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The Class of '18 QBs are really Only as Good as their Situations

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21 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

*2019 DVOA: -22.1%

They hadn't calculated the Nati game in yet...

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55 minutes ago, Losmeister said:

They hadn't calculated the Nati game in yet...

Dak Prescott is the best QB in the NFL! 

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20 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

I see NoBowles has found a new handle.

 

20 hours ago, Maxman said:

Bu-Bye. I feel like your time could be better spent trying to "Fire the Johnsons" which is needed because the Jets aren't getting better even though they have "No Bowles".

I just want to point out that I called that it was him before Max did and I have absolutely no access to IP information. That's how much of a lunatic-stalker that guy is.

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On 12/2/2019 at 1:49 PM, T0mShane said:

If my son was drafted by the New York Jets, I legitimately wouldn’t allow him to sign the contract. I’d advise him to sit out the year and force a trade. No ******* way I send him to this meat grinder organization 

If your son was drafted by the Jets, he'd be a bad QB.  If he were a good QB, we'd have taken an interior lineman or a strong safety in front of him.  So, this is all nonsense.

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21 hours ago, Eyes Of Adam said:

I guess you missed the part where he declared it was indisputable? For real, there are a bunch of clowns who know nothing, but think they are smarter than everyone else, and are making this board rough to read.

This board is tough to read.

Also, this is my 45th username.

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17 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

This board is tough to read.

Also, this is my 45th username.

even with 75 ignored users, this board is tough to read...

 

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7 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

I have never understood the need for an ignore list.  Everything that an ignore list does can easily be accomplished by scrolling past content by someone you don’t enjoy conversing with.  This method comes with the added benefit of not having to admit to yourself that you’re a grown man so affected by a person’s words on a football website that you need to use technology to filter the hurt away.

it shortens by far the amount of scrolling. and i already spend too much time here.

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1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

I am so relieved for little Connor and also for his mom, TinderSlut69.

With a handle like that I suggest a paternity test brah

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12 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

 

All four?!?!  You think the Cardinals feel like they got the right man for their team?  Then why did they trade him and start over ASAP? I doubt they would trade their 2018 first, third and fifth for a pick in the bottom of the 2019 second round. 

Jets Darnold

Bills Allen

Browns Mayfield

Ravens Jackson

That's “four”. Rosen hasn’t been  in the conversation with these guys for a while, has he?

I guess if you want to be a stickler, I could’ve said 4 of 5. Would that have really mattered?

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4 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

 

I just want to point out that I called that it was him before Max did and I have absolutely no access to IP information. That's how much of a lunatic-stalker that guy is.

It's great because he keeps making new accounts for the sole purpose of kicking in the door and screaming "SMART PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY STUPID. STUPID PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY SMART. I WILL DIE ON THIS HILL." Then he inevitably pushes it too far and does, in fact, die on that hill. Then he lurks for a couple months, gets his bowels in an uproar because too many people are citing DVOA, comes up with another lame punny handle, and runs the whole thing back. Truly one of the all-time greats

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I haven't seen many people mention this, but Sam losing his hair flip buddy McCown was a big deal.  Not only was it big for Sam it was also big for the Jets.  When Sam got mono, I bet the Jets could have won a game or at least stayed competitive as a team with McCown.  This team needed a stabilizing force and Sam needed his "mentor".  Instead the Jets, Gase and Douglas all decided they would roll with Falk as a backup.  I don't know what the timeline was for the Eagles signing McCown, but Hackenberg would have been better.  I think Sam will be fine, but I still believe Gase will ruin him.  Hopefully Sam will go into CJ's office and demand its either Gase or him.

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9 hours ago, dbatesman said:

It's great because he keeps making new accounts for the sole purpose of kicking in the door and screaming "SMART PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY STUPID. STUPID PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY SMART. I WILL DIE ON THIS HILL." Then he inevitably pushes it too far and does, in fact, die on that hill. Then he lurks for a couple months, gets his bowels in an uproar because too many people are citing DVOA, comes up with another lame punny handle, and runs the whole thing back. Truly one of the all-time greats

One note on the lurking for a few months. Well that part needs to be clarified at least. He does lurk for a few months but he emails the site with the passion of an afternoon caller to WFAN. Let me on the air !!!!

