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Antonio brown helmet issue \ GM fight \ suspension \ RELEASED: MERGED

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2 hours ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Why doesn't he have eyes!! Where are his eyes!! Ahhhhh!!!

Eyes only. Davis or Gase.

Who ya got?

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1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

They are pretty good I had one, don't know what the heck they are made of though. 

The last of AB's brain cells. ;-)

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2 hours ago, Pac said:

Obviously what he did yesterday is unacceptable and will lead to the end of his time in Oakland.

The point is Mayock is culpable in that you can't wave a steak in front of a Tiger and not expect him to go Tiger.  When Mayock did his Clint Eastwood act a couple weeks ago even I knew it would end badly and I'm just some guy, (albeit extremely intelligent in football matters), in Rochester.

Mayock should know better.  Unless his objective when fining him way to find a way out of the whole situation in which case it was very crafty.

:huh:  Are you serious with this ?

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17 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Its obvious that you just have no idea 

Macyok let AB come in and act the clown.

Supported AB when he did his foot thing.  A lot thought it was to get out of camp

Supported him when he ignored the league when it told him his helmet was banned and turned a simple thing into a shlt show

Supported him through the appeal. 

Of course AB took that opportunity and Mayock correctly said he needs to get into camp.

AB didnt show up for the walk through in a preseason game, Mayock said nothing

AB gets fined for missing camp and walk through, threatens Mayock

And hes the one who is wrong, is Clint like?

LOL

You are being naive.  Mayock, (actually Gruden), gave up draft capital and way too much money KNOWING that AB is likely certifiably crazy.  With that being the case, what do you think is going to happen when you use the media to try and embarrass him? 

MM did not need to use the media for his 30 second ultimatum.  It was poor form.  Do the same thing behind the scenes and you aren't where you are now.

Not sure why you're confused about my opinion.  I've called AB crazy, a punk, and that he was clearly wrong.  I'm also saying that Mayock and Gruden have been playing a sloppy game of good cop/bad cop and Mayocks pseudo tough guy act was community theater level bad.  He tried to be Clint Eastwood and came of like Clint Howard.

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I am really curious as to what Mayock said to cause AB to threaten him.

Mayock does seem like a dickhead that doesn't know how to talk to people, so I wouldn't put it past him to say some really disrespectful stuff.

Not defending Brown, but if Mayock crossed the line then I don't feel sorry for him either 🤷🏽‍♂️

I wouldn't expect you guys to understand, considering this is the internet. You know, where people gonads to say things that they would never say in person.

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4 minutes ago, King P said:

I am really curious as to what Mayock said to cause AB to threaten him.

Mayock does seem like a dickhead that doesn't know how to talk to people, so I wouldn't put it past him to say some really disrespectful stuff.

Not defending Brown, but if Mayock crossed the line then I don't feel sorry for him either 🤷🏽‍♂️

I wouldn't expect you guys to understand, considering this is the internet. You know, where people gonads to say things that they would never say in person.

I agree 100% with what you said about people saying things on the internet they'd never say to someone in person. Unless I'm wrong and all of them are that good with their hands, lol.

That said, in an employer/employee relationship it's very rare that the employer is going to seek out a confrontation with one of his most valued employees unless that person has pushed the envelope to a point of no return. When confronted, the employee has a choice. Accept the discipline and move on, or leave the job. In the real world, you threaten your boss, and need to be held back from assaulting him, forget keeping your job. You could go to jail. 

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6 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

I agree 100% with what you said about people saying things on the internet they'd never say to someone in person. Unless I'm wrong and all of them are that good with their hands, lol.

That said, in an employer/employee relationship it's very rare that the employer is going to seek out a confrontation with one of his most valued employees unless that person has pushed the envelope to a point of no return. When confronted, the employee has a choice. Accept the discipline and move on, or leave the job. In the real world, you threaten your boss, and need to be held back from assaulting him, forget keeping your job. You could go to jail. 

I completely disagree. It's actually quite common these days IMO.

