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Robby to command $13-$15m APY

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9 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Robbie isn't a star WR, why the high bar?

I'm not sure you're getting at what I'm saying. I'm saying don't put ALL the outside WR eggs into the "rookie produces as a rookie" basket, not that Anderson is a star, nor that he should be retained instead of drafting a more prototypical WR1 prospect.

The draft strategy should not change one iota just because this veteran is signed to 1 guaranteed season. The point is that we don't get pigeonholed into a pick based on a gaping hole in the starting lineup, rather than a better pick - still on offense, mind you - that would serve the team better in both the short and long term. 

If anything, having Anderson plus Crowder plus Herndon will make the transition easier for a rookie instead of drives dying because he ran the wrong route or some other miscommunication (never mind QB-WR timing) that happens far more with rookie receivers. 

I think there's this expectation that just because you draft a WR in rounds 1 or 2 they automatically become 1000-yard WR1 receivers as rookies, and therefore an experienced veteran weapon is wasted and Darnold isn't worth risking a temporary over-investment. 

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17 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Exactly, over supply, so for once we can stop the damn guessing as an organization to what we have at QB. You get talent around Darnold then the balls in his court to prove whether he's our guy or not and the only way you can do that is exactly what you're suggesting. 

This is all I'm saying. I don't get the fervor for erring on the side of providing Darnold with fewer receiving weapons. This is the year he's supposed to take this massive leap forward, and people want to give him a pretty good slot receiver plus a rookie plus a 32-33 year-old who's lost 2 steps from before his Achilles tear? I'm in favor of bringing back DT also, but as a WR4 not as a WR2/3.

You want to give Darnold multiple, dangerous options? That doesn't happen by force-feeding two rookies, and/or a rookie plus a has-been, into the starting lineup, leaving no margin for error or injury. 

Anderson isn't an elite WR, isn't going to get an elite "#1" WR's contract, and if that's what it takes to re-sign him then duh we should pass. But this whole notion that he's only a marginal starter - while pining for the likes of starting Demaryius Thomas 15+ games in the next breath - is nonsensical to me. That's a move that a team makes when they're quasi-tanking and/or cleaning house of 30something has-beens, and are just using a McCown-ish, low-ceiling, stopgap QB for the year or anyway a veteran QB who isn't still very much developing.

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6 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

This is all I'm saying. I don't get the fervor for erring on the side of providing Darnold with fewer receiving weapons. This is the year he's supposed to take this massive leap forward, and people want to give him a pretty good slot receiver plus a rookie plus a 32-33 year-old who's lost 2 steps from before his Achilles tear? I'm in favor of bringing back DT also, but as a WR4 not as a WR2/3.

You want to give Darnold multiple, dangerous options? That doesn't happen by force-feeding two rookies, and/or a rookie plus a has-been, into the starting lineup, leaving no margin for error or injury. 

Anderson isn't an elite WR, isn't going to get an elite "#1" WR's contract, and if that's what it takes to re-sign him then duh we should pass. But this whole notion that he's only a marginal starter - while pining for the likes of starting Demaryius Thomas 15+ games in the next breath - is nonsensical to me. That's a move that a team makes when they're quasi-tanking and/or cleaning house of 30something has-beens, and are just using a McCown-ish, low-ceiling, stopgap QB for the year or anyway a veteran QB who isn't still very much developing.

it's hard to see how letting anderson walk (unless the money is outrageous) helps the jets.  they need several new OL starters, at least 1 wr even if robbie stays - and maybe 2 rbs as well.  anderson reminds me of the chris carter 'all he does is score touchdowns' - he's not a complete wr but he scores, stretches the field and has decent hands.  

the jets need an OL and running game more than drafting a  wr in the first round.  that's how the offense will get better.

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37 minutes ago, nycdan said:

First of all, do any of you guys know who our 3rd Safety is? 

Rontez Miles (scheduled to be a UFA but he'd be cheap to bring back), and he'd be fine as a replacement level Safety.  

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40 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Just for sake of argument, in 2016 there was a WR drafted at 15 and then 3 more drafted consecutively with the 21-23 picks.

