Gase Continues to Tweak Jets Roster, Is Leonard Williams Safe?

[Wonderboy]

1 hour ago, jetstream23 said:

If we get 10-12 sacks out of him then I'd franchise tag him for 2020, and then potentially look at trading him.  Even though this just seems like the Jetsiest thing ever, drafting an excellent DT and watching him get 10 sacks, then trading him at the ripe old age of 25 or 26, I could probably get on board as long as two things happen:  1) QW is looking solid 2) The compensation for Leo is good (something like getting a 1st round pick and sending a 6th back to the trade partner).

Leo has 17 sacks in 4 years (avg of 4 per year) with 7 in 2017 being his high. For argument sake, let’s say he gets 10 in 2019 and that’s generous considering he had only 5 last year. With 5 years into his career, somebody will give him a hefty contract, say 5 years 60 million. I just hope it won’t be us. Trade him now or let him walk and get a comp pick. 

[choon328]

2 hours ago, New York Mick said:

So Leo won’t be on the field the same time as  QWillaims? Is Leo his backup?

You said if they trade Leo they have to find a replacement who won't be as good. They already found someone who can fill his spot as good or better when they drafted Quinnen. So finding a replacement shouldn't be an excuse to not trade Leo. They still would have McClendon at the nose and Anderson opposite Quinnen. Then sign a vet free agent for depth.

[choon328]

2 hours ago, Alka said:

I didn't realize that we only played with (1) one defensive lineman.  I thought we ran a 3-4 defense, with (3) three defensive linemen?  

Henry Anderson, Steve McClendon, Quinnen Williams. That's 3. 

[joewilly12]

4 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Henry Anderson, Steve McClendon, Quinnen Williams. That's 3. 

Steve McClendon is 33 years old and not half as good Leonard Williams. 

[Eaton Beaver]

3 hours ago, New York Mick said:

If he’s as bad as some posters think he won’t get $14 million a year.

As I’ve said 100 times. If they trade Leo they’ll need to replace him. You either get someone that cost more and is better, cost the same and is as talented or someone who sucks but is cheaper. I’d rather keep Leo this season and see how he does. He’s not a bad player. 

As for as the first goes, they won’t get a first for him but I’d rather they keep him instead of taken a crapshoot on a draft pick and hope he’s better anyway. 

I agree, I hope Gase can light a fire underneath him and he plays the way he can. I think Bowles was too soft and allowed complacency in some areas. He is making $14,200,000 this year which I think he hasn't earned yet, if he turns it on this year he will get a new contract, I just am worried that we will end up with nothing for him if we don't play this right.

[Maxman]

About that podcast tho ...

[jeremy2020]

36 minutes ago, Eaton Beaver said:

I agree, I hope Gase can light a fire underneath him and he plays the way he can. I think Bowles was too soft and allowed complacency in some areas. He is making $14,200,000 this year which I think he hasn't earned yet, if he turns it on this year he will get a new contract, I just am worried that we will end up with nothing for him if we don't play this right.

He literally hasn't earned it yet. Players get their paychecks during the regular season for each game.

[Hael]

Trade compensation for Leo would be roughly what we got for Sheldon Richardson (who had more production).  Eg a net third rounder (in Sheldon's case we got a 2nd and swapped picks to bring the draft value to a mid third)

[BornJetsFan1983]

Something tells me Gase will draft a diff position in the 1st next year

[Eaton Beaver]

17 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

He literally hasn't earned it yet. Players get their paychecks during the regular season for each game.

You are very clever, a regular Einstein

[Jetmech]

Been waiting for that trade deadline deal that never happens for years. Don’t expect it with Leo either....


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[Jet Nut]

6 hours ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Delusional, Diva WR bitches about old team. News at 11.

Who Gase didn't want to pay the NFLs richest WR contract and allowed to walk.  

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, choon328 said:

You said if they trade Leo they have to find a replacement who won't be as good. They already found someone who can fill his spot as good or better when they drafted Quinnen. So finding a replacement shouldn't be an excuse to not trade Leo. They still would have McClendon at the nose and Anderson opposite Quinnen. Then sign a vet free agent for depth.

So you think Anderson, McClendon Quinnen is a better DL than Anderson, LW & QW?  

McClendon is better now than Leo? 

Really? 

[New York Mick]

4 hours ago, choon328 said:

You said if they trade Leo they have to find a replacement who won't be as good. They already found someone who can fill his spot as good or better when they drafted Quinnen. So finding a replacement shouldn't be an excuse to not trade Leo. They still would have McClendon at the nose and Anderson opposite Quinnen. Then sign a vet free agent for depth.

No one has any clue how good QW is and I didn’t only say not as good and if you get rid of Leo he still will need to be replaced even with an unknown rookie on the team. 

[Scoop24]

 

even Manish who is currently at war with gase and the  jets . Don’t see Leo being traded .

[jamesr]

 
even Manish who is currently at war with gase and the  jets . Don’t see Leo being traded .

Is the 100% sure? Or 200%?

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[Creepy Lurker]

3 hours ago, jamesr said:

Is the 100% sure? Or 200%?

