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Tony Pauline on Leveon Bell+more

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1) I was told at Shrine Game practices that the Jets are going to take a hard look at every offensive lineman that is available in free agency. If they sign a pricey offensive lineman in March, they may go in a different direction on draft day.

2) We’ll have to wait and see what happens with WR Robby Anderson. My personal preference is that they sign Anderson as he’s not only a good receiver with game breaking skills, but he also has a great rapport with quarterback Sam Darnold.

3) Trading down is optimal but I do believe Wirfs and Wills will be available at the 11th pick. In that case, I’m taking Wirfs.

Except Anderson is not a very good receiver ... He's.an average speed guy with good ball tracking skills ... A nice WR 3/4 for 5mill per.

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33 minutes ago, Ghost said:

Bell is NOT the issue. Are you guys crazy? Our sh*tty offensive line is the damn issue. Put him behind the Titans OL and I promise you Bell will get 1,500 all purpose yards. 

Why?  Because he had a good season in 2017?

SAR I

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3 hours ago, CTM said:

1) 2 years older at a position known to breakdown right around Bells age

2) was ran into the ground in Pittsburgh particularly his last year.

3) Speaking of his last year he saw a clear regression in all of his per carry stats (nearly a 20% drop in YPC)

4) Strong Oline vs Weak Oline 

5) HoF QB putting up top 3-8 numbers vs young QB putting up bottom 3 numbers

Naturally the only logical conclusion here is that Gase sucking is the sole reason for Bell sucking because we dont like Gase and  Drake played well this year 

 

 

Naturally that settles it! Bell is a cancerous disease who sucks at football and naturally it has nothing to do with Gase! In fact, Gase has nothing to do with any of Gase’s other failures as a HC or OC over the last 6 years because naturally it’s all maccccccs fault!

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11 hours ago, Green Truth said:

This is fine,  I get it he is a great back,  but he maybe has 2 years left in him.  Give the guy a chance to win a ring.  Just get a 3rd or 4th for him so we can get a decent back in this draft.  I actually kinda felt sorry for him this year.

this is a stupid move for a 3rd or a 4th+  eat the bonus money when we need offensive linemen. Good teams do not get rid of good players for that and eat salary on top of it. That is stupid move and would mark douglas as a moron. If you move Bell it has to be for more, it also shows Gase alienates another good nfl player and hopefully marks the beginning of the end of Gase as the NY Jets coach

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Bell is NOT the issue. Are you guys crazy? Our sh*tty offensive line is the damn issue. Put him behind the Titans OL and I promise you Bell will get 1,500 all purpose yards. 

Gase doesn't know how to use him ... that combined with the above stated observation results in lackluster production.  

 

 

I can't wait until we trade arguably the best back in the league for peanuts and our Franchise QB brings us to 8-8.

 

If we trade him I hope he goes to San Fran or New England where the head coaches seem to have actual grey matter.

 

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7 hours ago, Dcat said:

Frankly,  I think there may be stuff about Bell and his relationship with the Jets that we don't know.  Just rumors/heresay from twitter.  

I think there is a chance we are getting played here. This smells like Darrelle Revis.  Or Rex Ryan. 

Bell knows the end is near in Pittsburgh because he’s older and used too much. Takes a year off to create the perception that he’s “refreshed”.  Comes to a team without an offensive line and is hidden from public view all preseason. Refuses to change his “patient” lateral style to create the perception that it’s the weak line that’s at fault and not him. Now trying to force his way to a contender with an elite line where he can fake it for another year.

We’ve seen this before.  

SAR I

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4 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

Gase doesn't know how to use him ... that combined with the above stated observation and you have lackluster production.

I can't wait until we trade arguably the best back in the league for peanuts and our Franchise QB brings us to 8-8.

If we trade him I hope he goes to San Fran or New England where the head coaches seem to have actual grey matter.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

Bell WAS a great back. Unfortunately the Pittsburgh Steelers were the beneficiary of that greatness not the NY Jets. 31 teams could have signed Le'veon Bell, actually 32 because the Steelers could have kept him by giving in to his demands. 

Of course Macc & the NY Jets basically bid against ourselves like we always do. I'm loving the difference in management & coaching. We have our QB & these guys aren't afraid to do what's best for the team OVERALL. TEAM. The Jets have always been about a guy here, a star there. It's about time it stops. 

