Trader Joe - Jets trade with Colts for CB Nate Hairston

[GREENBEAN]

6 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing Lee is a great player, but he is a NFL caliber starting LB.

My original point here was about Douglas wasting the pick we got for him on a player we could've gotten on waivers. If we somehow missed on Hairston, I'm sure we could've gotten someone comparable and kept the pick. The fact that Douglas wasted any sort of capital on this move doesn't impress me. That was my point.

Somewhere along the way in my discussion with 80, we got to where I said it equated to Gase and Douglas combining to basically trade Lee for Hairston (a waiver wire type player). You and 80 might feel the way you do about Lee's situation here, I don't feel he was as bad as both of you do. I didn't like when we traded him. I thought KC took advantage of Gase. We only got a 6th because Gase accepted it, and I don't like that Douglas gave it away. 

This is my opinion, and I think it's reasonable, I see your side also though. I don't think either of us are changing our minds, and what does it matter anyway? What's done is done. That's why I told 80 earlier it is what it is, I hope the guy gets on the field and contributes something.

Well said. I think you and I are the last of the bunch who feels this way.  I honestly believe that Lee would be worth more today than he was when we traded him. Legget too. (he scored a nice TD the other day)  We said that when it happened and I have not changed my mind now.  Obviously you haven't either.  Hey, I'm all on board for giving Douglas the benefit of the doubt and that He, Hogan and Savage are a FO crew to be reckoned with. I'm in. And our situation might just call for some moves like this where we have to give up a little capital to remain competitive at all. Ok, I'll buy it and not complain too much.  

That said, I feel ya. The Lee and Legget moves were bad moves made by GM Gase.  The first thing I thought today, after trying to figure out who Hairston was, was that we essentially traded Lee for this guy and which of the two would have more value out there today with all of the injuries in the NFL.  I can't help it. I think like that. lol 

So here I am rooting for Lee to be the biggest flop on KC this year and hoping Hairston and Alex Lewis end up being solid contributors... Pro bowlers even. hahaha.  I want no one anywhere outside of the Jets to do well.  I wish them all failure. 

 

[14 in Green]

1 hour ago, GREENBEAN said:

are we arguing if a 5th has more value than a 6th these days? 

I think 80 was, I wasn't.

I thought Gase was dumb for making the trade before we hired the new GM. I also thought KC took advantage of him and got a young, starting LB for a ridiculous price. I wouldn't have traded him for a 5th either.

The fact that Douglas turned around and traded that ridiculous return for a player we could've gotten on waivers in a few days? Doesn't exactly have me jumping for joy about their personnel wizardry the way a lot of people here do. 

[GREENBEAN]

Just now, 14 in Green said:

I think 80 was, I wasn't.

I thought Gase was dumb for making the trade before we hired the new GM. I also thought KC took advantage of him and got a young, starting LB for a ridiculous price. I wouldn't have traded him for a 5th either.

The fact that Douglas turned around and traded that ridiculous return for a player we could've gotten on waivers in a few days? Doesn't exactly have me jumping for joy about their personnel wizardry the way a lot of people here do. 

Right.I know it was 80. I was just busting his chops a bit. 

 I just replied to your other post so I won't say the same stuff here, but I agree.  I can subscribe to the culture move on Gase's part and I think that at least had something to do with it. Show the team that he doesn't care who you are or where you were drafted. If you're not on board 100% then you're out. Sure, I can understand that. If Lee had to go, he had to go. 

But I think it also had to do with a little bit of F U as Macc walked out the door. IMO that was Gase letting macchiato's know exactly how he felt about him. I bet Macc's office wasn't even cleaned out before Lee was gone. Gase ran the coup and that was the smack in the chops.  That's what I think, and as is standard, when emotions get involved people make stupid choices. 

I also agree that KC saw the window and ran through it. Can't blame em.  

 

[BornJetsFan1983]

At some point we need to send some candy or something to them with a thank you card. They keep helping us, some would say screwed us on Sam but it didn't cost 2 number 1 picks. Now this. Hey a 6 the for possible rosterable cb. Yeah man thank youb colts.

[14 in Green]

9 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said:

Right.I know it was 80. I was just busting his chops a bit. 

