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[Tony Pauline] Joe Douglas Done Deal


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5 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

Not all coaches personalities are alike.  Bowles, for instance, had 4 years of failure.  Gase had only 3 in Miami and will have even less in NY if he puts out a team like Bowles did.

Gase is going to build a true winner or there will be turmoil by the end of year 2.

In all honesty, the BB comparisons are ridiculous.  Sure, there are aberrations everywhere, but pointing to, possibly, the best coach in the history of the game as an example of why Gase can be successful is just silly.  

Gase is a nut job - but seemingly knows the game.  I just hope the team gets hot under him and they can make a run over the next couple of years.

How was 2016 a failure? They went 10-6 and lost in the wildcard.

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11 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

BB was lightyears away from being the best coach in FB - when he came to the Pats from Cle.  He came over as an abrasive defensive genius, Gase comes in as an abrasive offensive prodigy - there are similarities and Gase already has his QB - where BB kinda of lucked into one.  Not saying I expect Gases's HC career with the Jets to look like Beli's , but those pointing to his "failures" in Mia need only to look at BB's failure in Cle. 

Belichick had MANY great years as a DC.  Gase is still largely unproven as far as I'm concerned.  Doesn't mean he can't be a very good HC but he doesn't have anywhere near the accolades that BB did when he first went to the Pats.

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4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Rosen + whatever RB >>> Daniel Jones + Barkley

 

 Best player according to who? Who cares what the “experts” say? They rarely take positional value into account.

 

RB is one of the lowest paid positions for a reason.

Crappy RBs yes. Top RBs no. And I say he’s the best player from that draft and Rosen is awful. 

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2 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

BB was lightyears away from being the best coach in FB - when he came to the Pats from Cle.  He came over as an abrasive defensive genius, Gase comes in as an abrasive offensive prodigy - there are similarities and Gase already has his QB - where BB kinda of lucked into one.  Not saying I expect Gases's HC career with the Jets to look like Beli's , but those pointing to his "failures" in Mia need only to look at BB's failure in Cle. 

But he is now - I'm not saying he was always great (although he was always a great DC)

The only point I'm trying to make is comparing Gase to him not realistic comparison - BB is an aberration, an outlier.  

100's of coaches failed in their first jobs and never got any better.  Siting BB as why we should expect greatness from Gase is just silly.

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2 hours ago, Long Island Leprechaun said:

How was 2016 a failure? They went 10-6 and lost in the wildcard.

And Bowles won 10 games in his first year.  Would you still say his stint as a HC was successful?  I was referencing his tenure as HC of the Dolphins.

Gase ultimately failed and got worse along the way - just like Bowles.  For an offensive genius he put up bottom 5 offenses every year as a HC.

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Just now, Lith said:

That means we have complied with the Rooney rule. 

Yep

Nothing preventing the Jets from hiring Douglas at this point if he’s their guy.

I’m hoping that Albert Breer is right about people in league circles believing that Champ Kelly could join Douglas’ staff. 

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1 minute ago, Untouchable said:

Yep

Nothing preventing the Jets from hiring Douglas at this point if he’s their guy.

I’m hoping that Albert Breer is right about people in league circles believing that Champ Kelly could join Douglas’ staff. 

Yup.  Interview Douglass tomorrow, Kelly on Monday; then have both of them on hand for the start of minicamp Tuesday. 

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53 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

And Bowles won 10 games in his first year.  Would you still say his stint as a HC was successful?  I was referencing his tenure as HC of the Dolphins.

Gase ultimately failed and got worse along the way - just like Bowles.  For an offensive genius he put up bottom 5 offenses every year as a HC.

It's really not that hard to admit that you misstated. Gase had two under .500 seasons, not three as you stated. Just keeping you honest. Your response is simply evasive.

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3 hours ago, New York Mick said:

Crappy RBs yes. Top RBs no. And I say he’s the best player from that draft and Rosen is awful. 

People say "best player in the draft" all the time but never actually discuss why. Under what criteria is Barkley the best player? For that matter why was QW  considered the best? Least chance to bust? No, that was likely Q Nelson. Most impact to add victories? Giants won 1 additional game. Mayfield added what, 6?  Best player at highest impact position? Hardly. QB, OT, Edge, WR CB are ALL more important. Taking Barkley over Darnold makes sense on absolutely no level when you have an old fading QB. So just the best at hisu position? That statement drives me nuts, it's just rhetoric with no connection to reality.

