Leo not apart of the Jets plans?

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Williams is a much better player than Darron Lee.  Williams may not be a difference maker, but he is a plus starter.  You comparison to Sheldon is fairly ridiculous.  8 sacks and 11 TFL?  My ******* hero   You know who had 11 TFL in 2018?  Leonard Williams.  Williams had 7 sacks in 2016.  That 3 seasons before the proposed trade, just like Richardson's 2014. In the following 2 years Richardson combined for 6.5.  Sounds familiar, no?  More importantly, Richardson was a known knucklehead (dating back to Mizzou) who had served suspensions for both personal conduct and substance abuse.  I don't think he is worth much more than a 4th, but at a 4th I'd keep him and start him even if I planned to let him walk in 2020.  

Yes, Williams is much better than Darron Lee.  Hence why I'm not advocating for trading him for anything less than a 4th.  And you're preaching to the choir here:  I'd love to get a 2nd/3rd for Williams.  But if that's not available to us, I'll go as low as a 4th, since we're definitely letting him walk after the season for no better than a compensatory 3rd. 

And again, if Williams was worth a 3rd or more to somebody, I imagine he'd have been traded already.  Hopefully I'm wrong there.

[Rangers9]

I think the deal is with Gase is he willing to work with Greg Williams. And let him run the defense. Does Greg think that Williams can be an impact player with the Jets.  There could be a market for Leo. This is the final year of his contract and Leo is finally getting bigger money over 14 mil for 2019.  

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Im willing to wait and see what Gregg Williams can do with this D and Williams before making a hasty decision to part ways with him. 

We had the worst D coordinator and HC in the NFL since L. Williams has been here. 

I just don't see Gregg Williams using Leo in such a way that he has some monster season.  There's only so many snaps that can go around to all of our D-Linemen.  And I'm not convinced Quinnen Williams will be spending tons of time at NT, either.  That's a huge waste of talent. 

[joewilly12]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

I just don't see Gregg Williams using Leo in such a way that he has some monster season.  There's only so many snaps that can go around to all of our D-Linemen.  And I'm not convinced Quinnen Williams will be spending tons of time at NT, either.  That's a huge waste of talent. 

We have zero depth at DL L.Williams-H.Anderson-Q.Williams that's it the rest are JAG's 

[choon328]

40 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Macc really ***ed us?

 

More like Gase prevented Macc from ***ing us

 

Macc would have stuck us with another $90 million behemoth disaster contract for Leo

 

Now next season we can use our draft picks plus $47 million in cap room to upgrade the OL

The offensive line is a 2 year rebuild. This should have been year 1. It's quite possible that at the end of this season we look back and realize they just wasted a year of Darnold's development. 

[sec101row23]

Just now, choon328 said:

The offensive line is a 2 year rebuild. This should have been year 1. It's quite possible that at the end of this season we look back and realize they just wasted a year of Darnold's development. 

They did that last year by running him out there with a one armed center, and a rag tag bunch of off the street free agents at WR.    Now Sam has a new offense to learn and only slightly better players around him.  Last year was essentially a waste.  

[choon328]

46 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

What in Mac’s track record makes you think he wasn’t about to give Leo a crazy extension?

I don't think you're reading my post correctly. There are a contingent of people who think the Jets were going to let Leo play out this deal and then let him walk away and get a comp pick instead of giving him an extension. I said that theory was in doubt while Macc was the GM. Now that Macc's gone it's way more likely he gets traded or they let him walk at the end of the season and not give him an extension. That was what I was saying. I thought for sure Macc would double down on Leo to save face if he was still here.

[choon328]

3 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

They did that last year by running him out there with a one armed center, and a rag tag bunch of off the street free agents at WR.    Now Sam has a new offense to learn and only slightly better players around him.  Last year was essentially a waste.  

His progression was very visible at the end of the year. I don't think it was wasted. This year should be a big jump in his play. I'm not sure we'll see that the entire season, only flashes.

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

We have zero depth at DL L.Williams-H.Anderson-Q.Williams that's it the rest are JAG's 

Better draft some more then!

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

We have zero depth at DL L.Williams-H.Anderson-Q.Williams that's it the rest are JAG's 

Who cares.  It's the D-Line.  Unless you have pass-rushers, they're just space-eaters.

[Bungaman]

On 5/19/2019 at 2:11 PM, joewilly12 said:

Mo Wilk still lives right up the road from me, seems very content. 

I'll bet he's weighing in at a round (not around) 375 or so ...

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, Bungaman said:

I'll bet he's weighing in at a round (not around) 375 or so ...

Last time I saw him he looked the same as he did when he was playing. 

 

[Bleedin Green]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I just don't see Gregg Williams using Leo in such a way that he has some monster season.  There's only so many snaps that can go around to all of our D-Linemen.  And I'm not convinced Quinnen Williams will be spending tons of time at NT, either.  That's a huge waste of talent. 