 I just replied to your other post so I won't say the same stuff here, but I agree.  I can subscribe to the culture move on Gase's part and I think that at least had something to do with it. Show the team that he doesn't care who you are or where you were drafted. If you're not on board 100% then you're out. Sure, I can understand that. If Lee had to go, he had to go. 

But I think it also had to do with a little bit of F U as Macc walked out the door. IMO that was Gase letting macchiato's know exactly how he felt about him. I bet Macc's office wasn't even cleaned out before Lee was gone. Gase ran the coup and that was the smack in the chops.  That's what I think, and as is standard, when emotions get involved people make stupid choices. 

I also agree that KC saw the window and ran through it. Can't blame em.  

 

What's that old saying about "Great minds"...    ?

[GREENBEAN]

3 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

What's that old saying about "Great minds"...    ?

Um...  

 

[Jet Nut]

41 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing Lee is a great player, but he is a NFL caliber starting LB.

My original point here was about Douglas wasting the pick we got for him on a player we could've gotten on waivers. If we somehow missed on Hairston, I'm sure we could've gotten someone comparable and kept the pick. The fact that Douglas wasted any sort of capital on this move doesn't impress me. That was my point.

Somewhere along the way in my discussion with 80, we got to where I said it equated to Gase and Douglas combining to basically trade Lee for Hairston (a waiver wire type player). You and 80 might feel the way you do about Lee's situation here, I don't feel he was as bad as both of you do. I didn't like when we traded him. I thought KC took advantage of Gase. We only got a 6th because Gase accepted it, and I don't like that Douglas gave it away. 

This is my opinion, and I think it's reasonable, I see your side also though. I don't think either of us are changing our minds, and what does it matter anyway? What's done is done. That's why I told 80 earlier it is what it is, I hope the guy gets on the field and contributes something.

Unfortunately apparently there werent many who think he is.  

I get he used a pick, just dont get the wasted part of the equation.  He used a pick to get someone he thought could add depth to the secondary.  I know someone will come in with Brady or so and so was drafted with a 6 but lets face it, 6th round picks youre usually hoping can add depth or add to specials.  So getting depth, if thats what he thinks he got, today, is better than waiting a year.  Especially with how little he has on this team today.  

I dont think you position is way off or that theres no merit, I just think we're over rating Lee given the amount of interest hes gotten.  ANd as I joked earlier, Lee was a player most wanted cut.  So not much difference between the two players other than Lee cost us a 1st.  Sucks but what can you do, no one is upping their rating of Lee because we used a 1st on him.  

Hey, we've moved on from Lee, hopefully he ultimately got us a player who contributes.

[Doggin94it]

7 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing Lee is a great player, but he is a NFL caliber starting LB.

My original point here was about Douglas wasting the pick we got for him on a player we could've gotten on waivers. If we somehow missed on Hairston, I'm sure we could've gotten someone comparable and kept the pick. The fact that Douglas wasted any sort of capital on this move doesn't impress me. That was my point.

Somewhere along the way in my discussion with 80, we got to where I said it equated to Gase and Douglas combining to basically trade Lee for Hairston (a waiver wire type player). You and 80 might feel the way you do about Lee's situation here, I don't feel he was as bad as both of you do. I didn't like when we traded him. I thought KC took advantage of Gase. We only got a 6th because Gase accepted it, and I don't like that Douglas gave it away. 

This is my opinion, and I think it's reasonable, I see your side also though. I don't think either of us are changing our minds, and what does it matter anyway? What's done is done. That's why I told 80 earlier it is what it is, I hope the guy gets on the field and contributes something.

This is a legitimately terrible and self-contradictory take. It doesn't matter how we got the pick Douglas traded, because Douglas didn't make that move. By the time Douglas got here, Lee had been traded and the return on it is the equivalent of a sunk cost. If you are holding that pick in the hopes of getting equivalent value to Lee out of it, then you are saying that the return for Lee was actually fair, because it is reasonable to expect equivalent value to him from that pick. 

