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Herndon suspended 4 games

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And then this happened:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/vikings-rb-roc-thomas-suspended-three-games-for-felony-drug-arrest/ar-AAEq4os?ocid=spartanntp

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This stems from an arrest earlier this year. Thomas was popped for felony drug possession after police found 143.28 grams of marijuana in the 23-year-old’s apartment.

That's about a third of a pound.  Slightly over the 'personal use' boundary for most people.  3 games.  Go figure.

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I wish someone would explain to me how it is that McCagnan/Bowles spent 4 years preaching "character", even using this mantra to justify bailing on Sheldon Richardson, yet drafted player after player with character issues. Thankfully, Robbie Anderson appears to be cleaning up his act, but it seems to me there have been a number of players they brought in who had to miss games due to different kinds of off-field shenanigans. Have I got this wrong?

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On 7/15/2019 at 10:32 AM, bitonti said:

Money really isn't everything. 

For example

If I said to you today, "OK buddy, I have an opportunity for you, best of your life. All you have to do is get in a car, and get on the NJ turnpike.

That's it. Just let someone else drive. I'll take care of the rest. 

At some point, your car will be hit, FROM BEHIND, by an almost double legally drunk 22 year old NFL player in a Nissan Armada going 100+ mph.

the driver of your vehicle will be a 76 year old man.

your vehicle will flip and slide 700 feet after impact and the tire from his SUV will be lodged in your side/rear panel of whatever sh-tbucket the old man drives 

Herndon walks away fine, minus a failed sobriety test and 4 game checks lost.  There's probably a lawsuit too... maybe...  

THESE ARE ALL THE FACTS YOU KNOW AHEAD OF TIME

you dont' know your physical condition etc. 

Would you take that deal? 

Let's be honest whoever is involved with the accident with Herndon a good chance F--Ked medically.  All those above facts were in the police report

this doesn't sound frivolous. 

 Also he's Chris Herndon not Walmart

 

I'm not saying anyone ASKS to be involved in that. Thank God no one was killed. Even more of a miracle that no one was hurt... Until they found out he was in the NFL

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10 hours ago, nycdan said:

And then this happened:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/vikings-rb-roc-thomas-suspended-three-games-for-felony-drug-arrest/ar-AAEq4os?ocid=spartanntp

That's about a third of a pound.  Slightly over the 'personal use' boundary for most people.  3 games.  Go figure.

Yeah it’s total garbage and bs and the worst part is our schedule is actually really tough early in the season and we are missing our starting full time tight end

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1 hour ago, Doug said:

I wish someone would explain to me how it is that McCagnan/Bowles spent 4 years preaching "character", even using this mantra to justify bailing on Sheldon Richardson, 

Have I got this wrong?

Everyone talking about Sheldon, as a driver, it was totally different. He was going super fast, they pull him over he has a minor, the smell of weed (no actualy weed) and had a gun. Which sounds awful.

Until you find out the minor was his blood cousin (a boy) and the state was Missouri where everyone has guns. 

it ended up being a misdemeanor, legally. and not just because Sheldon is an NFL player. No one got hurt, it was mildly reckless but essentially one family member showing off his new car to another.  

and none of it was taped, leaked on TMZ/youtube

Chris Herndon is in way deeper trouble and as it was said earlier in the thread, he's lucky no one died. He deserves 4 games the guy let his team down. he's Sam's security blanket and will miss 1/4 of the season because he's an a-hole

there's no sugar coating the situation, the more facts we learn 

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48 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Yeah it’s total garbage and bs and the worst part is our schedule is actually really tough early in the season and we are missing our starting full time tight end

Yep, and to make up for it they will have to go to Bell even more.  Who knows what kind of Football shape Bell is going to be in the first few games

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Just now, flgreen said:

Yep, and to make up for it they will have to go to Bell even more.  Who knows what kind of Football shape Bell is going to be in the first few games

from all accounts Le'veon Bell has been training at one of those combine prep places and is down to 230 or so... he is in sick shape and has something to prove 

 

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27 minutes ago, bitonti said:

from all accounts Le'veon Bell has been training at one of those combine prep places and is down to 230 or so... he is in sick shape and has something to prove 

 

That's what he says, and I hope he's right.  

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13 hours ago, flgreen said:

Yep, and to make up for it they will have to go to Bell even more.  Who knows what kind of Football shape Bell is going to be in the first few games

I think Bell will be fine.  Maybe we go with multiple back sets and split out Bell wide with Montgomery or McGuire in the backfield

 

 

Bring back the wishbone

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Does the Leggett release look like a bad idea in hindsight or was he a goner no matter what?
Get ready for a lot of 11 Personnel groupings to start the year I guess.  I don't mind that with Crowder and Bell here now.

