"Pitiful offensive line"

[Barry McCockinner]

9 minutes ago, De-Jet-Erate/Duane said:

My hope is they use the time off to get Harrison and Edoga reps and  try them against the Eagles. They looked decent in preseason and can't be worse than what's being played now. Maybe even provide a little spark.

I'd like to see them get reps but I don't think they help the problems we're seeing. Just my opinion.

[Jetster]

Because we'll have some free agent dollars & used a 3 Edoga, we need to find out if Edoga can play. 

Perfect scenario is a mix of young & old. You go hard after Thuney & Scherff in free agency, and hope you can land Thomas & a young center to groom in the draft like the kid from Wisconsin. Love his name, looks like it could be pronounced Badazz. 

Thomas- Thuney- Harrison- Scherff- Edoga with a youngster pushing Harrison & swap them out when he's ready. You do this & your pointing at 2021 as the year to challenge in the AFC East. 

[SAR I]

14 hours ago, phill1c said:

It's Kalil and Winters. Neither is physical or very bright.

It's Darnold.

When DC's don't respect your QB they pressure more aggressively and clog the running lanes up the gut.

When Sam returns and starts completing passes (wait for it) longer than 2 yards the OL will remarkably look improved.

SAR I

[rangerous]

On 9/27/2019 at 6:42 PM, Losmeister said:

the above plus time w/ top Dallas OLs says different...

Same OL Coach 3 teams, 2 OLS that are good....  and one sucks balls......  the ONE variable is the NYJ personnel.

the one real variable is kalil.  and maybe osemele.  kalil is almost worse than a rookie since his head was in the retirement camp and he's trying to catch up physically and mentally.  osemele may be an issue because he came for the money.  they signed him because he was supposed to be a good fit for the scheme too.  i really hope they take a good hard look at the guys not playing and see if they can do better.

[rangerous]

1 hour ago, SAR I said:

It's Darnold.

When DC's don't respect your QB they pressure more aggressively and clog the running lanes up the gut.

When Sam returns and starts completing passes (wait for it) longer than 2 yards the OL will remarkably look improved.

SAR I

darnold is an issue but these guys have been letting guys through untouched.  darnold would not have a chance to throw with that kind of pass protection.

[SAR I]

2 hours ago, rangerous said:

darnold is an issue but these guys have been letting guys through untouched.  darnold would not have a chance to throw with that kind of pass protection.

The OL has been bad, no doubt.  But 14 days to study/practice/bond should help them get their communication right, and having a legit NFL quarterback should reduce the overloading, so I'm optimistic that they'll play in a more professional manner in Philly.

SAR I

[phill1c]

10 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

And people are wondering why the O line has issues?   

People were wondering?!

[MaxAF]

11 hours ago, Lith said:

Only good thing about this OL is that Douglas will be forced to make changes next season.  Beachum, Kalil and Shell are UFA.  Winters and KO can both be cut with no cap implications and would save $18MM cap space.  Hopefully we will find out if Harrison and Edoga are part of the answere for next season, becuase if they are, we should be able to find three other starters.  One with a likely top 10 pick in the draft, and we can use that $18MM cap space to find two others.

As for Gase, I can't absolve him of responsibility because the OL is bad.  The OL is part of the team he coaches.  The OL coach is his hire.  The 5 guys who are playing now were all decent, not great, but decent starters last year.  Either they all turned to suck overnight, or something else is going on which Gase/Pollack need to figure out by next Sunday. 

And if there are guys who did turn into suck overnight, then Gase/Pollack have to see this and replace them.  We have 3 experienced back-ups and a promising rookie to choose from on the bench.  Lewis, Compton, Harrison &/or Edoga need to get a shot.

My thoughts are if they were better than the starters.... they would be starting. ?

[Philc1]

10 hours ago, SAR I said:

It's Darnold.

When DC's don't respect your QB they pressure more aggressively and clog the running lanes up the gut.

When Sam returns and starts completing passes (wait for it) longer than 2 yards the OL will remarkably look improved.

