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RonaldJet

A defense of Adam Gase....

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3 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Rex stunk, Gase stinks, bowles stinks.

The jets look worse than any other team for the last 15 years and they have had some bad teams.  The offense looks embarrassing bad.  This guy is an offensive coach.

Todd Bowles should have been retained, he had even worse talent then gase has.  lol

What if what you’re seeing is the net result of seven years plus of horrific roster management and this is the reckoning?

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8 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Rex goes 4-12 and the fans buy a billboard to get his GM fired after two years.

Adam Gase inherits a roster from a GM whose *five* drafts make John Idzik’s drafts look like Jimmy Johnson’s drafts and, uh, they want a billboard to get Adam Gase fired.

 

the difference? You personally liked Rex and you don’t like Gase. You’re all a bunch of emo poofs with daddy issues. 

While true, this doesn’t means Gase is good or should stay. 

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Just now, Integrity28 said:

While true, this doesn’t means Gase is good or should stay. 

Of course not, but it’s just funny how fans rallied around Rex up until his last day even when it was obvious he was tearing the franchise apart, but they’re ready to bounce Gase almost immediately 

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Just now, T0mShane said:

Of course not, but it’s just funny how fans rallied around Rex up until his last day even when it was obvious he was tearing the franchise apart, but they’re ready to bounce Gase almost immediately 

Rex took this team to back-to-back AFC title games.  I can completely understand why some Jet fans would want to give him the benefit of the doubt for a couple of extra years.  By the end, I was happy to see him go and I didn't think he deserved that last year that he was given.  But again, I understood.

The best defense of Gase is that "he had a crappy roster that was also riddled by injuries".  Fair enough.  But what exactly has he shown so far that screams "this guy deserves a 2nd year"? 

Through 8 games has he shown that he's been able to do more with less?  Has he shown he can overcome injuries and still keep his team be competitive?  Or is the idea that he's a great coach but only under perfect circumstances (a great roster that has no injuries)?

 

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15 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

What if what you’re seeing is the net result of seven years plus of horrific roster management and this is the reckoning?

So should Bowles have been fired?  Or was he dealt a bad hand all these years from horrific roster management?

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2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Rex took this team to back-to-back AFC title games.  I can completely understand why some Jet fans would want to give him the benefit of the doubt for a couple of extra years.  By the end, I was happy to see him go and I didn't think he deserved that last year that he was given.  But again, I understood.

The best defense of Gase is that "he had a crappy roster that was also riddled by injuries".  Fair enough.  But what exactly has he shown so far that screams "this guy deserves a 2nd year"? 

Through 8 games has he shown that he's been able to do more with less?  Has he shown he can overcome injuries and still keep his team be competitive?  Or is the idea that he's a great coach but only under perfect circumstances (a great roster that has no injuries)?

 

I think you give him a second year because you don’t fire coaches after one year because that’s how you lose the ability to hire good coaches in the future. 

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1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

LOLOLOL THEY FIRED THE GUY WHO SPENT THE MONEY

Lololol I doubt they fired him for signing Bell and Mosley. 

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2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

So should Bowles have been fired?  Or was he dealt a bad hand all these years from horrific roster management?

Bowles was 1. Hampered by Maccagnan but 2. Had four years and made enough mistakes in those four years to deserve to lose the job. 

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1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

I think you give him a second year because you don’t fire coaches after one year because that’s how you lose the ability to hire good coaches in the future. 

Fair enough.  But that doesn't have anything to do with Adam Gase.  It's just about appearances to the prospective next HC that he'll be given a fair shake.

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2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think you give him a second year because you don’t fire coaches after one year because that’s how you lose the ability to hire good coaches in the future. 

He is destroying a potential franchise Qb right before our eyes.  If it is a mistake you correct it now.  There will always be good candidates, you just have to pick the right one.

We gave Rex and Bowles what, 4-5 years a piece?  Didn't help us this time around.

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17 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I'll say this to the Gase defenders.  It's possible that he can succeed given a better roster if it remains healthy throughout the year.  But if he's only able to succeed in a "best case scenario", is that really a guy we should be rallying behind?  Considering how many injuries there are in the NFL, how realistic is a "best case scenario" anyway? 

So far, Gase has not shown that he's creative enough to overcome "bad situations" (e.g. having a crappy OL, losing his starting QB to mono for 4 weeks, injuries, etc).  I think the legit good coaches in the NFL at least keep their teams competitive in those situations.  Meanwhile, we got beaten pretty badly by the putrid Dolphins.

I see Gase for what he truly is now.

He is that nutjob that EVERY Company has, who is 110% married to the Company.  He’ll work 22 hours a day 7 days a week...tirelessly.