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk
 

I was just going to say that haha. Nice job. 

[rangerous]

13 hours ago, genot said:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2788367-jarvis-landry-rips-dolphins-culture-begged-adam-gase-for-bigger-route-tree  Read the article. If you have a question about your role, your told to f... off. Real good way to build team chemistry. You might even get traded, if you have a legitimate question about your role.

imo i don't think landry was launched simply because he spoke out against gase's offense.  landry seemed to be one of those hotheads who can do great things but also are a detriment if they don't get the ball.  i will say that in the few i did see the doltfins play it seemed like they didn't get landry involved in the offense enough.  but that also goes back to the philbin days.

[choon328]

9 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Steve McClendon is 33 years old and not half as good Leonard Williams. 

Well Quinnen would be taking over for Leo, not McClendon. Why is this so hard for you and others to process? 

[choon328]

6 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

So you think Anderson, McClendon Quinnen is a better DL than Anderson, LW & QW?  

McClendon is better now than Leo? 

Really? 

Did I say that? Wtf are you talking about. I said Quinnen is Leo's replacement. If Leo was traded Quinnen would easily replace his 4 sacks per year. There is a legit illiteracy problem on this site.

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, choon328 said:

Did I say that? Wtf are you talking about. I said Quinnen is Leo's replacement. If Leo was traded Quinnen would easily replace his 4 sacks per year. There is a legit illiteracy problem on this site.

 

illiteracy problem.  I asked a simple question.  You can answer or ignore.  Leave the snide remarks out of it, this is on you

Wouldn't LW, QW and Anderson be better than QW, McClendon and Anderson.  

 

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, choon328 said:

Well Quinnen would be taking over for Leo, not McClendon. Why is this so hard for you and others to process? 

Because you apparently have the "illiteracy" problem 

Youre solution is to trade away LW and replace him with McClendon.  If you dont dump LW you can start him, QW and Anderson.  After hes traded the DL is QW, McClendon and Anderson.

"illiteracy"

[BettyBoop]

16 hours ago, jack48 said:

That is too big.  The new GM would have to be on board

Or maybe, Johnson lets Gase go wild and trade Leo.  Maybe he would take a 5th for him.  Then Johnson can hire a GM and do another "deep dive" into the organization and realize that he made a mistake with Gase and allow the GM to fire him the day before the season starts.  

"Well", Johnson says, "there's never a good time to fire a coach".  

[choon328]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

 

illiteracy problem.  I asked a simple question.  You can answer or ignore.  Leave the snide remarks out of it, this is on you

Wouldn't LW, QW and Anderson be better than QW, McClendon and Anderson.  

 

 

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Because you apparently have the "illiteracy" problem 

Youre solution is to trade away LW and replace him with McClendon.  If you dont dump LW you can start him, QW and Anderson.  After hes traded the DL is QW, McClendon and Anderson.

"illiteracy"

What you're failing to realize is that I was responding to somebody who said that if Leo was traded the Jets would need to find somebody to replace him. I said they drafted the guy who would replace him IF he was traded. 

And honestly it's not hard to replace 40 tackles and 4 sacks. I bet Shepherd could put up that production if he started all 16 games. Leo is an above average run stopper and an average interior pass rusher. 

But to answer your question the lineup with Leo would be slightly better. Not $14 million better that's for sure. And I definitely wouldn't pass up a 3rd to move him if I had the chance. Same thing with Robbie.

 

[Jet Nut]

8 minutes ago, choon328 said:

 

What you're failing to realize is that I was responding to somebody who said that if Leo was traded the Jets would need to find somebody to replace him. I said they drafted the guy who would replace him IF he was traded. 

And honestly it's not hard to replace 40 tackles and 4 sacks. I bet Shepherd could put up that production if he started all 16 games. Leo is an above average run stopper and an average interior pass rusher. 

But to answer your question the lineup with Leo would be slightly better. Not $14 million better that's for sure. And I definitely wouldn't pass up a 3rd to move him if I had the chance. Same thing with Robbie.

 

The DL with LW, QW and Anderson is the best DL with this roster.  Dumping LW doesn't make us better. 

Have no clue why you're arguing a simple point 

[choon328]

7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

The DL with LW, QW and Anderson is the best DL with this roster.  Dumping LW doesn't make us better. 

Have no clue why you're arguing a simple point 

You're arguing a completely different point then what my post was responding to. That's the problem here. Maybe you should've looked at the post I was responding to before commenting. That would've been smart.

Also, I have a fundamental disagreement with certain people on how good Leo actually is. He has elite talent with average starters production the past 2 years. This is the NFL and talent is not enough. Production matters.

He hasn't produced at a high enough level to warrant his $14 million this year or any future years. So I would without a doubt move him for a 3rd and could get the same production out of a McClendon/Shepherd duo. 

[#27TheDominator]

14 minutes ago, choon328 said:

You're arguing a completely different point then what my post was responding to. That's the problem here. Maybe you should've looked at the post I was responding to before commenting. That would've been smart.

