wasn’t willing to break his iron man streak and left him in there. Mangini’s coaching was boring and bad, a terrible combination. If you think we went from 4-12 to 9-7 because of favre I don't know what to tell you. The OL was putrid in 2007, they signed 2 big time vets which helped our young OL stars in the making. We went from one of the worst to one of the best. Thomas Jones went from averaging 3.6 ypc in 2007 to 4.5 in 2008, that's almost a yard difference PER CARRY. Brett favre was holding us back, he was either costing us games or keeping opponents in games with his reckless play because he was disinterested in being here. He built his career playing through pain, don't give me the injury excuse. He was playing every week and he was mostly mediocre/bad that year outside of 3-4 games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted May 6, 2019 Share Posted May 6, 2019 On 5/3/2019 at 8:53 PM, Jetsfan80 said: I don't care that much about Pro Bowls (Adams getting there with only 1 INT is a bit of a farce), but in the unlikely event that happens, I'd certainly give him credit. Given that Leo is likely to be gone next year and Herndon is a good but not "special" TE, it all likely comes down to Darnold and Adams. And Adams can never, ever have even half the impact on a team that Revis had during those "shut down" years. Adams was a second team all pro and probably should have been first team. Pro bowls can be overblown, all pros are not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted May 6, 2019 Share Posted May 6, 2019 On 5/3/2019 at 8:43 PM, CTM said: If Darnold, Adams, Leo and Herndon combine for more pro bowls than Revis, Mangold, Brick and Harris what do you say then? Revis was 3 time 1st team all pro with us Mangold 2x 1st, 1x 2nd Harris a 1x 2nd team all pro That's what they are chasing individually but more important those guys made 2 title games. If these guys get us over the hump then that's all that matters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYJ1 Posted May 6, 2019 Share Posted May 6, 2019 On 5/1/2019 at 5:02 PM, T0mShane said: This is great work but, bar none, the worst Jets season is the one where Testaverde blew his Achilles out in the opener. Worse than a parent dying in your arms. Don’t at me. Most heartbreaking definitely, I was CERTAIN the Jets were going to the SB that season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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