I've run into countless people in positions of power that just do not have people skills. They do not know how to talk to people, and they take things to a different level. And think that because they're in a position of power, they can talk to you however they want.

With me, I've always felt like this: if you're going to reprimand me, that's fine. Discipline me however you see fit. But I will not allow you to disrespect me and talk to me however you want, knowing damn well they'd never talk to me like that outside the workplace. Personally if any supervisor at my workplace tried that, I'll go straight upstairs to HR.

Brown is absolutely wrong, but the court of public opinion completely okays Mayock being disrespectful. Like he's not in a position of power and shouldn't be held to higher standards 🙄

That's why I brought up about this being the internet. Posters are ok with what Mayock did, because their wimps who wish they could talk to people however they want but hide behind some form of protection. Any real man would not be ok with any type of disrespect coming their way even if it's from a position of power.

 

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32 minutes ago, Pac said:

You are being naive.  Mayock, (actually Gruden), gave up draft capital and way too much money KNOWING that AB is likely certifiably crazy.  With that being the case, what do you think is going to happen when you use the media to try and embarrass him? 

MM did not need to use the media for his 30 second ultimatum.  It was poor form.  Do the same thing behind the scenes and you aren't where you are now.

Not sure why you're confused about my opinion.  I've called AB crazy, a punk, and that he was clearly wrong.  I'm also saying that Mayock and Gruden have been playing a sloppy game of good cop/bad cop and Mayocks pseudo tough guy act was community theater level bad.  He tried to be Clint Eastwood and came of like Clint Howard.

Lol, I'm being naive?  

AB has acted like this when exactly?  I'm naive?  

MM wouldn't have to speak to the media if AB didn't post every brain fart he had in IG and Twitter. And he embarrass anyone.  He, after AB threatened to not play in gsmesmover a stupid helmet.  Not once but a second time after losing his stupid appeal.  Mayocks response, it's time to move on and play.  The idiot who showed up in a hot air balloon, burnt his own feet and reffers to him as Mr Chest was embarrassed?  LOL, I'm NAIVE?  

I, confused about youre opinion.  I think you're half wrong.  I agree about everything you said about AB.  I think you're dead wrong in thinking Mayocksmresponse & Gruden being sloppy or Clint like.  

As was said all night on the pregame shows, Raider people handled this perfect, AB   Crossed the line.  

 

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38 minutes ago, King P said:

I completely disagree. It's actually quite common these days IMO.

I've run into countless people in positions of power that just do not have people skills. They do not know how to talk to people, and they take things to a different level. And think that because they're in a position of power, they can talk to you however they want.

With me, I've always felt like this: if you're going to reprimand me, that's fine. Discipline me however you see fit. But I will not allow you to disrespect me and talk to me however you want, knowing damn well they'd never talk to me like that outside the workplace. Personally if any supervisor at my workplace tried that, I'll go straight upstairs to HR.

Brown is absolutely wrong, but the court of public opinion completely okays Mayock being disrespectful. Like he's not in a position of power and shouldn't be held to higher standards 🙄

That's why I brought up about this being the internet. Posters are ok with what Mayock did, because their wimps who wish they could talk to people however they want but hide behind some form of protection. Any real man would not be ok with any type of disrespect coming their way even if it's from a position of power.

 

You make good points here, but you just said yourself, you'd go to HR, you wouldn't try to put your hands on him.

 I think Brown kept pushing the envelope here, I don't think he's been confronted about his behavior since before college. I think in his world, any rebuke is someone "disrespecting" him, and he got violent. That isn't a normal or acceptable reaction, even if you're a star NFL receiver.

I guess we have to agree to disagree here. I think Brown created this situation, and it is where it is because of his actions. I think he thought he could bulldoze the Raiders, but Mayock finally stood up to him. Standing up to someone isn't necessarily being disrespectful. Brown, whether right or wrong felt dissed, and stood up to him in return. If there's one person in this story who comes off like a "wimp" to me, it's Gruden. I'm not buying Mayock as the villain here, sorry.

