New Look At Possible Trade Partners For Adams With New Draft Rankings And Team Needs

[Philc1]

1 minute ago, kevinc855 said:

how dare you put Jamal adams in the dame sentence as Wilkerson or sanchez……..apples and oranges boomer

Were you here when Wilkerson was about to be a free agent?  People were considering suicide if we didn’t extend Wilkerson 

[Philc1]

Just now, joewilly12 said:

How long has the Patriots secondary been together?  

How many of the Patriots secondary have been there a long time?  

The smartest player personnel move the jets made last 20 years was trading Keyshawn Johnson in his prime for a pick that ended up being John Abraham 

 

Keyshawn in his prime is waaaayyy more valuable than Adams

[kevinc855]

1 minute ago, Philc1 said:

Were you here when Wilkerson was about to be a free agent?  People were considering suicide if we didn’t extend Wilkerson 

no one on this forum ever compared Wilkerson to Adams,......then there was you...your credibility is shot now. Thanks for playing tho

[Jetscode1]

58 minutes ago, Dcat said:

How can you not even remotely understand the importance of positional value?    It's a huge issue and why the team is so bad today.  Mac constantly invested in the positions of least value.  Like 2 safeties in a row.  Do you realize just how much damage it has caused by investing in safeties and constant DLs for the last decade?

None of this has to do with Adams' talent.  It goes much deeper into the overall priorities of the team, which, under Woody Johnson, have been horrible.

This point is exactly correct.  The priorities and the draft were horrendous on multiple levels.  IMO the only way forward is to acquire/develop more players.  We cannot continue to bemoan the fact that Tannebaum/Idzik/Macc had zero clue how to build a reasonable roster.  We need to move forward and moving forward means we build with the players that are here and want to stay here.  Adams and Maye, while not the ideal under positional value perspective offer us two players who want to change the culture and turn this franchise around.  To trade Adams now after he's built his own brand and also helped the Jets establish an identity as team possibly ready for more only reinforces the destructive nature of the churn that has existed under the Johnson family.   

[Jet Nut]

8 hours ago, TeddEY said:

The skins record is, at least, a cautionary tale about the value of a SS.  It’s not the end-all, be-all.  Just speaks to a positional value argument that many have stated all along.  Add to that that WAS is a bottom half of the league defense and pass defense, and it should, if we remove emotion, give pause about making a 14M+/year investment at that position.

Are we certain Jamal Adams plays without a hold out next year?  Honestly, he shouldn’t.  If I were his agent, I’d advise him to hold out.  And, even if he doesn’t, the longer we wait, the less leverage we have, because it looks less likely we’d pay him.

Well we'll agree to disagree.  They suck with or without him. He was terrible his last 2 seasons with the Giants.  But more importantly they're a horrible team starting a QB who isn't ready to start.  What the SS is or isn't won't change a thing.  Neither would an edge or any other position star not playing QB

We can look at a Colts team, one that with and without Sanders were two different teams.  We can look at Pitt with Palomala, was he why they were good?  Ed Reed, was he the reason the Ravens were a great D?  What a team is or isn't has nothing to do with one single player.  

We can ask about a player holding out at any and every position on the field.  Whether fans think its a position of importance or not. Have no clue why he would be advised to hold out for no apparent reason other than fan speak.  Hes not a low round or UDFA playing at a pro bowl level, hes a top draft pick. 

[Jet Nut]

7 hours ago, T0mShane said:

He’s going to hold out this offseason for a new deal.

To the hope and prayers of all the haters.  

Hes not holding out. 

 

[Jet Nut]

8 hours ago, New York Mick said:

Adams wouldn’t of changed that outcome. Jackson would run circles around Adams. 

Adams was the perfect candidate to keep an eye on Jackson.  Don't know how it would have worked out but it would have been his job.

[Jetsfan80]

We're a better ball club than we were 3 years ago.

We are?

[Jetsfan80]

This point is exactly correct.  The priorities and the draft were horrendous on multiple levels.  IMO the only way forward is to acquire/develop more players.  We cannot continue to bemoan the fact that Tannebaum/Idzik/Macc had zero clue how to build a reasonable roster.  We need to move forward and moving forward means we build with the players that are here and want to stay here.  Adams and Maye, while not the ideal under positional value perspective offer us two players who want to change the culture and turn this franchise around.  To trade Adams now after he's built his own brand and also helped the Jets establish an identity as team possibly ready for more only reinforces the destructive nature of the churn that has existed under the Johnson family.   