In other words, you can think that the Chiefs fleeced the Jets in the Lee deal (i agree) - but if so you cannot argue that getting a cornerback with actual NFL starting experience for a 6th round pick is a bad deal because you wouldn't have traded Lee for him straight up.  Or you can criticize this deal as not enough value for that sixth round pick, but if so it makes it much harder to argue that the Chiefs fleeced the Jets when they gave them that same pick for Lee. 

It would be different if the same person pulled the trigger on both deals. Because then you could point to the inconsistent valuations of that particular pick held by the GM who first accepted it as a return for Lee and then dealt it for this quarterback. But since it isn't the same person valuing the pick on both sides of the equation, your point is ridiculous

[freestater]

9 hours ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

Thank you joewilly, you're an honorable man and I appreciate you

Do you have a problem with gay people? It sure seems like you do. 

[JustInFudge]

15 hours ago, JiF said:

Thank you joewilly, you're an honorable man and I appreciate you

 

9 hours ago, BROOKLYN JET said:

Thank you joewilly, you're an honorable man and I appreciate you

[Apache 51]

Any Bird leftovers, Joe?

[freestater]

8 hours ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

At some point we need to send some candy or something to them with a thank you card. They keep helping us, some would say screwed us on Sam but it didn't cost 2 number 1 picks. Now this. Hey a 6 the for possible rosterable cb. Yeah man thank youb colts.

P.S.  if you and Quentin Nelson ever have a problem, go ahead and give us a ringy dingy

[JetsFanatic]

I think it was a good trade by Douglas.  Hairston  was originally a fifth round pick in 2017 and was a starter, though he was limited by injuries,  for a very low 6th rounder. We still have our own 6th rounder in 2020. 

We needed depth at CB and he was certainly worth what was traded.

[The Voice of Reason]

14 hours ago, JiF said:

You said something along the lines of "see him first hand"...I mean, anyone can.  His tape is out there, you and I could find it if we really wanted to.  My assumption is a 5th round pick who's played significant time probably checks the boxes you would want to check.  Did Rex have some insight? Sure.  But I'm quite confident they traded for the guy because they saw something on film they liked and realize he's a dude that will put in the work to get better.  Forgive me for feeling like that was implied.  Not too many 5th round slackers make it in the NFL. 

 

WTF... Now you are hedging that Rex Hogan had some insight... Yet if you look at the players that the Jets have picked up or traded for they have been from the 3 organizations that the FO just came from... you don't think there is a correlation? Jesus... 

[JustInFudge]

23 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

WTF... Now you are hedging that Rex Hogan had some insight... Yet if you look at the players that the Jets have picked up or traded for they have been from the 3 organizations that the FO just came from... you don't think there is a correlation? Jesus... 

You're sexy when you're feisty.  It turns me on.  Not so sure why you're so worked up but keep it up!  So hawt. 

That said, Im not exactly sure what you're yelling at.  Nobody argued that having some inside knowledge of player isnt an advantage.  I commented on your stupid comment of "seeing him first hand" because it was a stupid comment.  We've all seen him first hand.

As for the rest of the stupidity you're spewing;

Joe Douglas was not with the Ravens when they drafted Alex Lewis.

Rex Hogan was not with the Colts when they drafted Nate Hairston

No one that I'm aware of on this team had any affiliation with the Panthers when they signed Khalil.

Who was affiliated with the Texans that gave us inside info that we couldnt see on the tape for Ryan Griffin?

Did someone have inside info on Tyler Bertolet?

Who else am I missing honey?  

 

 

[#27TheDominator]

13 minutes ago, JiF said:

Did someone have inside info on Tyler Bertolet?

Brant Boyer.

[JetsFanatic]

27 minutes ago, JiF said:

You're sexy when you're feisty.  It turns me on.  Not so sure why you're so worked up but keep it up!  So hawt. 

That said, Im not exactly sure what you're yelling at.  Nobody argued that having some inside knowledge of player isnt an advantage.  I commented on your stupid comment of "seeing him first hand" because it was a stupid comment.  We've all seen him first hand.

As for the rest of the stupidity you're spewing;

Joe Douglas was not with the Ravens when they drafted Alex Lewis.

Rex Hogan was not with the Colts when they drafted Nate Hairston

No one that I'm aware of on this team had any affiliation with the Panthers when they signed Khalil.