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I guess I must have missed something.  Does anyone have a quote of what Mayock supposedly said that set Brown off?  From the interviews I've seen on nfl.com, AB was screaming at Mayock at practice about the fines and Mayock was *not* shouting back as much.  He may have said something that made it worse, but I haven't seen a quote on that.  It's just as possible that AB was completely off his rocker over the fines and there was nothing Mayock could have said or not said that was going to result in a different outcome. 

Right now there is a lot of assumption out there that Mayock failed to properly placate a hystrionic diva (as if that's even a thing).  I'm not sure that's a fair narrative yet.

What I've seen on it so far:  http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-now/0ap3000001051116/Rapoport-What-happened-in-A-B-s-screaming-match-with-Mayock

 

 

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35 minutes ago, nycdan said:

I guess I must have missed something.  Does anyone have a quote of what Mayock supposedly said that set Brown off?  From the interviews I've seen on nfl.com, AB was screaming at Mayock at practice about the fines and Mayock was *not* shouting back as much.  He may have said something that made it worse, but I haven't seen a quote on that.  It's just as possible that AB was completely off his rocker over the fines and there was nothing Mayock could have said or not said that was going to result in a different outcome. 

Right now there is a lot of assumption out there that Mayock failed to properly placate a hystrionic diva (as if that's even a thing).  I'm not sure that's a fair narrative yet.

What I've seen on it so far:  http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-now/0ap3000001051116/Rapoport-What-happened-in-A-B-s-screaming-match-with-Mayock

 

 

Brown seems to live in a world where he’s surrounded by people who never question his behavior, and because of that we’ve read some stories about him that make him hard to defend.

The incident that led to him being suspended from the Steelers final game last season.

Throwing furniture off the balcony of a high rise building.

Not paying a personal chef $45,000 he supposedly owed him.

Not showing up to mandatory practices with the Raiders.

All this and more inside of a year, no less!

I’m someone who takes the player’s side almost every time, but with Brown, I won’t. He’s one of  two things. Either he’s Incredibly spoiled and self centered, or suffering from some mental problem, be it depression or mood swings.

The fact that people are trying to shift blame to Mayock for “not knowing how to deal with someone like him” or “disrespecting him by confronting him in front of others” makes me shake my head.

 

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Brown is an entitled prick. I think that's the HR term for it.

What a fail of a hire. Should be a leader on the field, in the stats and in the locker room. Seen some football player marriages go south but this is the best and fastest in a while.

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Antonio Brown may very well be seriously mentally ill and in need of help. That may not be easy to come by when you're a stubborn, one man corporation.

This is weirdly both incredibly unreal and surprising and also not at all surprising.

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I’ve got my popcorn ready for this. What a sh*t show. Personally I can help enjoying some Schadenfreude, at the Raiders expense.

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11 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

 

FB_IMG_1567729350113.jpg

Bingo. And let's not forget that following this incident, Brown also witnessed his former teammate Ryan Shazier suffer a brutal injury that left him crippled. The guy doesn't want to play anymore, but his ego just won't allow him to walk away. The only thing that keeps Brown going is the idea that he's the most important guy in the room. That's why he had such an issue with Roesthlisberger. That's why he lashed out at Juju after he was voted team MVP.

"I don't even have to play football", etc.

He doesn't possess the humility to just walk away from the game so instead he's going to try and sabotage his career. His end game is to become so toxic that no one will want to hire him.

Expect for the Pats*, of course.

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Another spoiled Pittsburgh athlete from a bygone era who went to the Bay Area

NOT SAFE FOR WORK!!! Massive amounts of cursing!!!

 

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8 hours ago, Obrien2Toon said:

Saw today that the letter thing is a league mandated thing

I originally thought it was a bad way to do it, but not the case

they most likely told him and/or his agent directly, and then the letter is given 

Oh I remember from deflate gate the certified letter issue. Yes unions have that covered. 

My point was more that he seemed caught off guard or surprised by it 

he is nuts and trying to get released so it probably doesn’t matter what mayock did really but he looks very bad here as well 

all joking aside he seems to have some personality issues like Brandon marshal used to talk about 

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7 hours ago, King P said:

I completely disagree. It's actually quite common these days IMO.

