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Untouchable

Alex Leatherwood vs Tristan Wirfs

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I’ve come to grips with Andrew Thomas most likely being a pipe dream at this point.

The Jets are going to win at least 2-3 more games, finish 4-12 or 5-11, and end up picking in the #6-10 range in all likelihood.

I’ve been watching more and more of Leatherwood and I honestly think I prefer him over a guy like Wirfs.

Leatherwood looks a lot like Brick. Long arms, good bend, and shows clean footwork. 

Wirfs has looked a little overwhelmed over the last couple of weeks. I still think he’s a legit Top 20 pick and comes from a school that churns out quality NFL OL by the truckload, but I’ve soured on him just a tad.

So what do you guys think?

If you’re in charge of the Jets and Thomas is already off the board but you’re hellbent on taking an OT in Round 1...who are you picking?

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I think Wills is the better Alabama tackle.  Wirfs tape thus far this year hasn’t been spectacular, but people at this point are raving about his athleticism and potential.  That worries me a little, would like to see him a little more fundamentally sound, especially if we are talking top 10 pick.  

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I don't want to be "projecting" a guy with a Top 10 pick.  We need a fundamentally sound guy who has performed well against top competition. Can't take a swing on a guy who has great athleticism but "if he cleans up his technique he'll be great."  Just my opinion.

Given Darnold heading into Year 3 in 2020, I could argue that this is the single most important Draft and offseason the Jets have had in a decade coming up.  We need to nail it.

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3 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

I think Wills is the better Alabama tackle.  Wirfs tape thus far this year hasn’t been spectacular, but people at this point are raving about his athleticism and potential.  That worries me a little, would like to see him a little more fundamentally sound, especially if we are talking top 10 pick.  

That scares the shi* out of me for an OT.  Some really bad ots have been picked for that reason.

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6 hours ago, Untouchable said:

I’ve come to grips with Andrew Thomas most likely being a pipe dream at this point.

The Jets are going to win at least 2-3 more games, finish 4-12 or 5-11, and end up picking in the #6-10 range in all likelihood.

I’ve been watching more and more of Leatherwood and I honestly think I prefer him over a guy like Wirfs.

Leatherwood looks a lot like Brick. Long arms, good bend, and shows clean footwork. 

Wirfs has looked a little overwhelmed over the last couple of weeks. I still think he’s a legit Top 20 pick and comes from a school that churns out quality NFL OL by the truckload, but I’ve soured on him just a tad.

So what do you guys think?

If you’re in charge of the Jets and Thomas is already off the board but you’re hellbent on taking an OT in Round 1...who are you picking?

Honestly, I think seeing Chuma Edoga's comparative play on the left side versus the right side makes me reconsider being so cavalier about a guy playing RT being able to switch over to the left side. Wirfs is playing on the right side right now. I have no idea if he is going to be able to play on the left side, but I am assuming that Wirfs is more comfortable on the right side. Alaric Jackson isn't a reason to keep Wirfs on the right side. 

I actually like Leatherwood's game. He's pretty twitchy for a guy that big and he has some vines on him. The one red flag with Leatherwood is that his punch is not very accurate, he needs to do a better job of landing that punch on the defender's chest versus hitting the defender's shoulder pad. 

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27 minutes ago, maury77 said:

Honestly, I think seeing Chuma Edoga's comparative play on the left side versus the right side makes me reconsider being so cavalier about a guy playing RT being able to switch over to the left side. Wirfs is playing on the right side right now. I have no idea if he is going to be able to play on the left side, but I am assuming that Wirfs is more comfortable on the right side. Alaric Jackson isn't a reason to keep Wirfs on the right side. 

I actually like Leatherwood's game. He's pretty twitchy for a guy that big and he has some vines on him. The one red flag with Leatherwood is that his punch is not very accurate, he needs to do a better job of landing that punch on the defender's chest versus hitting the defender's shoulder pad. 

Agreed completely

Hell, watching some of Iowa at the end of last season, I was actually more impressed by Jackson than Wirfs.

And with the injury, Jackson may even be able to be had in the early 3rd.

I think Leatherwood, similar to Brick, will be a 10 year rock at LT. He may not be a future all-pro or rack up pro-bowl after pro-bowl, but he’s a dude you can stick on the left side and not have to worry about your QB getting killed. I also think he’s a little better than Brick was, at least coming out of UVA, as a run blocker. Not as refined technique wise, but not sloppy either. Pass protection will always be his strong suit, but I don’t think he’ll get pushed around in the run game.

And he’s pretty much tailor made for a zone blocking scheme.

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3 minutes ago, Untouchable said:

Agreed completely

Hell, watching some of Iowa at the end of last season, I was actually more impressed by Jackson than Wirfs.

And with the injury, Jackson may even be able to be had in the early 3rd.

I think Leatherwood, similar to Brick, will be a 10 year rock at LT. He may not be a future all-pro or rack up pro-bowl after pro-bowl, but he’s a dude you can stick on the left side and not have to worry about your QB getting killed. I also think he’s a little better than Brick was, at least coming out of UVA, as a run blocker. Not as refined technique wise, but not sloppy either. Pass protection will always be his strong suit, but I don’t think he’ll get pushed around in the run game.

