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Villain The Foe

In hindsight, how awesome was that Jets/Colts trade for Darnold?

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9 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

Imagine if Andrew Luck decided to retire before the 2018 draft. We would not have Sam Darnold right now. Talk about a trade looking great for the Colts, some even comparing it to highway robbery, only to have your Franchise QB that allowed you to even make such a trade retire a year later. 

That gotta hurt. 

Welp, I guess we won that trade! 

Let's not kid ourselves. Mac panicked and got dumb-lucky with Darnold. The Colts were executing their plan and got screwed a year later, but still have a stocked team and a very good backup QB with starting experience for both the Colts and Pats. We just have Sam, and no way to support him.

I'd still take the Colts situation at this point. Jets supporting cast is just as likely to ruin Sam as they are to see him flourish.

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12 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Let's not kid ourselves. Mac panicked and got dumb-lucky with Darnold. The Colts were executing their plan and got screwed a year later, but still have a stocked team and a very good backup QB with starting experience for both the Colts and Pats. We just have Sam, and no way to support him.

I'd still take the Colts situation at this point. Jets supporting cast is just as likely to ruin Sam as they are to see him flourish.

Trust, we all know this. Even I was concerned about the trade given that Macc gave up all of that capital to make a trade that didnt guarantee him the player that he coveted. 

Folks made it some sort of foregone conclusion that the Giants were most definitely going Barkley. Even though they did, the fact that they could have just as easily picked Darnold confirmed that it was indeed dumb luck on the part of Macc. 

Im really just concentrating on the part where the Colts got screwed a year later. 

Ironically, this situation shows what we both spoke about briefly about Bridgewater. You need 2 QB's in this league. You just never know what will happen. Brissett isnt a top 16 QB in the league, but he's better than whatever the Redskins are going to field and I would take him over Joe Flacco as well. 

They're not totally burnt, but man...it's rare that situations like this break in the Jets favor. 

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37 minutes ago, Creepy Lurker said:

It was a good trade for the Colts too but I’m sure they are kicking themselves. Hindsight doesn’t work in this business. 

Not in the business, but as fans on a forum who can discuss it...sure. 

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I always said Luck is a Goober.

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1 hour ago, Creepy Lurker said:

It was a good trade for the Colts too but I’m sure they are kicking themselves. Hindsight doesn’t work in this business. 

There were actually questions if Luck would ever be effective after the shoulder injury.  They took a chance with the trade.  I think it is the leg stuff that is sending him off, but he does not throw anywhere near as hard as he once did either.  So yes, it was a good break for us.  Cleveland and the NYG skipping Sam was, as well

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1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said:

Trust, we all know this. Even I was concerned about the trade given that Macc gave up all of that capital to make a trade that didnt guarantee him the player that he coveted. 

Folks made it some sort of foregone conclusion that the Giants were most definitely going Barkley. Even though they did, the fact that they could have just as easily picked Darnold confirmed that it was indeed dumb luck on the part of Macc. 

Im really just concentrating on the part where the Colts got screwed a year later. 

Ironically, this situation shows what we both spoke about briefly about Bridgewater. You need 2 QB's in this league. You just never know what will happen. Brissett isnt a top 16 QB in the league, but he's better than whatever the Redskins are going to field and I would take him over Joe Flacco as well. 

They're not totally burnt, but man...it's rare that situations like this break in the Jets favor. 

Picking 3rd, I am fairly certain Macc had his eyes on Allen.

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2 minutes ago, ljr said:

Potential franchise QB > everything else

100% true. But what a team does with him once they get him is as important as having him. I think thank was the Ape’s point. Colts got a generational talent in Luck and he played well in spite of them never giving him what he needed. Even after serious injuries came back last year and did s good job. They were finally loaded to make the run and boom... he called it quits. 

We got off to a rough start with Sam last year but luckily he just got some bruises and a welcome to the NFL. We need this coaching staff and front office to make much better choices going forward because this is already Sam’s second year and we are  modestly behind the 8 ball. Yet, gotta feel better than last year because the recent O line  moves shows they recognize the deficiencies. 

Sad what happen to Luck and we have to hope that the Jets will do everything possible to support Sam. Colts drafted back to back generational QBs. We had Namath, now Sam. Kinda long time to wait, must do something with it!

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4 minutes ago, jack48 said:

Picking 3rd, I am fairly certain Macc had his eyes on Allen.

Haha, you're probably right. That's even worse. 