Corey Coleman, Josh Doctson, Laquon Treadwell and Will Fuller.

Doctson is out of the league.  Treadwell might as well be for all he has played.  Coleman bounced around a few teams and then tore his ACL so he's probably done.  Fuller averages 550 yards and 4 TDs per season over his four years in the NFL.

So which one of these guys would you trade Jamal Adams for?

See what I mean.  It isn't as simple as 'trade Jamal, replace him with a great WR and a good Safety'.  It's much more likely to be 'trade Jamal, replace him with a forgettable WR and weaken the defense at the same time'.  We aren't in cap trouble.  There's just no reason to do this except that you guys are all addicted to the draft because you don't remember what the postseason feels like.

 

The WR's in the 2020 class are going to be much better than the WRs you listed.  That makes it far less of a "roll of the dice".  

We talk a big game about how we need to help Darnold, then scoff at the WRs in this draft class.  Makes no sense.

Fine.  Take 2 OL in the first.  Wirfs and Biadasz.  Then grab a WR in the 2nd.  Or take two OL in the first and one in the 2nd.  I don't care.  It's all about the offense.  

We don't need to draft a Safety to replace Jamal.  Bring back Rontez and/or sign a cheap on in free agency.  It's not a hard position at which to find a decent starter.

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4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Rontez Miles (scheduled to be a UFA but he'd be cheap to bring back), and he'd be fine as a replacement level Safety.  

Come on.  He ended the year on IR with neck and hip injuries after making 7 total tackles in 7 games played.  And look at his record of games played over the past few years.  This is not, in my opinion, a 'fine' replacement for an All-Pro Safety.  He's a decent enough backup but if he's starting, we are going to feel the difference.

 

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4 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Come on.  He ended the year on IR with neck and hip injuries after making 7 total tackles in 7 games played.  And look at his record of games played over the past few years.  This is not, in my opinion, a 'fine' replacement for an All-Pro Safety.  He's a decent enough backup but if he's starting, we are going to feel the difference.

 

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Fine.  Then sign a cheap FA.  There are plenty of them.  

 

Player Pos. 2019 Team 2020 Team Type Snaps Age Current APY Guarantees
                 
Rodney McLeod S Eagles   UFA 99.8% 30 $4,000,000 $1,500,000
Anthony Harris S Vikings   UFA 83.1% 28 $3,095,000 $0
Ha-Ha Clinton-Dix S Bears   UFA 99.4% 28 $3,000,000 $500,000
Karl Joseph S Raiders   UFA 55.4% 27 $2,971,079 $11,884,316
Clayton Geathers S Colts   UFA 51% 27 $2,750,000 $1,250,000
Nate Ebner S Patriots   UFA 0% 32 $2,500,000 $1,200,000
Cody Davis S Jaguars   UFA 5.3% 31 $2,500,000 $2,500,000
Tre Boston S Panthers   UFA 100% 28 $2,125,000 $500,000
Jordan Lucas S Chiefs   UFA 3.7% 27 $2,025,000 $0
Adrian Phillips S Chargers   UFA 28.7% 28 $2,000,000 $1,250,000
Michael Thomas S Giants   UFA 26.9% 31 $2,000,000 $1,500,000
Damarious Randall S Browns   UFA 67.2% 28 $1,978,932 $6,401,310
Jeff Heath S Cowboys   UFA 66.6% 29 $1,917,750 $1,800,000
Rontez Miles S Jets   UFA 1.9% 32 $1,907,000 $0
Anthony Levine S Ravens   UFA 0% 33 $1,400,000 $1,300,000
Akeem King S Seahawks   UFA 24.8% 28 $1,400,000 $400,000
Walt Aikens S Dolphins   UFA 9.2% 29 $1,350,000 $1,300,000
Andrew Sendejo S Vikings   UFA 37.2% 33 $1,300,000 $500,000
Tavon Wilson S Lions   UFA 73.4% 30 $1,200,000 $250,000
Jahleel Addae S Texans   UFA 48.8% 30 $1,105,000 $150,000
Mike Adams S Texans   UFA 6.3% 39 $1,090,000 $0
Sean Davis S Steelers   UFA 5% 27 $1,021,742 $2,130,957
Vonn Bell S Saints   UFA 82.5% 26 $993,075 $1,825,944
Darian Stewart S Buccaneers   UFA 14.7% 32 $930,000 $0
Kurt Coleman S Bills   UFA 6.7% 32 $930,000 $0
J.J. Wilcox S Falcons   UFA 0% 29 $895,000 $200,000
Josh Shaw S Cardinals   UFA 0% 28 $895,000 $45,000
Johnathan Cyprien S Falcons   UFA 3.7% 30 $895,000 $275,000
Kemal Ishmael S Falcons   UFA 27.3% 29 $895,000 $90,000
Jaylen Watkins S Chargers   UFA 31% 28 $835,000 $0
Curtis Riley S Raiders   UFA 26.6% 28 $810,000 $165,000