I've run into countless people in positions of power that just do not have people skills. They do not know how to talk to people, and they take things to a different level. And think that because they're in a position of power, they can talk to you however they want.

With me, I've always felt like this: if you're going to reprimand me, that's fine. Discipline me however you see fit. But I will not allow you to disrespect me and talk to me however you want, knowing damn well they'd never talk to me like that outside the workplace. Personally if any supervisor at my workplace tried that, I'll go straight upstairs to HR.

Brown is absolutely wrong, but the court of public opinion completely okays Mayock being disrespectful. Like he's not in a position of power and shouldn't be held to higher standards 🙄

That's why I brought up about this being the internet. Posters are ok with what Mayock did, because their wimps who wish they could talk to people however they want but hide behind some form of protection. Any real man would not be ok with any type of disrespect coming their way even if it's from a position of power.

 

A lot of what you say here is true, and I witness this kind of stuff all the time at work,  where you add in the authority of rank, and guys thinking they're still a Chief or supervisor at the bar or other out of work activity, but the NFL is not the FD....or Dunder-Mifflin or whatever corporate entity you want to cite. The NFL is Public, it relies on media and and networks etc as partners, and if asked, and Mayock says something like "Its time to be here, get all in" or whatever, Brown needs to realize that. Also, HE has been the one causing the problems from day one. In this case, Mayock basically IS HR, he sent a private communication to Brown, who chose to make it public, and then chose to cause a workplace incident. 

 

Mayock is guilty of not babying a problem employee, nothing more. 

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9 hours ago, Matt39 said:

AB not playing Monday moved the line zero points. The Raiders have all the leverage here. Hell, the league has the leverage.

Thats the other side of this

The Raiders are winning nothing with AB.  They can win nothing without him too.  And save all that money and brain cells wasted on having to hold his hand and rub his back while telling him great he is

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7 hours ago, King P said:

I am really curious as to what Mayock said to cause AB to threaten him.

Mayock does seem like a dickhead that doesn't know how to talk to people, so I wouldn't put it past him to say some really disrespectful stuff.

Not defending Brown, but if Mayock crossed the line then I don't feel sorry for him either 🤷🏽‍♂️

I wouldn't expect you guys to understand, considering this is the internet. You know, where people gonads to say things that they would never say in person.

The Internet “Where people let their gonads do the talking!”

 

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8 hours ago, King P said:

Mayock does seem like a dickhead that doesn't know how to talk to people, so I wouldn't put it past him to say some really disrespectful stuff.

Not defending Brown, but if Mayock crossed the line then I don't feel sorry for him either 🤷🏽‍♂️

Have an example that would lead anyone to show Mayocks a dickhead or that he doesnt know how to talk to people?  What, while listening to him talking about how hes behind and supporting AB through all the bs he put the Raiders through all preseason would lead you to this conclusion?  Examples?  

And what line did Mayock cross?  When, I dont know, he said it was time to put things behind him and get to camp?  You know, like the rest of ABs teammates?

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12 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

 

FB_IMG_1567729350113.jpg

 

Except CTE probably isn't caused by one big hit.  It's a series of sub-concussive, seemingly minor hits over time that really does the damage.  Hence why the original posterboy for CTE was Mike Webster, who never received a major hit but received contact to the helmet all game every game.  

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13 hours ago, SAR I said:

So you are a pee man?

SAR I

Re-read it.  Don't go near it unless I am the one being tested.  I just read the reports and write the ****ers up.   For that and a ton of other stuff. 

If anybody thinks they are going to get out of the bonus so easy, I think you are nuts.  Being crazy and saying crazy sh*t does not cost you $30M.  Maybe if it were properly worded, but I doubt the Raiders were that shrewd.  Especially for the team that signed Incognito and Vontaze Burfict.  He missed a  practice and a walk through?  Big ******* deal.  Fine him sure, but that is nothing even compared to what Polite did and people are still whining that we cut that guy.