And he’s pretty much tailor made for a zone blocking scheme.

That is so critical. Part of the reason I was slightly pessimistic about the Osemele signing is that he was tailor made for a gap scheme and sucked in a zone scheme (which is what the Jets were going to run more of). 

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He's raw and should not be considered in the first round but I love Prince Tega Wanogho, the Auburn LT, as a prototype NFL LT prospect. 

I don't think you can compare Wirfs to a guy like Edoga (taken in the 3rd round) as far as guys who have the potential to move from RT to LT. They are in two completely different categories. Wirfs has great strength, he is a monster in the run game and could just as easily move inside to OG at the NFL level, IMO. He's versatile, a different kind of lineman. 

I like Leatherwood a lot. I don't think he is as good in the run game as far as the push he gets but he is solid as a rock in pass protection and not a liability in the run game by any means.

If the Jets find themselves drafting 6th-10th and A.Thomas is off the board you have to consider trading down. If you are hell bent on an OT I'm just going to go with my gut and take the more versatile Wirfs. I know that's playing is safe but worst case scenario he ends up a rock solid OG or RT. But it's close.  

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Wirfs seems like a RT prospect only and although I didn’t love the pick, unless his character concerns are continuing behind the scenes the team needs to stick with Edoga at RT through the offseason, hope he can get stronger, and solidify that spot. 

So that being said I think Austin Jackson would be the name to watch if we are picking 8-10 as he has the upside and long term starting potential you need at LT.  

IMO though the ideal situation is to move down if someone like Herbert is there. I dont care if we get the “value” that the draft chart says, getting an extra second round pick in a draft like this that is strong at OT and WR can really allow us to fill multiple needs and use a high second rounder on someone like Creed Humphrey.   

I could even see Joe D looking at someone like Trey Adams as a great value in the early second round and taking bisadaz at center in the first if he were to trade down. 

This draft happens to have the depth we need at OL and hopefully we can solidify center and LT for the future out of this draft just like we did with Brick and Mangold.  

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5 hours ago, BCJet said:

Wirfs seems like a RT prospect only and although I didn’t love the pick, unless his character concerns are continuing behind the scenes the team needs to stick with Edoga at RT through the offseason, hope he can get stronger, and solidify that spot. 

So that being said I think Austin Jackson would be the name to watch if we are picking 8-10 as he has the upside and long term starting potential you need at LT.  

IMO though the ideal situation is to move down if someone like Herbert is there. I dont care if we get the “value” that the draft chart says, getting an extra second round pick in a draft like this that is strong at OT and WR can really allow us to fill multiple needs and use a high second rounder on someone like Creed Humphrey.   

I could even see Joe D looking at someone like Trey Adams as a great value in the early second round and taking bisadaz at center in the first if he were to trade down. 

This draft happens to have the depth we need at OL and hopefully we can solidify center and LT for the future out of this draft just like we did with Brick and Mangold.  

I don't think we're in a position to take a chance hoping Edoga will step up. He shouldn't have been playing this season anyways.

Beachum is our best lineman by a lot. He's not great but he's competent and will be the likely guy to remain starting on the OL out of anyone. He may get shifted to RT if we draft a top LT . Either way I think he returns and starts next season. Edoga may get shifted inside or be taken out of the team, more likely the latter.

The interior of the line is where we're the weakest in the league. It's what needs a complete overhaul. A HOF talent like Mangold is unlikely to emerge but I'd agree trading down and solidifying as much of the line as possible, even if a Jerry Jeudy was sitting on the board. I'd agree too that "value" needs to be put to the side in this draft. There's one glaring aspect of the team that needs fixing and that has to be the priority. Everything else we can work around.

 

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56 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

I don't think we're in a position to take a chance hoping Edoga will step up. He shouldn't have been playing this season anyways.

Beachum is our best lineman by a lot. He's not great but he's competent and will be the likely guy to remain starting on the OL out of anyone. He may get shifted to RT if we draft a top LT . Either way I think he returns and starts next season. Edoga may get shifted inside or be taken out of the team, more likely the latter.

The interior of the line is where we're the weakest in the league. It's what needs a complete overhaul. A HOF talent like Mangold is unlikely to emerge but I'd agree trading down and solidifying as much of the line as possible, even if a Jerry Jeudy was sitting on the board. I'd agree too that "value" needs to be put to the side in this draft. There's one glaring aspect of the team that needs fixing and that has to be the priority. Everything else we can work around.

 

Look, if Beachem can/willing to move to RT at this point in his career, sign me up for that and keep developing Egoda as the swing tackle.  Thats money well spent IMO.

Totally agree on the interior of the line, which is why Creed Humphrey or Biadasz is a near necessity for this team.  Why we passed on signing a center is something Ill never understand, but at this point we need to use a high draft pick on one, and keep harrison as a backup center and guard.  

As for receivers, this class is beyond deep, we can get a first round talent in the 50s, but need to find a way to get an additional top 50 pick to get a center and OT.

