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14 in Green

The Polite Question. What’s the answer?

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2 minutes ago, EM31 said:

The Narrative is well established on these types of things.

  • It is waayyy too early to talk about this. You are the stupidest poster in the history of message boards.... kick, ban!
  • It is still way to early to talk about this.  Why do Jets fans hate themselves so much?
  • It is still too early to talk about this.
  • Haven't we beaten this subject to death already?  No reason to discuss it further.

You forgot one:

"What's done is done.  We drafted him, not Chase Winovich.  Just because Winovich had 23 sacks over his first 2 seasons and Polite had 3.5, no reason to complain about it.  Macc is gone."

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3 minutes ago, flgreen said:

Polite only had 3.5 sacks with the Gators?  You might want to check your stats

*Facepalm"

Read it again, then get back to me.  

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7 minutes ago, Embrace the Suck said:

How can a third round pick in his first camp be a big concern when we have:

  1. new coach
  2. new gm
  3. Sam going into his second year
  4. New offense with big play ability
  5. New defense

Is it really time to start getting concerned about a guy who been on the job a couple of months? This isn't Gholston territory.

 

Yes, because without a pass rush, our season is mostly sunk.  We don't have the corners to allow QB's to have time back there.  

Gregg Williams can only scheme his way into QB pressures/sacks so much.  We need a natural pass rusher to emerge, and Polite is our "best bet" this season, unfortunately.  Thanks Macc.

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1 minute ago, Embrace the Suck said:

Well I guess that coaches will have to earn their money by coaching and some young guys will have to earn theirs and develop. We haven't had a real/consistent pass rush in over a decade anyway. The main underlying problem has always been scoring points. Score more points and put other teams in obvious passing situations and you'll see more sacks and better coverage. Doesn't hurt to have a DC that isn't there just because he's the coaches bff either.

When you use like 95 % of your first round picks on defense, of course you're going to have trouble scoring points.  But the fact that we invest so much in the defense only to see it suck year in and year out is pathetic.  

Yet people want to sit here and yell "Mosley!  Jamal!  QW!" and act like we're going to be fine.  

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15 minutes ago, Fantasy Island said:

I knew Gholston was a bust when we drafted him.  Then we got Erik Ainge who also sucked.   We should have drafted better than Polecat.

Just wait a couple seasons for people to complain about beating that dead horse. 

"We get it, we get it, Polite is a bust.  You can't change the past so stop whining."

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1 minute ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

Yeah, but it had nothing to do with the numbers!

It was that damn Gregg Williams' fault!  Worst DC since Kacy Rodgers!

  • Haha 1

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18 hours ago, Nixhead said:

In Polites defense - it wasn't his choice to be drafted in the 3rd round. It was out of his hands. What if we picked him in round 6 ? There would be no bust conversations at all and we would be claiming steal of the draft. Yes Mac totally blew this pick by getting him in the 3rd. Would he have lasted till the 6th - probably not. Maybe this was said already - I didn't read every post in this thread - sorry - and I stated earlier that he will be a bust as a third round pick - but as a 6th round pick he would be probably given more time to develop and mature. As a 3rd round pick we expect immediate results. So WTF - give the guy a chance and see what develops. It could actually be McCoffee that ruins his career by drafting him too early - he got a lot more money than a 6th rounder but along with that bigger signing bonus comes pressures and expectations. If he can handle everything thrown at him and survive we might actually have something. 

 

We're not allowed to bash the GM who over-drafted guys because he's gone, and we're not allowed to bash the players for getting over-drafted. 

Got it.  

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9 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

No one gives a shlt about metrics enough to hunt down the metrics to every single pass rusher to prove or disprove your point.  Because no matter how many times you repeat yourself most people dont think you have to perform at a combine to be a great pass rusher.   

Positions for which combine numbers matter the most in predictive value:

1.  EDGE

 

**** Big Gap ****

 

Everything else

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21 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

This has got to be the shortest leash I have ever seen fans put on a third round selection. 

 

8 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

What is stunning is so many fans on this forum were gushing over this selection. 

I don't know what is going on with this guy but he played 2 preseason games. How can you write this guy off so soon. 

 

He had roughly 37 red flags when he was taken and was a Mike Maccagnan pick.  So, yeah, we're gonna go ahead and write him off unless he provides a compelling reason to think he'll turn into something.  

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1 hour ago, Greenseed4 said:

@T0mShane and others...

How do you explain his JR year college stats:

19.5 TFL, 11 sacks, 4 PD, 6 FF

All in the SEC. 

If he performed well 2 years ago in college, but looks fat and slow today, what do you deduce happened?  

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12 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Jets fans: Hey, mistakes were made. You gotta move on.

 

Also Jets fans: Eric Mangini ruined my marriage,

"And Bill Parcells killed my dog."

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7 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Dude, go back and read the posts right after he was drafted. I think one thread was called that wasn't a good selection and went onto say that was a great selection. Honestly, I don't  care about this guy  so much, third round picks don't  always work out so this would be another one that didn't but I find it funny that nobody was screaming over the 37 red flags you speak of the moment he was selected. 

