So did Gase suddenly FIND the locker room after losing it?

[Pac]

6 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

So the Steelers with an 8-6 record who played great defense all year are now a JV team because the Jets beat them ? The Steelers did this without The Rapist and that's a pretty big feat in itself and the People calling for Tomlin's head early in the year are Idiots.

I'm not particularly a big Gase Fan or a big Darnold fan but they have both proved a little bit this season and if we get this team in order and Douglas has a good offseason it should be interesting to see how this team responds in the second year of Gase and Company .  If Douglas solidifies the OL and gets a few real WR's in here things can change in a hurry and I think those should be the priorities 

It's nice to see you've finally come around on Macc.  If you're saying that our JV team beat their varsity then you're admitting our depth isn't nearly as tragic as people whined about it.  I agree with you.

[BallinPB]

He didn't lose the locker room.  He's just a trash coach.  Only a good season next year will prove me wrong.  

[HessStation]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

And the offense has one WR, a number two as the board screams all the time, and a slot WR.  No one at TE.  A OL that sucks as much as any OL I've seen here, one that cant pass block or open any holes for Bell.

In a game against a top D.  Against a team playing for their playoff lives.  

But hey, that doesn't help the narrative

It was a sloppy home game they pulled out against a back up and third string QB. There was nothing inspiring about it but I’m glad they won. I’m much more impressed with Williams and think he’s the guy they need to keep. 

[Jet Nut]

29 minutes ago, HessStation said:

It was a sloppy home game they pulled out against a back up and third string QB. There was nothing inspiring about it but I’m glad they won. I’m much more impressed with Williams and think he’s the guy they need to keep. 

It was a win against a team that has been playing with their backup since week 1, who cares given they’ve been winning, have a top D, a good HC, were favored and playing for their playoff lives

It was a good win, they all don’t give to be pretty or “inspiring”.  Hard to do with all the jags filling spots on the Jets 

[greenwichjetfan]

17 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I see lots of people in the gameday thread conveniently hammering different people on the Jets depending on the situation.  The same people criticizing Gase end up saying how bad Sam Darnold was playing...so which is it?  Did Gase win a game over Mike Tomlin and a playoff caliber team IN SPITE of Sam Darnold?  Did he suddenly motivate all these guys to step up today and make solid opportunistic plays when we needed them.  Did he buy Sam Ficken some glasses?  Or, did Sam Darnold bail out Adam Gase against a Top 5 defense?  Can't have it both ways.

I obviously think that the notion Gase had somehow "lost the locker room" was complete bullsh:t.  The dude is dragging a Bottom 5 NFL roster to a 5-2 record over the past 7 games.  There were even posts in the GD thread complaining about the Bell run on 3rd down to make that FG a little closer for Ficken so the Jets could go up 16-10.  Could you imagine either going for it on 4th down or an incomplete pass on 3rd that caused Ficken to miss from further away?  The Jets would have had to protect the short and intermediate distances on Pitt's last drive so that a FG wouldn't tie the game 13-13.  It was absolutely the smart way to manage the game there.  He knew the Jets D could prevent a TD....a FG was more dicey.

I think Gase has been very, very consistent the past two months.  He knows what he has now on this team....and what he doesn't.  He's found a decent way to try to balance run/pass with an Offensive Line that can do neither particularly well.  This was the Jets best win of the season....and they finish with a winning record at Home.

Go Jets!

I hate going against you, as I've generally found myself on your side over the course of many years both here and JI. I also like your more optimistic takes on all things Jets as a counter to most of the BS on here. However, on this, I can't.

Gase is awful. It was proven when he went 23-25 with the dolphins with 18 of those losses being by double digits. This has been further emboldened on the Jets, where he has gone 6-9 with 8(!) blowout losses.

And although losing Sam was tough for 3 games, teams like the Steelers and Titans were still in playoff contention with QB2 and QB3s (Steelers lost a HoF QB). Still, I'm not even asking to win with the backup QB, I just wanted to see Gase put together a semi-competent offense with his hand-picked backup QB, but his offenses literally didn't even score a single TD in 180 minutes of football!!! 

