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Why Jets’ Sam Darnold’s return is bad news for Adam Gase


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1 hour ago, Lith said:

The issue is not so much losing, but how we have lost the last 3 games.  Injuries or no injuries, Gase,has got to find a way to cobble together a competent offense.  Maybe Falk is just that bad that there was nothing he could do, but the offenensive play over the last three weeeks has been historically inept. 

We have scored 9 offensive points in 3 games.  Not saying we should be putting up 30+ with a 3rd string QB, but we gotta be better than 3 per game.

And while the offense has scored 9 points, they have given up 14.  We have run one play in the red zone in 3 games -- the 19-yard TD run by Vyncynt Smith, and we only got to the red zone in the first place thanks to a ST turnover.  We have averaged 165 yards of offense in those games.  Nobody else in the NFL is below 230.  We have averaged 3.1 yards per play.  Nobody else in the league is below 4.  

Thankfully, that stretch is in the rear-view now.  Nothing about hte last 4 weeks matters now except for the 0-4 record.  Time to see what we can do with a healthy Darnold under Center.  I really hope we get to see the dynamic offense we heard so much about in the offseason.

It's almost like the loud statement many of us have made over and over again that "it's not about wins and losses" are just falling on deaf ears.  It's about historic incompetence.  This offense had a streak going in which they were 0-43 on 3rd down.  It's week 5 and ST/D has outscored the offense.  Repeat those 2 little nuggets to yourself.   It's unreal.

If this team was where it's at record wise but showed just a little bit of fight on offense, I wouldnt be complaining one bit.  It's the fact I've never witnessed anything this bad on offense.

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3 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Bad article?  It's 100% correct.

The same people bleating that it is a bad article are probably the ones lamenting gases poor lot in life for having to deal with a 3rd string QB.  (Events in the league have shattered that notion 100% imo but hey cling to what you can cling to.)

Literally not one person who posted before you said it was a bad article. 

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5 hours ago, slats said:

The Jets roster is still terrible even with a healthy Sam Darnold. The hope here is that Sam makes them suck less, and Adam Gase manages to grow a set with an NFL caliber QB under center for the first time in a month. 

Gase's job the rest of the way is keeping the team together and playing hard. His job isn't on the line unless and until the team completely gives up on him. 

The Roster is not terrible this team and coaching staff got blindsided with Injuries and it had a huge effect. 

I'm not saying getting healthy will make us a playoff contender based on what happened the first few weeks but lets wait to pass judgement on how terrible this team may or may not be until we can get healthy and get things worked out. We lost our QB on Offense and on defense and the QB's we had to step in were terrible that along with the fact teams had no problem keying on Bell just enhanced the issues. 

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2 hours ago, Lith said:

The issue is not so much losing, but how we have lost the last 3 games.  Injuries or no injuries, Gase,has got to find a way to cobble together a competent offense.  Maybe Falk is just that bad that there was nothing he could do, but the offenensive play over the last three weeeks has been historically inept. 

We have scored 9 offensive points in 3 games.  Not saying we should be putting up 30+ with a 3rd string QB, but we gotta be better than 3 per game.

And while the offense has scored 9 points, they have given up 14.  We have run one play in the red zone in 3 games -- the 19-yard TD run by Vyncynt Smith, and we only got to the red zone in the first place thanks to a ST turnover.  We have averaged 165 yards of offense in those games.  Nobody else in the NFL is below 230.  We have averaged 3.1 yards per play.  Nobody else in the league is below 4.  

Thankfully, that stretch is in the rear-view now.  Nothing about hte last 4 weeks matters now except for the 0-4 record.  Time to see what we can do with a healthy Darnold under Center.  I really hope we get to see the dynamic offense we heard so much about in the offseason.

We can talk about injuries until the cows come home but I have had season tickets since 1984 and this is unquestionably the worst Jets offense I have ever seen.  Even Bubby Brister managed to put some points on the board.  As limited as Falk is, Gase did not put him in a position to succeed and I would expect that an "offensive genius" would come up with something creative to at least get past midfield once or twice.   

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4 hours ago, Untouchable said:

I don’t want Gase to fail.

