Bad start for gase, SOJ (merged)

[TuscanyTile2]

1 minute ago, SAR I said:

1.  Maccagnan was fired after the draft because of his behavior during the draft.  Sounds like he was a wimpy waffler.

2.  Gase is very highly regarded by Peyton Manning and is validated by the record-setting Broncos offense he installed in Denver.

For 40 years it's been nothing but rookie head coaches on the defensive side of the ball.  Finally we've got an experienced head coach on the offensive side of the ball.  Let's see how that goes before determining what Adam is or isn't qualified for.  Name a great head coach, no one saw them coming.  Bill Walsh was passed over.  Bill Belichick was a laughing stock.  You never know where the next great head coach comes from.  You have no idea what Gase is or isn't.  So stop your SOJ yapping and get onboard and lets see where this train goes.

SAR I

Bill Belichick was absolutely no laughingstock.  He was a highly regarded DC, a hand-picked replacement by Parcells and the Jets tried to give him the job twice.  He was always going to get another shot as a HC. 

I have no idea if Gase will be any good.  He seems like a lunatic and an a-hole (as a person) but that doesn’t mean he can’t be a very successful HC. I’m rooting for the Jets to win regardless of what I think of Gase as a person (well, so long as he doesn’t pull a Tyreek Hill type thing).  And I would love it if Joe Douglas is Macc’s replacement. 

I still stand by all my points though.  I see no reason why Macc shouldn’t have been fired at the end of last year.  

[14 in Green]

24 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Yankees fans don't think about the Mets at all, and most certainly the Giants don't think about the Jets at all.

It's a very curious thing for you to care about.  Our GM gets let go and you're worried about what other people think of you.  Do yourself a favor and stop listening to sports radio and stop reading the newspapers.  They create buzz where there isn't any.  Stop falling for it.

SAR I

Ok, so you took the smallest part of my post, and quoted it out of context to make a point that has nothing to do about anything. I will tell you I read your posts regarding Gase and the firing of Macc, and your take was interesting. I hope you're right about it. That said, here is where I differ with what you just wrote.

This board spent the last month ridiculing the OBJ trade and then the drafting of Daniel Jones. We love to ridicule the Giants and teams like the Raiders for giving Jon Gruden complete control. Then when a day like yesterday happens in Florham, it suddenly becomes "don't buy in to what the media is saying about us?" No, it doesn't work that way.

Why are the Jets being criticized? Its because they did this ass backwards. If They had hired Douglas back in January, and he then hired Gase as HC, I would've lauded this as a well thought out plan by ownership. They did the opposite though. They let a sub .500 HC gain complete control of the organization in 4 months. He pushed out the GM, while already having a successor in mind. If you think that new GM isn't going to be working under Gase, you're nuts.

Like I said earlier though, I'm willing to buy into your "its a cut throat sport" theory, only because we have no choice now. Its all about Gase going forward, like it or not. Hopefully he's the right guy for this.

[JohnnyLV]

3 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

You feel good with an ownership group that has shown time and again that they can’t run this franchise? There’s a reason that neither of them run the family business. You feel good with a coach that has a below .500 record and a -423 point differential in 3 years!? Even if you don’t believe the friction rumors of Gase with players and certain coaches, he’s got much more to prove than he’s given clout for. Oh. And it’s still a bottom 10 roster in terms of talent at prime positions. 

He's our coach. I would not have hired him. But he deserves a shot and there are things you can point to in Miami that suggest he may be a good coach.  It almost seems like people here already hate Gase more than Mac before we have even played a game. Gase also built quite a good coaching staff, infinitely better than Bowles. Plus it seems that we will wind up with a qualified GM that has the same philosophy as Gase. How is any of that bad? I just dont get all the outrage over firing an incompetent GM. It's seriously cray cray.