  

Part of moving forward and recognizing positional value involves electing NOT to pay a SS Macc drafted $15M a season.

 

Adams has “built a brand” so we shouldn’t trade him. lmao.

 

 

[New York Mick]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Adams was the perfect candidate to keep an eye on Jackson.  Don't know how it would have worked out but it would have been his job.

Jackson has made a fool out of everyone in the league that has spied on him. Adams wouldn’t have been any different. 

[T0mShane]

2 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

To the hope and prayers of all the haters.  

Hes not holding out. 

 

This is like when you said Maccagnan wasn’t getting fired 

[Philc1]

11 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

no one on this forum ever compared Wilkerson to Adams,......then there was you...your credibility is shot now. Thanks for playing tho

thanks for the case of selective amnesia this entire board was screaming for Wilk to get extended now the same people want to overpay like crazy to extend a box safety

[Philc1]

9 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

We are?

 

7-9 is the new Jets AFCG appearance 

[Jet Nut]

11 hours ago, New York Mick said:

Jackson has made a fool out of everyone in the league that has spied on him. Adams wouldn’t have been any different. 

Not saying he would have been shut down but I would think he could slow him down a little or lessen the damage.  Still would have been the one assigned to him some of the time.  It sure wouldn't hurt to have had Jamal that night

[Jet Nut]

10 hours ago, T0mShane said:

This is like when you said Maccagnan wasn’t getting fired 

And when I said he wasn't getting fired at years end I was right.  Anyway,I would think I'm not the only one who has made mistakes here.  I have no problem admitting it.  

 

[T0mShane]

3 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

And when I said he wasn't getting fired at years end I was right.  Anyway,I would think I'm not the only one who has made mistakes here.  I have no problem admitting it.  

 

I’ve never made a mistake here.

[RutgersJetFan]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

I’ve never made a mistake here.

Me neither. What a big mistake making loser Jet Nut is.

[New York Mick]

10 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Not saying he would have been shut down but I would think he could slow him down a little or lessen the damage.  Still would have been the one assigned to him some of the time.  It sure wouldn't hurt to have had Jamal that night

Of course it would of helped if they had Adams but it would of helped more if they had a better oline and could of scored more points. I like Adams he’s a great SS and is fun to watch but in this NFL you need to score points. 

[CTM]

4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I’ve never made a mistake here.

You are a mistake, it is your nature to be mistaken thus the only mistake you can actually make would be in not making one

[PepPep]

23 hours ago, bitonti said:

trey adams stayed in school because of the injury and he still might be a 2nd rder because of the injury history 

prediction he is the 4th OT drafted at best (could be like 6th or 7th, depending on combine medicals) 

AT BEST. With the depth of the OT position in this draft, IMO he is a 2nd rounder.  A.Thomas, Wills, Wirfs, A.Jackson (USC), and Leatherwood are all easily ahead of him. Then you have Tega Wanogho, Niang, A.Jackson (Iowa), Becton, J.Jones who are on par as prospects and depending on combine and workouts may have their stock rise. Personally, I really like Tega Wanogho over Adams. That's in part b/c of the injury but also b/c of Wanogho's immense upside despite being a bit raw, which I don't see with Adams.

[Jet Nut]

26 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

Of course it would of helped if they had Adams but it would of helped more if they had a better oline and could of scored more points. I like Adams he’s a great SS and is fun to watch but in this NFL you need to score points. 

I totally agree.  I wasn't trying to make the case that the game was lost because of the D.  The game was close than the final score implies IMO and if not for a couple of screwed up scoring plays could have been a tighter loss

[lounap23]

19 hours ago, Philc1 said:

Smart teams like the patriots trade their players for picks before having to pay them

 

Dumb organizations like the jets give ridiculous contracts to Muhammad Wilkerson, Mark Sanchez and Chad Pennington

Patriots have a system and win with it.  1. we ain't quite there yet.  2.  None of those players have played at the ALL PRO level of Adams.  and lastly the Pats pay their players they do not pay them when the contract runs into their declining years.   Adams is no where near his declining years.