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I guess I’m more bullish on Edoga than most of you (except for RobR, who loves him). Edoga’s biggest flaw right now is his play strength, but he is a 21 year old kid. Stick him and Quinnen in the weight room for a full off season and watch the results next year. I’m comfortable going into next season with Edoga penciled in at RT.


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16 hours ago, maury77 said:

I guess I’m more bullish on Edoga than most of you (except for RobR, who loves him). Edoga’s biggest flaw right now is his play strength, but he is a 21 year old kid. Stick him and Quinnen in the weight room for a full off season and watch the results next year. I’m comfortable going into next season with Edoga penciled in at RT.


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Offensive Tackles almost always have trouble coming out of the gate since it's one of the hardest positions on the field to play. So many here who love and worship Brick forget how awful he was his rookie season and sh*tty he was his second season. It wasn't until his third year until he started too become that rock.

I loved Edoga pre draft and even I think he's playing like sh*t right now. The way he is getting beat this year didn't coincide with his tape. Is it coaching? Youth? Scheme? Or just that I'm dead wrong and he sucks?

I'm willing to give him time because he was dominant in college and played in some big games. I still don't think he's a guard. 

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What about this guy? Jeremiah seems to like him and Joe Douglas may value his opinion as he was in consideration to join the jets.

 

 

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22 hours ago, Dinamite said:

What about this guy? Jeremiah seems to like him and Joe Douglas may value his opinion as he was in consideration to join the jets.

 

 

Hmmmm, I remember someone saying this about a month ago in this very thread.  

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1 minute ago, sec101row23 said:

Hmmmm, I remember someone saying this about a month ago in this very thread.  

Yes, my bad! I should have linked your post.   I think you raised an important point about athletic potential vs fundamentals.  In a league starved for quality tackles, he may still go high though.

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Just now, Dinamite said:

Yes, my bad! I should have linked your post.   I think you raised an important point about athletic potential vs fundamentals.  In a league starved for quality tackles, he may still go high though.

It’s all good, I was responding more to the “professional” draftniks coming around on Wills now.   

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On 12/2/2019 at 9:47 AM, sec101row23 said:

It’s all good, I was responding more to the “professional” draftniks coming around on Wills now.   

Willis is starting to get a lot of hype. I personally didn’t know he was such a strong LT prospect until recently. 

That being said if Austin Jackson enters the draft there will be 2 QBs, 2 pass rushers, 2 WRs 1 CB and 4 LT prospects all with very high grades at positions teams will value.   So that will likely allow us to grab one of the tackles picking 11th or better OR allow us to trade down if we are picking 7/8 and still potentially add one. 

It will be a really strong OT draft if Willis and Jackson enter which is great for the Jets 

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1 hour ago, BCJet said:

Willis is starting to get a lot of hype. I personally didn’t know he was such a strong LT prospect until recently. 

That being said if Austin Jackson enters the draft there will be 2 QBs, 2 pass rushers, 2 WRs 1 CB and 4 LT prospects all with very high grades at positions teams will value.   So that will likely allow us to grab one of the tackles picking 11th or better OR allow us to trade down if we are picking 7/8 and still potentially add one. 

It will be a really strong OT draft if Willis and Jackson enter which is great for the Jets 

IMO, just based on watching Bama games this year, Wills looks like the smoother more natural OT prospect than Leatherwood.  Also, Tua was left handed, which makes the RT his blindside protector.  I havent paid much attention to Austin Jackson, most of the time I was watching the WRs when watching USC this year.   
 

If they both come out, which they should, there could be some OT prospects sitting there for the Jets.  OTs and WRs by the bunches this year, let’s see if Douglas is competent.  

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4 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

IMO, just based on watching Bama games this year, Wills looks like the smoother more natural OT prospect than Leatherwood.  Also, Tua was left handed, which makes the RT his blindside protector.  I havent paid much attention to Austin Jackson, most of the time I was watching the WRs when watching USC this year.   
 

If they both come out, which they should, there could be some OT prospects sitting there for the Jets.  OTs and WRs by the bunches this year, let’s see if Douglas is competent.  

It’s hard to envision a scenario where the jets don’t take a tackle in the first round.  I don’t see them taking a wr either.  It will also be interesting to see what they do with the rb position, i always want them to take one in the 2nd but they never do.  Lamont Jordan where art thou?

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Doing some reading on Willis and he is apparently an elite run blocker who also has an athletic profile that should allow him to be an excellent pass blocker. Seems like an ideal player to me. 

The wild card will be Austin Jackson as it’s possible that both Willis and Thomas grade out as elite prospects and both go in the top 10 leaving Jackson as a player to target if we trade down. 

Its really sucks to always be rooting for the jets to lose games at the end of the year but the truth is if we wind up picking 4 versus 9 we could come away with extra picks in a WR and OL heavy draft and still get an elite LT prospect. Hate to say it but losing out is probably the best thing for this franchise. 

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1 hour ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Yeah, not like Alabama produces good pros.

It would really suck if Sam had to hand off to Derrick Henry, Mark Ingram and/or Josh Jacobs and only had Julio Jones, Amari Cooper or Calvin Ridley to throw to? 

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