SAR I

Huh?

 

Everyone gets blitzed all the time you don’t think Brady and Manning ever saw blitzes? 

 

[Philc1]

12 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

1. JETS

How can Jets’ Joe Douglas fix abysmal offensive line? Early look at 2020 draft, free-agent options

Today 5:56 AM 

 

 

 

 

By Matt Stypulkoski | NJ Advance Media for NJ.com

Joe Douglas made it very clear from his very first day as the Jets’ general manager: The offensive line is a priority.

So far this season, that unit has been a total debacle for a variety of reasons. But Douglas will have a chance to completely overhaul that unit this offseason – really, his first in charge of the roster – if he’s aggressive.

Why? Right tackle Brandon Shell and left tackle Kelvin Beachum are both in the final year of their deals. Center Ryan Kalil is playing on a one-year contract. Left guard Kelechi Osemele and right guard Brian Winters can both be cut with no dead cap hit this offseason.

In other words, all five guys can easily be replaced if this poor performance continues.

But, how could Douglas go about filling those five holes when the time comes this spring?

We figured Jets fans could use some optimistic daydreaming, given the team’s horrific 0-3 start. So, here is a best-case scenario for how the offensive line could look this time next year, if Douglas nails all his free-agent signings and draft picks:

Left tackle: Andrew Thomas, NFL Draft (Georgia)

Thomas is probably the best offensive line talent available in the draft – which means he’s going to go early in the first round. Jets fans obviously hope the team isn’t picking that high, but right now, at least, they’re on pace to. The Jets haven’t taken an offensive linemen in the first round since 2006. That trend needs to end in 2020. One way or another, Douglas must pick an offensive lineman early on. Filling the left tackle spot, arguably the most important on the line, with fresh, young legs would be a wise move.

Left guard: Joe Thuney, free agent (Patriots)

What better way to strengthen the offensive line than by simultaneously hurting the Patriots’ unit? The guard market isn’t looking all that great this spring, but Thuney is the youngest of the good ones at age 26. The Jets need to get younger on the line, so he fits that bill. Plus, he’s a stellar run-blocker, which should help maximize running back Le’Veon Bell.

Center: Tyler Biadasz, NFL Draft (Wisconsin)

Perhaps Douglas would feel more comfortable grabbing a free agent at this spot, too, in order to anchor the line with some experience. But we believe the GM should chase youth and upside, in order to best build long term, at the pivot. Biadasz could go in the first round, which may make him unavailable to the Jets. But if they can trade back into the round or if Biadasz slips into the second, then the Jets would suddenly have two reliable pieces on relatively cheap contracts for the next four or five years, in combination with Thomas. That would be huge.

Right guard: Brandon Scherff, free agent (Redskins)

Schreff recently received a contract-extension offer from the Redskins, but there is some belief that he’d prefer to stand pat and hit free agency at the end of this season instead. He’s likely to command top dollar, as guards go, because of his massive impact in the run game. But Schreff’s big cap hit would more or less get balanced out by having two rookies on the line, both of whom would come with very manageable cap numbers. He’s worth the investment, too, because he’s still in his prime at age 27.

 

---

Right tackle: George Fant, free agent (Seahawks)

Again, we’re thinking young(ish) here; Fant will be 28 next season. The fun part about Fant is that he’s versatile; the Seahawks occasionally use him as a sixth lineman/tight end, when they need additional help up front. In other words, he’s good enough that the coaches scheme up extra ways to make use of his talent.

 

I wanted Scherff 4 years ago but hey 

[jgb]

8 hours ago, Philc1 said:

I wanted Scherff 4 years ago but hey 

Me too, but I was scolded for suggesting we should draft a guard that high.  2 pro bowls later... of course Skins took him before we were on clock so moot.

[Beer Mule]

19 hours ago, SAR I said:

It's Darnold.

When DC's don't respect your QB they pressure more aggressively and clog the running lanes up the gut.

