NFL.com's Elliot Harrison: Top 25 QB's of All-Time

[Jetsfan80]

Your inexperienced youth can't grasp the wisdom I've given you.  Wisdom can't  be taught. It's  gonna be a while before you get it.

I’ll take my chances, thanks.

[Peace Frog]

1 hour ago, greenwichjetfan said:

The issue with guys like nyjunk is that a Jets fan’s opinion of Brady as the 5th best football player of all time isn’t good enough. Given the forum we’re on, that’s an odd take to call “irrational hate” and that’s who you’re throwing your name behind.  

Has nothing to do with being on a Jet Forum. 

He’s wrong, consistently been proven to be wrong yet needs to stuff his incorrect opinions down our throats with idiocy like “it’s not even close”. 

Yeah, Montana is the GOAT and the cheater occupies some spot in the top 5 but you can’t discount the cheating, the losing THREE SBs, the other 2 sure loses but for cheating and the worst strategic call since Little Big Horn and the era of pussification.

 

 

[CTM]

14 minutes ago, Hackenberg said:

Your inexperienced youth can't grasp the wisdom I've given you.  Wisdom can't  be taught. It's  gonna be a while before you get it.

Well it took him 40 years to get his little noodle wet so dont hold your breath

[Hackenberg - Banned]

3 minutes ago, CTM said:

Well it took him 40 years to get his little noodle wet so dont hold your breath

Sometimes people don't  learn how to cook, till later in life. Even something  as simple  as wet noodles 

And I think he's  only 34

[CTM]

1 hour ago, greenwichjetfan said:

The issue with guys like nyjunk is that a Jets fan’s opinion of Brady as the 5th best football player of all time isn’t good enough. Given the forum we’re on, that’s an odd take to call “irrational hate” and that’s who you’re throwing your name behind.  

Which of each is more likely

1) A Jets fan being biased for or against Brady?

2)  Joe's willly being really really latent homosexual or really really really latent homosexual?

3) Me being deeply concerned about what derpina thinks about Brady or just enjoying getting his sh*t stained Dragonball Z underoos in a bunch 

[CTM]

2 minutes ago, Hackenberg said:

Sometimes people don't  learn how to cook, till later in life. Even something  as simple  as wet noodles 

And I think he's  only 34

He gestated for 6 years until his hatch day when Jupiter was in Virgin

[Jetsfan80]

Which of each is more likely

 

3) Me being deeply concerned about what derpina thinks about Brady or just enjoying getting his sh*t stained Dragonball Z underoos in a bunch 

 

There it is! Called it a page or so ago.

 

You can’t get around this one my man. You’ve been a pro-Brady guy (relatively speaking) long before this thread.

[CTM]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

There it is! Called it a page or so ago.

 

You can’t get around this one my man. You’ve been a pro-Brady guy (relatively speaking) long before this thread.

Yes I think Brady is the GOAT but if you think I goofed on you in my first post in this thread as some attempt to convince you of the same you are seriously misguided.

 

[Jetsfan80]

Yes I think Brady is the GOAT but if you think I goofed on you in my first post in this thread as some attempt to convince you of the same you are seriously misguided.
 

And I’m trying to call you back to the light. Brady is not the GOAT, and his legacy will only diminish after his career ends.

[CTM]

Just now, Jetsfan80 said:

 

And I’m trying to call you back to the light. Brady is not the GOAT, and his legacy will only diminish after his career ends.

 

Not going to happen sister. Call my cynical but i believe all these guys skirt the rules and always have, even if you convinced me the Pat's were just better at it than others I'd still tip my cap.

[14 in Green]

Whew! After that “ranking the NFL helmets” thread the other day, I swore I was done with list threads.

Thank God I checked this one out anyway. I laughed more in the past half hour reading all this then at anything I’ve read in here besides last seasons Jets-Browns game thread.

Well done,

@CTM  @Jetsfan80 @Peace Frog @nyjunc

[Jetsfan80]

Not going to happen sister. Call my cynical but i believe all these guys skirt the rules and always have, even if you convinced me the Pat's were just better at it than others I'd still tip my cap.

Enabler.