The nutjob is not particularly bright, definitely doesn’t get RESULTS that anyone would deem outstanding, his results in fact are barely average and if he just worked an 8 hour day they would be far below average.  There is talk sometimes that maybe he should be let go but then management all agrees that the “guy basically works for $1 an Hour considering all that time he puts in...we’ll keep him”.

You couple that with the fact that I’m sure Gase is an as* kissser to the 1st degree, along with being a a known back stabbing snake, a finger pointer, a fake who ditches and dodges and it all makes sense now as to how a guy who never personally played football at higher than the high school level some how finagled his way into an NFL HC job(s).

But most importantly it is now evident that Gase can’t even scheme to protect the Jet Organization’s basically ONLY Asset....Sam Darnold....and that is unforgivable.  I don’t care if they NEVER win another game with Gase unfortunately still being HC.  That is the 1 and only thing that he has to succeed at.  We already know that Gase the “QB Whisperer” has caused Darnold’s game to backslide, this after a stellar final quarter of 2018 when Darnold was the NFLs Top Rated Passer.

I think Darnold is right now the NFL’s LOWEST rated Passer....along with virtually EVERY Jet OFFENSIVE METRIC being either at the VERY BOTTOM or close to it in the NFL.

Why is that?

Why is Lev Bell averaging 3.3 yards a carry?

Why is the Jet O averaging no more than 1 TD per game?  Hey, a funny thing, Gase’s O in Miami barely averaged a TD per game over his last 10 games there.

I realize due to Stumblebum Maccagnan the roster is bottom feeding, but still you’d expect to at least be just SOMEWHAT competitive with an “Offensive Genius”, wouldn’t you?

That’s why Gase must be Fired....YESTERDAY.

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2 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

He is destroying a potential franchise Qb right before our eyes.  If it is a mistake you correct it now.  There will always be good candidates, you just have to pick the right one.

We gave Rex and Bowles what, 4-5 years a piece?  Didn't help us this time around.

Strong points, all.  Not only can't we afford to let Gase ruin Darnold but we need to try to win the Superbowl on Darnold's first contract (as insane as that sounds) because he'll eat up a huge chunk of the salary cap in another 2-3 years.  

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8 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

So should Bowles have been fired?  Or was he dealt a bad hand all these years from horrific roster management?

Please SEE Todd Bowles circa 2019...31st in the NFL in Points Allowed.

Bowles should NEVER have been Upped to DC from the lowly assistant jobs he had for over 20 years, much less being made HC (he’s a good DC with 9 All Pros on his unit).

And Bowles is a better HC than Adam Gase..Unreal....”the NYJ torturing their fan base for decades”

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14 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Of course not, but it’s just funny how fans rallied around Rex up until his last day even when it was obvious he was tearing the franchise apart, but they’re ready to bounce Gase almost immediately 

Are we seriously comparing Gase with Rex who got 42 wins out of Sanchez n Geno, possibly the worst back to back Jets starting QBs of all time? Gase doesn’t have a leg to stand on. Not unless u think he made Peyton Manning. 

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9 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Fair enough.  But that doesn't have anything to do with Adam Gase.  It's just about appearances to the prospective next HC that he'll be given a fair shake.

The appearance that you’ll give the next hire more than half a season to get it turned around is kind of an important recruiting tool.

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9 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

He is destroying a potential franchise Qb right before our eyes.  If it is a mistake you correct it now.  There will always be good candidates, you just have to pick the right one.

We gave Rex and Bowles what, 4-5 years a piece?  Didn't help us this time around.

I disagree that there will be good candidates who’d take this job, but maybe that’s just because I’m embittered by our last five coaching searches which netted us also-rans. The most credentialed coach we’ve hired since Parcells was Todd Bowles, and that was after giving Rex six years. Gase wasn’t even part of the coaching search—he was a couch they picked up off the side of the road. Coaching prospects want stability first and foremost, and they wouldn’t be getting that here, at all. It’s an impossible sell to a top-tier candidate, imo

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8 minutes ago, CurtMart said:

Are we seriously comparing Gase with Rex who got 42 wins out of Sanchez n Geno, possibly the worst back to back Jets starting QBs of all time? Gase doesn’t have a leg to stand on. Not unless u think he made Peyton Manning. 

Rex is 59 years old and out of the league despite his begging for interviews at the start of every offseason.

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12 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

So your defense is basically he's only human and he's doing the best he can. I guess that's something.

I honestly don't believe he is even trying. I'm not speaking in hyperbole, I genuinely think he is mentally weak (see inability to handle criticism during press conferences, and COMPLETE inability to make eye contact when defending himself) and I believe he isn't even trying to coach this team. 

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16 minutes ago, JoeWillieWhiteShoesHOF said:

Why is Lev Bell averaging 3.3 yards a carry?

