PFF Makes the Case for Leo

[Joe the Breadman]

2 hours ago, Patriot Killa said:

We better be the #1 run stuffing team next year considering the elite run stuffers we added to an already impressive run stuffing team. Jamal Adams, C.J Mosley, Jordan Jenkins, Leo Williams, Quinnen Williams, Avery Williamson and Henry Anderson.

now only if it meant more than pass rushing.?

I agree completely.  Hopefully the above mentioned group of players can generate enough chaos to help out the corners.

I'm hoping a healthy Marcus Maye can be a difference maker as well.

[joewilly12]

37 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

This is indeed what you want.  A 6th overall pick that has to have a 3rd overall pick next to him playing NT so he can get 8 sacks instead of 5.

Solid DL is what I hope for win games in the trenches own the line of scrimmage and rest of the D overall is better. 

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

rest of the D overall is better. 

 

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

 

You dislike Leonard Williams and Jamal Adams are you sure you aren't PatsFanTX here to drive up the post count. 

[Beerfish]

8 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Solid DL is what I hope for win games in the trenches own the line of scrimmage and rest of the D overall is better. 

The great thing about this quote is it could be used every year for the last 10-12 years right after we have drafted a Dlineman.

[joenamathwouldn'tcry]

Must be the "new math".  Case in point,, Leonard Williams somehow graded out higher than Henry Anderson, while posting startlingly similar numbers across the board, and Anderson generating more sacks,  Leonard Williams played 200 more snaps from scrimmage than Anderson.

Actually it's worse than that.  Henry Anderson played 80 more snaps on special teams. That means that Leonard Williams played 275 more snaps from scrimmage in the regular defense than Henry Anderson.  That doesn't "add up".

Then there is the "eye test".  Leonard Williams, and more importantly the Defense as a whole, failed that one spectacularly.  Fifth against the run, and 12th overall in the league?  What league?  The AAF?  The Jets were successful early and miserable late in every game.  I can recall only a handful of meaningful stops the entire season.  None when it really mattered.   Leonard Williams was a big part of that.

I am sure that the upgrade of the surrounding cast will lead to greater success for Leonard Williams this year.  I expect that.  However, I don't anticipate that Leo will be the driver of the bus.  Passenger is more likely the case.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

The great thing about this quote is it could be used every year for the last 10-12 years right after we have drafted a Dlineman.

True but sooner or later it has to be successful. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

So let me see, Leo Williams is pretty good, and Jamal Adams is excellent. How can we rig that outrageous narrative into a negative? Of course... let's talk about wins and losses or how terrible PFF is. And if that doesn't work, let's distract ourselves with what a bad GM Mac is because we haven't worked that to death. There can be no good news in Jetsland. That is a party rule, comrade.

[bealeb319]

For all the crap people talk about Leo in this forum he really isnt a bad player. He might not be elite or the best player out of his draft but he isn't bad. I don't think he will demand top dollar to resign and of he would extend for a reasonable amount he is certainly worth it.

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app

[section314]

12 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

You dislike Leonard Williams and Jamal Adams are you sure you aren't PatsFanTX here to drive up the post count. 

What ever happened to that nut job? Did he get lifetime ban?

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, section314 said:

What ever happened to that nut job? Did he get lifetime ban?

Who knows? Im beginning think @T0mShane is him/her. 

[Jetfan13]

Wait, I thought he sucked and we should trade him? That’s what all the back seat GM’s here said.

[jack48]

2 hours ago, Lith said:

29th in points allowed.  25th in yards allowed.  17th in turnovers forced.  Considering the goals of a defense are: 

1. To limit the opponents points scored
2. To limit yardage gained by the opponent, and
3. To get the ball back for your offense by forcing turnovers.

Don't think I agree with PFF that we were "relatively" successful.  Unless maybe the author is comparing us to Tampa, Oakland and Cincinnati, who are the only three teams to allow more points than we did last season.  Relative to them, I guess you could argue we were moderatley successful.

Right.  Wheneer opponents were forced to pass against us (at the end of halves, for one example.  3rd and long for another) they moved a will

[jack48]

39 minutes ago, Joe the Breadman said:

I agree completely.  Hopefully the above mentioned group of players can generate enough chaos to help out the corners.

I'm hoping a healthy Marcus Maye can be a difference maker as well.

Maye actually hits too hard. Just as likely to hurt himself as somebody else. 

[Joe W. Namath]

Leo stinks.  Judge w/ ur eyes not this pff nonsense.

