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Sam Darnold is a “special” QB

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2 hours ago, Y3k said:

No... a throw away is an accurate throw if that’s what the QB intended to do 

I see. We're going to need new stats that take into account this new 'formula' you've defined in support of Darnold: if it's incomplete, it's still accurate" because you know exactly where Darnold is aiming. It's amazing how he's ever thrown an INT other than the OL not giving him time.

I mean, why even have empirical statistics when it comes to Darnold?  We'll just go with your Crystal Ball/Hindsight/Wishful Thinking. I'm ok with that...

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4 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Too much being made of fancy throws. There are no style points. The position requires you to consistently throw it to the guy. He's had his ups and downs. The last 3 games have been promising and good, but he still has a lot of work to do. He's still 27th overall in DVOA with the last 3 good starts. The Baltimore and Pittsburgh games are going to be benchmark type of matchups.

 

Agreed, except I’d add Buffalo to that list. He’s played very well the last three weeks, and there’s no reason he shouldn’t the next two also.

The only thing I find amusing about this victory lap the “see no evil fan boys” are taking now is that he’s doing it against the same bad teams they belittled Josh Allen for beating earlier.

All of us are happy to see Sam play well, however when he does the downside is we’re forced to listen to these same guys go way overboard proclaiming the same over the top comparisons and projections they do whenever he plays a good game.

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4 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

 

Just for the heck of it I pulled up the stats from the Cowboys - Patriots game this past weekend.

Dak Prescott has guys like Amari Cooper and Ezekiel Elliott, right?  He has an All Pro offensive line?  And he did this vs. the Pats...

1886838531_ScreenShot2019-11-26at2_21_18PM.png.ee50a2e5da2c5855b6a981937a2afeec.png

So Sam had no protection and no weapons and had a crappy game vs. New England?  Color me shocked!

Jerry Jones was reportedly upset after the game and made several statements that he expected more from the Cowboys. I thought he was referring to Dak but the press spins this as their HC should be fired. The problem is that Dak is a below average QB surrounded by top tier talent. If you put Sam on that team they'd be a legit SB contender.

I hope Jerry does give Dak a 40M contract as that would handicap the Boys going forward.

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4 minutes ago, 14 in Green said:

Agreed, except I’d add Buffalo to that list. He’s played very well the last three weeks, and there’s no reason he shouldn’t the next two also.

The only thing I find amusing about this victory lap the “see no evil fan boys” are taking now is that he’s doing it against the same bad teams they belittled Josh Allen for beating earlier.

All of us are happy to see Sam play well, however when he does the downside is we’re forced to listen to these same guys go way overboard proclaiming the same over the top comparisons and projections they do whenever he plays a good game.

Zzzzzzzzz your shtick is over 

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7 hours ago, CanadienJetsFan said:

 Sams not flashy but he’s got all the throws in his  repertoire. The NFL likes to talk about Jackson and Mahomes. Let them. 

that's EXACTLY what we want.

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3 hours ago, Sonny Werblin said:

He should not have thrown that pass. It was a poor decision. He chose to throw a risky pass that had to be perfect to work over running for an easy first down. 

Totally agree. I was screaming - run - run - don't pass it - GREAT THROW AND CATCH. Sam had an easy 10 yards of open field and I'd prefer he'd decide to move the chains with a guaranteed easy run rather than choose to throw a low percentage throw. It does show how much confidence he has in his ability to make tight throws.

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The Darnold we’ve seen the past three games looks a lot like the guy we saw the last four games of last year. Does his recent play represent growth of a young QB or just another hot streak in what’s been a peak-and-valley start to his career? I don’t know. Yes, he makes dazzling plays that not a lot of QBs can make. But he’s also been uniquely boneheaded with the football this season. He still needs to prove he can keep it together against a good, blitzing defense. How he plays against the Steelers, Ravens and Bills will be telling.  

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Why are people so surprised?  Darnold is a Franchise QB and a franchise player.  He  is a very special player but lets be honest- there are many special players in the NFL and the Jets have drafted so poorly that they always miss out on them.

