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14 in Green

The Polite Question. What’s the answer?

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8 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Watt played against first team players. And at 40lbs heavier was faster and quicker that Polite. 

But did he perform “a helluva lot better” than Polite in his first two preseason games? 

Nobody remembers how he looked but assuming he stepped onto the field a finished product is stupid. 

And he was the 11th pick of the draft BECAUSE he was 40 pounds heavier and faster. 

How about we give a third rounder more than 3 or 4 quarters of preseason football before we declare him a finished product and cut him. 

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6 hours ago, Beerfish said:

If the old regime was still in charge he would be here for at least a year or two no matter what.

With the new regime they have zero loyalty and zero to save face so if he is bad he will get cut.

He has to show something good from here on out for them to keep him around at the cost of another player.  He has about 2 weeks to do something really eye catching.

I disagree. There's no way they are going to give up on after only one training camp. He's guaranteed a roster spot. Although, I doubt very seriously he'll be on the game day 47.

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8 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

But did he perform “a helluva lot better” than Polite in his first two preseason games? 

Nobody remembers how he looked but assuming he stepped onto the field a finished product is stupid. 

And he was the 11th pick of the draft BECAUSE he was 40 pounds heavier and faster. 

How about we give a third rounder more than 3 or 4 quarters of preseason football before we declare him a finished product and cut him. 

Find the player with Polite’s athletic profile that succeeded. 

The only reason to think that Polite might be anything is because he was good in college and generally pass rushers translate well from college to NFL. But that’s just one bit of evidence against a multitude of evidence in the other direction.

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47 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

I'm not sure what measure a "helluva alot more" is but JJ Watt had one tackle through his first 2 preseason games.

Polite already has 4 tackles.

And JJ Watt was the 11th pick of the draft.

Ok. If you took the time to look that up, this Watt comparison means a lot more to you then it does to me. LOL

  Look, I’m not saying Polite is going to bust, hell I was the guy in the draft thread hoping we’d grab him. The last thing I want is to cut him. I’m just asking what role, if any he’s going to play come September.

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25 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Ok. If you took the time to look that up, this Watt comparison means a lot more to you then it does to me. LOL

  Look, I’m not saying Polite is going to bust, hell I was the guy in the draft thread hoping we’d grab him. The last thing I want is to cut him. I’m just asking what role, if any he’s going to play come September.

I don't know how well Polite's game is going to translate to the NFL, but if you liked Polite going into the draft, nothing has happened that you should change your mind.  If anything, you should be encouraged.  Greg Williams has spoken well of him, and has moved him up his depth chart.  If Polite sucks, and is a dog, Williams/Gase/Douglas will cut him. One thing Williams won't buy into, are guys that aren't hustling and giving him 100%. 

In answer to your original question, if the CS decides he's not trying, and he's going to be a bust, IMO they'll cut him.

I don't think that's going to happen.  I think he makes the 53, and whether or not he is active will depend on how much he improves in practice.

My opinion?  He'll be inactive 4-5 games, then start getting more and more reps in 3rd down situations         

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1 hour ago, kdels62 said:

Dee Ford had all of the athleticism in the world, Polite has mush for brains and mush for a body. 

Those are general statements, that don't get to the point of the comparison. As far as the personal attacks against someone you don't know, and never worked out with. Well.......

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7 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Who gets concerned after limited play in 2 preseason games.

Patience.

2 exhibition games and people want to cut this guy already

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4 hours ago, T0mShane said:

He may very well be a mental case and a total waste, though. His Combine was a cry for help. 

If he is we'll find out.  Any of these players can.  Hopefully he isn't.  Had to find out he isn't while he's playing on another roster. 

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2 hours ago, kdels62 said:

Dee Ford had all of the athleticism in the world, Polite has mush for brains and mush for a body. 

Thanks for the in depth, factual scouting report.

Mush for brains?

Mush for a body?

You have to try hard to sound like this.

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7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Thanks for the in depth, factual scouting report.

Mush for brains?

Mush for a body?

You have to try hard to sound like this.

untitled.thumb.png.6da6b60f710bf8f1a0adf885c18813e5.png

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2 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Ok. If you took the time to look that up, this Watt comparison means a lot more to you then it does to me. LOL

  Look, I’m not saying Polite is going to bust, hell I was the guy in the draft thread hoping we’d grab him. The last thing I want is to cut him. I’m just asking what role, if any he’s going to play come September.