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7 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

The WR's in the 2020 class are going to be much better than the WRs you listed.  That makes it far less of a "roll of the dice".  

We talk a big game about how we need to help Darnold, then scoff at the WRs in this draft class.  Makes no sense.

Fine.  Take 2 OL in the first.  Wirfs and Biadasz.  Then grab a WR in the 2nd.  I don't care.  It's all about the offense.  

We don't need to draft a Safety to replace Jamal.  Bring back Rontez and/or sign a cheap on in free agency.  It's not a hard position at which to find a decent starter.

I just don't know.  In 2017, Corey Davis and John Ross were both drafted in the top-10.  Neither is lighting up the league.  In fact, I don't think I'd trade Robby for either one.  

I absolutely want us to draft a WR.  But I don't want us to trade an All-Pro Safety to do it.  

The funny thing to me is, with all the talk about how badly we need a WR, the Titans and Vikings both won on the strength of a monster RB performance.  And Micheal Thomas, who is the best WR on the planet right now, didn't save NO.  I still want a great WR but I firmly believe improving the OL is more important this off-season and that's a big part of why.

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1 minute ago, nycdan said:

I just don't know.  In 2017, Corey Davis and John Ross were both drafted in the top-10.  Neither is lighting up the league.  In fact, I don't think I'd trade Robby for either one.  

I absolutely want us to draft a WR.  But I don't want us to trade an All-Pro Safety to do it.  

The funny thing to me is, with all the talk about how badly we need a WR, the Titans and Vikings both won on the strength of a monster RB performance.  And Micheal Thomas, who is the best WR on the planet right now, didn't save NO.  I still want a great WR but I firmly believe improving the OL is more important this off-season and that's a big part of why.

 

Fair enough.  Then use the pick from Adams for OL.  I'm fine with that option too.  3 straight OL in the first 2 rounds would be a great way to ensure Darnold has what he needs to be successful.

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Just now, nycdan said:

I just don't know.  In 2017, Corey Davis and John Ross were both drafted in the top-10.  Neither is lighting up the league.  In fact, I don't think I'd trade Robby for either one.  

I absolutely want us to draft a WR.  But I don't want us to trade an All-Pro Safety to do it.  

The funny thing to me is, with all the talk about how badly we need a WR, the Titans and Vikings both won on the strength of a monster RB performance.  And Micheal Thomas, who is the best WR on the planet right now, didn't save NO.  I still want a great WR but I firmly believe improving the OL is more important this off-season and that's a big part of why.

fixing the OL and drafting a much better RB are more important that wr.  watch how dalvin cook changed the game.  henry.  patriots used white out of the backfield as their only threat besides edelman.  give darnold protection and a running game, the team will be way better.

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3 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

it's hard to see how letting anderson walk (unless the money is outrageous) helps the jets.  they need several new OL starters, at least 1 wr even if robbie stays - and maybe 2 rbs as well.  anderson reminds me of the chris carter 'all he does is score touchdowns' - he's not a complete wr but he scores, stretches the field and has decent hands.  

the jets need an OL and running game more than drafting a  wr in the first round.  that's how the offense will get better.

Agree on all this except I'm ok with drafting a WR in round 1 over a "no matter who's there and who isn't" force-feeding of OL at all costs at #11.