No one WANTS Gase to fail

we all want them to go on a 12 game run and then win the Super Bowl 

but we can also admit for a so called offensive innovator the plays have been garbagio both in design and when they are called

the football world has become a spread RPO affair he's playing with pocket passing and dives on 3rd and 1. Feeding Bell to a ridiculous and obvious amount

it's not the losing I can't stand it's looking flat and uninspired 

the reverse touchdown was like a drop of water on a dying man's tongue but it's not really all that creative 

I've yet to see any play call that is new or exciting 

has anyone? 

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4 minutes ago, Green DNA said:

We can talk about injuries until the cows come home but I have had season tickets since 1984 and this is unquestionably the worst offense the Jets I have ever seen.  Even Bubby Brister managed to put some points on the board.  As limited as Falk is, Gase did not put him in a position to succeed and I would expect that an "offensive genius" would come up with something creative to at least get past midfield once or twice.   

thank you sir 

Kotite won 3 games that year in 1995 everyone thought was such a disaster

this team might not get to 3 wins and somehow everyone's ok with it 

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7 minutes ago, Apache 51 said:

Gotta find something that works and continue to evaluate talent, or the lack there of it's a challenge to say the least.

Okay, I don't know if you're defending Gase here or not, but with the exceptions of Lewis and Kalil, the rest of the starting Oline are unequivocally guys that Macc thrust on Gase.

I was just pointing out that that point in the article was stupid.

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

If our HC  only knew how to work with an offense.....a better QB definitely wouldn’t help

33B3B330-4509-4F55-A3EC-355C00377D30.jpeg

 

NO ITS NOT... I read this also and wonder why they were so open.  Was it because the scheme (we know that the svjeme has cause major problems with OL, WR, etc... AG admitted as much) or their route running.  Or maybe the opposing team D knew that the QB could not hurt them so they stack the box waiting for the inevitable  Bell off tackle A/B gaps, and then the expected 3rd down pass behind the LOS.   As one of the Philly D players stated they knew Bell was the focus of the O just like NE did.   

Posters who call out other posters for post AG's tenure in Miami need to understand that he was the HC and ( I'll remind people)  GM for awhile!  His record shows losing with his players and now stands at 0-7 in his last seven games.

As AG stated SAM will help but there are other issues... Well coach its your scheme, your CS and if as reported, people are "confused"  about their assignments when they line up, then that is an indictment of your own coaching ineptitude  and your stubbornness to continue to use plays, schemes that are failing.  

 

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6 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Great article.  No more excuses for anyone.  We are back.  We are healthy.  Time to produce.

 

We are healthy? We already lost Avery & Quincy for the year,  Mosely, Jenkins, KO, Herndon are all most likely out. That 6 starters & they'll probably be more looking at the players that did not practice. Will this team ever have its full fill of starters? 

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2 minutes ago, SOJ said:

 

NO ITS NOT... I read this also and wonder why they were so open.  Was it because the scheme (we know that the svjeme has cause major problems with OL, WR, etc... AG admitted as much) or their route running.  Or maybe the opposing team D knew that the QB could not hurt them so they stack the box waiting for the inevitable  Bell off tackle A/B gaps, and then the expected 3rd down pass behind the LOS.   As one of the Philly D players stated they knew Bell was the focus of the O just like NE did.   

Posters who call out other posters for post AG's tenure in Miami need to understand that he was the HC and ( I'll remind people)  GM for awhile!  His record shows losing with his players and now stands at 0-7 in his last seven games.

As AG stated SAM will help but there are other issues... Well coach its your scheme, your CS and if as reported, people are "confused"  about their assignments when they line up, then that is an indictment of your own coaching ineptitude  and your stubbornness to continue to use plays, schemes that are failing.  

 

Parcells started seasons on offense BORING AS HELL. You have to walk before you can run & this team hasn't played 1 offensive snap with its entire offensive group intact & has already had to make wholesale changes on the Oline, work in another practice squad WR, and might still not have their starting TE. 

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1 hour ago, shevys said:

Literally not one person who posted before you said it was a bad article. 