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

And Bowles won 10 games in his first year.  Would you still say his stint as a HC was successful?  I was referencing his tenure as HC of the Dolphins.

Gase ultimately failed and got worse along the way - just like Bowles.  For an offensive genius he put up bottom 5 offenses every year as a HC.

Wait, lets get this straight.  Gase was better his first year when he had his starting QB than he was in his second when he missed a chunk of the season and was worse in the third season when he was lost for most of the season. 

You're kidding right?  How can this be?  And wait, without that QB his offense suffered?  Thankfully we know this is why you just dont blindly quote numbers, right?

How many months have you been selling this?  

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

And Bowles won 10 games in his first year.  Would you still say his stint as a HC was successful?  I was referencing his tenure as HC of the Dolphins.

Gase ultimately failed and got worse along the way - just like Bowles.  For an offensive genius he put up bottom 5 offenses every year as a HC.

With just an average schedule Bowles first season would have been double digit losses as per usual.  Weakest schedule I’ve ever seen and each of the 10 wins were in doubt mostly until the very end of the game.

There are some glimmers of hope with Gase’s head coaching history, namely he was 11-0 when Tannehill was healthy, and overall coached to around a .500 record overall with an unhealthy Tannehill, Brock Osweiler and Moore as his QBs.  The one time he coached a real QB he got a statistically record setting year out of Peyton Manning who at that point was old and injured.

Meanwhile the Jets almost lost 2x as many games as they won with Bowles and Maccagnan, 24-40....24-40 and there are actually people out there who think it was wrong to fire these 2 bums.  I say bums because it’s the “way” most of those losses occurred, with Bowles both playing scared and playing to protect his job ie kicking a FG in the 4th Q down by 30 so his resume doesn’t show a shut out, and Maccagnan drafting scared, to protect his job, and now we know he can’t even make a decision.

There weren’t many head coaching options available when Gase got the job, but he just might be the perfect candidate at this time.  If anything he’s going to hold players accountable, as will Williams, haven’t seen any of that since Parcells coached.

I can’t say Gase is going to be a savior at this point but I do know he’ll be way better than Bowles, which might be more than enough as Darnold starts taking over the league ie it won’t matter much who is HC, it still would though if it were Bowles...worst I’ve ever seen.

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31 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

People say "best player in the draft" all the time but never actually discuss why. Under what criteria is Barkley the best player? For that matter why was QW  considered the best? Least chance to bust? No, that was likely Q Nelson. Most impact to add victories? Giants won 1 additional game. Mayfield added what, 6?  Best player at highest impact position? Hardly. QB, OT, Edge, WR CB are ALL more important. Taking Barkley over Darnold makes sense on absolutely no level when you have an old fading QB. So just the best at hisu position? That statement drives me nuts, it's just rhetoric with no connection to reality.

If they didn’t like Darnold and only wanted Mayfield as a QB if he fell then it makes 100% sense. Barkley is the best player from that draft at that time. Maybe they thought Eli had more to give and Barkley would make him better which he did, who knows but I would of drafted Barkley over Darnold as well. Half this board has such a hatred for the Giants that it doesn’t matter who they drafted they would of said it was wrong. 

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37 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

And he was the wrong pick.

QB trumps RB every time.  No matter how good that RB is.  Its not that hard to understand. 

AP won how many titles?  Playoff games?

Sanders won how many playoff games?  SBs?

In fact how many teams without a "star"at QB win SBs because of their "star" RB?  Or how many teams when they need a RB find a way to get one.  Now how many who need a QB find one as easily.  

Add in even if Jones is the right guy at QB and it takes him 3 years to really start winning for the Giants Barkley will be in his 4th plus season and who knows how much time they'll have together to win games.  

Thats why the RB, no matter what is the wrong pick and the FQB is always the right pick

 

How many SBs did Marino, McNabb, Rivers, Kelly, McNair, Romo etc win? Good balanced teams win SBs  

Barkley had a better chance of being good then Darnold, Allen or Rosen so he was a perfectly fine pick. I’d rather draft a excellent RB then a QB that’s a bust. No I’m not saying Darnold is a bust (he actually has a chance to be a really good QB) before you twist around what I’m saying. They might of thought he was going to be a bust and Eli had more to give so it makes sense. 