There may be other options as well, like moving down from #11 and picking up another high pick. I know few people seem to like these ideas, as there's a perception of the must-get guys no longer being available later, but playoff teams seem to make do with their highest picks falling in the 20s every year.

e.g. what if Philly wants to move up for a prospect at a position we're not really targeting in round 1 (like CB), and aided by the connection with Douglas, offers pick 21 plus 53 (plus maybe more, ideally), and we still end up with a rock-solid OT or a "#1" type WR worthy of picking at 21, plus another mid-2nd rounder that makes hitting on each pick right away that much less crucial.

Too early to judge the wisdom of that yet, never mind that I have no idea what offers there will or won't be.  What I can say with confidence is this strategy of always staying put at the highest possible pick, and taking the perceived safest bust-proof prospect, hasn't yielded nearly the team that was expected. We're very much dealing with being short three recent 2nd rounders (2 of them high ones), and they're not painless to do without unless we'd hit on everything, which we of course didn't happen. 

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4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

There may be other options as well, like moving down from #11 and picking up another high pick. I know few people seem to like these ideas, as there's a perception of the must-get guys no longer being available later, but playoff teams seem to make do with their highest picks falling in the 20s every year.

 

i think this is a very likely scenario, since there will probably be a few OT after the top 2 who are graded similarly.

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7 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

 

There may be other options as well, like moving down from #11 and picking up another high pick. I know few people seem to like these ideas, as there's a perception of the must-get guys no longer being available later, but playoff teams seem to make do with their highest picks falling in the 20s every year.

e.g. what if Philly wants to move up for a prospect at a position we're not really targeting in round 1 (like CB), and aided by the connection with Douglas, offers pick 21 plus 53 (plus maybe more, ideally), and we still end up with a rock-solid OT or a "#1" type WR worthy of picking at 21, plus another mid-2nd rounder that makes hitting on each pick right away that much less crucial.

I'd love a trade down. Get more picks. This is one of the deepest wr drafts ever. We can still get a stud wr or a good olineman in the 20s while getting extra ammo for the next round or 2. This should be the real goal for Douglas. Accumulate as many picks as possible

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3 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Fine.  Then sign a cheap FA.  There are plenty of them. 

Thats a list of bum JAG's none are nowhere as good as Jamal Adams. 

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Will Eagles sign Robby Anderson? Release Alshon Jeffery? Bring back Jordan Howard? Projecting 2020 offense

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I took this from another post I made: 

I’ve been thinking about Robby Anderson and then I thought back to losing Laveranues Coles, and what that did to that offense. Cotchery after him. Then I think about Braylon Edwards and the mistake we made letting him go and how that all worked out. Are there any home grown guys that we paid at WR that didn’t work out? Why don’t we ever try to keep these guys? I think we should sign Robby.

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10 minutes ago, Drums said:

I took this from another post I made: 

I’ve been thinking about Robby Anderson and then I thought back to losing Laveranues Coles, and what that did to that offense. Cotchery after him. Then I think about Braylon Edwards and the mistake we made letting him go and how that all worked out. Are there any home grown guys that we paid at WR that didn’t work out? Why don’t we ever try to keep these guys? I think we should sign Robby.

If the price is right I want RA a NY Jet we cannot overpay we will still need a #1 WR via the draft hopefully or free agency (slim pickings). 

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7 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Rontez Miles (scheduled to be a UFA but he'd be cheap to bring back), and he'd be fine as a replacement level Safety.  

He'll probably be out of the league next year since there's not much demand for a jag safety who is on the wrong side of 30. He's the typical JAG that Jets fans like to pump up yet he's never done a damn thing in his career except play decent specials.

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6 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

If the price is right I want RA a NY Jet we cannot overpay we will still need a #1 WR via the draft hopefully or free agency (slim pickings). 

Yeah that’s the problem—he should have been extended months ago. Now there will be a bidding war due to the lack of options at WR in free agency. It is basically Amari Cooper, then RA, then everyone else.

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2 minutes ago, Drums said:

Yeah that’s the problem—he should have been extended months ago. Now there will be a bidding war due to the lack of options at WR in free agency. It is basically Amari Cooper, then RA, then everyone else.