As we've seen in every loss including against two separate 0-7+ teams, when Williams' D doesn't show up, the Jets end up with the L because Gase's O stinks. Even with the 3 straight 34 point outputs (two of which came against bottom-barrel teams), the Jets are still sitting at 28th in the league at 17.5ppg. The league average is 22.8. Of the 6 games they've won this season, the Jets scored below league-average in two of them, and were 1 point above league average in the third and would have lost that game had it not been for Williams' brilliant defensive play calls in the final minutes and the players (Adams) executing them on the field. 

I'll repost something I wrote earlier this morning here:

2 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

If it weren’t for Williams’ defense (16th DVOA) propping up wins in 3 games where the offense only managed 1 or 2 TDs, Gase’s failures (30th DVOA) would be more clear to some than they currently seem.

 

Ultimately I'll be happy to be wrong, and I'll be happy if Gase really does turn it around, but what are we really left with? The knowledge that all of the data behind Gase's tenures as HC point to him being a bad HC, but because he was on the staff when Peyton re-broke passing records, he deserves the benefit of doubt? To me, that logic leaves us with hoping that both of the following are true independent of anything Gase does for the Jets to have future success with Gase: Douglass needs to transform in Ozzie overnight, and Sam needs to transform into prime Peyton overnight. 

[Scott Dierking]

2 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I did. I didn’t realize how bad the QB situation was with the Steelers. Mason Rudolph doesn’t get hurt and the Jets lose. That was apparent. 

So forgive me if I don't take all your prognostications as gospel.

[JetFreak89]

19 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I see lots of people in the gameday thread conveniently hammering different people on the Jets depending on the situation.  The same people criticizing Gase end up saying how bad Sam Darnold was playing...so which is it?  Did Gase win a game over Mike Tomlin and a playoff caliber team IN SPITE of Sam Darnold?  Did he suddenly motivate all these guys to step up today and make solid opportunistic plays when we needed them.  Did he buy Sam Ficken some glasses?  Or, did Sam Darnold bail out Adam Gase against a Top 5 defense?  Can't have it both ways.

I obviously think that the notion Gase had somehow "lost the locker room" was complete bullsh:t.  The dude is dragging a Bottom 5 NFL roster to a 5-2 record over the past 7 games.  There were even posts in the GD thread complaining about the Bell run on 3rd down to make that FG a little closer for Ficken so the Jets could go up 16-10.  Could you imagine either going for it on 4th down or an incomplete pass on 3rd that caused Ficken to miss from further away?  The Jets would have had to protect the short and intermediate distances on Pitt's last drive so that a FG wouldn't tie the game 13-13.  It was absolutely the smart way to manage the game there.  He knew the Jets D could prevent a TD....a FG was more dicey.

I think Gase has been very, very consistent the past two months.  He knows what he has now on this team....and what he doesn't.  He's found a decent way to try to balance run/pass with an Offensive Line that can do neither particularly well.  This was the Jets best win of the season....and they finish with a winning record at Home.

Go Jets!

Fans never put nearly enough emphasis on what it takes to learn an entirely new offensive system. Not to mention the defensive side as well but at the very least on D, if you are unsure what to do you can at least read the player in front of you to try and make a play. Fans expected the entire offense to be masters of the Gase system by Week 1....and never mind the fact that we are now down to our 2nd, 3rd and 4th string players in multiple positions as well....you think they knew the playbook? Half of them weren't in training camp over the summer. 

[Apache 51]

17 hours ago, Pac said:

I spent yesterday with the in laws.  I like them and we get along great but they have a strange affinity for a guy who lives on Pennsylvania Ave.  I have no problem with that either but before going I had to give a vow to the lady friend that I would not give my 2 cents if the subject was broached.  At one point her father, who is an awesome guy I joke with all the time, said "well he's the best thing that's ever happened to this country"...  after almost choking on my egg nog I had to take a deep breath and say: "hmmph..  that's something.... so....  is there any egg nog left"?