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1 hour ago, Sarge4Tide said:

Another spoiled Pittsburgh athlete from a bygone era who went to the Bay Area

NOT SAFE FOR WORK!!! Massive amounts of cursing!!!

 

You can’t talk to players like that anymore. They’re feeling will get hurt. 

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8 hours ago, King P said:

I am really curious as to what Mayock said to cause AB to threaten him.

Mayock does seem like a dickhead that doesn't know how to talk to people, so I wouldn't put it past him to say some really disrespectful stuff.

Not defending Brown, but if Mayock crossed the line then I don't feel sorry for him either 🤷🏽‍♂️

I wouldn't expect you guys to understand, considering this is the internet. You know, where people gonads to say things that they would never say in person.

And you reached this conclusion exactly how ?

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35 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Have an example that would lead anyone to show Mayocks a dickhead or that he doesnt know how to talk to people?  What, while listening to him talking about how hes behind and supporting AB through all the bs he put the Raiders through all preseason would lead you to this conclusion?  Examples?  

And what line did Mayock cross?  When, I dont know, he said it was time to put things behind him and get to camp?  You know, like the rest of ABs teammates?

Modern thinking the guy in charge is always wrong. 

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3 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

You can’t talk to players like that anymore. They’re feeling will get hurt. 

They'll be "offended" .

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10 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Re-read it.  Don't go near it unless I am the one being tested.  I just read the reports and write the ****ers up.   For that and a ton of other stuff. 

If anybody thinks they are going to get out of the bonus so easy, I think you are nuts.  Being crazy and saying crazy sh*t does not cost you $30M.  Maybe if it were properly worded, but I doubt the Raiders were that shrewd.  Especially for the team that signed Incognito and Vontaze Burfict.  He missed a  practice and a walk through?  Big ******* deal.  Fine him sure, but that is nothing even compared to what Polite did and people are still whining that we cut that guy.

Isn't those other situations a matter of teams [those that choose to let things go, even if it's the predominance of cases] not exercising their rights? Just because they don't exercise their rights in the contract doesn't therefore mean no one else has the right to exercise them in the future. Or I don't know, maybe it does, if that same team - or arguably the same league - has allowed/overlooked bad behavior with such frequency that the player has a legitimate case that he shouldn't have felt his own behavior seriously risked his roster spot (and in turn, all that money). As you bring up, AB's exhibits A and B are Incognito and Burfict that they're willing to sign on for players with outside-the-norm levels of antisocial (or technically, even criminal) behavior. 

However seriously we may or may not take it - writing something off as temporary, testosterone-induced, on-field version of beer muscles - he did threaten the team's GM with bodily harm. It's also true that as soon as someone jawing hard feels one or more others stepping in to restrain him, that ups the Hold me back, Charlie theatrics because he knows no one's going to let him loose. In other words, Mayock wasn't seriously at risk of bodily harm from Brown. 

Even still, I don't know that all this means the contract terms (posted earlier) that Brown signed don't actually apply. It doesn't say any of these things have to be caused by even more overt examples than he's displayed. It just says that he has to display them at all. Also the difference between this example and other NFLers before him is that they didn't all have a huge bonus due if they make the roster -- more often they are already on the roster, and if they weren't cut/suspended it's because the team wanted to keep the player, which makes the situation different from this one. 

I get your idea. Did he violate the contract? Yes, but you (and Brown's representation) would suggest he didn't violate it commensurate with what is in effect a $30MM fine. Still, I'm finding the main reasons I'm sympathetic to Brown are two-fold: f*** Mike Mayock and his smug, punchable face, and f*** the Raiders. :) 

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10 hours ago, Obrien2Toon said:

Saw today that the letter thing is a league mandated thing

I originally thought it was a bad way to do it, but not the case

they most likely told him and/or his agent directly, and then the letter is given 

If they saw that they were ultimately going to have to suspend him they had to document everything and put every stage in writing.   My suspicion is that it wasn't that long after they got him in the building that they realized it was quite possible that it wouldn't work out and that they best protect themselves against having to pay him to do no nothing.

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