Darnold is not only a franchise QB he is also the first time Jets have  gotten a true superstar in the draft.  Keyshawn Johnson was a #1 pick and he was only a very good player.  The Jets traded the number 1 pick passing on Orlando Pace- but even if they  took him his greatness is not the type we fans see in the  highlife reel. Other high picks like D'Brickshaw Fergueson were successful but the guys were not superstars.  Darnold is the first time the Jets delivered on an incredibly high pick.  He looks better to fans who remember Blair Thomas, Kyle Brady, and Jeff Lageman.  Darnold represents- hopefully- closing the book on the Jets always- and I mean always- missing out on superstar players in the draft.

Jadaveon Clowney represents is a good example of a way to describe past Jet drafts.  Clowney  is a very good, but not great player, drafted high in the draft.  The Jets had a history of always drafting high when guys like Clowney headlined the draft.  Darnold was the first time they  have drafted a guy whose ceiling is great and HOF.  I still say he is better than Mayfield and will be the best player chosen in the 2018 draft.

 

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I’ll know he’s turned a page when he doesn’t let an awful INT snowball into an awful game for the rest of this season. Have to stay consistent. 

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LOVE the people on here always complaining about Darnold.....yeah because we have had such a long line of elite QBs. HUGE shoes for Sammy to fill: immortals like Geno, Hack, Sanchize, the Beard, etc etc etc.

Come on people! Not like he’s replacing Montana or Brady here!

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23 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

The problem is that Dak is a below average QB surrounded by top tier talent. If you put Sam on that team they'd be a legit SB contender.

You are why the Jets will never be good.

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6 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I wish we could read the names of all those who  voted that Sam wouldn't amount to anything a few weeks ago and compare it to comments in this thread.

To be fair back then he was throwing the ball to his opponents about as much as his team. I want to see him do it against a top ten defense. So far so good. 

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3 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

To be fair back then he was throwing the ball to his opponents about as much as his team. I want to see him do it against a top ten defense. So far so good. 

Cowboys are a top 10 defense 

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5 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

To be fair back then he was throwing the ball to his opponents about as much as his team. I want to see him do it against a top ten defense. So far so good. 

There's two more gimmes against bottom feeders before they close out the season against three top five pass defenses. By then everybody is gonna be boycrushing so hard he could literally drop back for a pass, sh*t himself, and burst into tears and nobody would care.

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13 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

You are why the Jets will never be good.

Maybe you didn't understand. I don't want Sam on the Cowboys. I want JD to build a team like Dallas has around Sam.

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13 minutes ago, The Crusher said:
hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I wish we could read the names of all those who  voted that Sam wouldn't amount to anything a few weeks ago and compare it to comments in this thread.

People actually voted that Sam Darnold wouldn't amount to anything?

I think people were wondering WTF was wrong with him. I can't imagine anyone saying that he wouldn't be good. Just that, at that point, he WASN'T good.

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4 hours ago, Y3k said:

Who is measuring this and how?

Pro Football Reference.  You'd have to ask them how.  

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11 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

Maybe you didn't understand. I don't want Sam on the Cowboys. I want JD to build a team like Dallas has around Sam.

Maybe you don't understand. Prescott has the highest DYAR in the league and is an MVP candidate for a first-place team. The suggestion that they'd be better off with Darnold is contemptibly moronic.

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55 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

There's two more gimmes against bottom feeders before they close out the season against three top five pass defenses. By then everybody is gonna be boycrushing so hard he could literally drop back for a pass, sh*t himself, and burst into tears and nobody would care.

As long as it’s not intercepted I’m good 

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59 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said:

Maybe you don't understand. Prescott has the highest DYAR in the league and is an MVP candidate for a first-place team. The suggestion that they'd be better off with Darnold is contemptibly moronic.

What the hell are you talking about?  Legit mvp candidate?  laughable.