[T0mShane]

20 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

@T0mShane is him/her. 

Hmm

[peekskill68]

2 hours ago, Mac is a Tool said:

Listen i love leo. He just not worth 14 a year

The way the salary cap and contracts keep expanding, 14 million is about what an average to good D lineman will earn...

[k-met57]

1 hour ago, Bugg said:

Yes; If he only gets better because the talent around him improves, doesn't really make you want to sign him to a long term max contract. Worry is Coffee Boy as GM next year around this time might spend that kind of money to justify the pick no matter what. Think QW is going to be good, but still devoting this much resources to DL guys who so far don't get to the QB is crazy. This really is a make or break year; if the DL is very effective getting to the QB, would happily take back all of this naysaying and write that big check. if not...

i agree, this is the year Leo either takes the next step or not. its ok if he doesnt, just wont get paid like a top DL.

[BurnleyJet]

All this makes me feel so much better we signed Mo Wilkerson to that big contract. We could have signed snacks for half the money.

In 2019 we are thinking about signing Leo another Elite run stuffer, to an edge rusher contract, because he leads the league in almost sacks. Meanwhile we spent the #3 overall on Snacks replacement, go figure SOJ.

[FidelioJet]

4 hours ago, Bruce Harper said:

 

Leonard Williams now has four NFL seasons under his belt, and he has earned an overall grade above 75.0 in every year of his short career so far. Williams’ overall grade of 78.2 last season ranked 32nd out of 129 qualifying interior defenders, and third out of 15 qualifying interior defenders from his draft class back in 2015, trailing only Grady Jarrett and Eddie Goldman.

 

I'm supposed to be happy about this?

This is a disaster for #6 - "best player in the draft" pick.

[jeremy2020]

3 hours ago, Lith said:

29th in points allowed.  25th in yards allowed.  17th in turnovers forced.  Considering the goals of a defense are: 

1. To limit the opponents points scored
2. To limit yardage gained by the opponent, and
3. To get the ball back for your offense by forcing turnovers.

Don't think I agree with PFF that we were "relatively" successful.  Unless maybe the author is comparing us to Tampa, Oakland and Cincinnati, who are the only three teams to allow more points than we did last season.  Relative to them, I guess you could argue we were moderatley successful.

Hey, they said relatively. Maybe they meant relative to the worst defensive performances of all time.

[Lizard King]

I haven’t read it but I’ll summarize anyway. Williams is in a good position to have a breakout year becomes teams will be focusing on jamming up the rookie. If that’s not what it said, it should 

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

So let me see, Leo Williams is pretty good, and Jamal Adams is excellent. How can we rig that outrageous narrative into a negative? Of course... let's talk about wins and losses or how terrible PFF is. And if that doesn't work, let's distract ourselves with what a bad GM Mac is because we haven't worked that to death. There can be no good news in Jetsland. That is a party rule, comrade.

They're both very good players at positions that don't matter much.  That's why it doesn't translate into wins.

It's like having a couple really good customer service reps at a failing company.  

[genot]

Look at what williams presence did for Anderson. Anderson didn't approach those numbers with the Colts. Q, will do the same thing for Leo. If Polite is the real deal, all three  will be making those slash plays on a regular basis. You. can't block everyone

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, bealeb319 said:

For all the crap people talk about Leo in this forum he really isnt a bad player. He might not be elite or the best player out of his draft but he isn't bad. I don't think he will demand top dollar to resign and of he would extend for a reasonable amount he is certainly worth it.

Macc's resume:

PROS

• Drafted 3 players in the Top 10 who were "not bad"

[Larz]

3 hours ago, kelly said:

any of u guys remember ?..

 

cheers ~ ~

Jets fans lol

he came out of the game on third down because he was so useless as a rusher 

[Larz]

The thing with Leo is he is so naturally talented and strong that he got bye on talent for a long time and had baby fat and admitted that he was out of shape when he got to the nfl 

he looked better in the pics I saw recently so there is hope 

[kevinc855]

if he doesn't have 10 sacks plus SOJF thinks he "stinks!" 

