BurnleyJet Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Beerfish said: 4 more years of these kind of posts coming up each year with slightly lower expectations. This guy is Leo Williams all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Williams just looked overwhelmed from the jump. Milliner vibes. Both small town kids, Alabama players- where you're entire day is essentially planned for you. Trying to make the transition to the pros is a massive jump for a lot of those kids. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darnold Schwarzenegger Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 3 hours ago, playtowinthegame said: Jadeveon Clowney had a worse rookie season and was the number one overall pick. There's still hope for the Jets neophyte to become a difference maker. Clowney was also injured and only played in 4 games tho. Horrible comparison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jets723 Posted January 2, 2020 Author Share Posted January 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Darnold Schwarzenegger said: Clowney was also injured and only played in 4 games tho. Horrible comparison To be fair Williams also missed time and dealt with injuries Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnleyJet Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 2 hours ago, genot said: Please. Ed Oliver's production wasn't that much better than William's. Playing DT in a 4-3, the same position he played at Houston. Not to mention having Murphy and Hughes at ends. I’m sure I told you the stats in a previous thread. Double the sacks 15 more tackles. I know who I’d draft between the two. Quinnen Williams Total tackles: 28 Sacks: 2.5 Forced fumbles: 0 Fumble recoveries: 1 Pass deflections: 1 Ed Oliver Total tackles: 43 Sacks: 5.0 Forced fumbles: 1 Fumble recoveries: 0 Pass deflections: 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangerous Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Beerfish said: 4 more years of these kind of posts coming up each year with slightly lower expectations. This guy is Leo Williams all over again. i don't think leo ever had the ability to bowl over the guy in front of him. qwill has been able to push guys out of the way when he's played. granted we all want to see this on every play but at the same time the guy is a rookie and even though he came from alabama doesn't ean he fully understands the pro game. on top of that he's been nicked up a bit. some guys need to learn how to deal with these nicks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetstream23 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Quote 36. DI QUINNEN WILLIAMS, NEW YORK JETS There probably isn’t a more disappointing rookie season of 2019 than that of Quinnen Williams. After shattering PFF College records at Alabama in 2018, the third overall pick was expected to make an immediate pass-rushing impact in New York. While his run defense was better than most — he ranked 33rd at his position in run-defense grade — his pass-rushing was a bitter disappointment, as his lowly 5.7% pressure rate ranked 77th among 112 qualifying interior defenders by season's end. PFF has Williams as the #36 Rookie through Week 17. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetstream23 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, BurnleyJet said: I’m sure I told you the stats in a previous thread. Double the sacks 15 more tackles. I know who I’d draft between the two. Quinnen Williams Total tackles: 28 Sacks: 2.5 Forced fumbles: 0 Fumble recoveries: 1 Pass deflections: 1 Ed Oliver Total tackles: 43 Sacks: 5.0 Forced fumbles: 1 Fumble recoveries: 0 Pass deflections: 2 That's a meaningful difference but not huge IMO. I assume they played the same number of games/snaps? Also, Oliver doesn't show up on PFF's top 50 Rookies through Week 17 for some reason. Q. Williams is at #36. https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-top-50-highest-graded-rookies-through-week-17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurnleyJet Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, jetstream23 said: That's a meaningful difference but not huge IMO. I assume they played the same number of games/snaps? Ed Oliver 556 GM’s 16 starts 7 Quinnen Williams 511 GM’s 13 starts 9 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetscode1 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MindOverMatter Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 I'm not giving up on him yet but i'm also not expecting anything that would validate him being the #3 overall pick. If it was up to me I'd have drafted one of the passrushers or traded Q for the alleged "blockbuster" deal a team apparently offered the Jets earlier this year. Frustrating to say the least considering guys like Burns, Allen, Oliver are all showing so much promise. Even Sweat next year, with WSH switching to a 4-3, should be alot more of a threat. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 How come everyone's got all these age related excuses for Sam Darnold but a 21 year old playing DT is expected to dominate right away? it's a man's position QW (and Oliver) are still pups 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYJ1 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 No one has given up on him. But I am disappointed in his rookie season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choon328 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Q will probably be a good run stuffing DL for a while. He's just never going to be a guy who racks up sack numbers like the #3 overall pick should. He was outplayed by a fellow rookie who was undrafted in Kyle Phillips. Phillips flashed multiple times this season and Q didn't unless he was unlocked. Also, it's hard to not give up on him when people were flooding this board with the term "generational talent" as an excuse as to why he "had" to be the pick no matter what. I'm pretty sure the same people pushing this "patience" narrative are the same people who were screaming "Generational Talent"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, bitonti said: How come everyone's got all these age related excuses for Sam Darnold but a 21 year old playing DT is expected to dominate right away? it's a man's position QW (and Oliver) are still pups QB>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>tougher of a position than DT. QB>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>more important than a DT QB>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>more reliant on those around him than DT. Your comment might hold an ounce of water if there was not about 30 - 35 better rookies than this guy. Also we have 2nd year 6th rounders and udfa rookies playing better than him. He is a severe disappointment. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 3 hours ago, section314 said: Sounds more like Coples. And that didn't end with him being traded.? Pretty much was the Coples, Sheldon story with a little Leonard mixed in. Hope history doesn't repeat itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Maxman said: Pretty much was the Coples, Sheldon story with a little Leonard mixed in. Hope history doesn't repeat itself. Max....sadly for us it usually does. Except for January 12, 1969. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 I'd be pretty confident to wager that there isn't a GM in the NFL that would trade Ed Oliver or Josh Allen for Q. Could probably put Dexter Lawrence in that bet too. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobR Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, section314 said: I'd be pretty confident to wager that there isn't a GM in the NFL that would trade Ed Oliver or Josh Allen for Q. Could probably put Dexter Lawrence in that bet too. Sadly you can put ALMOST any other defensive player selected in the first round in that category. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, RobR said: Sadly you can put ALMOST any other defensive player selected in the first round in that category. It's just outrageous. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peebag Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 30 minutes ago, Jetscode1 said: Hutch was a mean balladeer 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache 51 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache 51 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 19 minutes ago, Maxman said: Pretty much was the Coples, Sheldon story with a little Leonard mixed in. Hope history doesn't repeat itself. Coples was a complete as##$^^&. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Q will grow .. he needs to get stronger and nastier. Time will tell.Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 4 hours ago, section314 said: Sounds more like Coples. And that didn't end with him being traded.? Coples, Aaron Maybin , dare I say Gholsten. All big DEs that get to the NFL and simply can’t play at a high level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRJets Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 I was thinking/hoping QW is not Leonard Williams II. Someone beat me to it with less optimism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetstream23 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 55 minutes ago, RobR said: Sadly you can put ALMOST any other defensive player selected in the first round in that category. There's some tunnel vision around here. QW definitely underperformed his Draft position but let's not call him the worst defender of the 1st round, or even of the Top 10. PFF has him roughly in-line with Josh Allen's grade as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobR Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, jetstream23 said: There's some tunnel vision around here. QW definitely underperformed his Draft position but let's not call him the worst defender of the 1st round, or even of the Top 10. PFF has him roughly in-line with Josh Allen's grade as well. That just shows you how utterly useless PFF grades are....even in their comments they said he sucked. I also didn't say he was the worst defender, I even put almost in caps. Do YOU really think that QW and Allen should have comparable grades after this season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornJetsFan1983 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 5 hours ago, Jets723 said: Look I understand as the 3rd overall pick we wanted a impact player immediately and Williams certainly didn’t have an impactful year. However I still feel he is gonna be a very good player for us despite not having a great rookie campaign. I do think injuries played a role in his year but also he didn’t seem comfortable either. I do think now that he had a year under him he will have a big second year. I know most. Have already made up their mind on him but let’s give the kid a chance in his second year ok 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmajet Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 For those with some hope left for QW, consider this, many on this site were saying the same thing about Adams a few years back. Maye was better, no impact, light on INTs; now he is our only pro-bowler and we should trade him for a blue chip OL, a couple of 1s and 2s. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetstream23 Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, RobR said: That just shows you how utterly useless PFF grades are....even in their comments they said he sucked. I also didn't say he was the worst defender, I even put almost in caps. Do YOU really think that QW and Allen should have comparable grades after this season? Allen had more flashes and clearly more sack production from the outside, but as you know PFF grades every NFL player on every play using half point increments. The grades are based on context and performance. In watching every game, PFF also records information and creates data that is typically unavailable to most people, at least as they describe it. All I know is that I have an untrained eye and I certainly don't watch every individual player on every individual play and then grade them between a -2 and +2 the way PFF does. If a RB was going to hit the A gap but it was plugged by a DT and that RB bounced outside and still got a 9 yard gain that's a bad play on D but a very good play by the DT. Those are the kinds of things that aren't assessed well by fans, especially ones with vested interests in a team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genot Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 4 hours ago, joewilly12 said: The Bills are in the playoffs the NY Jets aren't I think that helps pacify any doubts Bills fans have about Ed Oliver. Of course. The fact the Jet's aren't in the playoffs has nothing to do with Adams or QW. Creating holes to fill holes to me is not a winning formula. That's what i'm hearing from some. time and time again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobR Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 10 minutes ago, jetstream23 said: Allen had more flashes and clearly more sack production from the outside, but as you know PFF grades every NFL player on every play using half point increments. The grades are based on context and performance. In watching every game, PFF also records information and creates data that is typically unavailable to most people, at least as they describe it. All I know is that I have an untrained eye and I certainly don't watch every individual player on every individual play and then grade them between a -2 and +2 the way PFF does. If a RB was going to hit the A gap but it was plugged by a DT and that RB bounced outside and still got a 9 yard gain that's a bad play on D but a very good play by the DT. Those are the kinds of things that aren't assessed well by fans, especially ones with vested interests in a team. The problem with PFF is they don't know what a players assignment is on a given play and I have to question the merits on who is doing the grading. When you look at their rankings and how they slot players it is laughable at times. They have all pros who are decided by their peers ranked lower, and sometimes way lower than complete no name Jags. Pff is far from gospel and should be treated as such. QW was a ghost most games this year yet they give him a similar ranking to someone who had double digit sacks. It makes no sense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genot Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 2 hours ago, BurnleyJet said: I’m sure I told you the stats in a previous thread. Double the sacks 15 more tackles. I know who I’d draft between the two. Quinnen Williams Total tackles: 28 Sacks: 2.5 Forced fumbles: 0 Fumble recoveries: 1 Pass deflections: 1 Ed Oliver Total tackles: 43 Sacks: 5.0 Forced fumbles: 1 Fumble recoveries: 0 Pass deflections: 2 They play different roles in their respective defense's. Main reason being Gregg Williams doesn't have the quality outside defenders to play more in a 4-3, like Buffalo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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