Dallas has a great oline, a great back and a true #1 WR, all things our QB does not have, as a matter of fact he has no one close to a #1 Wr, one of the worst olines in the league.

You can think Darnold sucks all you want but most QBs in the league have a hard time if the other parts of the team are a liability, see aaron rogers getting his ass kicked all over the field this past week.

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I think most people think that Dam is just a jag with a top end ceiling of a Garret or flacco. There is nothing special about Darnold or his game, or his arm strength, or accuracy that is elite.

He is above average once the play breaks down, but so far nothing impressive or anything that shows he might actually be a franchise qb

People actually voted that Sam Darnold wouldn't amount to anything?
I think people were wondering WTF was wrong with him. I can't imagine anyone saying that he wouldn't be good. Just that, at that point, he WASN'T good.


Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using JetNation.com mobile app

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9 hours ago, JoeWillieWhiteShoesHOF said:

 

 

^ This is a terrible play call, terrible protection, but Sam made it work. His brilliance at sandlot football when plays like the above break down are why people are in love with Sam. However the below needs to go: 

8 hours ago, Grandy said:

Good play call, excellent protection, and instead of taking what the defense was giving him (running for the first against man coverage) in a game in which they were already ahead, he took an unnecessary risk by throwing off a bad base to a receiver who was a behind the defender at the release of the ball. Just a terrible decision, regardless of the outcome. That very easily could have been a pick6.

Obviously you don’t want to coach the productivity out of the player by making him completely risk averse, but he has to know the situation. If the above were a one-off, you chalk it up to him making a great play. The fact that it’s just another in a long line of questionable decisions is where it gets frustrating, because we all want him to throw TDs for the Jets in January and February games for a long time.

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2 hours ago, Samtorobby47 said:

I’ll know he’s turned a page when he doesn’t let an awful INT snowball into an awful game for the rest of this season. Have to stay 

2 hours ago, Rob123 said:

Why are people so surprised?  Darnold is a Franchise QB and a franchise player.  He  is a very special player but lets be honest- there are many special players in the NFL and the Jets have drafted so poorly that they always miss out on them.

Darnold is not only a franchise QB he is also the first time Jets have  gotten a true superstar in the draft.  Keyshawn Johnson was a #1 pick and he was only a very good player.  The Jets traded the number 1 pick passing on Orlando Pace- but even if they  took him his greatness is not the type we fans see in the  highlife reel. Other high picks like D'Brickshaw Fergueson were successful but the guys were not superstars.  Darnold is the first time the Jets delivered on an incredibly high pick.  He looks better to fans who remember Blair Thomas, Kyle Brady, and Jeff Lageman.  Darnold represents- hopefully- closing the book on the Jets always- and I mean always- missing out on superstar players in the draft.

Jadaveon Clowney represents is a good example of a way to describe past Jet drafts.  Clowney  is a very good, but not great player, drafted high in the draft.  The Jets had a history of always drafting high when guys like Clowney headlined the draft.  Darnold was the first time they  have drafted a guy whose ceiling is great and HOF.  I still say he is better than Mayfield and will be the best player chosen in the 2018 draft.

 

Revis?

 

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10 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Too much being made of fancy throws. There are no style points. The position requires you to consistently throw it to the guy. He's had his ups and downs. The last 3 games have been promising and good, but he still has a lot of work to do. He's still 27th overall in DVOA with the last 3 good starts. The Baltimore and Pittsburgh games are going to be benchmark type of matchups.

 

No “style points”???? 

If you don’t think some of the “stylish throws he has hit over his short career don’t prove that he has potential Top 5 QB talent then it’s worthless trying to hold an intelligent argument with you.  

I already asked Darnold’s detractors WHO in the NFL outside of Mahomes could have thrown that rope over a defender into the smallest of windows?  No answers that I have seen yet.  That single throw blows the “he has an Average arm” statement out of the water.  There have been similar throws.  He really guns it when that’s what the SITUATION calls for.