[nyjunc]

19 hours ago, Peace Frog said:

Again this troll sh*tting on Namath. 

I’ve only been here for a few months but it’s evident why folks here feel like he’s the board hemorrhoid with his constant tea-bagging of Brady and the constant bashing of our best QB, a QB that he never saw play. 

It’s pathetic. 

At some point could you actually discuss football rather than just take shots at those who know more than you?

14 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

It’s very evident who’s new here and who’s been here for some time. The latter know better than to engage/respond to him while watching the former work their way to the same conclusion.

It's evident who knows their stuff and can engage in an intelligent debate.

14 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 Plus he spends months talking to himself in the college forum about UNC Basketball, despite not being an alum, and talking down to people for having the audacity of supporting athletic programs at other schools they actually attended.

 

He’s one of the worst end results of the most recent JI to JN migration.

Yeah that's it.  Do you ever tell the truth about anything?

[nyjunc]

14 hours ago, Peace Frog said:

It’s funny, he keeps trying to convince folks here he’s bringing “truth and facts” but they are really just slanted opinions and he keeps saying he doesn’t like Brady and doesn’t hate Namath but it’s clear he’s a Pats fan that adores Brady’s ball sack and constantly sh*ts all over Namath. 

What a dick. 

I don't try to convince, it's obvious to anyone that isn't completely biased and acts like an adult.  Just because we hate him and NE doesn't mean we cannot be honest.

I'm getting the feeling you are a second account of jetfan80 or Greenwichjetfan

12 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Yikes. You used to be intelligent.

 

When a golfer cheats once, other golfers won’t include him in their foursome ever again.

 

The Pats get caught cheating twice, plus have a long history of shady, mysterious events like opposing helmets losing their radio signals, playbooks going missing, and a mathematically impossible home field advantage. And yet Brady gets worshipped. By Jets fans.

 

When did Brady ever get caught cheating? If you think slightly inflating a football is cheating I don't know what to tell you especially considering when a game later with the football properly inflated he led his team to 14 4th qtr points to beat an all time great Seattle D in the SB.  You know, the same D that Peyton led his MUCH more talented O to just 8 garbage time points to in the previous SB.

11 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

In most instances I generally enjoy his posts. He’s got a good grasp of data and how to use it to tell a story. But it’s like he has some obscure PTSD that makes him go full stupid when it comes to brady.

I mean, he just championed the same clown who thinks Namath isn’t deserving of the HoF, Tony Dungy is the reason for Peyton’s success, Sanchez & Pennington are better QBs than Favre, and a 2x SB MVP is a scrub who doesn’t even belong in the conversation for the HoF.

Do you ever get tired of lying? By the way, it was nice to see you commenting on UConn basketball this year and on the probation they were just placed on.  ?? If course you didn't say a word because you only show up when the team wins.

Just to clarify these lies:

I have always said Joe belongs in the Hall, I have also said he's there as much for what he meant to the game off the field as for his play on the field.  His play alone would not have gotten him in.

Dungy is the reason for Peyton's success?  This is a new lie, it must be desperation time.  What I did say in regards to Dungy (and other Peyton HCs) was that he had more success without Peyton than BB without Brady.  Each of Peyton's former HCs had much more success without Peyton than BB had without Brady.

I never once said Sanchez and Chad were better than favre.  I said favre never wanted to be here and he played like it.  Chad and Mark were better Jets, did much more for our team but obviously they weren't half the player favre was.  You really struggle to read, huh?

As for Eli, I never called him a scrub.  He was once a solid QB way back when but the HOF is for the greatest of all time.  Eli isn't even one of the best of his generation.  SB MVPs are nice (even though he didn't deserve either) but show me the full season awards he has? Show me the all pro selections? He has had great moments and great games but he's never been a great QB. 

[nyjunc]

10 hours ago, Peace Frog said:

Has nothing to do with being on a Jet Forum. 

He’s wrong, consistently been proven to be wrong yet needs to stuff his incorrect opinions down our throats with idiocy like “it’s not even close”. 