"This is a magma-hot lazer-hot take that getting the starting QB back is “bad news” for the head coach. If you found this article compelling, ask yourself why you want the Jets to lose and for Gase to fail. "

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6 hours ago, slats said:

The Jets roster is still terrible even with a healthy Sam Darnold. The hope here is that Sam makes them suck less, and Adam Gase manages to grow a set with an NFL caliber QB under center for the first time in a month. 

Gase's job the rest of the way is keeping the team together and playing hard. His job isn't on the line unless and until the team completely gives up on him. 

Week 8/9?

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34 minutes ago, Jetster said:

We are healthy? We already lost Avery & Quincy for the year,  Mosely, Jenkins, KO, Herndon are all most likely out. That 6 starters & they'll probably be more looking at the players that did not practice. Will this team ever have its full fill of starters? 

You're one of my favorites here, but nah, this injury argument just doesn't hold up, and for so many reasons. Let me give you some.

Avery was injured due to Gase's negligence. There was no reason for him to be on the field at that point in a stupid preseason game.

The CS knew Herndon would miss the first 4 games due to his incredible stupidity, yet they've found nobody remotely able to play his position worth a damn through this point.

Guys like KO and Enunwa have had one injury after another for a few years. Counting on them staying healthy was a pipe dream. Look at other teams winning with back up QBs and other position players around the league.

I know you're living down south now like I am, but the other day I was reading a NY paper online. The Giants 4 starting LBs are out. Barkley is out as is the 2nd string RB. Their OL and WRs are as bad as ours, yet they insert a rookie QB everyone laughed at them for drafting (especially here) and he wins his first two games. We haven't even been able to out score our defense and STs through 4 games.

My point is injuries happen in football. I know you know that, so we can't claim we're the only team that has them. What we are is a horrible football team, that is being horribly coached. Playing a 3rd string QB is going to keep just about any team from winning, but I can't imagine it making a team look as inept for as long as we did. Even after the bye week there wasn't the slightest sign of them having improved in any facet of the offense. Forget winning, they were completely lost.

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40 minutes ago, SOJ said:

 

NO ITS NOT... I read this also and wonder why they were so open.  Was it because the scheme (we know that the svjeme has cause major problems with OL, WR, etc... AG admitted as much) or their route running.  Or maybe the opposing team D knew that the QB could not hurt them so they stack the box waiting for the inevitable  Bell off tackle A/B gaps, and then the expected 3rd down pass behind the LOS.   As one of the Philly D players stated they knew Bell was the focus of the O just like NE did.   

Posters who call out other posters for post AG's tenure in Miami need to understand that he was the HC and ( I'll remind people)  GM for awhile!  His record shows losing with his players and now stands at 0-7 in his last seven games.

As AG stated SAM will help but there are other issues... Well coach its your scheme, your CS and if as reported, people are "confused"  about their assignments when they line up, then that is an indictment of your own coaching ineptitude  and your stubbornness to continue to use plays, schemes that are failing.  

 

The numbers aren't true? 

Go argue with Next Gen Stats.  Don't argue with me, I didn't compile the numbers and report them.  I put up what they're reporting.  If you don't like it I'm sure they have a web page.  Tell them you're a Jets fan and as such you know it can't be right.  And if you're going to call them wrong, you need more than coaches complaining saying we can do better.  

He is the HC, that you're right about. Point being? 

Cant make this shiltnup

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46 minutes ago, Spoot-Face said:

Okay, I don't know if you're defending Gase here or not, but with the exceptions of Lewis and Kalil, the rest of the starting Oline are unequivocally guys that Macc thrust on Gase.

I was just pointing out that that point in the article was stupid.

I wouldn't defend Gase. I don't pretend to know whats going on on 1 Jets Dr.,4679CA9D-FD79-45FE-9278-9B6E766538BD_1_105_c.thumb.jpeg.9c00ef3a945ef6383f4adb480459beba.jpeg in fact I'm still looking for...... one Jets drive.

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41 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

You're one of my favorites here, but nah, this injury argument just doesn't hold up, and for so many reasons. Let me give you some.