It wasn't easy.

I think you are missing the big picture.

[Jet Nut]

10 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

So forgive me if I don't take all your prognostications as gospel.

Hey, he put up 7 points, his crystal ball sees points that weren’t there but surely would be later.  
Love people who not only whine about losses but also whine about wins.  
 

[CrazyCarl40]

2 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

I'm sure you cant wait.  Are hoping, hope against hope that they do lose next season

Then you can do what you always do.  Find your black cloud and complain about it.  WTF would you do with a winning season here?  LOL

I’d be shocked because it hasn’t happened in a long time for this franchise or this coach. With how easy it is to turn things around in the NFL with decent roster management, this franchise continues to be a disgrace. 

1 hour ago, sourceworx said:

He's a Notre Dame fan who hates the fact that our QB is from USC.

Nope. I like Darnold and am sad he has to deal with Gase’s ineptitude. 

22 minutes ago, Scott Dierking said:

So forgive me if I don't take all your prognostications as gospel.

I wouldn’t think you would given your disdain of me. But carry on. 

9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Hey, he put up 7 points, his crystal ball sees points that weren’t there but surely would be later.  
Love people who not only whine about losses but also whine about wins.  
 

Have a nice holiday!

[Randy Rasmussen]

As an old time Jets fan I’m happy the Jets have beaten the Cowboys, Giants, Raiders and Steelers this year.
Not totally on board with Gase and the job he did but considering the obstacles he faced offensively I’m okay with him coming back.
On the other hand if Gregg Williams starts getting close to leaving for a HC position I would have zero problem firing Gase and giving the job to Williams


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[HessStation]

33 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

It was a win against a team that has been playing with their backup since week 1, who cares given they’ve been winning, have a top D, a good HC, were favored and playing for their playoff lives

It was a good win, they all don’t give to be pretty or “inspiring”.  Hard to do with all the jags filling spots on the Jets 

Fair enough, I agree. I’m still tempering expectations on Gase who hasn’t shown much to date tho.

[Scott Dierking]

26 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I wouldn’t think you would given your disdain of me. But carry on. 

 

I don't know you personally, so there is no disdain personally. 

My disdain is for the on-line persona that you choose to create, that is dismissive of anyone that does not 100% agree with your opinion. Iam also amused by the persona that takes the "negative rep" tool so personally, and cannot maturely handle (once again), someone differing in the on-line persona's opinion.

Merry Christmas and happy holidays to you personally.

 

[Sammybighead]

He didn’t lose locker room. Fact

he still stinks as coach. Fact

[kdels62]

3 minutes ago, Sammybighead said:

He didn’t lose locker room. Fact

he still stinks as coach. Fact

I’m okay with this analysis. I don’t agree with it but it’s reasonable.

[CrazyCarl40]

2 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

I don't know you personally, so there is no disdain personally. 

My disdain is for the on-line persona that you choose to create, that is dismissive of anyone that does not 100% agree with your opinion. Iam also amused by the persona that takes the "negative rep" tool so personally, and cannot maturely handle (once again), someone differing in the on-line persona's opinion.

Merry Christmas and happy holidays to you personally.

 

Well it’s because I’m right all the time. Haven’t you noticed?! Have a good holiday!

[southtown24th]

Get to 7-9.

Very, very, very respectable considering:

1. Sam missed 4 games

2. We had 0 backup QB

3. Out For Season--Blake Cashman, Chuma Edoga, Quincy Enunwa, Chris Herndon, Ryan Griffin, Tru Johnson, Ryan Kalil, CJ Mosley, Avery Williamson, Brian Winters, etc. OUT FOR THE SEASON.

 

7-9 is a WIN.

[jetstream23]

14 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

I hate going against you, as I've generally found myself on your side over the course of many years both here and JI. I also like your more optimistic takes on all things Jets as a counter to most of the BS on here. However, on this, I can't.

Gase is awful. It was proven when he went 23-25 with the dolphins with 18 of those losses being by double digits. This has been further emboldened on the Jets, where he has gone 6-9 with 8(!) blowout losses.