[MaxAF]

I’m not listening to the rumor mill. I’m not listening to the crappy beat writers. I’m not listening to the SOJ fans. Here’s a team that’s trying to get the right coaching personnel, the right player personnel and the right administration to put together a winning franchise and I’m going to wait and see before I pass judgement on the moves the Jets made. I like what’s going on so far. Bowles and his staff for the most part had to go. Mac had to go. I think most would agree with that. So what’s the issue.  I will hold my criticisms at the end of the season. Hopefully it will be in January.

[Jet Nut]

31 minutes ago, SAR I said:

Thank God, a head coach who gets it.  This ain't ballet.  Be decisive, be manipulative, be evil.  Whip those players into shape.  Kick those potheads to the curb.  Restore order.

SAR I

It definitely is a my way or the highway environment.  And all about winning.  Theyre reporting its a mindset and get on board or get thrown off.

I like it, will take it over what we've had

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

You feel good with an ownership group that has shown time and again that they can’t run this franchise? There’s a reason that neither of them run the family business. You feel good with a coach that has a below .500 record and a -423 point differential in 3 years!? Even if you don’t believe the friction rumors of Gase with players and certain coaches, he’s got much more to prove than he’s given clout for. Oh. And it’s still a bottom 10 roster in terms of talent at prime positions. 

An owner who has been in charge for two, going on 3 years?  Who in his tenure had his players backs with the Anthem debate, who love him for that.  Who has presided over getting a FQB, who got rid of his HC after two seasons.  The HC everyone wanted out.  Now dumped the GM.  Who everyone also wanted out.  

I do feel good about a HC who in 3 seasons only was a couple of games under .500 when his starting QB was out for just about 2 of those 3 seasons.   Who's primary function is to develop a FQB and who has an extensive resume of success with QBs of all types.

Yeah would be nice to have a Parcels/Belichick/Cowher type resume but there wasnt one available so I'm not whining or crying over it.  

[Jet Nut]

28 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

23-25. Minus 432 point differential! Let’s see him coach a game!

What were the point differentials with Denver?  Chicago?  

Or should we only care about scoring with 3rd string QBs like Cutler, Moore, Osweiler and even Tannehill to judge his coaching abilities?  

 

[FidelioJet]

11 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

It definitely is a my way or the highway environment.  And all about winning.  Theyre reporting its a mindset and get on board or get thrown off.

I like it, will take it over what we've had

Problem is it didn't work out well with this guy last time. 

Doesn't mean it can't hear but he certainly doesn't seem to have learned any lessons.

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

What were the point differentials with Denver?  Chicago?  

Or should we only care about scoring with 3rd string QBs like Cutler, Moore, Osweiler and even Tannehill to judge his coaching abilities?  

 

We actually care about him as a HC - not an OC with possibly the best QB to ever play the game.

[Jet Nut]

3 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Problem is it didn't work out well with this guy last time. 

Doesn't mean it can't hear but he certainly doesn't seem to have learned any lessons.

Dont know about lessens learned or not.  He had a problem with Ajai, who apparently was difficult, wouldnt buy in, Landry who he didnt want to pay record dollars and another back who didnt like splitting carries.  Like any HC there are those who buy in and those who dont.  Happens

[WowOhWow]

5 hours ago, SAR I said:

Terrible at what?

Woody Johnson stepped into the Parcells resignation mess and set us on a course for the best 12 year run we've ever had averaging 9 wins per year with a healthy quarterback, a division title, 6 playoff wins, and restored respect to the organization.  His $400 million dollar investment is now worth $3 billion.  Man, what a failure.

Christopher Johnson stepped into the remains of the Ryan/Idzik mess and now has us perched to be the one team in the AFC East to be ready to rattle off 12 wins when B&B retire in 2-3 years.  He shrewdly traded up into position to grab Sam Darnold changing the course of the franchise for the next decade.  For only the second time since Vietnam we have finally hired a head coach with prior coaching experience and one from the offensive side of the ball.  Man, what a failure.