I'm pretty sure people were pointing out those red flags at the time.  Even if they weren't, it's up to the GM to recognize when a guy is a slug.  Unfortunately, the previous front office didn't pay much attention to measurables or advanced metrics.  Hence...Lorenzo Mauldin.  Polite was being touted as a 1st round pick until his disastrous combine and interviews, so I imagine part of that support for the pick was a residue of that "old information".  

I love how people's default when defending a pick is to say "I didn't hear any of you on this message board making these complaints when the pick happened!"  Not only is that false, it's an easy way to deflect blame away from the scouts and GM that look at this stuff (or don't look at this stuff) for months before making the pick.  GM's are paid the big bucks to have foresight, dude.   

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35 minutes ago, rangerous said:

sure,   third rounders don't always work out but at that draft position they should at least show some serious potential beyond physical ability.  third round is not a throw away pick.

Yep.  Jordan Jenkins (Macc's only success in the 3rd round prior to perhaps Edoga) was a perfect type of selection.  Somewhat limited upside but a solid floor player.  He didn't get cute with that pick.  Jenkins was a guy we'd had a ton of visits with that offseason (more than any other team by far) and knew exactly what he brought to the table, then went ahead and took him.  Perfectly done.  

And it's not like there weren't options in this draft class at that spot.  Winovich, RB David Montgomery, RB Darrell Henderson, RB Devin Singletary, WR Miles Boykin and several others would have made a ton of sense at that spot.  

At least he seemed to nail the Edoga pick later in the round....

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38 minutes ago, rangerous said:

it's kind of too bad polite is following in the long line of mac misses.  he probably needs to have more time at least to get his head around the desire to play the game.  he has the physical talent.  it all comes down to heart and the desire to learn how to play better.

If only we could put Lorenzo Mauldin's mind/drive in Polite's body.  

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3 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Actually I see this as Monday morning QBing. The guy apparently  seemed like a value pick in the third round and everyone thought it was an awesome pick at the time. Now that he isn't  working out, nobody in their right mind should have made this pick.  

Because people are only figuring out now why he fell so much.  Armchair GM's only saw his productivity in college and assumed he was a steal.  Digging deeper, he probably should have fallen beyond the 3rd round.  

GM's are supposed to have plenty of info on these guys and recognize busts a lot easier than we can.  But if you don't use the info at hand, or ignore rather obvious red flags, it leads to some really bad picks.  

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18 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

To add to this, everyone e desperately  wanted an edge rusher. I would  venture to say that in the third round, this guy possibly had the most upside of anyone left as far as pass rusher. People criticize picking BPA and that isn't  what this was, it was a need pick so now we shouldn't  do that either. 

I wanted a GOOD pass rusher too.  Emphasis on "good".  At first I praised the pick because I thought at the time Polite would be a good pass rusher.  The numbers and eye test suggest otherwise.  

Based on how far he fell, and probably would have continued to fall, the BPA argument doesn't work.  We don't know how the other GM's graded him, but he looks more like a 5th round project type at this point.  If that was the case, he wasn't the BPA/value pick to make there.  

Jordan Jenkins was basically a starter from Day 1.  THAT'S what a good 3rd round selection looks like.  Edoga also.  

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1 hour ago, Greenseed4 said:

Yep.  And Jordan Jenkins also only had 4 tackles combined through his first two preseason games.  You're awesome. 

Jordan Jenkins didn't have anywhere close to the number of red flags Polite had.  He's also a very different player than Polite; he's an edge setter in the Calvin Pace mode.  You knew what you were getting in Jenkins the moment he was taken; a good but not great LB.  With Polite there was a much wider range of outcomes.  

Other than all that, great point!

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3 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said:

I didn’t draft him, I’m just not writing him off before next week.

I might even give him a whole half season before ranting, or comparing him to other long-haired players. 

All we have is the info we have.  Red flags and unimpressive play.  Obviously that all could change.  But right now, not impressed.  That's all we can talk about in this thread, at this moment.  

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1 minute ago, JiF said:

You're not so sure but you're sure the coaching staff would be so sure but you have no idea what is actually going on.

Dropping knowledge!

 

You sounded pretty unsure too, and you're a Gator guy.  

Reminds me of when we drafted Geno Smith, and I asked a friend who went to West Virginia what he thought of him.  His response told me all I needed to know.  "Ehhh........".  42 TD/6 INT senior season, and a huge Mountaineer fan was ambivalent.  Yikes.  

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7 minutes ago, JiF said:

Pretty unsure about what, specifically?  If he's going to be a good Football player?  Sure, I'm unsure.  Just like I'm unsure if Quinnen Williams is going to be worth the 3rd overall pick and that unsureness level gets even lower as you move down the rounds of the draft. 

Otherwise, I think I've been pretty clear that I'm 100% sure I'm not ready to make the determination on Jachai Polite 5 weeks into his pro career.

 

My point was that you're a Gator guy, and still can't bring yourself to get really excited about Polite despite a productive final season there, and its pretty telling.  Hence why he's kind of like the Geno Smith of Florida.  

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22 minutes ago, JiF said:

@Jetsfan80 - how piqued is your interest now?????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????????????

 

 

image.gif

 

Boner-rific.  Hopefully this isn't just getting excited about a seeing eye single.  

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38 minutes ago, Snook said:

Why would we ignore his last year of actually playing real games?

Not ignore.  Diminish in light of new information.  He fell in the draft for a reason.  How often has a player like that worked out for us?

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