And although losing Sam was tough for 3 games, teams like the Steelers and Titans were still in playoff contention with QB2 and QB3s (Steelers lost a HoF QB). Still, I'm not even asking to win with the backup QB, I just wanted to see Gase put together a semi-competent offense with his hand-picked backup QB, but his offenses literally didn't even score a single TD in 180 minutes of football!!! 

As we've seen in every loss including against two separate 0-7+ teams, when Williams' D doesn't show up, the Jets end up with the L because Gase's O stinks. Even with the 3 straight 34 point outputs (two of which came against bottom-barrel teams), the Jets are still sitting at 28th in the league at 17.5ppg. The league average is 22.8. Of the 6 games they've won this season, the Jets scored below league-average in two of them, and were 1 point above league average in the third and would have lost that game had it not been for Williams' brilliant defensive play calls in the final minutes and the players (Adams) executing them on the field. 

I'll repost something I wrote earlier this morning here:

 

Ultimately I'll be happy to be wrong, and I'll be happy if Gase really does turn it around, but what are we really left with? The knowledge that all of the data behind Gase's tenures as HC point to him being a bad HC, but because he was on the staff when Peyton re-broke passing records, he deserves the benefit of doubt? To me, that logic leaves us with hoping that both of the following are true independent of anything Gase does for the Jets to have future success with Gase: Douglass needs to transform in Ozzie overnight, and Sam needs to transform into prime Peyton overnight. 

Facts are facts.  Nothing you said is untrue.

This is a 6-9 team that is winning some recent games with an overachieving Defense and an underachieving offense.  Gase doesn't have a good history as a HC.  He has some flashes as an OC and a HC specifically when it comes to the passing game but not the overall offense.  And, that's where the conversations on this board maybe become more nuanced.  It's pretty much a fact that QBs like Cutler, Tannehill (until this year) and Peyton Manning had their best seasons under Adam Gase.  I don't know why that is, what circumstances took a HOF player like Peyton Manning from an A caliber guy to an A+ those years, what helped Cutler and Tannehill minimize their mistakes under Gase, etc. but those things happened.  But again, it's been QB performance and not always the entire Offense.

Gase has coached QBs well, above average, and in some cases to record setting seasons.  But he's lost a lot of games....and a lot of games BADLY (10+ points).  It's hard to reconcile.  It's very difficult to look at the Jets team this year and say whether their results are better than what their roster should give them.  I honestly want to know how to assess that.  Can someone tell me that the Jets have the 27th best offensive roster but only the 29th best offensive performance?  Do the Jets have the 31st best roster on O but have coached and QB'd them up to the 26th best offensive performance?  How many guys on the Jets starting offense would start for other teams?  Anyone besides Bell.....maybe Robby as a WR2 for a couple of AFC teams?

I appreciate your post and logical guys like us can disagree about where this team may be heading.  I don't wave the Gase flag but I do think he deserves another year with a better OLine and at least one more quality WR.....and maybe even some healthy TEs.  The OLine is really the question here - I think the playbook has been shrunk, 30-40 plays removed, we're trying to execute short passes and not letting routes develop because we know that Darnold has already been sacked more times this year than he was in fewer games last year.

I don't know if Gase is a good HC.  I don't know if he's even a great Offensive guy.  But I do think he's very good at two things....coaching QBs and pass route scheming that gets mediocre guys wide open.  I've seen it all year.  Crowder, even DT and Vyncint Smith.  They seem to pop open with nobody within 8 yards of them several times per game.   I've never seen anyone more open than when Crowder dropped that TD pass vs. Baltimore only to catch another TD a minute later.  I just think that if we had a better OLine and gave Darnold some more time we'd see guys like Robby explode and this team that's won 5 of their last 7 would finally inspire some hope in us.