Less than 20 seconds. It's actually pretty easy.  Player, Game Logs, Year.

http://www.nfl.com/player/j.j.watt/2495488/gamelogs?season=2011

When you are trying to confront hyperbole with hyperbole, it's good to be well equipped.

 

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2 hours ago, kdels62 said:

Find the player with Polite’s athletic profile that succeeded. 

The only reason to think that Polite might be anything is because he was good in college and generally pass rushers translate well from college to NFL. But that’s just one bit of evidence against a multitude of evidence in the other direction.

You are arguing something different than what is being discussed.

Who knows whether he will be good or not.

Should we cut him NOW cannot be decided based upon his weight, timed speed, quickness or any other criteria.  Right now.

If there is a multitude of evidence right NOW that he won't be any good then we should have cut him the day after he was drafted.

Let's give him a year.  Or 2. Maybe the 21 year old 238 pound guy fills out to a solid 250 pound guys when he's 23 and been in an NFL strength and conditioning program for 2 years.  And his natural pass rushing talents can be better put to use.

Or cut him now.

One of them sounds like a good idea.

 

 

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56 minutes ago, genot said:

Those are general statements, that don't get to the point of the comparison. As far as the personal attacks against someone you don't know, and never worked out with. Well.......

These statements are not general. You can look up the metrics that show that Polite and Ford are at completely different levels of athleticism. 

While you’re second point is mostly a distraction from your inability to really have a valid point, I’ll concede that I don’t know that his brain is mush. I do know that he’s a player with motivation and work ethic concerns. I also know that relative to his peers he’s neither athletic nor is he in the best shape, which has no relation to my lack of athleticism.

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Just now, Philc1 said:

The answer:

 

trade Leo and a future first for Clowney

I luv ya, butjtfp.gif.df87d487d61284c38b7baf95fc565299.gif

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1 minute ago, kdels62 said:

These statements are not general. You can look up the metrics that show that Polite and Ford are at completely different levels of athleticism. 

While you’re second point is mostly a distraction from your inability to really have a valid point, I’ll concede that I don’t know that his brain is mush. I do know that he’s a player with motivation and work ethic concerns. I also know that relative to his peers he’s neither athletic nor is he in the best shape, which has no relation to my lack of athleticism.

If you want to throw out his game film, and totally disregard it. be my guest. When you look out his film, it doesn't support your argument. His workout numbers do. the best thing for everybody, at this point, is to chill, and see if he develops. Dee ford was a non-factor his 1st two years in the league. Substitute Polite for Ford, people would have been yelling bust, bust, bust.

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3 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Another year with zero pass rush yay

I have a $100 bet that Leo has 10 plus sacks this year. if i lose, i will pay up!!!!!usatsi_11543572.jpg.864e60244f13720a34e25a7e225db726.jpg

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9 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Now that we're 2 preseason games into his career, I think it's safe to say he's a bust.

I'm with you that knee-jerk reactions aren't always accurate.  But we could tell pretty quickly that guys like Darnold had "it" and guys like Vernon Gholston didn't.  QW seems to have it (thank god!).  But for Polite it doesn't seem like he's just slow to come around or has one thing to work on.  He's making a variety of mistakes and when a guy does that you have to wonder if he's in over his head.  The saving grace for a guy like that is typically when you see those one or two "Whoa!" plays where he flashes a quick second of greatness and you say, "Ah, that's what they saw in him....how do we get him to do THAT more often and more consistently?"....but I'm not sure we've even seen the flash yet, have we?  If there was just one play where he tore around the corner for a sack, or made some sick inside swim move to pressure a QB into an incompletion we might see promise.  Has that happened yet?

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13 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

I'm with you that knee-jerk reactions aren't always accurate.  But we could tell pretty quickly that guys like Darnold had "it" and guys like Vernon Gholston didn't.  QW seems to have it (thank god!).  But for Polite it doesn't seem like he's just slow to come around or has one thing to work on.  He's making a variety of mistakes and when a guy does that you have to wonder if he's in over his head.  The saving grace for a guy like that is typically when you see those one or two "Whoa!" plays where he flashes a quick second of greatness and you say, "Ah, that's what they saw in him....how do we get him to do THAT more often and more consistently?"....but I'm not sure we've even seen the flash yet, have we?  If there was just one play where he tore around the corner for a sack, or made some sick inside swim move to pressure a QB into an incompletion we might see promise.  Has that happened yet?