I read somewhere that Gase loves Daniel brown too though. That would give him 3 TE’s to play with for a 12 or 22 grouping if he felt the matchups were there to be exploited. I don’t know much about that guy but if he’s likes him that’s all that matters I guess.

I’m also deep in the Wesco camp and think he’s a sleeping giant. Losing Herndon is obviously bad news, but this will let us see what these other guys have to offer. We could see more 12 than we think.


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I’m not sure why they released him so quickly. There were 5 waiver claims placed on him, he appears to have some value. 
I liked him at Clemson but he really didn’t do much here. He had a reputation for being lazy but I had thought he did a 180 on that. 

I believe that was a bad move. I don’t think Douglas would have done it. Especially when we have holes at CB and OL that are pretty serious. Legget was definitely tradable for some depth at either of those positions when the cuts begin.


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1 hour ago, GREENBEAN said:


I believe that was a bad move. I don’t think Douglas would have done it. Especially when we have holes at CB and OL that are pretty serious. Legget was definitely tradable for some depth at either of those positions when the cuts begin.


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I was a little surprised when I saw the move as well.

I am not sure how much value you would actually get back from Legget. Teams wanting you off the waiver is different then giving up assets in the future, maybe a 7th? Or you can find another Mac out there who makes a trade for a guy like Rashard Robinson and gives up a 5th 🤦‍♂️

I do believe we bring another body in to compete for the 4 game start while Herndon is out. At that point then we can judge if this is a bad move or not. My guess is there are probably more effective veteran tight ends still in FA then what Legget will produce the first four games of the season. Or maybe a surprise cut happens in preseason 

Still seems like a **** you move from Gase to Mac, which I know I shouldn't like, but I kind of do lol 

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3 hours ago, GREENBEAN said:


I read somewhere that Gase loves Daniel brown too though. That would give him 3 TE’s to play with for a 12 or 22 grouping if he felt the matchups were there to be exploited. I don’t know much about that guy but if he’s likes him that’s all that matters I guess.

I’m also deep in the Wesco camp and think he’s a sleeping giant. Losing Herndon is obviously bad news, but this will let us see what these other guys have to offer. We could see more 12 than we think.


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Wesco, by far, is our most interesting draft pick.  Sure, QW is the stud, Polite could turn out to be a steal in Round 2, a guy like Austin is a lottery ticket who, if healthy, could grow into a CB2 at some point.....but Wesco is a very, very unique player and I think we could be in for a surprise at just how much he ends up on the field.

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I was a little surprised when I saw the move as well.
I am not sure how much value you would actually get back from Legget. Teams wanting you off the waiver is different then giving up assets in the future, maybe a 7th? Or you can find another Mac out there who makes a trade for a guy like Rashard Robinson and gives up a 5th 🤦‍♂️
I do believe we bring another body in to compete for the 4 game start while Herndon is out. At that point then we can judge if this is a bad move or not. My guess is there are probably more effective veteran tight ends still in FA then what Legget will produce the first four games of the season. Or maybe a surprise cut happens in preseason 
Still seems like a **** you move from Gase to Mac, which I know I shouldn't like, but I kind of do lol 

Believe me I’m not claiming legget was a world beater but he has proven he can play at an nfl level and provide solid depth at minimum. Those guys at that tier are valuable. Legget didn’t just get claimed on waivers. There were 5 claims. I think it was polian( I could be wrong there) that said. If you cut a guy and there are more than two waiver claims then you didn’t maximize the value you could have for that player. He saw that as an issue that should have been explored to a greater extent.

If it’s a 7th or a player the other team was going to cut or whatever, managing that bottom end of the roster and intelligently, not emotionally, working through every single move to squeeze every last drop of value that you can is one of things that separate the truly great GM’s and the rest.

Sure a good FU is nice now and then but I would have liked to see both legget and Lee in douglas’ hands while we navigate through the cutting/ mini draft season . All the injuries and roster shuffling creates opportunities to bolster the roster. Having guys like leggett and even sterling around for the specific reason to use as currency isn’t the stupidest thing to do.


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Wesco, by far, is our most interesting draft pick.  Sure, QW is the stud, Polite could turn out to be a steal in Round 2, a guy like Austin is a lottery ticket who, if healthy, could grow into a CB2 at some point.....but Wesco is a very, very unique player and I think we could be in for a surprise at just how much he ends up on the field.