[DetroitRed]

No


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[Philc1]

8 hours ago, lounap23 said:

Patriots have a system and win with it.  1. we ain't quite there yet.  2.  None of those players have played at the ALL PRO level of Adams.  and lastly the Pats pay their players they do not pay them when the contract runs into their declining years.   Adams is no where near his declining years.

Wilkerson if he wasn’t all pro would have been one if JJ Watt didn’t exist and he wasn’t old

 

The smartest move is to trade Adams and get picks back now rather than get stuck with a $100 million box safety the next 6 years

[Beerfish]

On 12/23/2019 at 7:45 PM, Jet Nut said:

To the hope and prayers of all the haters.  

Hes not holding out. 

 

Same confidence on this one as your Darron lee guarantee?

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

Same confidence on this one as your Darron lee guarantee?

Yeah, my Darron Lee GUARANTEE

You've been wrong, I don't know, 10 different ways about just Jamal Adams for starters, might not want to go this route

And I'm joking but still 100% right, the haters would be thrilled.  

[Sperm Edwards]

So, to many it’s a no brainer to keep and extend Adams instead of [whatever compensation you think is too little, like even a 1st & a 3rd, though pick slot matters when gauging trade value].

If it’s so obvious Adams is worth more than that, then why wouldn’t 20 teams be falling over each other to steal him away from us?

Or put another way, why is he a more valuable player to the Jets than he is to anyone else? If he was worth much more than a 1+3 then surely we’ll get much more than that in trade offers.

[Sperm Edwards]

The problem with today slotting our picks on days 1-2 (and using that as the basis for why additional high picks are unnecessary, as some like to do) is it presumes we'll hit on each pick, and further that they'll show up as hits right away. Just on the OL, we need/want to fill at least 2-3 OL starters through the draft from 2020-2021 to adequately upgrade for real. That doesn't mean draft 2-3 OL prospects. It means draft no less than 4. Then factor in the needed young starters at WR, CB, EDGE that we're likewise not simply to all hit with 1 pick invested for each just because we desire they'll all hit.

If moving Adams means we get more chances at excellent starters, at objectively more important positions, then we have to listen to all offers. It is clear even with a lesser SS instead of Jamal Adams we can still field a winning team (just like every single playoff team is and has been doing without him). 

I certainly sympathize any/every fan's emotional attachment to a top player we drafted, since it's not like we have so many to be proud of, but that is not enough of a reason. Nor is it enough of a reason to have the league's best SS (blindly granting him that title for the sake of argument); if it was, we'd be getting offers for multiple mid- or later first rounders value that his original #6 pick was worth more than in the first place. We won't, though.

Yes he was cheaper on a full rookie deal, and that hurts his trade value some, but there's also no worry about his ability translating from college to the NFL. Yet not one team will make an offer equating to a #6 pick's chart/trade value, even though other GMs are fully aware of the risks of drafting lesser players at other positions with those high picks.

The answer to why most (if not all) others will keep their multiple high picks instead of trading for Adams is they know even if they just kinda-mostly hit on one of them, with SS and other big-$ positions as needs, drafting the league's 5th-10th best LT (on a rookie deal for 4 years) is still worth more to them than the league's best SS. Even more so while it'll clear an extra $10MM/year they can use towards acquiring/upgrading a veteran FA pickup at yet another starter position.

That's 2 higher-value positions they'd shore up instead of just SS, even whiffing on one of the picks they'd use instead of picking up a shiny new probowl safety. That's why Adams is not going to command multiple offers in the top 15 1st + 2nd (or more) range, and why if we somehow get even one such crazy offer even near that (Dallas?) then he's gone.

[lounap23]

On 12/24/2019 at 8:45 PM, Philc1 said:

Wilkerson if he wasn’t all pro would have been one if JJ Watt didn’t exist and he wasn’t old

 

The smartest move is to trade Adams and get picks back now rather than get stuck with a $100 million box safety the next 6 years

He had one year at an ALL-Pro level 2015.  The contract year. His 5th year in the league.   Adams is now 2 years at All-Pro Level.  Not in a contract year and only 3 years in the league.  And you are so wrong calling Adams a box safety.   Watch the tape, the All-22 tape and you'll see Adams on 3 different levels is a force on defense. 