Yeah, Montana is the GOAT and the cheater occupies some spot in the top 5 but you can’t discount the cheating, the losing THREE SBs, the other 2 sure loses but for cheating and the worst strategic call since Little Big Horn and the era of pussification.

 

 

I would love it if you guys at least tried to prove me wrong.  All you do is hurl insults or yell me Brady/NE were cheating.  Please get back to me when you can put together an intelligent argument against Brady being the best of all time.  

[Peace Frog]

Holy sh*t how obsessive is this guy. I never realized how bad it was. Wakes up in the morning firing off some strongly worded posts defending himself against strangers on the internet that happen to disagree with him. It’s pathological.

You spend time bashing Joe Namath after never having him seen him play, you sound like an idiot. 

You spend time tea-bagging Brady with slobbering opinions and not accept the very valid critiques that everyone else accepts, you sound like an idiot. 

You spend time obsessing about a college basketball program and you didn’t attend the school? Just plain disturbing. 

Dude, stop quoting me, it’s creeping me out. 

[greenwichjetfan]

30 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Dude, stop quoting me, it’s creeping me out. 

I enjoy knowing that he’s quoting me, and then not reading his responses. 

[Peace Frog]

6 minutes ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I enjoy knowing that he’s quoting me, and then not reading his responses. 

He’s an obsessive compulsive freak. 

That someone who calls himself an “adult” can get so worked up about this stuff is really pathetic. 

[HessStation]

I agree Brady and Montana are now a 1, 2 slam dunk for historical references.

But Manning, Marino, Elway are the 3 best QBs to ever play imo. You place those guys in the same systems/Patriot & 49er teams and those teams are that much better. 

[nyjunc]

There is little doubt peace frog is also either greenwichjet fan or jetfan80.

[Dunnie]

I am old enough to remember almost all of these guys quite well ....

Two notes :

1. Brady is clearly the GOAT.
2. Kelly is too low on this list.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[nyjunc]

1 minute ago, HessStation said:

I agree Brady and Montana are now a 1, 2 slam dunk for historical references.

But Manning, Marino, Elway are the 3 best QBs to ever play imo. You place those guys in the same systems/Patriot & 49er teams and they’re that much better. 

Here are the results of the Belichick system without Tom Brady (BB as HC without him plus his coaching tree):

BB 7+ seasons, 54-63, 1 WC Playoff app, 1 WC playoff win, 5 losing seasons

Romeo Crennell 5+ seasons, 28-55 record

Josh McDaniels 1+ season, 11-17

Eric Mangini 5 seasons, 33-47, 1 WC playoff app

Nick Saban 2 seasons, 15-17

Jim Schwartz 5 seasons, 29-51 record, 1 WC playoff app

Bill O'brien 5 seasons, 42-38, 3 playoff apps(3 div titles), 1 WC playoff win

Matt Patricia 1 season, 6-10

 

Totals: 31+ seasons, 218-298, 6 playoff apps, 2-6 playoff record, 2 wins came in WC Rd as home team

 

Tom Brady is the system

[greenwichjetfan]

21 minutes ago, HessStation said:

I agree Brady and Montana are now a 1, 2 slam dunk for historical references.

But Manning, Marino, Elway are the 3 best QBs to ever play imo. You place those guys in the same systems/Patriot & 49er teams and those teams are that much better. 

100% sums up my feelings on these debates. Great job being much more concise than I could hope to be.

[Peace Frog]

52 minutes ago, HessStation said:

I agree Brady and Montana are now a 1, 2 slam dunk for historical references.

But Manning, Marino, Elway are the 3 best QBs to ever play imo. You place those guys in the same systems/Patriot & 49er teams and those teams are that much better. 

I put Montana as number 1 but I’ll agree Marino and Peyton are the best I’ve seen play. You put them in Belli’s system and they each win more SBs than Brady. Peyton’s been the better QB over this span but for Belli’s system and systematic cheating. Marino is the best pure QB I’ve ever seen.  