Who was affiliated with the Texans that gave us inside info that we couldnt see on the tape for Ryan Griffin?

Did someone have inside info on Tyler Bertolet?

Who else am I missing honey?  

 

 

Just sayin'

[JustInFudge]

14 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

Just sayin'

I said "drafted"...it would have made sense if you were following the thread.

[JetsFanatic]

21 minutes ago, JiF said:

I said "drafted"...it would have made sense if you were following the thread.

He was. He joined the Colts in the 2017 off season, that is when Hairston was drafted.

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

He was. He joined the Colts in the 2017 off season, that is when Hairston was drafted.

He joined the Colts in May of 2017.  It's like saying he was part of this draft class for the Jets. 

[DMan77]

I mean... Maybe they know something we don't about Hairston. Maybe they also didn't want to waste their #3 wavier claim on him because they have someone else in mind.

I don't know. Doesn't seem like a move that will move the needle at all. He hasn't been a good CB...

[JetsFanatic]

Just now, JiF said:

He joined the Colts in May of 2017.  It's like saying he was part of this draft class for the Jets. 

I'm not arguing your points, but in the case of certain players I do think if a front office executive was employed by a team at the same time a player of interest was there I'm sure they would ask for that person's input. I would bet my bottom dollar that Douglas asked Hogan what he thought of Hairston.

That is my only point.

[JustInFudge]

14 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

I'm not arguing your points, but in the case of certain players I do think if a front office executive was employed by a team at the same time a player of interest was there I'm sure they would ask for that person's input. I would bet my bottom dollar that Douglas asked Hogan what he thought of Hairston.

That is my only point.

100% no argument here. 

[#27TheDominator]

8 minutes ago, DMan77 said:

I mean... Maybe they know something we don't about Hairston. Maybe they also didn't want to waste their #3 wavier claim on him because they have someone else in mind.

I don't know. Doesn't seem like a move that will move the needle at all. He hasn't been a good CB...

This is false logic.  If they have someone else they want to use the waiver claim on, why not use the 6th to trade for him?  I think they are desperate at CB and having the guy in camp an extra week and a half makes it way more likely that he will be able to contribute early in the season.  This is more important with Johnson dinged.

[The Voice of Reason]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

You're sexy when you're feisty.  It turns me on.  Not so sure why you're so worked up but keep it up!  So hawt. 

That said, Im not exactly sure what you're yelling at.  Nobody argued that having some inside knowledge of player isnt an advantage.  I commented on your stupid comment of "seeing him first hand" because it was a stupid comment.  We've all seen him first hand.

As for the rest of the stupidity you're spewing;

Joe Douglas was not with the Ravens when they drafted Alex Lewis.

Rex Hogan was not with the Colts when they drafted Nate Hairston

No one that I'm aware of on this team had any affiliation with the Panthers when they signed Khalil.

Who was affiliated with the Texans that gave us inside info that we couldnt see on the tape for Ryan Griffin?

Did someone have inside info on Tyler Bertolet?

Who else am I missing honey?  

 

 

Why do they have to be part of the team that drafts him sweety-pie.... 

The point you are making is that unless the draft them, its not 'their guy' therefore have no connection or additional knowledge about the player.

This is absolutely stupid. 

Rex Hogan has inside knowledge on every colts player whether he drafted him or not. So he knows more then most teams about Hariston and Kindred.

Alex Brown came from Phi where Douglas just was.

Chad Alexander was on the Ravens when they drafted Alex Lewis, signed Quincy Adeboyejo, and had Albert McClellan.

Stephon Anthony was at Miami with Gase

Kahlil, Griffin, and Bertolet were FAs, not players getting cut, The first 2 are also established veterans most of these other players are trying to find a needle in a haystack guys.

If you don't think there is a correlation to the Jets picking off the scraps of Ravens, Phi, Miami, and Indy while not touching other cuts from other organizations then I don't know what to tell you... 

Will they pick up players from other teams... of course... but since these FO people have JUST come over from these organizations they have more intimate knowledge of the bottom of the barrel players. Its really not that hard... Maybe that's an issue for you.

 

[JustInFudge]

3 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

Why do they have to be part of the team that drafts him sweety-pie.... 