 

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1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said:

Imagine if Andrew Luck decided to retire before the 2018 draft. We would not have Sam Darnold right now. Talk about a trade looking great for the Colts, some even comparing it to highway robbery, only to have your Franchise QB that allowed you to even make such a trade retire a year later. 

That gotta hurt. 

Welp, I guess we won that trade! 

I bet Luck keeps playing. If it was the off-season, then it would carry more weight.  Saying this are his age and point in his career just sounds like he had a bad week. 

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5 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

Haha, you're probably right. That's even worse. 

 

I think Allen still has the highest ceiling of anyone in that class but the Bill's are just such a bad team at this point. 

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8 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

I think Allen still has the highest ceiling of anyone in that class but the Bill's are just such a bad team at this point. 

He was the 2nd most inaccurate QB of the guys drafted in the 1st round. Accuracy is very hard to fix by the time you get to the pros. 

His ceiling is the highest because of how physically gifted his is. Men arent made like that everyday. However, as a QB, he's no where near as gifted as a Sam Darnold for example. 

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6 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

He was the 2nd most inaccurate QB of the guys drafted in the 1st round. Accuracy is very hard to fix by the time you get to the pros. 

His ceiling is the highest because of how physically gifted his is. Men arent made like that everyday. However, as a QB, he's no where near as gifted as a Sam Darnold for example. 

Again not inaccurate, inefficient. We've discussed ad nauseam

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1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said:

hey're not totally burnt, but man...it's rare that situations like this break in the Jets favor. 

Truth.

Reich was in Philly with Sudfeld, I read they may pursue him. Makes sense, and Philly getting McCown sort of suggests that some league circles have been aware of Luck possibly retiring for a while.

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1 hour ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

You'd trade the Jets' roster for the Colts' roster?  No way would I do that.  

Yes. The Jets have 5-6 legit NFL players. The Colts have a roster. I’d make the best of it this year, then since I have a roster I’d throw whatever draft capital I have to at getting a QB next year.

Colts have a good situation, all things considered.

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2 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Yes. The Jets have 5-6 legit NFL players. The Colts have a roster. I’d make the best of it this year, then since I have a roster I’d throw whatever draft capital I have to at getting a QB next year.

Colts have a good situation, all things considered.

Andrew Luck changing his mind after a year off wouldn't be the most shocking thing, either. Dude sounds beaten down, though, hard to put the same level of trust in him again. But I think they'd send the company jet if he said he wanted to come back. 

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1 hour ago, The Gooch said:

Colts will be in on Trevor Lawerence in 2021!!!!!!

The Gooch makes a good point!

nbc 90th special facepalm GIF by NBC

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4 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Yes. The Jets have 5-6 legit NFL players. The Colts have a roster. I’d make the best of it this year, then since I have a roster I’d throw whatever draft capital I have to at getting a QB next year.

Colts have a good situation, all things considered.

Darnold, Adams, Leo, Osemele, Bell, Anderson, Crowder, Herndon. There's 7 legit nfl players. I can keep going.

 

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10 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Yes. The Jets have 5-6 legit NFL players. The Colts have a roster. I’d make the best of it this year, then since I have a roster I’d throw whatever draft capital I have to at getting a QB next year.

Colts have a good situation, all things considered.

No sure thing you get a good QB in any particular draft. There will be major competition for Tua/Lawrence.

Jets have the hardest piece to find in football and he’s still a baby.  

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22 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

He was the 2nd most inaccurate QB of the guys drafted in the 1st round. Accuracy is very hard to fix by the time you get to the pros. 

His ceiling is the highest because of how physically gifted his is. Men arent made like that everyday. However, as a QB, he's no where near as gifted as a Sam Darnold for example. 

Sam had accuracy  issues as well and I believe they found something in his throwing motion or how he setup and he got much better. I do hope Allen sucks because  he is in our division so hopefully  nobody is doing this with him. 

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4 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Sam had accuracy  issues as well and I believe they found something in his throwing motion or how he setup and he got much better. I do hope Allen sucks because  he is in our division so hopefully  nobody is doing this with him. 

Not sure how much a issue his inaccuracy was. He did have trouble with the long ball but always had nice touch Sam’s most noticeable issue come out was fumbling away the ball. They fixed that pretty quick. 

Allen is cyborg-like monster with the potential to be good to unstoppable. But, his accuracy issues show up everywhere in his game and was literally the biggest ding on him coming out. 

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2 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Imagine if Andrew Luck decided to retire before the 2018 draft. We would not have Sam Darnold right now. Talk about a trade looking great for the Colts, some even comparing it to highway robbery, only to have your Franchise QB that allowed you to even make such a trade retire a year later. 