When Sam returns and starts completing passes (wait for it) longer than 2 yards the OL will remarkably look improved.

SAR I

Let’s put this in terms you can understand- the line is a Datsun. Darnold wants a BMW

[rldev]

10 minutes ago, Beer Mule said:

Let’s put this in terms you can understand- the line is a Datsun. Darnold wants a BMW

A line should be reliable. You most certainly don't want it to be a BMW:)

[Beer Mule]

32 minutes ago, rldev said:

A line should be reliable. You most certainly don't want it to be a BMW:)

Right on. I want my line built Ford Tough

[Beer Mule]

Tannenbaum gave Mark ******* Sanchez the keys to a Ferrari. Give Darnold a chance at least FFS

[SAR I]

3 hours ago, Beer Mule said:

Let’s put this in terms you can understand- the line is a Datsun. Darnold wants a BMW

Let's put this in terms you can understand-  Luke Falk is a bicycle.

SAR I

[DMan77]

23 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

Last 5 drafts:

2015 5th round Jarvis Harrison G

2016 traded a future 4th round pick in 2017 for a 2016 5th round pick to draft Brandon Shell

2019 3rd round Chuma Edoga. 

In 5 YEARS Maccagnan drafted 3 O-linemen, 2 of them in the 5th round.   And people are wondering why the O line has issues?   

I think most of us are past wondering why it has issues... We've seen that for a couple years now.

At this point I think we're all trying to figure out what can be done to fix or improve it. Both right now and in the future...

For the future it -seems- like Joe D. sees the OL as a high priority. His comments and his roster moves so far seem to at least point to that, so that leaves me a little optimistic...

For the present, we just have to hope these guys get better at working together. The talent level isn't super high. So the ceiling isn't either...

but a good percentage of their struggles have been misplays, missed blocks, miscommunications... In theory those can be worked out at least a LITTLE bit. But who knows? 

 

[Losmeister]

you dont understabnd... Luke Falk isnt a 3rd string QB, he's actually a credible backup in this league. Its Gases fault the OL is dysfunctional, not the OL coach who is actually good when he has players....

mccarthy coulda fixed it all obviously...   its so simple...   like alchemy

[Losmeister]

and someone up there had the stones to say that all our OL pllayers are DECENT??

[joewilly12]

Are Jets giving up on Ryan Kalil experiment?

Updated 7:25 AM; Today 5:11 AM 

Andrew Mills | NJ Advance Media for NJ.com

New York Jets center Ryan Kalil came out of retirement to sign with the Jets on August 1, but has struggled mightily through three games.

 

 

 

 

By Matt Stypulkoski | NJ Advance Media for NJ.com

It’s no secret: The Jets’ offensive line is bad. Really, really bad.

Head coach Adam Gase knows it. Offensive line coach Frank Pollackknows it.

So, all options are on the table as they attempt to fix the issue in practice this week, fresh off some self-scouting during the bye and ahead of Sunday’s trip to face the Eagles.

“We just have to keep looking and figure out: What are the best five guys for us?” Gase said.

In other words: Lineup changes may be in the works.

After Gase hinted at a potential shakeup, he was asked about it directly – and doubled down.

“We’re going to work through that this week and kind of figure out what’s best for us to do for Sunday,” Gase said. "I would just say this: All of those guys that we’re coming in this week, we’re competing and we’re going to put the five guys we think give us the best chance out there. I’m not really sure who that’s going to be quite yet.”

So, obviously, Gase didn’t come right out and say which players are on the chopping block and which backups could be in line for a promotion.

But, if Gase and Pollack are weighing their starting options, they’ll surely have to start those evaluations by examining the center spot.

Ryan Kalil has played in three games since coming out of retirement and all three have turned into a debacle. In fact, he has the lowest performance grade of any Jets offensive starter, according to ProFootballFocus.com’s metrics.