The "BS" going around is from defeatist Jets fans who don't know how to act when things are actually going well.  Yesterday was a good day.  Back pages and water cooler teasing don't matter.  This is football.  Man up.  Your team got better yesterday.  Ain't no dysfunction anymore.  Quite clear who is calling the shots in Florham Park now.

SAR I

Do you really believe what you just wrote or are you just trying some type of reverse psychology type of approach?

Go take a look at the Jets record since this ownership group purchased the Jets.  It's abysmal.  They average a shade over 7 wins a year, have made the playoffs 6 out of 19 years, and haven't made the post season in 8 seasons (being over .500 1x).

Again, shouldn't we expect more from this franchise?  I guess you're happy with less than mediocre results.  

[Jet Nut]

14 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

We actually care about him as a HC - not an OC with possibly the best QB to ever play the game.

Where talking about his ability to coach and how his offense faired but you dont think his years as an OC should also be looked at?  He didnt just coach PM prior to the Fins job.  His maybe GOAT of a QB had his best record breaking year, with a record breaking O under Gase.  So its significant.  The same QB who raves about Gase and called CJ to recommend him for the job. 

So yeah, I think looking at his whole resume is important

[Jet_Engine1]

20 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

No he didnt. The firing should have occurred in January.

Now we need to find a GM willing to get a coach pushed in him. 

This is a joke. 

Ew.

[Butterfield]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

Or we look back upon yesterday as the coup that set this franchise on the right course for the next 20 years.

Two years ago, Adam Gase was the hottest HC candidate and the brightest offensive mind in the NFL.  How about we see him coach a single game before flying the "Fire Adam" banners, shall we?

Jets fans are just awful.  You act like losers and so you attract losers.  You all should be ashamed of yourselves.

SAR I

Maybe you thought he was the hottest HC candidate a couple years ago.  I sure didn’t.

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

23-25. Minus 432 point differential! Let’s see him coach a game!

No quarterback in Miami with Tannehill hurt for a large part of his tenure.  Let's see him coach a game with a quarterback.

SAR I

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Quoting for I told you so when this team falls below .500 and Bell bounces in like Week 14. 

If that happens it's not because Mike Maccagnan was fired in May.

SAR I

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I still stand by all my points though.  I see no reason why Macc shouldn’t have been fired at the end of last year.  

Why did Abraham Lincoln go to the theater?  Why did John F. Kennedy go to Dallas?  Why did John Lennon get out of the limo?

If Chris Johnson knew in February what he knew yesterday, Chris Johnson would have fired Mike Maccagnan in February.

SAR I

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, 14 in Green said:

Ok, so you took the smallest part of my post, and quoted it out of context to make a point that has nothing to do about anything. I will tell you I read your posts regarding Gase and the firing of Macc, and your take was interesting. I hope you're right about it. That said, here is where I differ with what you just wrote.

This board spent the last month ridiculing the OBJ trade and then the drafting of Daniel Jones. We love to ridicule the Giants and teams like the Raiders for giving Jon Gruden complete control. Then when a day like yesterday happens in Florham, it suddenly becomes "don't buy in to what the media is saying about us?" No, it doesn't work that way.

Why are the Jets being criticized? Its because they did this ass backwards. If They had hired Douglas back in January, and he then hired Gase as HC, I would've lauded this as a well thought out plan by ownership. They did the opposite though. They let a sub .500 HC gain complete control of the organization in 4 months. He pushed out the GM, while already having a successor in mind. If you think that new GM isn't going to be working under Gase, you're nuts.

Like I said earlier though, I'm willing to buy into your "its a cut throat sport" theory, only because we have no choice now. Its all about Gase going forward, like it or not. Hopefully he's the right guy for this.

I didn't mean to change the context of your post; I merely only felt I could respond to the second part.

This "we" who love to ridicule the Giants?  That's a select few insecure Jets fans who give the rest of us a bad name.  It's petty and unnecessary.  Low class and immature.  So stop it.  Worry about the Jets.  The Giants don't affect us one way or the other and there is no joy in their failure, it's classless.