Right. It’s interesting to me. I listen to moving the chains with pat kirwan and Jim Miller a lot. During the mock draft season Jim Miller went on record saying that Wesco was one of his top steals in the entire draft and thought he could end up with a better career than some of the bigger names in the TE class. I have been really high on jace sternberger and would have loved to grab him, but I’m ecstatic he didn’t go to the pats at least. :)

So Wesco became someone of interest for me due to that show. Even though I really wanted macc to take a damned center at that spot and stop trading back in the 4th, I was pretty excited that Wesco was the pick. Again, I would have taken a C or at least OL there but I really like Wesco as the ultimate pick.

He has all of the makings of an excellent TE and can add to our protection as well as catch and steam roll people. It may be a blessing in disguise that Herndon misses a few games where wesco’s progress is concerned.

I’d still rather Herndon was playing of course, but Wesco has me excited.


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35 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said:

If it’s a 7th or a player the other team was going to cut or whatever, managing that bottom end of the roster and intelligently, not emotionally, working through every single move to squeeze every last drop of value that you can is one of things that separate the truly great GM’s and the rest.

Sure a good FU is nice now and then but I would have liked to see both legget and Lee in douglas’ hands while we navigate through the cutting/ mini draft season

You are correct. 

If you asked me today would I rather have D.Lee/Leggett/Sterling or a late 6th rounder in the next draft, I would pick option 1 and see if JD can make some moves. Although Sterling should really think about changing his style of play, or potentially giving up football for a while, 3 concussions in under 2 years. 

 

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You are correct. 
If you asked me today would I rather have D.Lee/Leggett/Sterling or a late 6th rounder in the next draft, I would pick option 1 and see if JD can make some moves. Although Sterling should really think about changing his style of play, or potentially giving up football for a while, 3 concussions in under 2 years. 
 

Agreed. I don’t see sterling making it through the season Unfortunately. I’m no doctor but that guys concussions have to be concerning. I hope the best for him but truth is I’m glad we’re not counting on him for a roster spot.


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36 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said:


Right. It’s interesting to me. I listen to moving the chains with pat kirwan and Jim Miller a lot. During the mock draft season Jim Miller went on record saying that Wesco was one of his top steals in the entire draft and thought he could end up with a better career than some of the bigger names in the TE class. I have been really high on jace sternberger and would have loved to grab him, but I’m ecstatic he didn’t go to the pats at least. :)

So Wesco became someone of interest for me due to that show. Even though I really wanted macc to take a damned center at that spot and stop trading back in the 4th, I was pretty excited that Wesco was the pick. Again, I would have taken a C or at least OL there but I really like Wesco as the ultimate pick.

He has all of the makings of an excellent TE and can add to our protection as well as catch and steam roll people. It may be a blessing in disguise that Herndon misses a few games where wesco’s progress is concerned.

I’d still rather Herndon was playing of course, but Wesco has me excited.


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I think Wesco will end up getting 2 to 3 targets per game.  One will be a 3 yard completion on 3rd and 2, the other will be a rumblin' bumblin' stumblin' 24 yard catch on 1st down where he knocks 2 defenders out of the game.  It will be glorious.

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9 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said:

I’m glad we’re not counting on him for a roster spot.

Speaking of rosters spots on offense.

Interesting to see after handing out 2 big contracts to injury prone receivers (Enunwa/Crowder) that we didn't bring more veteran guys in to compete for a spot. 

Josh Bellamy basically got a 3 million, can be 4 after incentives. I see him more a a ST player but Gase seems to love him. Say you have Q and Crowder injured at the same time for a game or 2, which is realistic based on there injury history.

  1. Robby Anderson
  2. Josh Bellamy
  3. Deontay Burnett
  4. Greg Dortch?
  5. Quandree Henderson?
  6. Charone Peak?

That line up is scary and feels so Jets like, doesn't it? lol. I know I am going to get killed for it, but that is why I am open to bringing in a Dez or Crabtree.  

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I think Wesco will end up getting 2 to 3 targets per game.  One will be a 3 yard completion on 3rd and 2, the other will be a rumblin' bumblin' stumblin' 24 yard catch on 1st down where he knocks 2 defenders out of the game.  It will be glorious.

Ain’t nothin wrong with that!