Avery was injured due to Gase's negligence. There was no reason for him to be on the field at that point in a stupid preseason game.

Guys like KO and Enunwa have had one injury after another for a few years. Counting on them staying healthy was a pipe dream. Look at other teams winning with back up QBs and other position players around the league.

I know you're living down south now like I am, but the other day I was reading a NY paper online. The Giants 4 starting LBs are out. Barkley is out as is the 2nd string RB. Their OL and WRs are as bad as ours, yet they insert a rookie QB everyone laughed at them for drafting (especially here) and he wins his first two games. We haven't even been able to out score our defense and STs through 4 games.

My point is injuries happen in football. I know you know that, so we can't claim we're the only team that has them. What we are is a horrible football team, that is being horribly coached. Playing a 3rd string QB is going to keep just about any team from winning, but I can't imagine it making a team look as inept for as long as we did. Even after the bye week there wasn't the slightest sign of them having improved in any facet of the offense. Forget winning, they were completely lost.

So you're firmly in the Darnold and Semiens injuries have nothing to do with our record group? 

 

Ill quote youre first first paragraph and move on

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12 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

So you're firmly in the Darnold and Semiensminjury have nothing to do with our record group? 

 

Ill quote youre first first paragraph and skid on

 I was talking more about not using injuries as the excuse for the team being THIS bad. Ive said many times with Darnold healthy, I expected this to be a 7-9 win team. I was probably being too optimistic as it turns out. Apparently we aren't that team. I just don't see us being inept. Even with Falk as QB.

I'm not a Gase hater, and I wasn't looking for him to work miracles with Falk. That said, the OL has regressed, and last week after the bye week I didn't expect a win, but I did expect a semblance of an NFL offense.

Lets say I'm disappointed with what I've seen, and am hoping that with Darnold back, things change drastically.

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20 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

 I was talking more about not using injuries as the excuse for the team being THIS bad. Ive said many times with Darnold healthy, I expected this to be a 7-9 win team. I was probably being too optimistic as it turns out. Apparently we aren't that team. I just don't see us being inept. Even with Falk as QB.

I'm not a Gase hater, and I wasn't looking for him to work miracles with Falk. That said, the OL has regressed, and last week after the bye week I didn't expect a win, but I did expect a semblance of an NFL offense.

Lets say I'm disappointed with what I've seen, and am hoping that with Darnold back, things change drastically.

Ok makes it somewhat better but come on, Darnold healthy makes us at least a one win team and makes us look better than what the POS Falk has done

Defense getting a blow, makes them better.  So would having Mosley, Jenkins, Copeland, whoever.  That's all, not a playoff team.  I'm amazed that some, not you, actually are selling guys like Hewitt, Cashman etc aren't drop offs from what we were expecting to dress on sundays,

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7 hours ago, Warfish said:

If we look like total unprepared crap on Sunday, we'll have a dozen excuse-threads on why Gase (and Darnold) aren't to blame, aren't be be evaluated, aren't to be judged because it'll be everyone else's fault but theirs no matter how bad a job they do. 

Same as always.

 

And you'll be here scream I told you so and dickslapping yourself 

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6 hours ago, Warfish said:

It's not specific to them. 

To a meaningful portion of our fanbase, ANY Jets "young QB prospect" and ANY "Jets Head Coach In Years 1-3" can do no wrong.

It's only after they're fired or cut that these homers pretend they knew all along the QB or Coach weren't the guy.  

Mr "I have no idea what it's like to be a fan"

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7 hours ago, Warfish said:

If we look like total unprepared crap on Sunday, we'll have a dozen excuse-threads on why Gase (and Darnold) aren't to blame, aren't be be evaluated, aren't to be judged because it'll be everyone else's fault but theirs no matter how bad a job they do. 

Same as always.

 

Because if we look like crap you'll be happy and if we don't but lose you'll still carry on

Waiing for the day you get that this is a fan board

Formfans

 

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2 hours ago, JiF said:

It's almost like the loud statement many of us have made over and over again that "it's not about wins and losses" are just falling on deaf ears.  It's about historic incompetence.  This offense had a streak going in which they were 0-43 on 3rd down.  It's week 5 and ST/D has outscored the offense.  Repeat those 2 little nuggets to yourself.   It's unreal.