The Jets are being criticized because it's big business for the media.  "Get Beningo in here!  Dial up the outrage!" on WFAN, dumb Tweets, stupid posts, all an overreaction to get clicks and sell advertising.  It's all phony.  Maccagnan's firing has no impact on the 2019 season.  If anything, it gives our head coach a major vote of confidence and our team a wakeup call at the exact right time.

Enjoy the 10-6 season.  Let's hope we're healthy heading in to Baltimore for the Wildcard Game.

SAR I

[SAR I]

1 hour ago, MaxAF said:

I’m not listening to the rumor mill. I’m not listening to the crappy beat writers. I’m not listening to the SOJ fans. Here’s a team that’s trying to get the right coaching personnel, the right player personnel and the right administration to put together a winning franchise and I’m going to wait and see before I pass judgement on the moves the Jets made. I like what’s going on so far. Bowles and his staff for the most part had to go. Mac had to go. I think most would agree with that. So what’s the issue.  I will hold my criticisms at the end of the season. Hopefully it will be in January.

Perfectly stated and the 100% right demeanor for all Jets fans at this time.  Beat writers and Twitter influencers aren't objective.  The more noise they make, the more phony outrage they pour on, the more money they make, it's all designed to scam the naive.

The Jets are a better team today than we were in January and a better team than we were yesterday.  It's going to be a strong season.  Can't wait.

SAR I

[SAR I]

51 minutes ago, WowOhWow said:

Do you really believe what you just wrote or are you just trying some type of reverse psychology type of approach?

Go take a look at the Jets record since this ownership group purchased the Jets.  It's abysmal.  They average a shade over 7 wins a year, have made the playoffs 6 out of 19 years, and haven't made the post season in 8 seasons (being over .500 1x).

Again, shouldn't we expect more from this franchise?  I guess you're happy with less than mediocre results.  

From 1999 to 2011 the New York Jets were a very good NFL franchise and with a healthy quarterback (VT and Pennington missed half the games we paid them to play) we averaged 9.5 wins per year and made the playoffs several times despite being in a division with the Patriots dynasty.

But after that 12 year run, it's been a slump for the last 7 years.  It happens.  That's life in the NFL.  You go up and then you go down.  The Bills went dark for 30 years.  The Dolphins 32 years.  The Jets put up a fight, spent on free agents, and finally decided to rebuild instead of remaining mediocre.  With Darnold and Gase, we had a very short down window.  It's not 32 years.  It's only 7.

What you should expect from a franchise is what happened yesterday.  Instead of holding onto Maccagnan to avoid bad press, Mr. Johnson did the bold thing and got him out of here immediately.  That's ballsy.  That's football. 

SAR I

[SAR I]

54 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Where talking about his ability to coach and how his offense faired but you dont think his years as an OC should also be looked at?  He didnt just coach PM prior to the Fins job.  His maybe GOAT of a QB had his best record breaking year, with a record breaking O under Gase.  So its significant.  The same QB who raves about Gase and called CJ to recommend him for the job. 

So yeah, I think looking at his whole resume is important

+1

Someone name me a more credible source on the offensive abilities and leadership qualities of a potential head coaching candidate than Peyton Manning.  I'm a smart guy,  I can't think of one.

SAR I

[SAR I]

29 minutes ago, Butterfield said:

Maybe you thought he was the hottest HC candidate a couple years ago.  I sure didn’t.

NFL people did and that means a hell of a lot more than a couple of Jets fans in a discussion forum.

SAR I

[bealeb319]

I fear Gase is a complete wack job @ssclown.

Did you start getting that impression after his first presser?

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app

[TNJet]

1 hour ago, bealeb319 said:

Did you start getting that impression after his first presser?

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app
 

Somewhat yes.