Believe it or not, Kalil’s performances look even worse when stacked up against the rest of the league. There are 153 offensive linemen who have played at least half of their team’s snaps so far this season. Kalil is ranked 145th among that group, per PFF. And if you limit the pool to the NFL’s 32 starting centers, Kalil checks in 30th.

Clearly, his transition from the couch has not gone according to general manager Joe Douglas’ plan.

On the bright side, center is also the one spot on the offensive line where the Jets have some semblance of depth. Backup Jonotthan Harrison played seven games last season and put together a passable, if unspectacular, performance during that stretch. He was decent again in Week 2, when he checked in for Kalil during the fourth quarter; Harrison ranks 17th among the 37 centers to see playing time this season, though his 18 snaps are clearly a small sample size.

Other changes the Jets could consider? Rookie Chuma Edoga could feasibly fill in at one of the tackle spots or Alex Lewis could plug in at guard. But those moves would be riskier; Edoga has never played in an NFL game, while Lewis missed most of the past two-and-a-half seasons due to injury. Tom Compton is really the only other backup on the Jets’ roster with extensive starting experience; he started 14 games at left guard last season for the Vikings.

While the other four starters – left tackle Kelvin Beachum, left guard Kelechi Osemele, right guard Brian Winters and right tackle Brandon Shell – have all had enough ugly moments to at least warrant some discussion, none have been as consistently subpar as Kalil.

For what it’s worth, Gase did also hint at more changes than simply swapping in some new personnel. He added that the Jets have to clean up both their coaching and their play calling; so, he and Pollack are sharing some of the blame in this mess, too.

But, clearly, he thinks a benching or two could help spark this unit moving forward, otherwise he would have shot the idea down on the spot.

 

Instead, he embraced it time and time again.

“When you’re 0-3, if things stay the same, then that’s our fault,” Gase said. "We have to figure out what the best thing for us to do is moving forward.”

[Wonderboy]

On 9/29/2019 at 6:36 AM, Jetster said:

I like Darnold, I think he'll be a good QB, but the Jets needed a QB & this goes back to the idiotic drafting of Christian Hackenberg in the 2nd round! Jets could have had another player at that spot (Olineman Maybe?), plus there would have been a good chance they might have drafted either Watson or Mahomes in 2017. Then they wouldn't have had to trade 3 number 2 picks & could have been in play for Nelson. That Hackenberg miss was the beginning of the end for MaccCoffee. It set off a domino affect that has us where we are today. 

Exactly. Now JD just has to wipe this putrid OL clean next season. They can save plenty but Not resigning any of these bums, draft a couple OL with high picks, Sign a couple quality FA’s, make a few trades, It’s really not that complicated and would be a vast improvement. 

[ljr]

OL early & OL often JD!

I’ll greenlight it if you want to slide a WR1 in there as well


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Losmeister]

"The New York Jets now have the third-highest paid offensive line at $45.4 million (including backups), based on 2019 salary-cap charges, according to ESPN Roster Management."

https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/81088/jets-high-priced-under-performing-offensive-line-receives-wake-up-call

[freestater]

4 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

"The New York Jets now have the third-highest paid offensive line at $45.4 million (including backups), based on 2019 salary-cap charges, according to ESPN Roster Management."

https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/81088/jets-high-priced-under-performing-offensive-line-receives-wake-up-call

When you dont draft o-line, or treat it like an afterthought, you end up paying in more than one way. We pay in losses, the Johnsons pay in millions, and the idiot Macc paid with his job...

[Losmeister]

Just now, freestater said:

When you dont draft o-line, or treat it like an afterthought, you end up paying in more than one way. We pay in losses, the Johnsons pay in millions, and the idiot Macc paid with his job...

KO has sucked balls...   I have been stunned at how poorly he has played... as bad or worse than Winters......................... just whiffing left and right... OMFG bad

last line of article?

"They've neglected the line for years," Woody said. "It's not Joe Douglas' fault and it's not Adam Gase's fault. It's years of neglect, and now it's coming home to roost."