Probably for the same reason he only averaged 4.0 YPC for the 13-3 Steelers running behind three Pro Bowl offensive linemen

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7 hours ago, JoeWillieWhiteShoesHOF said:

I almost always agree with you, but not this time.

Just look at the data produced by Gase in his coaching career, it’s abysmal outside of the time he was kissing up to Peyton Manning and bringing him coffee.  I was hoping the rest of his record could be wrote off to having bad QBs, but when I see him not rolling Darnold out, not scheming protections, and letting Darnold just get rocked week in and week out, I have to reassess my initial feelings.  

I don’t see an “Offense Guru” or “QB Whisperer” I’m just seeing a terrible coach, which makes me look back on his record of having teams finish at the back of the pack in offensive statistics, even adjusting for not having the best players.  I’m seeing a coach who barely can put up More than 1 TD over close to his last 20 games...that is a serious TREND.  Not indicative of any “Offensive Guru”. 

I hope I’m proven wrong and this gets turned around.  But what I’ve seen so far is someone first and foremost is destroying the potential Franchise QB, who has almost totally lost the team, someone who is not even close to being a Leader in any sense of the word, and someone who exacerbates problems 10 fold when they materialize.  When anything goes wrong with Gase they snowball into a disaster, evidence of that is his huge number of double digit losses.

Once a coach has lost his team he has to be fired.  There is no bringing the team back.

This is where the Jets are....Today.    

I disagree that Gase has lost the team.  I don't see that.  We've lived through the backstabbing end of the Rex regime and several of the Bowles years, that's not happening here.  Some very big stars are in the roster-  Mosley and Bell in particular-  and they aren't taking shots at all.

As for the reason we are 1-7, you break it into two parts:

First 4 games-  Down to the third string quarterback. 

Second 4 games - OL beyond salvage, hurt players not coming back, more players getting hurt.

SAR I

 

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5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Rex is 59 years old and out of the league despite his begging for interviews at the start of every offseason.

Where do you see Gase in 2 years?

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16 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The appearance that you’ll give the next hire more than half a season to get it turned around is kind of an important recruiting tool.

What about the prior 2 HCs, who were given 6 years (Rex) and 4 years (Bowles)?

Also, are you saying that Gase deserves to be fired but you just think we're between a rock and a hard place and so we have to keep him for another year?

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2 minutes ago, CurtMart said:

Where do you see Gase in 2 years?

Probably the OC of a college program.

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Just now, T0mShane said:

Probably the OC of a college program.

No, we're talking about after the Jets fire him.

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2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

What about the prior 2 HCs, who were given 6 years (Rex) and 4 years (Bowles)?

Rex is garbage, but Bowles is a fairly respected coach in the league who got kneecapped by Maccagnan, and imo letting Maccagnan fire Bowles, only to get fired himself five months later, was as organizationally inept as it gets. To compound that absurdity by then firing the coach you just hired to fix the disaster the newly-fired GM created would look terrible. It reeks of instability and buffoonery. If you want to be rid of Gase, you’ve gotta hope he quits at the end of the year *or* you have to hope Joe Douglas has a guy he wants to hire that’ll actually take the job. I don’t think you can fire Gase and then start cold-calling prospective coaches because you’re just going to end up with another baggage-laden dreg like Jay Gruden or, you know, Adam Gase.

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52 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Holy sh*t.  

You can't possibly believe this.  They went 4-12 last year.  Fans may spout playoffs, but they had to change a whole lot of parts.  That is the definition of rebuild.  They spent money?  That is how you rebuild.  Spend money and draft.  They have not had a good team or spent money in ages.  They have to spend it sometime.  

2015 was a rebuild year.  2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019 were rebuild years.  Now 2020 is a rebuild year too.  

https://www.newyorkjets.com/news/what-are-realistic-expectations-for-the-jets-in-2019

“Jets should be in the conversation in December.”

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jppelzman/2019/09/03/new-york-jets-nfl-betting-odds/

“Projected win total: 7.5”

 

92%+ said Jets would win 7 or more games. 
 

Where is the rebuild? 2019 was NOT supposed to be a rebuild year. After the initial losses N injuries, we waived the white flag. But even then, we shown no fight back skills or signs. 

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1 hour ago, Philc1 said:

We have scored 133 less points on offense this year after adding Bell, Osemele, Kalil, Crowder

And yet somehow this hot mess has nothing to do with Gase?

Osemele was damaged goods, refused to play hurt, and forced his way off the team.

Kallil was retired and checked out and by the time he started to show some life got injured and can't or won't play.

Bell is the victim of box stacking and an OL that has 4 guys who weren't starters and 1 guy playing out of position.

