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12 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

We all know the arguments for and against Macc.  IMO, he was mediocre.  Not as bad as some argue but he certainly wasn't a very good GM.

If we listed his Top 5 accomplishments against his Top 5 failures I think we'd simply see that it was the magnitude of the failures that outweigh the positives.  His successful draft picks are almost exclusively isolated to the 1st round with a couple exceptions.  He has executed some pretty poor FA deals like Crowell, T. Johnson (so far), and he overpaid Revis.  I think his best moves were in the trade arena....Brandon Marshall, Henry Anderson, Kelechi Osemele all look to have been very good trades for 5th, 6th, 7th round type picks.  All starters.  The trade up for Darnold was quite astute but required a little luck (thank you Cleveland and the Giants).

The future is now.  This is clearly Adam Gase's team.....who would have ever thought that just 5 months ago?!?!?!?!?  There's no doubt Gase will be HEAVILY involved in the GM hiring.

No, he was that bad.

Problem is listing top 5 accomplishments vs top 5 failures is an unfairly-favorable premise. He's got 5 accomplishments weighed against a multiple of that in failures, including the outright wasting of multiple seasons with his shortsightedness.

This was well deserved. Only issue is it's years later than it should have been.

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3 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

 They could’ve did it before the ****ing draft 

So we could listen to the whining about the new GM handicapped by drafting using someone else's scouts? Been there done that.

The time to do it was before the HC hiring process outright. 

Dumb as they look right now, but it'll pass as it did in Buffalo. It is a little bit funny that the HC he hired ended up getting him fired just 4 months later.

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20 hours ago, SAR I said:

Agreed, I don’t like the impact this may have on draftees and signees. 

SAR I

As opposed to the impact this had on signees a year after a handful of high-priced players told Macc to piss off?

The timing looks stupid. I'll still take it over keeping him. 

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6 minutes ago, CTM said:

Again, good news. However, we will know how a situation where GM and HC still report to owner, but this time the HC has approival over the GM. It's a recipe for trouble. I like Gase but we just handed organization to the guy for better or worse.

It's bizarre, no doubt. Gase is an odd pick to hand the near-total control to, but he won't be able to whine about the players the GM picked that he didn't want. Then again any complaints he has of the GM will fall on deaf ears. Crying wolf and all. 

Could also be that if/when Gase's term has run its course then his handpicked GM will go with him, and a totally-clean process begins again. Hopefully it won't be too soon.

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5 minutes ago, David Harris said:

I want to know what moves specifically over the past free agency and draft class got Mac fired?

The bell signing seems to be huge regarding this. I like the Mosley move. The Trumaine contract Is an albatross. I think missing out on all the edge rushers in free agency was significant as well.

Could be the DC/son stuff, and at that point they couldn't go on a GM search in March so they just let it go through the draft. 

You don't hire a HC and say here's your force-fed DC, and then the DC says here's another force-fed coach because he's the DC's son. Honestly I think that was the last straw for Gase, and the worst offense. You make a guy the HC he gets to pick his own staff or don't bother hiring him. Just took this long for him to wear down Chris Johnson, who probably hoped things would smooth out for a while at least with the draft over.

I also don't think Gase is as thrilled with the OL as the GM was. Osemele was a fine addition, but the line isn't good overall. They're starting a backup center and next year both tackles are UFAs. The biggest splashes in FA went to the defense even after hiring an offensive-minded HC (not just Mosely, but don't forget the 2nd-biggest splash was to be Barr not Bell, and it's possible there is no Bell if the Barr signing went through). 

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1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

What if Johnson wanted Gase and Macc wanted Greg Williams and this was the compromise? 

It's so dumb I wouldn't even be shocked. But the reality is CJ was the one touting what a big splash the Jets were going to make with the HC hire, only to fire a low-demand/no-demand HC the Dolphins just fired. 