The fact that he wasn't extended has me thinking he's not in the future plans here. 

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8 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

The fact that he wasn't extended has me thinking he's not in the future plans here. 

Same here--which brings us back to the first point that I made. History repeating itself. I don't think this will make us better on offense. Even if we draft WRs, it would not hurt having RA in the lineup. He is one of the players that will have success on another team, unlike Leo, Mo, Sheldon, etc. At the same time, we can't break the bank for him. 

I would not want to be Joe Douglas right now. 

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3 minutes ago, Drums said:

I would not want to be Joe Douglas right now. 

JD knew what he was getting into when the took the job here as GM. 

He needs to step up to the plate and fill the glaring needs holes on this team through free agency and the draft. 

He needs to improve this teams roster. 

No more excuses here from crappy GM's who have put us where we are today. 

 

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5 minutes ago, Drums said:

Same here--which brings us back to the first point that I made. History repeating itself. I don't think this will make us better on offense. Even if we draft WRs, it would not hurt having RA in the lineup. He is one of the players that will have success on another team, unlike Leo, Mo, Sheldon, etc. At the same time, we can't break the bank for him. 

I would not want to be Joe Douglas right now. 

Yes, but with a cap you can't sign players to big deals because you are afraid they may do well with another team. 

You need to sign/let players with an ultimate goal for the Jets. If Anderson demands 13-15 million he isn't really worth it imo. And I am a big Robby fan. 

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9 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

This is all I'm saying. I don't get the fervor for erring on the side of providing Darnold with fewer receiving weapons. This is the year he's supposed to take this massive leap forward, and people want to give him a pretty good slot receiver plus a rookie plus a 32-33 year-old who's lost 2 steps from before his Achilles tear? I'm in favor of bringing back DT also, but as a WR4 not as a WR2/3.

You want to give Darnold multiple, dangerous options? That doesn't happen by force-feeding two rookies, and/or a rookie plus a has-been, into the starting lineup, leaving no margin for error or injury. 

Anderson isn't an elite WR, isn't going to get an elite "#1" WR's contract, and if that's what it takes to re-sign him then duh we should pass. But this whole notion that he's only a marginal starter - while pining for the likes of starting Demaryius Thomas 15+ games in the next breath - is nonsensical to me. That's a move that a team makes when they're quasi-tanking and/or cleaning house of 30something has-beens, and are just using a McCown-ish, low-ceiling, stopgap QB for the year or anyway a veteran QB who isn't still very much developing.

If the Jets sign Cooper and Draft another WR preferably a big Possession guy like a Brandon Marshall/Micheal Irvin type I don't give a crap what they do with Robbie as long as it's not top WR money . I would be fine with the 12 Mil guaranteed type deal with Robbie and the big money going too Cooper and obviously the new receiver via the draft being on the rookie deal. If the Jets happen to hit a home run with the rookie, we can be very special as fast as next year as long as Darnold turns out to be the guy. In year 3 he better be the guy or he'll never be the guy IMHO

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8 hours ago, Darnold Schwarzenegger said:

I'd love a trade down. Get more picks. This is one of the deepest wr drafts ever. We can still get a stud wr or a good olineman in the 20s while getting extra ammo for the next round or 2. This should be the real goal for Douglas. Accumulate as many picks as possible

our pick is not good enough to get picks trading down ...that needed to be done the last 4 years no now TBH

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3 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

our pick is not good enough to get picks trading down ...that needed to be done the last 4 years no now TBH

That's just wrong. We are in an area that gets highly traded and actually makes it easier for us to trade down, because we arent top 10. 

Most teams avoid trading top 5 because the price is too high, which we ran into last year. 

Someone is going to salivate for our 11, especially if any of the QBs outside of Burrow are available, the 3 teams behind us are QB needy. 

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1 hour ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Yes, but with a cap you can't sign players to big deals because you are afraid they may do well with another team. 

You need to sign/let players with an ultimate goal for the Jets. If Anderson demands 13-15 million he isn't really worth it imo. And I am a big Robby fan. 