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13 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I am so relieved for little Connor and also for his mom, TinderSlut69.

I didn't realize she changed usernames. I'll update the info on file.

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On 12/2/2019 at 7:32 PM, 14 in Green said:

I agree with you.

I also think all four organizations feel like they got the right man for their team, and wouldn’t change anything if they could pick again.

I'm pretty sure the Cardinals would do the Rosen pick over again if they could.

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16 hours ago, jgb said:

Good QBs make their situations.

QBs, in general, get way too much credit, and way too much blame. In the end, they're one player in an organization. Perhaps the most important, but just one. 

Good players have a hard time shining when they're on bad teams. Crap, look at Le'V Bell. He came here being touted as one of the best players in the league, and his impact on the Jets has been next to nothing. 

To me, it's not surprising that Jackson is balling with the Ravens, Rosen has nearly washed out going from Arizona to Miami, and Darnold and Mayfield have been inconsistent (at best) on two of the league's perennially bad teams. There's a reason guys like Trent Dilfer and Jim McMahon can be Super Bowl champions while Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, and Warren Moon can't. Football is the ultimate team game, and the NFL is the ultimate organizational game. 

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1 hour ago, Maxman said:

One note on the lurking for a few months. Well that part needs to be clarified at least. He does lurk for a few months but he emails the site with the passion of an afternoon caller to WFAN. Let me on the air !!!!

My guy!

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2 hours ago, slats said:

QBs, in general, get way too much credit, and way too much blame. In the end, they're one player in an organization. Perhaps the most important, but just one. 

Good players have a hard time shining when they're on bad teams. Crap, look at Le'V Bell. He came here being touted as one of the best players in the league, and his impact on the Jets has been next to nothing. 

To me, it's not surprising that Jackson is balling with the Ravens, Rosen has nearly washed out going from Arizona to Miami, and Darnold and Mayfield have been inconsistent (at best) on two of the league's perennially bad teams. There's a reason guys like Trent Dilfer and Jim McMahon can be Super Bowl champions while Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, and Warren Moon can't. Football is the ultimate team game, and the NFL is the ultimate organizational game. 

Disagree. Didn't say bad QBs couldn't win SBs. Only that a good QB keeps you relevant and mostly in the hunt nearly every year. Obviously there are exceptions.

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16 minutes ago, jgb said:

Disagree. Didn't say bad QBs couldn't win SBs. Only that a good QB keeps you relevant and mostly in the hunt nearly every year. Obviously there are exceptions.

Good QBs keep you in the hunt with a good team around them. Bad teams, injuries, etc., can remove the best QBs from said hunt. The QB's a critical piece, of course, but the idea that they make their own situation is silly, IMHO. Especially when you're talking about second year players. 

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12 minutes ago, slats said:

Good QBs keep you in the hunt with a good team around them. Bad teams, injuries, etc., can remove the best QBs from said hunt. The QB's a critical piece, of course, but the idea that they make their own situation is silly, IMHO. Especially when you're talking about second year players. 

Again disagree look no further than a colts with manning and without. Went from perennial contender to atrocious. Granted this is an extreme example.

But if I’m given a choice: (1) elite QB/bad team and (2) great team/mediocre QB I’m taking number 1. 100 roads to a super bowl, 95 start with a great QB. Team 1 above has a better shot in coming years of winning it all IMHO.

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11 minutes ago, jgb said:

Again disagree look no further than a colts with manning and without. Went from perennial contender to atrocious. Granted this is an extreme example.

But if I’m given a choice: (1) elite QB/bad team and (2) great team/mediocre QB I’m taking number 1. 100 roads to a super bowl, 95 start with a great QB. Team 1 above has a better shot in coming years of winning it all IMHO.