My guess is Gase was Macc's choice, thinking that Gase wouldn't have the clout to get him fired when it was Macc-extension time again. Only makes it funny that he lasted 3 months before Gase started to try getting him fired (maybe even earlier but that's when we heard about it), and only lasted to mid-May. 

lol Jets

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44 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

So, none of the other HC prospects wanted Gregg Williams?  Now, Gase gets to fire him as GM?

J!

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33 minutes ago, Bugg said:

Like Anderson. But between the Williamses and Anderson, you are spending an awful lot of cap room on DTs. And not nearly so much on the OL. When you consider Tru Johnson, Adams and Maye and the legion of other DBS Coffee Boy has amassed, that is a ridiculous misallocation of resources. Said it over and over; DBs aren DL guys who do not get to the QB are overhead in 2019. Yet this idiot devoted the bulk of his chips to those groups. 

So much for the ridiculous theory by some that so many resources devoted to the D was all Macc taking marching orders from Bowles. They can both suck; no need to absolve one by blaming the other for all of it. 

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29 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

Here comes Peyton Manning! Book it.

Successful move or not in the long run, that would at least quickly take the stink off the initial clown car assessments. 

Therefore no way it happens lol. We must fit the whole team and FO into a VW Beetle. 

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17 minutes ago, slats said:

This plays into Gase not liking what the Jets paid for free agents. 

Also Heimerdinger coordinating the trades with other teams (including the trade for the move up to #3 for Darnold). Probably didn't care for Macc taking all the credit for it in the papers. 

Whatever, if that's the case they both had to go. Macc for the lousy drafting and draft-asset management, and both him and Heimerdinger for the lousy asset management in terms of the cap. 

Gase will get his guy, as he's the acting GM, and if they fail before turning this team around then they'll both likely get tossed together in a few years. That is, unless one is clearly so much better than the other on paper I suppose. Would be better if they just didn't suck of course. 

Whatever. New day and all. :) GM and HC will have no built-in excuses to be able to blame the other. A hand-picked B, and B accepted it; and they both know each other, like each other, and presumably share philosophies. 

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16 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

If McCarthy wanted the Jets job, but 31 other teams didn't want McCarthy, is that really a good example of someone competent wanting the Jets job?

I'd love to coach the Jets too.  But currently, neither McCarthy nor I are football coaches of any kind. 

And "dear leader" is Gase, not T0mShane.  Keep up. 

31 other teams weren't looking for a new HC

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15 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

It's getting uncanny how many of the velcro shoe crew's talking points are being shot down

Master of the cap who gets us out of contracts after only 2 years for non-QBs, totally unlike every other GM!

I particularly used to enjoy that one.

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2 minutes ago, CTM said:

Ugh,  you are likely a little dog herpes nat fluttering around spewing out the host organisms talking points

ew

and lol

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30 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

Very dangerous ground the Jets are treading on right now. 

Not that Macc was any hero, but a vacuum power void can turn this thing very toxic. And the characters that are lurking can turn things fast.

:hap:

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1 minute ago, New York Mick said:

Who’s the new GM?

Right now they don't have one, but there's at least one deemed a likely candidate. 

Gase is interim, since someone has to take the calls. That would have otherwise been Heimerdinger, but he was tossed as well.

It's May 15. Even being the Jets, if Gase is still interim GM on June 1 I'll be surprised. 

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1 minute ago, Spoot-Face said:

^^And this comes from a guy who has naked pics from just about every male poster on JetNation, so you know he's seen a lot of grotesque things.

This is where I should have been sending them? Oops.

Sorry, @kelly.

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1 minute ago, nj meadowlands said:

I haven't read much of this thread, but is there any chance that the Jets straighten out their organizational hierarchy and hire someone who is Gase's boss but reports to the owner? @Sperm Edwards @T0mShane

Read it all. Best news of 2019 don't deprive yourself.

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3 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

What are you going to do, fire your brand new HC?

A now obvious power struggle had gone on and Gase Won. 

Meh, maybe. Gase didn't have that kind of leverage. After getting canned by the Dolphins, if he then quit 3-4 months after getting hired by the Jets, it'd be the last HC gig he got for a long, long time. 