If this team was where it's at record wise but showed just a little bit of fight on offense, I wouldnt be complaining one bit.  It's the fact I've never witnessed anything this bad on offense.

I agree. 

No one should expect the offense to be great with Luke in there for the Jets, no one.  

But all any Jets fan is looking for here is competent play at a minimum.   

When Sam went down last year McCown didn’t light it up! Ok that is what it is. And when Sam came back he made the Jets better.  

What we have seen on the last three games on offense I have never seem from a Jets team regardless of talent or record.  

So no sane poster should be expecting the Jets to play lights out on offense but we can expect minimum quality play that at least matches what Jeremy Bates was putting up last season. 

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Just now, Jet Nut said:

Ok makes it somewhat better but come on, Darnold healthy makes us at least a one win team and makes us look better than what the POS Falk has done

Let me try to make where I'm coming from a little more clear. I'll go through it game by game, you tell me if I'm being unfair.

Week 1. I was really pissed at Darnold and Gase, especially Darnold for how he looked on the last possession of the game. Next day we hear he had strep, then later find out about the mono. I then give him a pass. No way he was near 100%.

Week 2. A total nightmare. Siemian gets hurt early, Falk has to come in cold. I'm actually encouraged by the way he played, but it was a perfect storm of bad luck. No way to blame anyone for that loss.

Week 3. No sane person could've expected to win that game. On our best day we probably can't beat that team. To be honest though, I never felt Gase even made an attempt to try. That was disappointing.

Week 5 (game 4) This was the one that bothered me. We are coming off our bye week. For some stupid reason I loved the CS we put together this year. Going into Philly and expecting a win was going to always be a tough ask. Expecting to see improvement in any or all facets of the offense wasn't though. To look as bad as they did with an extra week to prepare is something that cannot be defended.  

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18 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

...dickslapping yourself...

I'm content to leave all the "dickslapping" to you Nut, I don't really swing that way.

Now, please stop spamming me with all the "JetNut is has been spam-quoting and spam neg-repping you" notification messages. 

Dude, seriously, you're a grown man.  You're on ignore.  You know you're on ignore.  You've been on ignore for literally months and months now.  At some point, it really should sink in that I don't want to engage with you and I most assuredly don't want to be spammed with your barely legible, typo filled scribblings. 

As Max once asked, I am doing everything I can to leave you alone, and not engage with you unless you spam me. 

You, on the other hand, seem literally obsessed with me and what I think.  

Let it go ffs.  Seriously.  This is bordering on clinical. You don't like how I think?  Great!  Ignore me!

 

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10 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Let me try to make where I'm coming from a little more clear. I'll go through it game by game, you tell me if I'm being unfair.

Week 1. I was really pissed at Darnold and Gase, especially Darnold for how he looked on the last possession of the game. Next day we hear he had strep, then later find out about the mono. I then give him a pass. No way he was near 100%.

Week 2. A total nightmare. Siemian gets hurt early, Falk has to come in cold. I'm actually encouraged by the way he played, but it was a perfect storm of bad luck. No way to blame anyone for that loss.

Week 3. No sane person could've expected to win that game. On our best day we probably can't beat that team. To be honest though, I never felt Gase even made an attempt to try. That was disappointing.

Week 5 (game 4) This was the one that bothered me. We are coming off our bye week. For some stupid reason I loved the CS we put together this year. Going into Philly and expecting a win was going to always be a tough ask. Expecting to see improvement in any or all facets of the offense wasn't though. To look as bad as they did with an extra week to prepare is something that cannot be defended.  

Week 1, clearly all the reports are that Adar old played with mono.  Clearly aches, pains, lethargy and chills would effect a QB.  I get he played but throught it all we should have posted 20 Pats and a win

Week 2, nightmare, you're right, no one to blame.  Unless your a fan on a board who lives n a dream sequence.

Week 3 agree again, just don't know eh. The OL sucks and the QB has no ability to make OL calls,or to get the ball out quick enough we should expect more.  