[greenwichjetfan]

4 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

It's pretty much a fact that QBs like Cutler, Tannehill (until this year) and Peyton Manning had their best seasons under Adam Gase.  I don't know why that is, what circumstances took a HOF player like Peyton Manning from an A caliber guy to an A+ those years, what helped Cutler and Tannehill minimize their mistakes under Gase, etc. but those things happened.  But again, it's been QB performance and not always the entire Offense.

So, I responded to this in the other thread as well. I know in terms of raw absolute numbers, Peyton fared slightly better in ‘13, but his ‘04 performance was actually legendary and was significantly better than his ‘13 performance by both DVOA and AY/Y. The only reason I make this distinction is because it looks like from the above that you want to give Gase credit for that little extra that helped him re-break the record books, but the fact is he actually was already a HoF QB and in consideration for GOAT and had his best statistical year a decade before he even met Gase. Meanwhile, yes, Cutler’s best season came under Gase’s first year as his OC in Chicago at 7.4 AY/Y but Cutler’s second best season at 7.2 AY/Y and Gase was still a WR coach on DEN.  Gase then proceeded to deteriorate Cutler’s play to the point that Cutler’s last season with Gase was the second-worst season of his career. Lastly, Tannehill’s first and second best seasons came the year after and year before he got hitched to Gase. 

Listen man, I’m not trying to rain on your parade. I just think that because you feel so strongly about his ability to coax better QB play out of players, you should have the facts. It’s all there on FO and PFR for your reference; I’m not making this up just to hate on Gase. 
 

5 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

It's very difficult to look at the Jets team this year and say whether their results are better than what their roster should give them.  I honestly want to know how to assess that.  Can someone tell me that the Jets have the 27th best offensive roster but only the 29th best offensive performance?  Do the Jets have the 31st best roster on O but have coached and QB'd them up to the 26th best offensive performance?  How many guys on the Jets starting offense would start for other teams?  Anyone besides Bell.....maybe Robby as a WR2 for a couple of AFC teams?

I appreciate your post and logical guys like us can disagree about where this team may be heading.  I don't wave the Gase flag but I do think he deserves another year with a better OLine and at least one more quality WR.....and maybe even some healthy TEs.  The OLine is really the question here - I think the playbook has been shrunk, 30-40 plays removed, we're trying to execute short passes and not letting routes develop because we know that Darnold has already been sacked more times this year than he was in fewer games last year.

 

I’m with you. I get that this roster blows chunks. I was out there along with some of the other guys who hated Macc well before he was finally relieved of his duties.  I’m not saying Gase should have had this offense at ‘13 Broncos levels, or that we should have won 10 games. I just wanted to see competency. I wanted to see him change the sh*tty parts about him from Miami. His drive stats/pace stats on the Jets are dead last this year, and it’s a continuation of his 3 years being in the bottom 4th of the league in MIA. His play calling hasn’t changed. He still runs up the middle on second down more than any coach in the league, something which he was on the leaderboard for in MIA all 3 years. He’s asking Sam to run read-option out of the pistol 7 times per game even though Sam is not a true threat to run. Bell looks like he’s lost a step, but then we see what Drake is doing in Arizona now that he’s rid of Gase, and you can’t help but wonder if it’s simply improper usage. This Jets team is riddled with injury - something that coincidentally plagued Gase’s tenure in MIA too. 

The other part that makes no sense to me is that if in fact he’s saddled with such a terrible roster, how has he been capable of scripting opening drive scores for most of the last 2 months? The players become really good for just the opening drive and revert back to bad for the rest of the game? I don’t think so. I think the roster is weak but that great coaching can get middling to solid results, as Gase has proven on those opening scores. I think Gase is great at scripting, but he can’t make real-time decisions. Meaning he’s consistently awful at play-calling and game flow after his initial plan has been used up. I tracked this and posted in a different thread but will include it here because it’s so eye-popping: 

Jets O has scored 7 times on opening drives. 5 TDs, 2 FGs
- Average # of plays/possession for the 7 opening scoring drives: 10.83 plays
- Average # of yards/possession for the 7 opening scoring drives: 74.83 yards