I have serious doubts Gase marched into CJ's office with a de facto "right now, either he goes or I go" demand and won. Gase couldn't find another HC job for another decade or two; the Jets meanwhile could certainly hire another HC in a day or two. Maybe McCarthy, maybe promote Williams until he flops on the job, maybe they make a pitch to someone else who'll get hired next year. 

I agree that he's won in terms of the result, but with both Macc and Heimerdinger getting fired, that story so far could hold water. Too early to tell. 

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32 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

They have no right to deny the interview.  This is wrong

You sure? I don't know how this works. I know after their season has ended then teams can't deny (unless it's a lateral move and he's under contract the following year), and during the season they're employees of other teams whose plans for the upcoming season may now be ruined. But after the new league season officially starts, yet before the regular season begins, it's curious.

Why should another team lose their own guy in May just because the Jets felt like firing their GM at this time? Between final elimination and the start of the next season? Fine; promote/extend your guy or risk losing him. But once the new league year has started in March? Those teams could argue they'd have gone another way. 

For example, what if we fired Macc right before the 2018 draft, and hired the 2nd in command at a draft competitor with the same needs right ahead of or around us, so we'd know their board and know if we had to leapfrog them to get our man; or if it was a team behind us, we'd get to know what they were willing to give up in trade so we could beat that preemptively; whichever, it would give us an underhanded advantage in that regard. My guess is we'd need permission to even interview him, let alone hire him, since the new season was underway. 

Is it different now that the draft is over? I honestly don't know; my gut tells me we need permission to interview guys who are under contract with other teams, but it's for a promotion so they might not need it.

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3 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

Does Gase seem rational to you? - He did similar power moves in Miami with the owners there. I get what you’re saying, but I don’t buy the fight between the Maccagnan and heimerdinger, smoke screen to me.

Not with those eyes he doesn't. Means to an end and all that, lol.

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32 minutes ago, rammagen said:

little bit older but I believe these rules have not been changed

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d815667b9/article/changing-coaching-staffs-isnt-as-easy-for-teams-as-it-once-was

 

Unless a coach already under contract is being interviewed for a head coaching job, or a personnel exec is being interviewed for a promotion to general manager that would involve final say on personnel, their existing team can block any meeting. Many out there think that only a lateral move can be blocked. That is not true on the coaching or personnel side.

Last offseason, for instance, the Redskins blocked special teams coach Danny Smith from interviewing for the same position with the Packers, and also blocked secondary coach Jerry Gray from interviewing for the defensive coordinator position with the Texans, which would have been an obvious promotion. The only reason the Browns were able to hire personnel executive George Kokinis from the Ravens is that he was promised final say on the roster in Cleveland, which he did not have in Baltimore

 

This was my guess, but I really didn't know. 

You can't have your team and staff all set up for the upcoming season that begins in March, and then a few months later someone else poaches your guy by claiming it's for a promotion. I mean they can ask, and often teams give permission because what goes around comes around, but if they think it'll adversely impact the season - with all the jobs on the line that go with it - I'd think they would and should have the right to deny. 

Say you hire a DC or head of scouting in January. He was your top choice. You stopped looking as all your 2nd and 3rd choices on down sign with other teams for the same position. Now months later someone else comes along and has the right to poach him just because it's not a lateral move?

That would make no sense, and I'd think it would cause a lot more offseason movement than we see occurring. The only FO-type moves after the draft are with the scouting dept, but I think their contracts terms are scheduled to end after the draft anyway so teams don't lose all their scouting from the prior season if/when they change GMs and coaches. Everyone else's runs out after the season like players, coaches, and other FO positions like GM, and are untouchable until after the teams are eliminated, or after the SB should the teams get that far, with player contact prohibited until days before FA officially begins. 

But just because that would make sense to me doesn't automatically mean that's the way it is, so I wasn't sure. Take the rules with team options, where a team can amortize a SB over a year where the team can cut the player; how a cut and a failure to exercise a team option are a distinction without a difference, yet they're treated as two very different things in terms of cap (and comp pick) calculations.

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