The point you are making is that unless the draft them, its not 'their guy' therefore have no connection or additional knowledge about the player.

This is absolutely stupid. 

Rex Hogan has inside knowledge on every colts player whether he drafted him or not. So he knows more then most teams about Hariston and Kindred.

Alex Brown came from Phi where Douglas just was.

Chad Alexander was on the Ravens when they drafted Alex Lewis, signed Quincy Adeboyejo, and had Albert McClellan.

Stephon Anthony was at Miami with Gase

Kahlil, Griffin, and Bertolet were FAs, not players getting cut, The first 2 are also established veterans most of these other players are trying to find a needle in a haystack guys.

If you don't think there is a correlation to the Jets picking off the scraps of Ravens, Phi, Miami, and Indy while not touching other cuts from other organizations then I don't know what to tell you... 

Will they pick up players from other teams... of course... but since these FO people have JUST come over from these organizations they have more intimate knowledge of the bottom of the barrel players. Its really not that hard... Maybe that's an issue for you.

 

I dont know what you're yelling it, sugarcakes.

Its like we're having 2 different conversations. 

[The Voice of Reason]

18 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

This is false logic.  If they have someone else they want to use the waiver claim on, why not use the 6th to trade for him?  I think they are desperate at CB and having the guy in camp an extra week and a half makes it way more likely that he will be able to contribute early in the season.  This is more important with Johnson dinged.

I think its both, I think they have a few players that they are waiting on to get a waiver claim on and this might have been one of them. So instead of trying to get 2 guys with that waiver claim (that might get cut on the same day) they traded for one with their last pick they had available for trade (Chiefs 6th rounder, 7th is tied up in Alex Lewis if he makes the team) and will go for another player at cuts.

[The Voice of Reason]

1 minute ago, JiF said:

I dont know what you're yelling it, sugarcakes.

Its like we're having 2 different conversations. 

Let me recap:

This started when you made the claim that because Hairston wasn't drafted by Hogan, he had no inside knowledge of him, and that you can review the tape that everyone has, and that was all that JD needed to trade for him and he didn't need to ask Hogan anything about the player.

[Apache 51]

4 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

Let me recap:

This started when you made the claim that because Hairston wasn't drafted by Hogan, he had no inside knowledge of him, and that you can review the tape that everyone has, and that was all that JD needed to trade for him and he didn't need to ask Hogan anything about the player.

I hope he got an opinion.

[The Voice of Reason]

16 minutes ago, Apache 51 said:

I hope he got an opinion.

Of course he did... that notion otherwise is asinine, which is my point

[#27TheDominator]

I think the real key to Hogan having insight on Hairston comes from last year, not when he was drafted.  Hairston had a very promising rookie season.  Last year he played almost 100% of the snaps at the start of the season.  He played 50% week 7, and then he supposedly got benched for a blown coverage.  He never played more than 6 snaps on D again.  Having the inside scoop on what went down could be very helpful in determining what he might bring here. 

FWIW, Maulet was on the Colts last year and Maccagnan signed him before any of these guys came on board. 

[The Voice of Reason]

1 minute ago, #27TheDominator said:

I think the real key to Hogan having insight on Hairston comes from last year, not when he was drafted.  Hairston had a very promising rookie season.  Last year he played almost 100% of the snaps at the start of the season.  He played 50% week 7, and then he supposedly got benched for a blown coverage.  He never played more than 6 snaps on D again.  Having the inside scoop on what went down could be very helpful in determining what he might bring here. 

FWIW, Maulet was on the Colts last year and Maccagnan signed him before any of these guys came on board. 

And Maulet is as good as gone

[#27TheDominator]

I don't see how people can rate this trade today.  You have to see if the kid contributes.  If he does, it is a win.  Next year's 6th?  That is good.  If the kid busts, it was probably worth a shot.  If all these shots miss, then we have another problem.

[Jet Nut]

3 hours ago, JiF said:

 

Hes like Butters on South Park, trying so hard to be part of the cool group.

And failing

[HelenOfTroy]

This thread disappoints, I thought it was about Trader Joe’s, the grocery store.

What a waste of time.  ?