Kid has put up 3 consecutive 30+ point games, if you count the first Buffalo game as a W which it should have been Darnold is 5-3 this year, with 4 games over 30 points.

Jet fans should be ecstatic, this guy IS a Franchise QB, there is no more debate.  

You want to cite statistics?  Throw out the New England game and his TD:INT ratio is 2:1.  His QB Rating OVER 100...that DVOA is totally SKEWED by the New England game.

But like I’ve been saying.  Don’t try to judge Darnold on statistics, judge him based on what you see.  What I see is an incredibly talented 22 year old QB lifting a team composed mostly of garbage from his Day 1, and making them COMPETITIVE anytime he gets the smallest amount of time to make throws.

So hypothetically, lets say his OL composed of guys who COULD NOT START on virtually any other team lets Baltimore steamroll Darnold just like they let New England, are you going to rush to write on these boards that “Darnold s*cks”?  I’m sure you will.

Darnold doesn’t have “a lot” of work to do.  Joe Douglas does.  His work will be trying to find a slew NFL quality players to surround Darnold.

 

 

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10 hours ago, Matt39 said:

Too much being made of fancy throws. There are no style points. The position requires you to consistently throw it to the guy. He's had his ups and downs. The last 3 games have been promising and good, but he still has a lot of work to do. He's still 27th overall in DVOA with the last 3 good starts. The Baltimore and Pittsburgh games are going to be benchmark type of matchups.

 

 

I said “Special” before this guy haha

Again, just LOOK at the throws, f*ck DVOA, along with any other metric you try to denigrate The Kid with.  You can’t see that he’s going to be a Top 5 QB? Easily.  Once he gets some just half way decent talent around him??  Get lucky and get him a real #1 WR along with a quality OL...he’s going to be Top 2.  Romo has said #1, and that’s definitely something to shoot for, but that will be tough as long as Mahomes is playing...Rejoice Jet Fans...

 

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7 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

^ This is a terrible play call, terrible protection, but Sam made it work. His brilliance at sandlot football when plays like the above break down are why people are in love with Sam. However the below needs to go: 

Good play call, excellent protection, and instead of taking what the defense was giving him (running for the first against man coverage) in a game in which they were already ahead, he took an unnecessary risk by throwing off a bad base to a receiver who was a behind the defender at the release of the ball. Just a terrible decision, regardless of the outcome. That very easily could have been a pick6.

Obviously you don’t want to coach the productivity out of the player by making him completely risk averse, but he has to know the situation. If the above were a one-off, you chalk it up to him making a great play. The fact that it’s just another in a long line of questionable decisions is where it gets frustrating, because we all want him to throw TDs for the Jets in January and February games for a long time.

Bad decision ANY way you slice it, agreed.

But I’m thinking Darnold was so “in the zone” and confidence level so high that he just “knew” he’d hit that throw.

I can already see he is going to have a career full of Head Coaches biting their lips in between saying “No, no, no” or “don’t, don’t, don’t” all the way up until the final result of a play is known to all....similar to Landry with Staubach and Holmgren with Favre.....with the majority of the time everyone loving the end result.

His style of play coupled with the crazy skills he has is going to translate into “a lotta points” and ultimately will make his prediction he made to Deion Sanders on Draft night of “a lotta Wins” come true.  That will come with more experience and roster upgrades.

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12 hours ago, Sonny Werblin said:

He should not have thrown that pass. It was a poor decision. He chose to throw a risky pass that had to be perfect to work over running for an easy first down. 

That's what I meant a few posts above about a bonehead decision that worked out anyway.

  • Darnold had a 100% chance of a 1st down and instead he threw a low-percentage attempt, to a receiver in double-coverage, sidearm, on the run, stepping to the left, that ended up some 6" away from a late-jumping defender's fingers.
  • He made an absolutely perfect throw, but right there anything less than a perfect throw is incomplete (and possibly picked off). He's accurate, but under those circumstances no one is that accurate every time on demand (and his throws with 20 yards of air certainly don't always fit in that football & a half window size even when he sets his feet properly and steps into his throw).
  • Even with a perfect throw: the pass could have been outright dropped; Anderson could have high-pointed it poorly; the first db could have leapt earlier and tipped it; Anderson could have bobbled it and gotten clocked while trying to secure it (coughing it up in the process); and Anderson could have gotten tackled immediately which would have negated the bigger play that made this risk worth it in hindsight.