[T0mShane]

8 minutes ago, Larz said:

The thing with Leo is he is so naturally talented and strong that he got bye on talent for a long time and had baby fat and admitted that he was out of shape when he got to the nfl 

he looked better in the pics I saw recently so there is hope 

The thing with Leo is that he's always been this player and will always be this player. He's never been high-volume sack guy, here or in college. He's not an elite athlete. He's been in the league long enough to where people should stop expecting more of him. We always do this with draft picks: we ignore every shred of concrete evidence about them and replace it with wishful thinking about what they *could* be based on pre-draft hype. Sometimes a player is what he is. It's a double-edged sword with Leonard because he's a pretty good player, but he's not--and there's no reason to think he'll ever be--an elite player. "Best player in the draft!" is just scout-speak for a good player that likely won't bust who says "yes, sir/no sir" when they're interviewed. Jets fans did this with Mark Sanchez, too. If you're confused as to why your top ten pick isn't dominating the pro game, just look at the collegiate stats, factor in the athletic testing to determine how much room they have to improve, and that'll tell you the story, Sometimes what you see is what you get. And Jamal Adams. Who sucks. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

18 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

They're both very good players at positions that don't matter much.  That's why it doesn't translate into wins.

It's like having a couple really good customer service reps at a failing company.  

Which is irrelevant to this discussion. We're not talking about the Jets franchise, but about the performance of specific players. Your failing company may be failing, but it doesn't appear that it's because of lousy service reps. I'd guess they'll get a good job elsewhere.

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Which is irrelevant to this discussion. We're not talking about the Jets franchise, but about the performance of specific players. Your failing company may be failing, but it doesn't appear that it's because of lousy service reps. I'd guess they'll get a good job elsewhere.

It becomes very relevant when we start talking about extensions for Leo and Jamal Adams.  How much we spend on those 2 (if any) will impact what we do at other positions on the field that actually matter.

[cant wait]

wait they say the jets run D was elite last season? they couldn’t stop a nosebleed, especially later on

[Thai Jet]

5 hours ago, Bruce Harper said:

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-leonard-williams-continued-improvement-as-a-pass-rusher-could-take-the-jets-defense-to-a-whole-new-level-in-2019

Leonard Williams' continued improvement as a pass rusher could take the Jets defense to a whole new level in 2019

BY DANIEL RYMER • MAY 2, 2019

EAST RUTHERFORD, NJ - NOVEMBER 02: Defensive end Leonard Williams #92 of the New York Jets celebrates as the Buffalo Bills huddle together during the third quarter of the game at MetLife Stadium on November 2, 2017 in East Rutherford, New Jersey. (Photo by Elsa/Getty Images)

The New York Jets were relatively successful on the defensive side of the ball in 2018, ranking 12th in overall defensive grade (83.5) in the NFL. A large reason for the Jets’ defensive success was their run defense, as they ranked fifth in the NFL with an elite run-defense grade of 90.7. Of course, safety Jamal Adams was the star of the show as he was one of our highest-graded safeties in the league last season, but lost in Adams’ breakout campaign was Leonard Williams, who has quietly become a game changer against the run.

cs

Hope this doesn't upset the DBags.

[Creepy Lurker]

1 hour ago, Jetfan13 said:

Wait, I thought he sucked and we should trade him? That’s what all the back seat GM’s here said.

He doesn’t suck. He’s an underachiever thats great against the run(not as important as pass rush) which won’t justify the contract that he’ll command. I’d be fine with resigning him for $10-$12 mil/per absolute tops.

The problem is that his draft slot, 5th year option amount and fact that we suck, will make it very difficult to resign him for a reasonable number.

Plus Mac will try to save face on one of his top 10 picks not looking like a mistake and will feel obligated to resign him. He is still young so he will  probably command $15mil/per and I can not justify that. 

[Thai Jet]

7 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The thing with Leo is that he's always been this player and will always be this player. He's never been high-volume sack guy, here or in college. He's not an elite athlete. He's been in the league long enough to where people should stop expecting more of him. We always do this with draft picks: we ignore every shred of concrete evidence about them and replace it with wishful thinking about what they *could* be based on pre-draft hype. Sometimes a player is what he is. It's a double-edged sword with Leonard because he's a pretty good player, but he's not--and there's no reason to think he'll ever be--an elite player. "Best player in the draft!" is just scout-speak for a good player that likely won't bust who says "yes, sir/no sir" when they're interviewed. Jets fans did this with Mark Sanchez, too. If you're confused as to why your top ten pick isn't dominating the pro game, just look at the collegiate stats, factor in the athletic testing to determine how much room they have to improve, and that'll tell you the story, Sometimes what you see is what you get. And Jamal Adams. Who sucks. 

Since Adams went #6 over all waiting to see how your #6 overall pick in the JN Mock Jawaan Taylor turns out. What did he wind up going 35th ?