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Speaking of rosters spots on offense.
Interesting to see after handing out 2 big contracts to injury prone receivers (Enunwa/Crowder) that we didn't bring more veteran guys in to compete for a spot. 
Josh Bellamy basically got a 3 million, can be 4 after incentives. I see him more a a ST player but Gase seems to love him. Say you have Q and Crowder injured at the same time for a game or 2, which is realistic based on there injury history.
  1. Robby Anderson
  2. Josh Bellamy
  3. Deontay Burnett
  4. Greg Dortch?
  5. Quandree Henderson?
  6. Charone Peak?
That line up is scary and feels so Jets like, doesn't it? lol. I know I am going to get killed for it, but that is why I am open to bringing in a Dez or Crabtree.  

And that’s where the TE and extra RB’s would come in change from the 11 personnel. Anderson, and Burnett pit there with Herndon, Wesco,bell and Montgomery/ Powell. Not too bad if they all pan out.

But I hear your point. It is concerning to have guys with extensive injury histories as corner stones of the new offense. I think next offseason is the year we finally see our stud LT and WR brought into the fray. We will know what we have with a lot of guys this year. But next year is big franchise LT for sure and big # 1 WR brought for Sam to play with.


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19 hours ago, GREENBEAN said:


Right. It’s interesting to me. I listen to moving the chains with pat kirwan and Jim Miller a lot. During the mock draft season Jim Miller went on record saying that Wesco was one of his top steals in the entire draft and thought he could end up with a better career than some of the bigger names in the TE class. I have been really high on jace sternberger and would have loved to grab him, but I’m ecstatic he didn’t go to the pats at least. :)

So Wesco became someone of interest for me due to that show. Even though I really wanted macc to take a damned center at that spot and stop trading back in the 4th, I was pretty excited that Wesco was the pick. Again, I would have taken a C or at least OL there but I really like Wesco as the ultimate pick.

He has all of the makings of an excellent TE and can add to our protection as well as catch and steam roll people. It may be a blessing in disguise that Herndon misses a few games where wesco’s progress is concerned.

I’d still rather Herndon was playing of course, but Wesco has me excited.


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I'm kinda excited about Wesco, too, but he's not a Herndon replacement. If you watched his all-catches highlight reel, they're all very short throws and then he lumbers over people. Looks like he has decent hands, but he's not going to stretch the field and make one-handed grabs like Herndon can. His suspension is going to hurt. He really came on last year catching more than twice as many passes in the last eight games as he did in the first. I expect him to be a big part of the offense when he gets back, and be tough to replace when he's out. I expect Wesco to generally just be an extra OL lined up at TE, FB, or H-back, catching the occasional outlet. To replace what Herndon brings as a receiver, they'll probably employ Montgomery or more 3 & 4 WR sets.  

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On 7/17/2019 at 8:34 AM, Doug said:

I wish someone would explain to me how it is that McCagnan/Bowles spent 4 years preaching "character", even using this mantra to justify bailing on Sheldon Richardson, yet drafted player after player with character issues. Thankfully, Robbie Anderson appears to be cleaning up his act, but it seems to me there have been a number of players they brought in who had to miss games due to different kinds of off-field shenanigans. Have I got this wrong?

Which player after player with character issues were drafted by Macc?

Anderson wasnt one 

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I'm kinda excited about Wesco, too, but he's not a Herndon replacement. If you watched his all-catches highlight reel, they're all very short throws and then he lumbers over people. Looks like he has decent hands, but he's not going to stretch the field and make one-handed grabs like Herndon can. His suspension is going to hurt. He really came on last year catching more than twice as many passes in the last eight games as he did in the first. I expect him to be a big part of the offense when he gets back, and be tough to replace when he's out. I expect Wesco to generally just be an extra OL lined up at TE, FB, or H-back, catching the occasional outlet. To replace what Herndon brings as a receiver, they'll probably employ Montgomery or more 3 & 4 WR sets.  

I agree. They are different players with different skill sets. You outlined it well. My thinking is not necessarily to duplicate what Herndon brings but fun feats to fill the void of his suspension. Sure the WR’s may just get done of the throws that would have gone to Herndon, but there will need to be more of the matchup exploitation that will be missing.

I don’t see Wesco as doing what Herndon does but I do see him peeling off of his blocks to be one an outlet as well as gage designed plays to him. I see a few third down catches to start and an additional designed screen type of plays per game. If he does really well I. That roll his touches will most likely increase which would be a good thing.

I would say we still see 11 personnel as the base with 21 thrown in with Montgomery/ Powell as the extra RB In there. We have players that can cause mismatches. Im
Excited either way because I believe Gase knows how to utilize the personnel groups accurately


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all those run plays with the FB in motion in front o Bell when he was in Pittsburgh?

Wesco gonna be his escort. 

dig it.

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