That's why I despised the pick so much, without having any individual issues with Quinnen specifically.  Either he's going to be put at NT, which like you, I can't believe to be true, as it would make the pick even more idiotic if that were the plan all along, considering what a ridiculous waste of resources that would be.  Or they'll look to use him to more of his ability, which will also send at least one of Leo or Anderson to the bench in the process.  It's such a weird circumstance, which is why I think the interest in keeping Leo would be entirely dependent on him actually willing to take a contract that properly aligns with his performance on the field to date and nothing more.

While I agree that there was a definite upgrade at DC, I'm highly skeptical that's suddenly going to make an individual player see any significant increase in performance.  The difference-maker you really see in coaching changes is overall unit performance, not in a single player's stat line.  Bottom line, even with questionable coaching, if a player is really that good he'll always outperform those around him.  We see it throughout the NFL pretty regularly, but have never seen that out of Leo.  The most likely scenario is he's exactly the guy we've seen for years now, which certainly isn't bad, but not great either.

[Villain The Foe]

On 5/19/2019 at 8:06 PM, T0mShane said:

Very hard to see a former Best Player In The Draft get talked about this way. 

This.

[JoeWillieWhiteShoesHOF]

3 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

They did that last year by running him out there with a one armed center, and a rag tag bunch of off the street free agents at WR.    Now Sam has a new offense to learn and only slightly better players around him.  Last year was essentially a waste.  

Actually I kind of disagree.  The Kid was running for his life virtually every play, his mind must have been preoccupied again, virtually every play, with this piece of sh*t “Center” that this Cigar Store Indian “Coach” insisted on playing for 9 consecutive weeks, is he going to get me the ball clean this play? (All this when the Kid’s mind should be laser focused on Reading the D thrown at him in real-time).....at this point in Darnold’s maturation I think going forward so much is going to be GRAVY.

How much worse can it get?  Oh yeah I forgot mention his “Coach” put him in 3rd and Long virtually EVERY series by calling 2 runs into the middle of the line that couldn’t run block.

Playing in Gase’s system should be a walk in the park for Darnold.  Kid very intelligent too.

[Creepy Lurker]

Bucs cut Gerald McCoy. Things could get interesting. 

[RobR]

28 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

Bucs cut Gerald McCoy. Things could get interesting. 

So you're saying you can get a better version of Leo for no draft compensation and you'd have to pay him about a quarter of the salary? ?

[Creepy Lurker]

2 minutes ago, RobR said:

So you're saying you can get a better version of Leo for no draft compensation and you'd have to pay him about a quarter of the salary? ?

Not what I meant at all but funny haha. I meant potential trade partner since Bowles would push for him. 

[RobR]

36 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

Not what I meant at all but funny haha. I meant potential trade partner since Bowles would push for him. 

They could have paid McCoy around 12 mil this year iirc or trade assets to pay Leo 14mil when both would be on the last years of their contracts. Doesn't make sense and it already looks like Bowles has been neutered when it comes to player acquisitions. They wouldn't even give up a 6 for Lee. 

[Creepy Lurker]

1 minute ago, RobR said:

They could have paid McCoy around 12 mil this year iirc or trade assets to pay Leo 14mil when both would be on the last years of their contracts. Doesn't make sense and it already looks like Bowles has been neutered when it comes to player acquisitions. They wouldn't even give up a 6 for Lee. 

McCoy is old and Leo may be viewed as value to them. This league is full of idiots and Todd Bowles is the biggest one that I’ve ever seen. Wishful thinking on my part and a long shot but probably our only realistic trade partner for this situation. 

[greenwave81]

On 5/19/2019 at 1:51 PM, Pac said:

All good teams trade away their best players before having to pay them..

 

If they are your best players, but not worth the money based on cap that they demand/require to stay, then yes....you get rid of them or trade them.

The trick is to draft players actually WORTH what they cost to retain.

[RobR]

1 hour ago, Creepy Lurker said:

McCoy is old and Leo may be viewed as value to them. This league is full of idiots and Todd Bowles is the biggest one that I’ve ever seen. Wishful thinking on my part and a long shot but probably our only realistic trade partner for this situation. 

I think the trade scenarios are basically done at this point and it doesn't help that there are better veterans out there for a nominal cost. 

TBH I don't mind Leo playing out this year to help QW develop. We still have a sh*tload of cap and I'm sure Douglas will do a lot better than Mac next year. 

[greenwave81]

7 hours ago, Rangers9 said:

I think the deal is with Gase is he willing to work with Greg Williams. And let him run the defense. Does Greg think that Williams can be an impact player with the Jets.  There could be a market for Leo. This is the final year of his contract and Leo is finally getting bigger money over 14 mil for 2019.  

A 'market' for Leo?  Sure.

At his cost this year, you'd be lucky to get a mid round DP.

Trusting or hoping that Gregg W gets Leo to be worth a new deal is a fool's dream IMO.

[Rangers9]

24 minutes ago, greenwave81 said:

A 'market' for Leo?  Sure.

At his cost this year, you'd be lucky to get a mid round DP.

Trusting or hoping that Gregg W gets Leo to be worth a new deal is a fool's dream IMO.

This is the first and last year of Leo’s rookie contract when he got paid. His previous salaries were in the lower single mils. We know he’s no Khalil Mack but 14 mil for a good DL isn’t huge. But doubtful you’re right anyone would pay him that much. He is a good player and double teamed a lot. But not elite and a double digit player. 