Exciting play. Happy with the extra yardage. Happy to see he can make a great throw like that in a game situation. And still with all that, the smart decision there is to take a 100% guaranteed 6-8 yard first down run and slide.

It wasn't a mere showboating throw on Darnold's part, but still makes me think of Willie Mays Hayes basket-catching it: "Nice catch, Hayes. Don't ever f***ing do it again." 

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4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

That's what I meant a few posts above about a bonehead decision that worked out anyway.

  • Darnold had a 100% chance of a 1st down and instead he threw a low-percentage attempt, to a receiver in double-coverage, sidearm, on the run, stepping to the left, that ended up some 6" away from a late-jumping defender's fingers.
  • He made an absolutely perfect throw, but right there anything less than a perfect throw is incomplete (and possibly picked off). He's accurate, but under those circumstances no one is that accurate every time on demand (and his throws with 20 yards of air certainly don't always fit in that football & a half window size even when he sets his feet properly and steps into his throw).
  • Even with a perfect throw: the pass could have been outright dropped; Anderson could have high-pointed it poorly; the first db could have leapt earlier and tipped it; Anderson could have bobbled it and gotten clocked while trying to secure it (coughing it up in the process); and Anderson could have gotten tackled immediately which would have negated the bigger play that made this risk worth it in hindsight.

Exciting play. Happy with the extra yardage. Happy to see he can make a great throw like that in a game situation. And still with all that, the smart decision there is to take a 100% guaranteed 6-8 yard first down run and slide.

It wasn't a mere showboating throw on Darnold's part, but still makes me think of Willie Mays Hayes basket-catching it: "Nice catch, Hayes. Don't ever f***ing do it again." 

The question is whether Sam will accept that it was a poor decision. Brett favre throws that ball in the first game of his career AND the last. It’s hard for guys who’ve made incredible plays their whole lives to “choose” the smart, boring play.

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16 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I wish we could read the names of all those who  voted that Sam wouldn't amount to anything a few weeks ago and compare it to comments in this thread.

 

 

embarrassed shame GIF

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10 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

Jerry Jones was reportedly upset after the game and made several statements that he expected more from the Cowboys. I thought he was referring to Dak but the press spins this as their HC should be fired. The problem is that Dak is a below average QB surrounded by top tier talent. If you put Sam on that team they'd be a legit SB contender.

I hope Jerry does give Dak a 40M contract as that would handicap the Boys going forward.

Exactly. Outstanding assessment of Dak Prescott by you.

Absolutely the first thing I thought of when I heard Prescott had turned down $30Mill per year and wanted 40.

Sam Darnold could only dream of having say 1/3 the Talent that surrounds Prescott and even now there are some games over Darnold’s short career where he looks head and shoulders above and better than Prescott playing with his current bottom feeding Offensive unit.

Prescott is HIGHLY overrated and I predict Dallas will NEVER win anything substantial with him, even if he has 10 guys playing along side him who go to the Pro Bowl.  Would love to see how he would play with exactly what Darnold has to currently work with.

Man, if Prescott gets that $40Mill I shudder to think what Darnold will command 3 Years from now...$200Mill a Year?

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Lol at the idiot haters nit picking a “bad” decision where the QB made a great throw and play. If Robby takes a better angle after making the catch that is a TD... they were at the 50 yard line... he passes up a 15 yard scramble for a potential TD- is that really a bad decision? His WR was open... it just requires a high degree of difficulty throw.

do you really need me to make a cut up of all the risky throws that all time great QBs have made on what are considered their “great” plays? If you want a QB that literally never takes a chance then you are asking for Kirk Cousins. 

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