[HessStation]

40 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Here are the results of the Belichick system without Tom Brady (BB as HC without him plus his coaching tree):

BB 7+ seasons, 54-63, 1 WC Playoff app, 1 WC playoff win, 5 losing seasons

Romeo Crennell 5+ seasons, 28-55 record

Josh McDaniels 1+ season, 11-17

Eric Mangini 5 seasons, 33-47, 1 WC playoff app

Nick Saban 2 seasons, 15-17

Jim Schwartz 5 seasons, 29-51 record, 1 WC playoff app

Bill O'brien 5 seasons, 42-38, 3 playoff apps(3 div titles), 1 WC playoff win

Matt Patricia 1 season, 6-10

 

Totals: 31+ seasons, 218-298, 6 playoff apps, 2-6 playoff record, 2 wins came in WC Rd as home team

 

Tom Brady is the system

Imo, Belichick was on a learning curve and in some bad situations until he got to New England where he was finally allowed to start building what became his system/culture. I don’t think Brady is “just” a system QB and the same goes for Montana. Both I’d still consider all time greats. They aren’t 1 and 2 however and probably more like 5 and 7 or something like that in my book. 

 

Fwiw, I think the best way to answer these kinds of questions, is if you started a franchise today, without a HC, surrounding team etc. yet, who would you pick first for your franchise...obviously suspending disbelief and leveling out the different generations they played in, which some people can’t do. No way in any shape/form I’m taking Brady or Montana over those 3 including probably a couple other guys.

[HessStation]

2 hours ago, nyjunc said:

I would love it if you guys at least tried to prove me wrong.  All you do is hurl insults or yell me Brady/NE were cheating.  Please get back to me when you can put together an intelligent argument against Brady being the best of all time.  

Because it’s a losing battle. Historically especially when you add weight to Super Bowl wins it’s Brady and Montana. But those guys were not better QBs than Manning, Marino, Elway, even probably Rodgers and maybe a couple other guys. 

 

They were both still great but in much better career situations. 

 

Fwiw, to try and explain it really is my “unbiased opinion” this is a similar argument to Jeter. I’m a Yankee fan, he’s one of my favorites and an all time great. BUT his greatness is heightened a bit due to the “situation” “luck” of being on great teams with surrounding greatness. There are other SS better than him.

[nyjunc]

22 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Imo, Belichick was on a learning curve and in some bad situations until he got to New England where he was finally allowed to start building what became his system/culture. I don’t think Brady is “just” a system QB and the same goes for Montana. Both I’d still consider all time greats. They aren’t 1 and 2 however and probably more like 5 and 7 or something like that in my book. 

 

Fwiw, I think the best way to answer these kinds of questions, is if you started a franchise today, without a HC, surrounding team etc. yet, who would you pick first for your franchise...obviously suspending disbelief and leveling out the different generations they played in, which some people can’t do. No way in any shape/form I’m taking Brady or Montana over those 3 including probably a couple other guys.

I'm taking Brady and I'm winning.  You can have the stat guys like Peyton or favre.

Belichick took over a Cleveland franchise that was used to winning (had been to 3 AFC championship games in 5 years) and inherited a young, pro bowl QB.  In NE he inherited a core that won 2 division titles, made playoffs 3 times in previous 4 seasons and had a PB QB in his prime.  He had 4 losing seasons in 5 years in Cleveland, he was 5-13 in NE until Brady took over.

[nyjunc]

14 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Because it’s a losing battle. Historically especially when you add weight to Super Bowl wins it’s Brady and Montana. But those guys were not better QBs than Manning, Marino, Elway, even probably Rodgers and maybe a couple other guys. 

 

They were both still great but in much better career situations. 

 

Fwiw, to try and explain it really is my “unbiased opinion” this is a similar argument to Jeter. I’m a Yankee fan, he’s one of my favorites and an all time great. BUT his greatness is heightened a bit due to the “situation” “luck” of being on great teams with surrounding greatness. There are other SS better than him.

Jeter was a great player, he was never considered the best.  He never won an MVP, never won any major award.  I used to compare Brady to Jeter and Manning to Arod but that was before Brady started putting up video game numbers too.  There's literally nothing Manning does better than Brady.  There are some QBs with more physical tools but none have the total package Brady has which is why he's the best and he's done it with probably the least talent around him.