Crowder was supposed to be a big asset because Herndon and Enunwa were going to pull coverage off of him.  Oops.  With those two gone, Crowder gets doubled because no one respects Thomas and Sam has no time to hit Robbie. 

There you go.  Injuries.  Logic.  But I know, it's boring, you've heard "injuries" too many times so you need to manufacture a new narrative, a new episode of One Hurt Jets Drive must have a new script and so now it's all about the head coach.  "Fire Gase!" because the spoiled and ignorant are bored.

SAR I

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Just now, T0mShane said:

because you’re just going to end up with another baggage-laden dreg like Jay Gruden or, you know, Adam Gase.

So you agree that Gase has done a bad job then?

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11 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Also, are you saying that Gase deserves to be fired but you just think we're between a rock and a hard place and so we have to keep him for another year?

The odds are higher that Gase performs well in his second year with a team in the second year of a playbook and a system they've learned as opposed to a new head coach starting us all over again.  Sam Darnold in his third offensive system is more damaging than giving Gase another shot.

He's got a 4 year contract and isn't going anywhere.  Wrap your brain around that.  Start talking about something productive instead of trying to get an unfireable guy fired.

SAR I

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1 minute ago, SAR I said:

The odds are higher that Gase performs well in his second year with a team in the second year of a playbook and a system they've learned as opposed to a new head coach starting us all over again.  Sam Darnold in his third offensive system is more damaging than giving Gase another shot.

He's got a 4 year contract and isn't going anywhere.  Wrap your brain around that.  Start talking about something productive instead of trying to get an unfireable guy fired.

SAR I

Has Gase done a good job this year in your opinion?  

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4 minutes ago, CurtMart said:

 

92%+ said Jets would win 7 or more games. 
 

Where is the rebuild? 2019 was NOT supposed to be a rebuild year. After the initial losses N injuries, we waived the white flag. But even then, we shown no fight back skills or signs. 

Where is the list of players that were injured during the first 4 games that came back to bail us out in the subsequent 4 games?

That's right, there aren't any.  Darnold?  He's not himself.  Probably going to find out that the mono hit him more than we know.

"Fight back skills or signs".  There we go again, bored of the truth, trying to manufacture a story that is more exciting so that you don't have to repeat yourself every week.  Sorry.  Repeat after me:  "It's the injuries".

SAR I

 

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1 minute ago, SAR I said:

The odds are higher that Gase performs well in his second year with a team in the second year of a playbook and a system they've learned as opposed to a new head coach starting us all over again.  Sam Darnold in his third offensive system is more damaging than giving Gase another shot.

He's got a 4 year contract and isn't going anywhere.  Wrap your brain around that.  Start talking about something productive instead of trying to get an unfireable guy fired.

SAR I

It’s wild: the constructive thing is to hope players come back from injury, Gase shows a little something, Darnold pulls it together with better protection, and you go into 2020 with a clear list of positional needs and a plan for free agency. Instead, we’ve got straight-up nihilists who just want to fire everybody in sight and then, somehow, hire some imaginary super-coach whom they absolutely cannot name, but they just *know* is out there waiting for Chris Johnson to call. 

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2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Has Gase done a good job this year in your opinion?  

Yes.

Because with this amount of injury it would be very easy for the team to quit and backstab and none of that is happening.  Bill Walsh couldn't win with this offense, so why would we expect Gase to?

Just a reminder:  We were a 4-12 team with a 21 year old quarterback that felt optimistic about this season because of 2 new offensive line veterans (Osemele, Kallil), the return of 2 offensive weapons (Enunwa, Herndon), the addition of a slot WR (Crowder), the addition of a top RB (Bell), and the maturation of the QB (Darnold). 

4 of those players haven't been on the field.  1 of those players was minimized or missed the first 4 games due to disease.  2 of those are skill players that are easy to neutralize without the others. 

SAR I

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8 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

It’s wild: the constructive thing is to hope players come back from injury, Gase shows a little something, Darnold pulls it together with better protection, and you go into 2020 with a clear list of positional needs and a plan for free agency. Instead, we’ve got straight-up nihilists who just want to fire everybody in sight and then, somehow, hire some imaginary super-coach whom they absolutely cannot name, but they just *know* is out there waiting for Chris Johnson to call. 

Agreed.  SOJF's are just insane, mob mentality at its finest, Green Lives Matter if I ever saw it.

Take last year's 4-12 offense, take away all the free agents, take away the 2 best receivers, lose the QB for half the season, and you wind up with a squad that is dysfunctional and worse than last year.  Surprised?  Who could be? 

Adam Gase's fingerprints are not on that situation.  He's a head coach.  He's not a doctor.  He's not God.

SAR I

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