Week 5 bothered me too, thought it could have been closer.  Unfortunately Falk had his worst game making OL calls and changes, was sacked 10 times, half of which at least were his fault.

To those who think these are excuses, too bad.  It's all based on sound football discussion and took more thinking and logic.  Disagree if you like, that's fine.  Telling me or others that were fools is telling.  In fact blaming it totally on the HC is foolish and excuse making at its finest  Shlt, one actually believes that the players on the OL are Gases fault.  

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32 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'm content to leave all the "dickslapping" to you Nut, I don't really swing that way.

Now, please stop spamming me with all the "JetNut is has been spam-quoting and spam neg-repping you" notification messages. 

Dude, seriously, you're a grown man.  You're on ignore.  You know you're on ignore.  You've been on ignore for literally months and months now.  At some point, it really should sink in that I don't want to engage with you and I most assuredly don't want to be spammed with your barely legible, typo filled scribblings. 

As Max once asked, I am doing everything I can to leave you alone, and not engage with you unless you spam me. 

You, on the other hand, seem literally obsessed with me and what I think.  

Let it go ffs.  Seriously.  This is bordering on clinical. You don't like how I think?  Great!  Ignore me!

 

I thought i was on ignore?  Passing up the ignore by opening my post, which I post for others is on YOU.  Not me.  You really don't understand the whole posting thing.  I don't know if you have me on ignore or not, only if you post when I have you on ignore is there a notification in threads.   I'm not name calling, I'm not doing anything other than disagreeing and talking football.  Sorry it throws you.  Guess I'll leave you totally in your dream land

You've told others to do the same, put me on ignore, makeskes youre experience better?  But you undo ignore, read what I write and reply.  Ok

Max has said nothing.  Slats asked me not to reference you by amgoofy name in posts, I havent

No obsession.  When you say something I don't agree with I'll buttfumble or I agree I'll upvote it.  It's how the board works  You start telling people to ignore me I'll respond.  That's childish.  I don't need you telling me who to ignore when you can't keep me on ignore  It's simple, leave me alone.  

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4 hours ago, Warfish said:

I .  If you believe Gase is, in fact, a future Super Bowl winning Head Coach, then obviously you wilI just wonder what it is you see that makes you believe Gase is a future Super Bowl winning Head Coach....

Fish, we don’t know if he is or if he isn’t. What coaching hire, ever, could you say that about? I certainly wasn’t pounding the table for Gase this offseason, but he’s our coach now and, because of that one fact, Maccagnan is gone and we attracted a presumed top-tier GM candidate in Joe Douglas. The roster is ******* garbage and that’s a universally acknowledged fact (outside of a single room in a Rochester hostel), and the high-end expectation for the team was six or seven wins, and that was with Darnold becoming a very good QB right away. Without Darnold, it’s easily the worst team in football, and that’s what we got for 3 1/2 weeks. If you hated Gase coming in, you’d hate Gase now because he didn’t create a miracle with Luke Falk against the Pats or Eagles. If you liked Gase coming in, there’s no reason to jump ship yet because, as I said, competing for any wins this year was 100% contingent on Darnold being good. 
 

Here’s a thought exercise: Let’s say they hired your preferred coach, and that coach lost Darnold after Week One, and lost Simiean a quarter into Week Two. Is the record any different? Does Mike McCarthy have the offense looking any better? Does Luke Falk put up a few more TDs? Ok. Let’s say that Luke Falk puts up two TDs every week. The result? You’re still 0-4, except now you still have Mike Maccagnan as your GM. It simply would not be worth it. 

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1 hour ago, 14 in Green said:

Avery was injured due to Gase's negligence. There was no reason for him to be on the field at that point in a stupid preseason game.

Well, there was some reason. Avery was in there getting reps as the defensive signal-caller as a contingency plan in the awful event that C.J. Mosley could not play. It's just ironic that that contingency plan got Avery injured (on a freak accident being hit by one of our guys, no less), just to see, a week later, that awful event occur in which Avery was needed to be prepared for, anyway.

The universe is funny sometimes.

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