 

 

 

 

[Philc1]

15 hours ago, choon328 said:

The offensive line is a 2 year rebuild. This should have been year 1. It's quite possible that at the end of this season we look back and realize they just wasted a year of Darnold's development. 

If you’re saying Mac should have signed Paradis and Brown yes I absolutely agree I was pounding the table for both before free agency

 

Should Mac have traded down for an ok at best prospect? No and besides no one wanted to trade up look at how the draft turned out Haskins went 15

 

 

[Philc1]

14 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Who cares.  It's the D-Line.  Unless you have pass-rushers, they're just space-eaters.

Didn’t the rams defensive line shut down Brady in the super bowl 

[Philc1]

9 hours ago, Creepy Lurker said:

McCoy is old and Leo may be viewed as value to them. This league is full of idiots and Todd Bowles is the biggest one that I’ve ever seen. Wishful thinking on my part and a long shot but probably our only realistic trade partner for this situation. 

We got a 2nd for Sheldumb two years ago it’s not out of possibility we can get similar for Leo

[Jetster]

Why trade Leo when you could get a 3rd round comp pick if you let him walk next year? We have plenty of cap space so getting rid of his 14 million means nothing as there just aren't enough good free agents left to spend big dollars on. QW & Leo working the inside this year might turn out to be what we expected for the Sons of Anarchy. Anderson hustles his azz off (opposite of Mo), and developing Polite from the edge with Luvu, Copeland could be a bit of a surprise based on the domino affect of Oline dealing with QW & Leo inside. 

Adams & Mosely are also damn good blitzers who bring power & strength that's tough to deal with for most Olines. 

[Jetster]

11 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

We got a 2nd for Sheldumb two years ago it’s not out of possibility we can get similar for Leo

For a 2nd you have to take it depending on where you think that 2nd will be. Having 3 picks in the 1st possible 50 picks could fill your Oline, WR, CB woes.

[mrcoops]

14 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Last time I saw him he looked the same as he did when he was playing. 

 

So, around 375 or so then.

[Creepy Lurker]

32 minutes ago, Jetster said:

Why trade Leo when you could get a 3rd round comp pick if you let him walk next year? We have plenty of cap space so getting rid of his 14 million means nothing as there just aren't enough good free agents left to spend big dollars on. QW & Leo working the inside this year might turn out to be what we expected for the Sons of Anarchy. Anderson hustles his azz off (opposite of Mo), and developing Polite from the edge with Luvu, Copeland could be a bit of a surprise based on the domino affect of Oline dealing with QW & Leo inside. 

Adams & Mosely are also damn good blitzers who bring power & strength that's tough to deal with for most Olines. 

We’ve been over this many times. Comp picks don’t just fall in your lap. There is a formula and a team with many holes like us, will most likely be active in FA which would offset our losses and we wouldn’t get a comp pick. I would totally agree with you if it were that simple but it’s not.

We are at risk of getting nothing for him which is why I am hopeful for an unlikely trade. Idiot Bowles wanting him was my only possible trade scenario for maybe a 3rd rounder. Anything less wouldn’t be worth trading. 

[LockeJET]

This is exactly why Mac shouldn't have been allowed to run this off seasons free agency and draft. He played this offseason like we are super bowl contenders. Had we had a new GM that didn't have the pressure to win this year, the moves would have been totally different. Like not signing Bell and trading Leo, especially after taking Williams 3rd overall.

[Lizard King]

I tried selling an *autographed* Leonard Williams poster at a yard sale over the weekend for $5 and could not - in Florham Park

[Jetster]

5 minutes ago, LockeJET said:

This is exactly why Mac shouldn't have been allowed to run this off seasons free agency and draft. He played this offseason like we are super bowl contenders. Had we had a new GM that didn't have the pressure to win this year, the moves would have been totally different. Like not signing Bell and trading Leo, especially after taking Williams 3rd overall.

The attitude Le'veon brings will be a huge determining factor for Sams development this year. You only need to look at what Gurley did for Goff and Zeke did for Dak. Both of these guys struggled when they didn't get production, Dallas while Zeke was suspended struggled mightily, and the Rams & Goff just weren't the same explosive team when Gurley slowed down. 

So much is riding on Bells pride & attitude. If Le'veon shows up as a leader in camp with a huge chip on his shoulder, Sam could explode this year. Criticism can be a huge motivator & do you ever remember a player of Bells pedigree having so much doubt surrounding him? He's still only 27, had a whole year to heal his body, has overall numbers closest to Jim Brown, and was always a top 3 pick in fantasy football. I'd love to be able to know what's going through his mind.

I hope it's, "I can't wait to show the world why I wanted to get paid".  

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Creepy Lurker said:

We’ve been over this many times. Comp picks don’t just fall in your lap. There is a formula and a team with many holes like us, will most likely be active in FA which would offset our losses and we wouldn’t get a comp pick. I would totally agree with you if it were that simple but it’s not.

Gase just fired Macc for spending too much in free agency.  It's a safe bet to suggest we'll be playing the comp pick game a lot better under the new GM, whoever it is.