Jets O on the 78 possessions after scoring on opening drives. 10 TDs, 11 FGs
- Average # of plays/possession after opening scoring drive: 4.91 plays
- Average # of yards/possession after opening scoring drive: 19.24 yards

5 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

I don't know if Gase is a good HC.  I don't know if he's even a great Offensive guy.  But I do think he's very good at two things....coaching QBs and pass route scheming that gets mediocre guys wide open.  I've seen it all year.  Crowder, even DT and Vyncint Smith.  They seem to pop open with nobody within 8 yards of them several times per game.   I've never seen anyone more open than when Crowder dropped that TD pass vs. Baltimore only to catch another TD a minute later.  I just think that if we had a better OLine and gave Darnold some more time we'd see guys like Robby explode and this team that's won 5 of their last 7 would finally inspire some hope in us.

As always, appreciate your optimistic outlooks and ability to have a discussion. Even with all of the above, I do believe in people’s abilities to change and be better, and I can get with hoping for the same for Gase.

So in the holiday spirit, here’s to hoping Santa can deliver a Christmas miracle to us next year and transform Gase from everything above into a great coach, like the pats got with a proven loser in Belichick after his time in Cleveland and his first season in NE. 

Happy holidays bud!

[Jethead]

Gates, Williams and Boyer all deserve kudos for their coaching job this year. Adams,  McLendon, Bell and other team leaders also get props for keeping the team together thru tough circumstances.

Eager to see the Jets add to the nicely developing core group they have. Lots to be said for continuity.

Next year could be fun!

[Philc1]

22 hours ago, BallinPB said:

He didn't lose the locker room.  He's just a trash coach.  Only a good season next year will prove me wrong.  

You won’t be proven wrong we have a tougher schedule next year and Gase will have a meltdown in the offseason purging guys like Bell and Robby

[Philc1]

17 hours ago, southtown24th said:

Get to 7-9.

Very, very, very respectable considering:

1. Sam missed 4 games

2. We had 0 backup QB

3. Out For Season--Blake Cashman, Chuma Edoga, Quincy Enunwa, Chris Herndon, Ryan Griffin, Tru Johnson, Ryan Kalil, CJ Mosley, Avery Williamson, Brian Winters, etc. OUT FOR THE SEASON.

 

7-9 is a WIN.

Other teams won games with backup QBs and third stringers.  Gase couldn’t be bothered with trying to prepare his backups and wasted time trying to develop Davis Webb in the preseason aka Hackenberg 2.0

 

We had an easy schedule this year. 7-9 is not a win 

 

[BallinPB]

32 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Other teams won games with backup QBs and third stringers.  Gase couldn’t be bothered with trying to prepare his backups and wasted time trying to develop Davis Webb in the preseason aka Hackenberg 2.0

 

We had an easy schedule this year. 7-9 is not a win 

 

Amazing how everyone is praising 7-9 like the Jets didn't literally have the easiest schedule in the league.  I wouldn't call this season a failure but it's definitely not a win.  

How quickly people forget we lost to the Dolphins and Bengals.  

[jetstream23]

3 hours ago, greenwichjetfan said:

So, I responded to this in the other thread as well. I know in terms of raw absolute numbers, Peyton fared slightly better in ‘13, but his ‘04 performance was actually legendary and was significantly better than his ‘13 performance by both DVOA and AY/Y. The only reason I make this distinction is because it looks like from the above that you want to give Gase credit for that little extra that helped him re-break the record books, but the fact is he actually was already a HoF QB and in consideration for GOAT and had his best statistical year a decade before he even met Gase. Meanwhile, yes, Cutler’s best season came under Gase’s first year as his OC in Chicago at 7.4 AY/Y but Cutler’s second best season at 7.2 AY/Y and Gase was still a WR coach on DEN.  Gase then proceeded to deteriorate Cutler’s play to the point that Cutler’s last season with Gase was the second-worst season of his career. Lastly, Tannehill’s first and second best seasons came the year after and year before he got hitched to Gase. 