1.  His pass coverage is excellent underneath and downfield.  He grades out very high on both. and this is where the ALL-22 tape comes in nicely.  Watching Adams drop out of the box into coverage or lineup and cover man to man is nothing short excellent.

2.  When he is in the box his effect on the run game is outstanding. But you know that since you call him a box safety and it's easy to see him in the box when watching live TV.  

3.  His blitz skills are elite. Again you know that 

 you do not trade a player with those abilities.  I said it before and I will say it again.  Trading Adams for picks is dumb because it now creates a whole that the odds we will fill at or even near his level are slim

There are only 2 reasons to trade Adams:

1. He demands a trade.  Might happen.  I don't get the impression he will but you never know. 

2.  Some team out there offers 3 to 4  picks -  2 #1's, a 2nd rd and maybe another pick in rd 3 or 4. this scenario is not happening.

[docdhc]

We don't have to pay Sam for a couple of years and we have lots of cap space. Even if we pay Jamal top safety money, 10mill/year, 30 + guaranteed, you can get out in 3 years. We have no other stars to pay except Mosely.  I need an explanation as to why we can't afford him when we will have to fill most of our holes with the draft rather than pricey free agents anyway.  He is the only elite player we have.

[lounap23]

Just now, docdhc said:

We don't have to pay Sam for a couple of years and we have lots of cap space. Even if we pay Jamal top safety money, 10mill/year, 30 + guaranteed, you can get out in 3 years. We have no other stars to pay except Mosely.  I need an explanation as to why we can't afford him when we will have to fill most of our holes with the draft rather than pricey free agents anyway.  He is the only elite player we have.

We can afford him the argument of not paying him a big contract comes from the idea once we pay him his production will drop off ala Wilkerson. That is not how you run a football team. For every Wilkerson or Haynesworth there are 10 other guys that got paid and continue to perform at the level they are paid to perform at.

[Pac]

On 12/25/2019 at 1:46 AM, Sperm Edwards said:

So, to many it’s a no brainer to keep and extend Adams instead of [whatever compensation you think is too little, like even a 1st & a 3rd, though pick slot matters when gauging trade value].

If it’s so obvious Adams is worth more than that, then why wouldn’t 20 teams be falling over each other to steal him away from us?

Or put another way, why is he a more valuable player to the Jets than he is to anyone else? If he was worth much more than a 1+3 then surely we’ll get much more than that in trade offers.

Odd post.  

[docdhc]

12 minutes ago, lounap23 said:

We can afford him the argument of not paying him a big contract comes from the idea once we pay him his production will drop off ala Wilkerson. That is not how you run a football team. For every Wilkerson or Haynesworth there are 10 other guys that got paid and continue to perform at the level they are paid to perform at.

I don't know I think even his detractors think he's good and will remain so after being paid.  Wilkerson had one good year and then a serious injury.  Adams has been a stud from day 1.  It seems to me most people argue that his position just isn't worth spending on.  Right now, though, and for the next couple of years at least, we don't have any mega contracts to worry about except Mosely, and Bell and they can be off the books in 2 years if necessary.  We may sign a high priced free agent on the OL or pay Robbie, or pay a free agent WR, but we will still be able to afford a Jamal contract.  I know you have to prioritize when you have a high quality roster with lots of studs but that isn't the Jets for the next few years.

[nyjunc]

Why don't we trade all our players, think of all the draft picks we'd have? We can do this every year so it makes draft day more exciting for those that don't actually want to win and just want higher picks.

[Jetsfan80]

20 minutes ago, Pac said:

 Odd post.  

It's not much different from the way you've been trying to paint the argument to where you can't lose:

• Scenario A:  Jets trade Jamal for a King's ransom.  Pac wins.
• Scenario B:  Jets keep Jamal and extend him.  Pac wins.  
• Scenario C :  Jets trade Jamal for what is perceived by fans to be less than market value.  Joe Douglas is called an idiot.  Pac wins.