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13 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

How many SBs did Marino, McNabb, Rivers, Kelly, McNair, Romo etc win? Good balanced teams win SBs  

Barkley had a better chance of being good then Darnold, Allen or Rosen so he was a perfectly fine pick. I’d rather draft a excellent RB then a QB that’s a bust. No I’m not saying Darnold is a bust (he actually has a chance to be a really good QB) before you twist around what I’m saying. They might of thought he was going to be a bust and Eli had more to give so it makes sense. 

So every QB who didnt win checks all the RBs, none of whom help a modern team win?  Question wasnt about teams, it was how many RBs are the leading reason for winning a SB in modern football.  

Barkley has nowhere near the chance to lead his team to a SB than Darnold.  Thats the point. If they both are what theyre supposed to be, Darnold is the better bet to get you there, not a RB.  Pretty simple and the modern game proves it.  Until the rules are changed back to what they used to be Barkleys a nice to have, not a have to have.  You need the QB and can always pick up a good enough back to win.

We'll have to agree to disagree.  

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11 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

So every QB who didnt win checks all the RBs, none of whom help a modern team win?  Question wasnt about teams, it was how many RBs are the leading reason for winning a SB in modern football.  

Barkley has nowhere near the chance to lead his team to a SB than Darnold.  Thats the point. If they both are what theyre supposed to be, Darnold is the better bet to get you there, not a RB.  Pretty simple and the modern game proves it.  Until the rules are changed back to what they used to be Barkleys a nice to have, not a have to have.  You need the QB and can always pick up a good enough back to win.

We'll have to agree to disagree.  

Of course we agree to disagree, it’s what we do

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1 hour ago, jetstream23 said:

What if Douglas gets drunk at dinner, vomits on Chris Johnson, then sleeps with Johnson's beautiful Asian wife?  Is he still getting the job?

I think so.

I mean, it's his job to lose at this point, right?

where do i sign up for that?

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3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

But he is now - I'm not saying he was always great (although he was always a great DC)

The only point I'm trying to make is comparing Gase to him not realistic comparison - BB is an aberration, an outlier.  

100's of coaches failed in their first jobs and never got any better.  Siting BB as why we should expect greatness from Gase is just silly.

THe thing people love to forget about Belli is that he went on to be a DC for years before getting his next HC gig.  He had a lot of time to simmer and slow down. He didn't come from Cleveland and go to the Pats. 

Anyhoo... I get your point and it's very possible Gase will succeed here.  It just has to be all in. The last time we had all in was the first 3 years of Rex. We have had a fractured house since. Going all in with Game by first hiring Douglas or Kelly will give him the best chance to succeed. Darnold is the man and we are gonna rock it. 

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20 minutes ago, choon328 said:

The sad truth is that there are people in this world and on this board who will never put themselves out there to back anything the Jets do. It's easier to take a negative stance or a wait and see approach on everything in life bc the blow back if you're wrong is minimal compared to actually putting yourself out there. Its not just sports, there are people like that in every aspect of life. They're cowards.

And if you're offended by that then there's a reason why you would be.

See the source image

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3 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Wait, lets get this straight.  Gase was better his first year when he had his starting QB than he was in his second when he missed a chunk of the season and was worse in the third season when he was lost for most of the season. 

You're kidding right?  How can this be?  And wait, without that QB his offense suffered?  Thankfully we know this is why you just dont blindly quote numbers, right?

How many months have you been selling this?  

I'm sorry, what QB did Bowles have?

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1 hour ago, GREENBEAN said:

THe thing people love to forget about Belli is that he went on to be a DC for years before getting his next HC gig.  He had a lot of time to simmer and slow down. He didn't come from Cleveland and go to the Pats. 

Anyhoo... I get your point and it's very possible Gase will succeed here.  It just has to be all in. The last time we had all in was the first 3 years of Rex. We have had a fractured house since. Going all in with Game by first hiring Douglas or Kelly will give him the best chance to succeed. Darnold is the man and we are gonna rock it. 

I agree, with Gase you need to go all-in...

I completely agree about Darnold - he is the man.   I just hope the new GM understands this and builds the team around him.

 

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