Listen man, I’m not trying to rain on your parade. I just think that because you feel so strongly about his ability to coax better QB play out of players, you should have the facts. It’s all there on FO and PFR for your reference; I’m not making this up just to hate on Gase. 
 

I’m with you. I get that this roster blows chunks. I was out there along with some of the other guys who hated Macc well before he was finally relieved of his duties.  I’m not saying Gase should have had this offense at ‘13 Broncos levels, or that we should have won 10 games. I just wanted to see competency. I wanted to see him change the sh*tty parts about him from Miami. His drive stats/pace stats on the Jets are dead last this year, and it’s a continuation of his 3 years being in the bottom 4th of the league in MIA. His play calling hasn’t changed. He still runs up the middle on second down more than any coach in the league, something which he was on the leaderboard for in MIA all 3 years. He’s asking Sam to run read-option out of the pistol 7 times per game even though Sam is not a true threat to run. Bell looks like he’s lost a step, but then we see what Drake is doing in Arizona now that he’s rid of Gase, and you can’t help but wonder if it’s simply improper usage. This Jets team is riddled with injury - something that coincidentally plagued Gase’s tenure in MIA too. 

The other part that makes no sense to me is that if in fact he’s saddled with such a terrible roster, how has he been capable of scripting opening drive scores for most of the last 2 months? The players become really good for just the opening drive and revert back to bad for the rest of the game? I don’t think so. I think the roster is weak but that great coaching can get middling to solid results, as Gase has proven on those opening scores. I think Gase is great at scripting, but he can’t make real-time decisions. Meaning he’s consistently awful at play-calling and game flow after his initial plan has been used up. I tracked this and posted in a different thread but will include it here because it’s so eye-popping: 

Jets O has scored 7 times on opening drives. 5 TDs, 2 FGs
- Average # of plays/possession for the 7 opening scoring drives: 10.83 plays
- Average # of yards/possession for the 7 opening scoring drives: 74.83 yards

Jets O on the 78 possessions after scoring on opening drives. 10 TDs, 11 FGs
- Average # of plays/possession after opening scoring drive: 4.91 plays
- Average # of yards/possession after opening scoring drive: 19.24 yards

As always, appreciate your optimistic outlooks and ability to have a discussion. Even with all of the above, I do believe in people’s abilities to change and be better, and I can get with hoping for the same for Gase.

So in the holiday spirit, here’s to hoping Santa can deliver a Christmas miracle to us next year and transform Gase from everything above into a great coach, like the pats got with a proven loser in Belichick after his time in Cleveland and his first season in NE. 

Happy holidays bud!

 

If I knew there was a definitive upgrade that the Jets could get at HC for next year I'd make the switch.  I just don't think firing coaches in two successive years for doing poorly with a horrible roster would be a good look for the Jets.  It certainly wouldn't attract top coaching candidates to line up for interviews here.  I also would like to see Sam Darnold get a chance in the same offensive system for two consecutive seasons which is something he hasn't had in 3 years (2017 USC, 2018 Bates, 2019 Gase).

I do try to see the glass half full.  The Jets have played markedly better over the 2nd half of the year (it was impossible to play any worse than the 1st half) but finishing the season with a 5-3 home record, Darnold going 12 TDs/ 3 INTs in his last 7 games, etc. are some reasons for hope.  

Merry Christmas and happy holidays!  Let's hope for the best....because that's about all we can do.

 

[Losmeister]

24 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

I think the roster is weak but that great coaching can get middling to solid results,

actually gwhich sed it,,,

 

6-6 w/ sam is the very definition of middling...

[greenwichjetfan]

2 hours ago, Losmeister said:

actually gwhich sed it,,,

 

6-6 w/ sam is the very definition of middling...

My position is that the great coaching which brought us to middling success is more of a function of Gregg Williams coaching up nobodies than Gase's offense. Of course Gase is HC and I don't want to seem extreme by saying he doesn't deserve any credit, but he is admittedly separated from the D, so I'm judging his offense. Only 4 games all season did the Jets O score even the league average in points this season, and they're in the bottom 4th of every individual or team metric tied to production and efficiency.