Peyton Manning is generally considered to be one of the greatest QBs to ever play the game. In his 16 year career, he managed to get to a second playoff game six times. He's credited with two post-season game-winning drives over that time. If he couldn't, "make his own situation," who can? Not Kelly, Marino, etc. 

I've never once discounted the importance of a great QB, just this supposition that said QB, "makes his own situation." You expect him to elevate it, as Manning certainly did over his career, but there are just to many other factors when it comes to the NFL. 

 

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30 minutes ago, slats said:

Good QBs keep you in the hunt with a good team around them. Bad teams, injuries, etc., can remove the best QBs from said hunt. The QB's a critical piece, of course, but the idea that they make their own situation is silly, IMHO. Especially when you're talking about second year players. 

Well if this is your metric Sam has overachieved with a crappy roster that has a ton of injuries this year

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7 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Well if this is your metric Sam has overachieved with a crappy roster that has a ton of injuries this year

I think he's done well given his circumstances. The roster sucks, was further decimated by injuries, and I'm not sold on the coaching staff. 

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3 minutes ago, slats said:

I think he's done well given his circumstances. The roster sucks, was further decimated by injuries, and I'm not sold on the coaching staff. 

Look not to take anything away from Lamar but he has a top 3 head coach and a great roster built by years of excellence in drafting

 

 

Sam has a Mangina clone and a division 2 college roster

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21 minutes ago, slats said:

Peyton Manning is generally considered to be one of the greatest QBs to ever play the game. In his 16 year career, he managed to get to a second playoff game six times. He's credited with two post-season game-winning drives over that time. If he couldn't, "make his own situation," who can? Not Kelly, Marino, etc. 

I've never once discounted the importance of a great QB, just this supposition that said QB, "makes his own situation." You expect him to elevate it, as Manning certainly did over his career, but there are just to many other factors when it comes to the NFL. 

 

Look at it  this way think of the last ten QBs to win the Super Bowl. Don’t see a lot of average guys on that list.

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10 minutes ago, jgb said:

Look at it  this way think of the last ten QBs to win the Super Bowl. Don’t see a lot of average guys on that list.

Eli Manning, Joe Flacco, and Nick Foles. Runners up include Goff, Newton, and Kaepernick. 

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20 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Look not to take anything away from Lamar but he has a top 3 head coach and a great roster built by years of excellence in drafting

 

 

Sam has a Mangina clone and a division 2 college roster

Lol, did you read the original post in this thread? 

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2 minutes ago, slats said:

Eli Manning, Joe Flacco, and Nick Foles. Runners up include Goff, Newton, and Kaepernick. 

Exactly. Disagree on Eli btw.

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4 minutes ago, jgb said:

Exactly. Disagree on Eli btw.

Why? Was Eli creating his own situation? One of those rare greats who also led the NFL in interceptions a few seasons? If you think Eli is a great QB, then you've effectively destroyed your own argument that good QBs make their own situations (the statement that started this conversation). In a 15-year career, Eli got his team to double-digit wins exactly five times. He didn't complete over 60% of his passes until his fifth year in the league. People already done with Darnold would've dumped Eli as a rookie. 

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12 minutes ago, jgb said:

Exactly. Disagree on Eli btw.

Kinda see Eli as a special case. He’s obviously not an all time great but he had a good arm, was tough as sh*t and was capable of beating good defenses with his arm.Flacco was almost that guy but things fell apart for him for whatever reason. 

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3 minutes ago, slats said:

Darnold would've dumped Eli as a rookie. 

Who are these people already done with Darnold?  Are these actual posters, or just a foil to make a point?

Because I see alot of "Darnold must improve" posts, not "Darnold must be cut" posts.

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On 12/2/2019 at 2:35 PM, PS17 said:

Genius is likely pointing to their record before Lamar took over last year. If JetNation pays me a small fee I’ll gladly translate Losmeister’s posts into literate thoughts for the rest of the board. 

LMAO

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