That gotta hurt. 

Welp, I guess we won that trade! 

Hindsight is pointless, except to learn from one's mistakes.  Had the giants selected darnold and mac took rosen or even Allen, how good would it have looked? Too bad for Colts, but "This is the business we have chosen" -Hyman Roth 

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58 minutes ago, MCGAHEE2121 said:

Again not inaccurate, inefficient. We've discussed ad nauseam

 

Inaccurate or inefficient, it doesnt matter. The ball doesnt reach the target often enough for folks to make any semantic corrections here. 

I wasnt part of that discussion, my bad. 

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The Colts got one of the best OG in the league and a beast on defense plus more picks so If Brissett doesn’t workout the Colts could still end up with a top QB. The Jets got Darnold so it’s a win win in my opinion. 

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31 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Sam had accuracy  issues as well and I believe they found something in his throwing motion or how he setup and he got much better. I do hope Allen sucks because  he is in our division so hopefully  nobody is doing this with him. 

Every rookie has accuracy issues, Not everyones accuracy issues are the same. 

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12 minutes ago, Dcat said:

Hindsight is pointless, except to learn from one's mistakes.  Had the giants selected darnold and mac took rosen or even Allen, how good would it have looked? Too bad for Colts, but "This is the business we have chosen" -Hyman Roth 

It probably would have looked like what I said below.

2 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Trust, we all know this. Even I was concerned about the trade given that Macc gave up all of that capital to make a trade that didnt guarantee him the player that he coveted. 

Folks made it some sort of foregone conclusion that the Giants were most definitely going Barkley. Even though they did, the fact that they could have just as easily picked Darnold confirmed that it was indeed dumb luck on the part of Macc. 

Im really just concentrating on the part where the Colts got screwed a year later. 

Ironically, this situation shows what we both spoke about briefly about Bridgewater. You need 2 QB's in this league. You just never know what will happen. Brissett isnt a top 16 QB in the league, but he's better than whatever the Redskins are going to field and I would take him over Joe Flacco as well. 

They're not totally burnt, but man...it's rare that situations like this break in the Jets favor. 

 

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2 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Not in the business, but as fans on a forum who can discuss it...sure. 

Of course. It’s a good discussion too. 

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That was essentially a win-win trade. They got 2 all pro guys out of it, and we got a franchise QB. That's a deal that I would do, if I'm the Colts GM, because you can't assume a franchise QB is going to retire at 29.

Considering they pay him well, they can't invest a top 3 pick for Darnold to sit behind him.

If he had retired before last year's draft, we'd be finding ways to defend Josh Allen or Josh Rosen.

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26 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Not sure how much a issue his inaccuracy was. He did have trouble with the long ball but always had nice touch Sam’s most noticeable issue come out was fumbling away the ball. They fixed that pretty quick. 

Allen is cyborg-like monster with the potential to be good to unstoppable. But, his accuracy issues show up everywhere in his game and was literally the biggest ding on him coming out. 

Allen’s arm talent is off the charts but the fact is is that he had trouble reading Div III D’s at Wyoming, was inaccurate and for all the hype never even put up many points in college big plays here and there aside.

I’m pretty sure he’d be the Jet QB right now if the Giants picked Darnold.  I just don’t think Woody would have wanted Rosen based on his political leanings.

So very good chance, if Allen busts, that the 3 #2’a shipped to the Colts by what’s-his-name? Mac something would be swirling around the same septic tank containing over 90% of Mac-something’s other decisions made for the Jets. I would have rather Allen have happened than if Mac-something’s Plan A had gone through, emptying the Jet vault for a guy who is 4-26 against teams with Winning records, Cousins...but Mac-something probably didn’t even know that haha.

Again, where is he?  Season about to start.  Anyone offer him a Janitor’s job?

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49 minutes ago, Ghost420 said:

Darnold, Adams, Leo, Osemele, Bell, Anderson, Crowder, Herndon. There's 7 legit nfl players. I can keep going.

 

Bell, Osemele and Crowder are is the only players on that list to have seen 2nd contracts and produce more than 3 consecutive seasons of excellent/average play. I think you're grossly over-estimating how quickly "flashes in the rookie season" can turn out to be legit. Remember Dee Milliner's defensive player of the month "flashes"? How about how Geno closed out that one season with gaudy stats? When I say legit, what I'm implying is that there are not many players on this team that have proven over a series of seasons that they are contributors, stars and legit roster pieces. By the end of this year, the story may be different - but I tend to think in the present. As such, we're a very, very thin roster full of inexperience and "I hope he works out" players.

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