I don't know much about the cap, but 13 mil is probably as high as I would go for RA and that is high. If it came down to offensive line and RA, I would have to lean towards the line. I just hope JD gets creative and finds a way to do both.

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1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

JD knew what he was getting into when the took the job here as GM. 

He needs to step up to the plate and fill the glaring needs holes on this team through free agency and the draft. 

He needs to improve this teams roster. 

No more excuses here from crappy GM's who have put us where we are today. 

 

Yeah man and he has 6 years to do it but I hope it doesn't take that long!

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More of this tired, overused, and pointless sentiment?
Teams need more than just a WR1, or do you think other teams have nothing but that type under contract?
He’s definitely a WR2, and it’s delusional to think the team is going to draft 2 instant starter WRs - including your dream idea of a WR1 - in this upcoming draft. 
Just saying.
He’s not the only option, and he’s not my dream player either, but there aren’t a lot of options in FA. They screwed this one up good. 
He’s not getting what he’s asking for here, and even if he did that isn’t “WR1” money anymore anyway. The type you have in mind is now north of $20MM/year as a UFA.
Dude is a WR3/4 .... Let's be rational

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

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If the price is right I want RA a NY Jet we cannot overpay we will still need a #1 WR via the draft hopefully or free agency (slim pickings). 
We would still need a #1 and #2 ... Crowder is our #3 and RA would be an overpaid #4

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8 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

If the Jets sign Cooper and Draft another WR preferably a big Possession guy like a Brandon Marshall/Micheal Irvin type I don't give a crap what they do with Robbie as long as it's not top WR money . I would be fine with the 12 Mil guaranteed type deal with Robbie and the big money going too Cooper and obviously the new receiver via the draft being on the rookie deal. If the Jets happen to hit a home run with the rookie, we can be very special as fast as next year as long as Darnold turns out to be the guy. In year 3 he better be the guy or he'll never be the guy IMHO

Whoa there, if they somehow sign Cooper then there is no Anderson. In that case it's then just a rookie starter with them, or at most try for Perriman or even less. I'm not good with boxing a rookie out completely; I'm just not in favor of relying on a rookie to be the #1 or #2 WR a month before the draft, before we even know whInch guy we'll take when, and don't want to lock us into any position in any round.

It really is going to take a few years for Douglas to totally right this ship. Not a few years to be seriously competitive, but it’ll take a few years before he can better start his highest picks as a better combination of BAP and need; right now he’s forced into way too heavy on need only at one of 2 position groups on offense only. There’s just no pipeline - at WR in particular - because of the lack of higher investment (and the bust mid-level investments that were made). OL is even worse because you-know-who never filled holes in advance. His only semi-serious attempt at this was Edoga, and this is what happens when you leave no margin for error: if that guy isn’t really good right away like a top pick, your next offseason is a mess. As it turns out he wasn’t good, Winters got even worse, and his one big offseason OL splash in Osemele was totally useless and he got suckered. Combine that with extending neither of his incumbent tackles and you have a clusterf**k that doesn’t allow the team to put blinders on just draft the best WR no matter who’s on the board. 

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3 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Dude is a WR3/4 .... Let's be rational

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

I don’t agree that is the rational opinion. He’s a legitimate starter.

If the team didn’t feel that way as well then they’d have shipped him off for a mid-rounder in October. Nobody running a 1-6 team bypasses a needed mid-round pick in the upcoming draft for one last half season of a guy they see only as a WR3/4, after making the effort to shop him around in the first place. 

Even in the face of recent plays like the best catch by any Jets receiver in years - and one of the better TD catches by any receiver all year - there’s still this reapeated irrational mantra that he doesn’t have the ability to make a tough catch, and false critiques that he’s disproportionately dropping passes out of line with his peers when a lot of passes to him were just uncatchable by anyone (as is the case with a lot of deep-route WRs). 

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11 hours ago, RobR said:

He'll probably be out of the league next year since there's not much demand for a jag safety who is on the wrong side of 30. He's the typical JAG that Jets fans like to pump up yet he's never done a damn thing in his career except play decent specials.

As I said.  Miles OR a cheap free agent Safety would be fine.  There's a long list of those that would be quite capable.  

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