[nyjunc]

27 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

I put Montana as number 1 but I’ll agree Marino and Peyton are the best I’ve seen play. You put them in Belli’s system and they each win more SBs than Brady. Peyton’s been the better QB over this span but for Belli’s system and systematic cheating. Marino is the best pure QB I’ve ever seen.  

Belli's system ?????????

Here are the results of the Belichick system without Tom Brady (BB as HC without him plus his coaching tree):

BB 7+ seasons, 54-63, 1 WC Playoff app, 1 WC playoff win, 5 losing seasons

Romeo Crennell 5+ seasons, 28-55 record

Josh McDaniels 1+ season, 11-17

Eric Mangini 5 seasons, 33-47, 1 WC playoff app

Nick Saban 2 seasons, 15-17

Jim Schwartz 5 seasons, 29-51 record, 1 WC playoff app

Bill O'brien 5 seasons, 42-38, 3 playoff apps(3 div titles), 1 WC playoff win

Matt Patricia 1 season, 6-10

 

Totals: 31+ seasons, 218-298, 6 playoff apps, 2-6 playoff record, 2 wins came in WC Rd as home team

 

Tom Brady is the system

[Peace Frog]

Freak.  Didn't read that nonsense.

[Peace Frog]

51 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Because it’s a losing battle. Historically especially when you add weight to Super Bowl wins it’s Brady and Montana. But those guys were not better QBs than Manning, Marino, Elway, even probably Rodgers and maybe a couple other guys. 

 

Actually Rogers is also head and shoulders better than Brady. I put him behind Marino and even though he’s physically a better specimen than Peyton, I think Peyton was the better QB. 

Put them in Belli’s system and it’s SB galore. 

[nyjunc]

6 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Freak.  Didn't read that nonsense.

Of course you didn't, why would you want to be educated on the subject?

[CTM]

47 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

Jeter was a great player, he was never considered the best.  He never won an MVP, never won any major award.  I used to compare Brady to Jeter and Manning to Arod but that was before Brady started putting up video game numbers too.  There's literally nothing Manning does better than Brady.  There are some QBs with more physical tools but none have the total package Brady has which is why he's the best and he's done it with probably the least talent around him.

Yep, pre 2007 (and post him supposedly taping opponents practices) Brady was more akin to Jeter. Since 2007 his numbers have been fantastic and hes lead the top 2 offenses in FO's best offenses of the top 30 years (07 and 10) , 4 of the top 12 and tied with Manning and Young for most in top 30

 

4  - Peyton Manning (IND '04, '00, '06, DEN '13)

4 - Tom Brady (NE '07, '10, '11, '12)

4 - Steve Young (SF '92, '93, '98, '94)

3 - Troy Aikman (DAL '95, '92, '93)

3 - Trent Green (KC '02, '03, '04)

[#27TheDominator]

I love it when "people" throw around playoff appearances by the Browns before Belichick got there.   What they did under Schottenheimer is pretty irrelevant.  The year before Belichick got there, the Browns had the worse point differential in the teams history at that point - going back to the 40's.  -234.  Hell, they only had 1 worse team since, and the point diff was worse than the recent 0-16 and 2-15 teams. They ******* sucked.  

[Jetsfan80]

3 hours ago, Peace Frog said:

Holy sh*t how obsessive is this guy. I never realized how bad it was. Wakes up in the morning firing off some strongly worded posts defending himself against strangers on the internet that happen to disagree with him. It’s pathological.

You spend time bashing Joe Namath after never having him seen him play, you sound like an idiot. 

You spend time tea-bagging Brady with slobbering opinions and not accept the very valid critiques that everyone else accepts, you sound like an idiot. 

You spend time obsessing about a college basketball program and you didn’t attend the school? Just plain disturbing. 

Dude, stop quoting me, it’s creeping me out.  

 

2 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I enjoy knowing that he’s quoting me, and then not reading his responses. 

 

2 hours ago, Peace Frog said:

He’s an obsessive compulsive freak. 

That someone who calls himself an “adult” can get so worked up about this stuff is really pathetic. 

 

It took me some time to learn not to engage with nyjunk.  You learned it much quicker.  I'm proud of you.