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Why isn’t anybody taking about the actual design on the Darnold goal line INT?


HessStation
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10 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

There was a lot of this going on.

The thought that Jets offensive line coach Frank Pollack formerly played this game at a somewhat competent level, and is allowing this type of effort is mind-boggling. 

Not that he has been given any sharp tools to work with here.

There was a Bell run in the third quarter where Edoga, I guess, thought he was supposed to block down, but instead he just kinda stood up, walked two steps to his right, and stood there while Bell was getting gang-tackled. 

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1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

There was a Bell run in the third quarter where Edoga, I guess, thought he was supposed to block down, but instead he just kinda stood up, walked two steps to his right, and stood there while Bell was getting gang-tackled. 

Jets fans: stats don't tell the whole story

Also Jets fans: DEMARCUS LAWRENCE ZERO SACKS WOOOOOOOOOO

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Just now, T0mShane said:

There was a Bell run in the third quarter where Edoga, I guess, thought he was supposed to block down, but instead he just kinda stood up, walked two steps to his right, and stood there while Bell was getting gang-tackled. 

Not having talent is an acceptable excuse, for at least a time.

Not giving effort is pretty well damning. At this level it is unacceptable.

There is quite a bit of "watching plays" rather than getting involved on both sides.

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2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

There was a Bell run in the third quarter where Edoga, I guess, thought he was supposed to block down, but instead he just kinda stood up, walked two steps to his right, and stood there while Bell was getting gang-tackled. 

So much irony that’s it’s the Jetsy Jets who take a rookie OT who has a promising start at RT and then moves him to the left side before anybody has time to finish a high 5. 

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6 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

You keep lowering the bar, Darnold keeps bumping his fat head on it.

Actually I'm not. It was a stupid decision  to try and pass the ball even if he was trying to throw it out of bounds. Sam needs to make better choices like just covering up and going to to the ground. That was a moronic thing to do. I'm just say slam could have had another half inch on each finger and that pass still goes nowhere good. 

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7 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

Apparently, you did not think this at all. You have already proven that you did not even know this was a "thing".

All I can do is help dissect plays from a mechanical standpoint. I can't do that from the perspective of the qb throwing the ball, nor can you. Darnold having small hands have proven in the past to be problematic. They certainly may have been a contributing factor in this play. 

 

How about dissecting  them from a common sense  stand point. Sam was halfway to ground when he threw the ball. It was going to be a bad outcome no matter what. 

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39 minutes ago, HessStation said:

I just realized it wasn’t short side of the field my bad there. But that play call was an abomination on second and goal on a crucial drive...then with 7 they let a blitzing LB inside untouched. So bad design plus horrible execution and the ball slips out of his hands. I agree he’s not looking good, but it’s like this team is so bad in so many ways, it’s sorta not fair to blame the 22 year old second year QB. Yet. Imo

I dont love the play call; jumbled up to the sideline but the execution was pathetic so we dont know what it should have looked like if ran correctly.

I dont put this all on Sam.  Everything around him is absolute sh*t but he goes to straight moron when everything is breaking down around him and that was supposedly his strength.

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25 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

How about dissecting  them from a common sense  stand point. Sam was halfway to ground when he threw the ball. It was going to be a bad outcome no matter what. 

Go to the :54 second mark of the video and freeze frame the video. Sam is actually upright. He has a defender behind him holding onto his left shoulder with the defender's left hand, and his right shoulder is being impeded by the defender's right hand.

Again, he is upright on 2 feet when he goes into his "motion" (which is saying it politely). Darnold has the ball in the palm of his hand. He is not in position to throw the ball.

He is being twisted as he basically shotputs the ball. 

Poor decision? Of course. But you have to understand he is reacting in a split second, under fire, not from the comfort of our easy chair watching on a monitor. 

From my perspective, he looks like he is trying to throw it away. Otherwise, it is one of the most incredibly accurate shotputs I have seen from a twisted position.

All I am saying is that given possible stronger hand leverage, maybe he has a better shot of controlling that ball out of bounds.

Pure speculation on my part I understand. But, his small hands have in the past given him problems with ball leverage.

Again, what are you arguing here? 

Screen Shot 2019-11-04 at 9.54.16 AM.png

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28 minutes ago, HessStation said:

So much irony that’s it’s the Jetsy Jets who take a rookie OT who has a promising start at RT and then moves him to the left side before anybody has time to finish a high 5. 

 

23 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

He didn't have a promising start at RT. He was sh*tty. It was just easier to deliberately ignore.

I thought I saw a stat where Edoga gave up fove pressures and two sacks at right tackle. 

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4 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

 Poor decision? Of course. But you have to understand he is reacting in a split second, under fire, not from the comfort of our easy chair watching on a monitor. 

The problem, as I see it, is that his reactions in a split section are typically the wrong ones.  I don't know if you can fix this.

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25 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

The problem, as I see it, is that his reactions in a split section are typically the wrong ones.  I don't know if you can fix this.

You can through repetition in a better environment. But the longer this goes on the more unlikely it becomes. This season has made every negative instinct he has more strong.