[freestater]

4 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

KO has sucked balls...   I have been stunned at how poorly he has played... as bad or worse than Winters......................... just whiffing left and right... OMFG bad

last line of article?

"They've neglected the line for years," Woody said. "It's not Joe Douglas' fault and it's not Adam Gase's fault. It's years of neglect, and now it's coming home to roost."

Me too. The communication is horrible. I just cant fathom how Gase can look at what this group has done but keeps trotting out the same batch week by week. Harrison, while not great or even good, is so much better than what Kalil has shown. None of the starters have exhibited anything that makes their position set in stone. It worries me that changes haven't already been made. I fear Gase has the same tendency to keep underperforming vets in that Bowles was so frustrating with.

[JustInFudge]

24 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

"The New York Jets now have the third-highest paid offensive line at $45.4 million (including backups), based on 2019 salary-cap charges, according to ESPN Roster Management."

https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-jets/post/_/id/81088/jets-high-priced-under-performing-offensive-line-receives-wake-up-call

All that depth is really paying off! 

[peekskill68]

On 9/29/2019 at 8:44 PM, MaxAF said:

My thoughts are if they were better than the starters.... they would be starting. ?

Not sure I agree on Kalil.  Benching him for Harrison, which by my eye test so far would be the right thing to do, is basically calling out your GM on one of his key signings.  You can get away with it for something so obvious to the fans like Kaare Vedvik, but Gase might not want to do that to Douglas on Kalil even if he sucks.

[Losmeister]

so, hold on...  are we saying that the Joe Douglas' effin feelings is what we have to careful of?? FTS!!

if Harrison can do better, put him in...

and thats the thing...   i am all for benching guys if the backup is better... (yes i am talking about Trumaine Johnson)   but your just killing yourslef if the backup is worse.

 

[Joe W. Namath]

7 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

so, hold on...  are we saying that the Joe Douglas' effin feelings is what we have to careful of?? FTS!!

if Harrison can do better, put him in...

and thats the thing...   i am all for benching guys if the backup is better... (yes i am talking about Trumaine Johnson)   but your just killing yourslef if the backup is worse.

 

Most definately.  If khalil was a Mac guy hed of been benched already.  

Khalil will start again this week cause gase and douglas dont want egg on their face.

Stuff like this is why players in miami got pissed at gase and probably why hes losing guys like jamal adams already.

[Beerfish]

DRAFT them! FA olineman are more often than not fools gold.

[MaxAF]

17 minutes ago, peekskill68 said:

Not sure I agree on Kalil.  Benching him for Harrison, which by my eye test so far would be the right thing to do, is basically calling out your GM on one of his key signings.  You can get away with it for something so obvious to the fans like Kaare Vedvik, but Gase might not want to do that to Douglas on Kalil even if he sucks.

It looks like Kalil is a bust. He may just need to shake the rust off and learn the assignments but yeah they could throw Harrison in there at center or even at Guard. 

[peekskill68]

15 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

so, hold on...  are we saying that the Joe Douglas' effin feelings is what we have to careful of?? FTS!!

if Harrison can do better, put him in...

and thats the thing...   i am all for benching guys if the backup is better... (yes i am talking about Trumaine Johnson)   but your just killing yourslef if the backup is worse.

 

Has nothing to do with Joe D's feelings.  It has to do with fact that Gase lobbied for this guy, won the battle with CJ to fire Macc and may not want to show him up by benching one of his key signings.  Makes Gase look bad as well.  That's all...

[Joe W. Namath]

11 minutes ago, peekskill68 said:

Has nothing to do with Joe D's feelings.  It has to do with fact that Gase lobbied for this guy, won the battle with CJ to fire Macc and may not want to show him up by benching one of his key signings.  Makes Gase look bad as well.  That's all...

Correct, this is what happens when you have an insecure coach.

[Losmeister]

33 minutes ago, peekskill68 said:

not want to show him up by benching one of his key signings.

like i said, FTS, "show him up"  ?????    this is a big boy pants job...   worried about the GM catching feelings???

FTS!!!