Also, I have a fundamental disagreement with certain people on how good Leo actually is. He has elite talent with average starters production the past 2 years. This is the NFL and talent is not enough. Production matters.

He hasn't produced at a high enough level to warrant his $14 million this year or any future years. So I would without a doubt move him for a 3rd and could get the same production out of a McClendon/Shepherd duo. 

Talent does matter, and you are not getting the same production out of a McLendon/Shepherd duo.  You complain about Williams "4 sacks per year" but McLendon had 5 in 3 years and 38 starts with the Jets. Shepherd has none in 16 games with 5 starts.  Tackles for loss and QB hits are even more unbalanced.  I am not big on the idea of paying Leonard Williams, but you aren't getting his production out of those 2 JAGs.

[New York Mick]

26 minutes ago, choon328 said:

You're arguing a completely different point then what my post was responding to. That's the problem here. Maybe you should've looked at the post I was responding to before commenting. That would've been smart.

Also, I have a fundamental disagreement with certain people on how good Leo actually is. He has elite talent with average starters production the past 2 years. This is the NFL and talent is not enough. Production matters.

He hasn't produced at a high enough level to warrant his $14 million this year or any future years. So I would without a doubt move him for a 3rd and could get the same production out of a McClendon/Shepherd duo. 

I agree with Jet Nut and you’re only concern seems to be his cost. Who gives a **** about the cost if they’ll have one of the better/best DL in the NFL? And LW is currently a starter on this roster as well as QW so if you trade LW you need to replace him. Replacing him with one of the backups that has less production is stupid. 

[choon328]

2 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Talent does matter, and you are not getting the same production out of a McLendon/Shepherd duo.  You complain about Williams "4 sacks per year" but McLendon had 5 in 3 years and 38 starts with the Jets. Shepherd has none in 16 games with 5 starts.  Tackles for loss and QB hits are even more unbalanced.  I am not big on the idea of paying Leonard Williams, but you aren't getting his production out of those 2 JAGs.

Production is the only thing that matters once you're in the NFL. Paying players solely based on talent without the production is a huge mistake.

Quinnen will probably beat Leo's production from 2018 and that won't be hard to do. Especially, since all I heard leading up to the draft on this site was how he was a "generational talent". So if you trade Leo you have the same defensive line as last year except swapping Quinnen for Leo. That means you have an improved defensive line from 2018 and an extra 3rd(?) for the 2020 draft. 

[choon328]

2 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

I agree with Jet Nut and you’re only concern seems to be his cost. Who gives a **** about the cost if they’ll have one of the better/best DL in the NFL? And LW is currently a starter on this roster as well as QW so if you trade LW you need to replace him. Replacing him with one of the backups that has less production is stupid. 

You think they're going to have one of the best defensive lines in football? Seriously? That has to be a joke.

[New York Mick]

10 minutes ago, choon328 said:

You think they're going to have one of the best defensive lines in football? Seriously? That has to be a joke.

Better/best. It’s definitely going to be one of the better ones with a chance to be up there with the best. It depends on DC Williams, QW and Polite. You can’t tell what a rookie is going to do so it’s unknown. 

You also skipped the part of how they don’t need to replace a starter if he’s traded. 

[Jet Nut]

41 minutes ago, choon328 said:

You're arguing a completely different point then what my post was responding to. That's the problem here. Maybe you should've looked at the post I was responding to before commenting. That would've been smart.

Also, I have a fundamental disagreement with certain people on how good Leo actually is. He has elite talent with average starters production the past 2 years. This is the NFL and talent is not enough. Production matters.

He hasn't produced at a high enough level to warrant his $14 million this year or any future years. So I would without a doubt move him for a 3rd and could get the same production out of a McClendon/Shepherd duo. 

Problem is youre the one who not only is wrong when you say that talent isnt enough. Especially when youre trying to sell someone with pretty much no production to someone with "elite talent" as if it means nothing.

And I'll say it again.  Playing on the DL is a whole lot more than sacks.  People forget all the crying over Snacks leaving and how it destroyed the DL.  I players whos value was completely not evident from sacks numbers.

[Jet Nut]

11 minutes ago, choon328 said:

You think they're going to have one of the best defensive lines in football? Seriously? That has to be a joke.

Nowhere near the joke where the punchline is McClendon on the DL isnt a drop off from LW.

Youre just going to keep insisting, no matter how many times youre told thats not quite the case.

 

[Jetsplayer21]

We all know what will happen. Being his contract yr, he is going to play like a maniac.   teams need to stop giving long contracts to DLs.. let them play yr to yr and Keep them hungry and motors running high

[Jet Nut]

1 minute ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

We all know what will happen. Being his contract yr, he is going to play like a maniac.   teams need to stop giving long contracts to DLs.. let them play yr to yr and Keep them hungry and motors running high

And some fans will insist it was to get paid.

Not that he played under a HC who was clueless.  Who had no idea how to use his DL.  Who was completely overrated as a DC.  Whos DC was even worse, a friend to hold his hand and nothing more.

Follow that up with all the talk of Greg Williams is going to use players in the right way.  Is a real DC.  Will motivate and push his players.

So which is it really?