Great point and it's always what I look for in the younger guys.....just show me that it's there. Take QW last night. He didn't show up on the stat sheet but he started playing faster and coming off the ball faster which was my biggest criticism of him after the first game. You can see it's there.

Polite has shown nothing and has mostly been running with the third stringers in practice and playing against them in the PS games. Still.....nothing. Against players that will be out of the league forever in two weeks. We should see SOMETHING for a 3rd rounder and it's not due to lack of playing time.

I've been plenty vocal about not liking the pick and not liking the player before he was drafted. If he ends up making it he will be the biggest outlier pass rusher in the NFL over the last 20+ years, not only because of his sh*tty combine but also his playing weight. Players with his numbers never succeed as OLB's in this league, as a DE the outlook is even more dire.    

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1 hour ago, genot said:

I have a $100 bet that Leo has 10 plus sacks this year. if i lose, i will pay up!!!!!usatsi_11543572.jpg.864e60244f13720a34e25a7e225db726.jpg

787CED41-5F72-4AC4-B372-DB57B9F08F24.jpeg.097ece7a7434151336e100bb89e3ceda.jpeg

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4 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

You are arguing something different than what is being discussed.

Who knows whether he will be good or not.

Should we cut him NOW cannot be decided based upon his weight, timed speed, quickness or any other criteria.  Right now.

If there is a multitude of evidence right NOW that he won't be any good then we should have cut him the day after he was drafted.

Let's give him a year.  Or 2. Maybe the 21 year old 238 pound guy fills out to a solid 250 pound guys when he's 23 and been in an NFL strength and conditioning program for 2 years.  And his natural pass rushing talents can be better put to use.

Or cut him now.

One of them sounds like a good idea.

 

 

Yes, the team can cut him now and evidence states that he should be cut. I don’t think we will be cut but I’m not holding out hope for a turn around. 

At this point our front 7 is so deep that keeping Polite means cutting from somewhere else. Is the hope that Polite has been lazy during the most critical parts of the career worth a roster spot? If his potential is capped by his athleticism, do you keep a backup caliber player at the expense of depth?

 

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23 hours ago, BUM-KNEE said:

I need to buy you a beer.

I will take you up of that next time I visit Maine  :)

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27 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

has anyone defined what a YOOG is?

Larz is keeping it under raps

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22 hours ago, mrcoops said:

Worse than that: I have no idea where my towel is.

got it !..

il_340x270.1296426042_rcgl.jpg?version=0

 

;)

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8 hours ago, kdels62 said:

Yes, the team can cut him now and evidence states that he should be cut. I don’t think we will be cut but I’m not holding out hope for a turn around. 

At this point our front 7 is so deep that keeping Polite means cutting from somewhere else. Is the hope that Polite has been lazy during the most critical parts of the career worth a roster spot? If his potential is capped by his athleticism, do you keep a backup caliber player at the expense of depth?

 

Potential capped by athleticism. 

Wow. 

If conjecture could ever be captured in one phrase, you have done it. 

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The team has seen him for weeks now if not longer they have a good idea if he has the talent etc needed to have a role in the NFL. But obviously not enough time yet to make that final decision. You don't cut him if he can't contribute immediately at most you try to PS him which makes him available for other teams's active rosters or even their PS. I'm hoping Williams can find the right role for him to contribute. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Potential capped by athleticism. 

Wow. 

If conjecture could ever be captured in one phrase, you have done it. 

What? Polite in the measurements that have proven useful for determining future success falls well short of any threshold. That’s not conjecture, it’s reality. If he had the athleticism and was out there looking how he does now, I’d want him on the roster but he hasn’t shown anything worth keeping.

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Just now, kdels62 said:

What? Polite in the measurements that have proven useful for determining future success falls well short of any threshold. That’s not conjecture, it’s reality. If he had the athleticism and was out there looking how he does now, I’d want him on the roster but he hasn’t shown anything worth keeping.

In 3-1/2 quarters of preseason football. 

Got it. 

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15 hours ago, Philc1 said:

2 exhibition games and people want to cut this guy already

I think they want to cut this guy because he tested horribly and he looks like a guy who tested horribly. 

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The pro-Polite people are clinging to this idea that he’s actually a good athlete underneath all that fat and he’s still fat six months later and he looks like he’s running with sandbags for feet, but it’s the people pointing to the facts that are crazy. 

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Mike Mamula had incredible athleticism and potential and his measurements ensured future success. 

We should just use a computer model to determine who is going to be good and who is not. 

Let’s not even let the coaches decide. 

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