[jetstream23]

On 5/15/2019 at 3:47 PM, Losmeister said:

hey, mods?

there are basically a dozen new threads on the same topic today...   how bout a little merging

 

GASE/MAC situ

It sounds like you're saying we should fire a Mod......in May?  That would be unprecedented... and bad timing.

 

[Peace Frog]

8 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

It sounds like you're saying we should fire a Mod......in May?  That would be unprecedented... and bad timing.

 

Is he saying the mods suck?

 

[Peace Frog]

3 hours ago, SAR I said:

NFL people did and that means a hell of a lot more than a couple of Jets fans in a discussion forum.

SAR I

He's pretty much been hailed as one of the young offensive innovative geniuses in the league.

I'll take that over another run-of-the-mill defensive coordinator come HC types.  

[CrazyCarl40]

9 hours ago, SAR I said:

No quarterback in Miami with Tannehill hurt for a large part of his tenure.  Let's see him coach a game with a quarterback.

SAR I

Plenty of coaches at least keep their teams competitive when their QBs go down. Bowles did better with lesser QBs. Spare me. 

[slats]

4 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Plenty of coaches at least keep their teams competitive when their QBs go down. Bowles did better with lesser QBs. Spare me. 

Huh? The fish finished ahead of the Jets every year he coached there. He was 5-1 against the Jets straight up. But yeah, sure, Bowles did better now.  

[SAR I]

6 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Plenty of coaches at least keep their teams competitive when their QBs go down. Bowles did better with lesser QBs. Spare me. 

You mean like when Ryan Fitzpatrick went down and Geno Smith only needed to beat the hapless Oakland Raiders to get us our 11th win and a playoff berth and he had a terrible day?

Todd Bowles, Quarterback Whisperer.

SAR I

[CrazyCarl40]

4 hours ago, slats said:

Huh? The fish finished ahead of the Jets every year he coached there. He was 5-1 against the Jets straight up. But yeah, sure, Bowles did better now.  

You didn’t read properly. He did better with lesser QBs. Ryan Fitzpatrick - career year. Josh McCown - career year. Sam Darnold - rookie that ascended towards the end. Bowles is a terrible coach, but he got max value out of QBs. Gase is a QB whisperer and got our scores by over 400 points in three years. 

[CrazyCarl40]

2 hours ago, SAR I said:

You mean like when Ryan Fitzpatrick went down and Geno Smith only needed to beat the hapless Oakland Raiders to get us our 11th win and a playoff berth and he had a terrible day?

Todd Bowles, Quarterback Whisperer.

SAR I

If you want to cherry pick but if you compare QB play between the two coaches, it’s not even close. Hang your hat on Gase. But I was right on Macc and I’ll be proven right on Gase. Overrated. 

[TuscanyTile2]

On 5/15/2019 at 8:31 PM, TuscanyTile2 said:

Speaking of bad starts:  Imagine the bile that will be spit at Gase from our home crowd if the Jets start like 1-5 next year.

Self bump.  It took until 1-7 but the bile is about to start flowing.

[CrazyCarl40]

So many LOL moments in this thread. Just gold. 

[BurnleyJet]

On 5/16/2019 at 10:15 PM, SAR I said:

I didn't mean to change the context of your post; I merely only felt I could respond to the second part.

This "we" who love to ridicule the Giants?  That's a select few insecure Jets fans who give the rest of us a bad name.  It's petty and unnecessary.  Low class and immature.  So stop it.  Worry about the Jets.  The Giants don't affect us one way or the other and there is no joy in their failure, it's classless.

The Jets are being criticized because it's big business for the media.  "Get Beningo in here!  Dial up the outrage!" on WFAN, dumb Tweets, stupid posts, all an overreaction to get clicks and sell advertising.  It's all phony.  Maccagnan's firing has no impact on the 2019 season.  If anything, it gives our head coach a major vote of confidence and our team a wakeup call at the exact right time.

Enjoy the 10-6 season.  Let's hope we're healthy heading in to Baltimore for the Wildcard Game.

SAR I

?