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This is an awful play, which Darnold makes infinitely worse.  The worst part by an order of magnitude is his thought process / decision.  Below is the frame where the defender knocks the ball a little loose.

image.png.8365fae659cd54a00cbb1198d9f56fc0.png

 

Here is a split second later.  He could easily just tuck the ball at this point.  But at *THIS* point he decides to throw!

image.png.d04cb51b8997d0f639be9d5537fd0e20.png

 

It's just too late at this point, *and* he knows he doesn't have a grip on the ball.  Just ridiculous.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, thshadow said:

This is an awful play, which Darnold makes infinitely worse.  The worst part by an order of magnitude is his thought process / decision.  Below is the frame where the defender knocks the ball a little loose. 

 

Mono boy has been just chock full of great decisions this season. 

remember the 14 fans who were hanging around saying he got the kissing disease from a drinking glass? 

these are the same geniuses who believe their GF got the clap from a toilet seat and crabs from "riding on the bus" 

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7 minutes ago, August said:

Why didn’t he throw it to the sidelines if “he was trying to throw it away”? I sense bs on that one. 

Because he did not have a grip, did not have leverage and was being twisted.

With all those factors, it would have been a hell of an effort to get the ball close to the receivers (and defenders) as he did.

 

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Just now, Scott Dierking said:

Because he did not have a grip, did not have leverage and was being twisted.

With all those factors, it would have been a hell of an effort to get the ball close to the receivers (and defenders) as he did.

 

Ok fine. Why didn’t he then take the sack since according to you “he did not have a grip, did not have leverage and was being twisted”?

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OK so I've watched this play several times

First I'm not sure how they over turned that Ryan Griffin TD. He had like 3 feet in bounds but whatever. 

 

so the design rolling left on the right hash makes some sense in there's more room to roll in that direction 

at snap the entire line slides left, and Edoga matches up with the End. 

The ILB who pressures Sam is 3-4 yards off the ball and delay blitzes (he's no where near the hole when the play starts)

It's possible Edoga is supposed to hang out in the hole blocking no one waiting for the stunt or the blitz, knowing Bell has outside pickup but he latches on to the edge rusher, which is a natural response (he's 22 and has to hit someone not just stand there) 

it's also possible Bell is supposed to have inside pickup.

There aren't any hot routes against the disguised pressure. Sam doesn't see it and Adam Gase dials up a slow developing play - with all the WR bunched up the fact there's no safety help in the middle cannot be exploited 

We don't really know who to blame here but the rookie Edoga will not get the benefit of the doubt. I blame Gase #1 for this situation and then Edoga/Bell but Sam definitely made it worse.  Take a sack, kick a FG it's 21-10 at half not the worst but you live to fight another day 

the RB bell looks like he's rubbing outside on the same end Edoga is blocking and then going to maybe join the routes in the flat 

the three WR are essentially playing grab ass with each other on the goal line, absolute garbage route design  

 

just my 2 cents the line looked far better this  week with Kalil replaced by Harrison. They still are among the league's worst but these problems are systemic HC/QB stuff and not going to be solved by 5 new linemen (as much as that is a comforting idea) 

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1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

 

I thought I saw a stat where Edoga gave up fove pressures and two sacks at right tackle. 

I actually thought he was getting good press At RT even from PFF first couple games before the move but maybe not sure and don’t care enough to look it up. He DEF sucks at LT

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30 minutes ago, bitonti said:

OK so I've watched this play several times

First I'm not sure how they over turned that Ryan Griffin TD. He had like 3 feet in bounds but whatever. 

 

so the design rolling left on the right hash makes some sense in there's more room to roll in that direction 

at snap the entire line slides left, and Edoga matches up with the End. 

The ILB who pressures Sam is 3-4 yards off the ball and delay blitzes (he's no where near the hole when the play starts)

It's possible Edoga is supposed to hang out in the hole blocking no one waiting for the stunt or the blitz, knowing Bell has outside pickup but he latches on to the edge rusher, which is a natural response (he's 22 and has to hit someone not just stand there) 

it's also possible Bell is supposed to have inside pickup.

There aren't any hot routes against the disguised pressure. Sam doesn't see it and Adam Gase dials up a slow developing play - with all the WR bunched up the fact there's no safety help in the middle cannot be exploited 

We don't really know who to blame here but the rookie Edoga will not get the benefit of the doubt. I blame Gase #1 for this situation and then Edoga/Bell but Sam definitely made it worse.  Take a sack, kick a FG it's 21-10 at half not the worst but you live to fight another day 

the RB bell looks like he's rubbing outside on the same end Edoga is blocking and then going to maybe join the routes in the flat 

the three WR are essentially playing grab ass with each other on the goal line, absolute garbage route design  

 

just my 2 cents the line looked far better this  week with Kalil replaced by Harrison. They still are among the league's worst but these problems are systemic HC/QB stuff and not going to be solved by 5 new linemen (as much as that is a comforting idea) 

Right on the mark

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2 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

If you look at the play, he has lost all leverage on the ability to direct the ball and to direct it with authority. If it was a clean release, I could understand your point of trying to make a play.

It is just a flutterball, that is one hell of an ability to control a ball in all those conditions. He just lost leverage on throwing it away.

 

Watching it again it's an interesting play.

He sees the WRs run into reach other, and is switching his feet to throw (whether out of bounds or to Crowder), I think he sees Chuma in the path of the ILB but then Chuma is completely oblivious (I think this is what Tom was referring to) and the guy is on Sam way faster than he is expecting. Darnold steps up (and almost looks like he thinks he's freed himself) and then gets spun while in the midst of throwing making it a mystery where he intended to put it. 

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