We have a stout Dline. We have a QB. We need the stout oline & a few missing pcs to the puzzle, WRs, young RBs, a CB & Edge Rusher. That's the job JD is paid to do. The next 2 years are critical for the next 10. 

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Bell WAS a great back. Unfortunately the Pittsburgh Steelers were the beneficiary of that greatness not the NY Jets. 31 teams could have signed Le'veon Bell, actually 32 because the Steelers could have kept him by giving in to his demands. 
Of course Macc & the NY Jets basically bid against ourselves like we always do. I'm loving the difference in management & coaching. We have our QB & these guys aren't afraid to do what's best for the team OVERALL. TEAM. The Jets have always been about a guy here, a star there. It's about time it stops. 
We have a stout Dline. We have a QB. We need the stout oline & a few missing pcs to the puzzle, WRs, young RBs, a CB & Edge Rusher. That's the job JD is paid to do. The next 2 years are critical for the next 10. 
I was open to your point of view until you stated 'we have our QB' ... If we are being completely honest we don't really know what we have in Darnold.yet.

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Backs are a dime a dozen. Other than Jim Brown, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton. They’re all more or less the same. Virtually   every back coming out of school are of the same skill set. It’s all about the line and blocking scheme. The only back currently I would want if I had a choice would be obviously Derrick Henry. There are definitely a few good other ones. Other than that..... Give me one big thumper and one smaller quick guy and we’re gtg. If Bell goes??? See ya. If he stays ( which seems very possible too given his huge price tag) I’ll be fine with that too- but we need to add a real quick guy from the college ranks.

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12 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I'm not a football expert, but I believe Adam Gase wants a running back who runs in a forward direction, toward the opponent's end zone. 

I think youre selling yourself short here. 😃

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Nobody is giving anything of value for Bell and we’re going to need to eat almost all of his contract.  

he’s done, which is why the Jets don’t want him and anyone watching film on him this past season knows that too - he’s dead weight.   If we can’t trade him he’ll be cut.  
 

maybe a team will roll the dice on for a very small salary and a 7th - but even that is unlikely.  

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38 minutes ago, KRL said:

If Bell isn't here next year it will be nothing but a HUGE stain on Gase.  To have
a RB of Bell's production and not being able to do anything with him is ridiculous.
Granted the OLine wasn't good, but Bell should have been used more in the screen game
and running WR routes

It was stupid for Macc to sign Le'veon Bell & Gase was 100% correct in not wanting him, especially for the price we paid.

What was the Dallas Cowboys record after paying Zeke Elliott? And Zeke is eons BETTER than Bell is currently. Oh, and look at the Oline Zeke ran behind, oh, and the Cowboys have Amari Cooper. 

A running back for the most part does not a Super Bowl team make....usually. Of course there are exceptions, I don't think Elway wins a Super Bowl without Terrell Davis, but look how fast Davis fell off with injuries. 

Lets see if Henry can get the Titans past the Chiefs. If the Chiefs jump out 10, 13, 14 points, the game might be over. 

Hell, I wanted Cook instead of Maye & look at his last game. 13 yards I believe? TEAM GAME. I'm sure the Rams wish they had a better backup for Gurley in 2018. How are the Rams doing in this years playoffs? 

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9 hours ago, CTM said:

1) Thats a pre June 1 figure,  post June 1 has a cap savings. Sportrac has below which doesn't really match OTC for pre June 1, but regardless there is a league year benefit to waiting after 6/1 resulting in cap savings (OTC doesn't have post 6/1 cut figure for some reason). I haven't kept up on cap rule intricacies but I'm almost certain this still exists and Sportrac seems to confirm.

OTC is right. There’s no post June 1 designation because it’s the last year of the current CBA. 

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This team needs a $14 million dollar a year RB as much as it needs another first round defensive tackle.   However Douglas can unload Bell I’m fine with.  

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The one time the Jets actually sign one of my fav players in the league....the HC doesn't want him/refuses to coach to his strengths 

 

Why do I do this to myself? LOL 

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Gase’s defenders out here are quick to throw away a HOF level player in Bell for a HC who has not been anyway near Bell’s level of performance in the NFL. 

This is the height of utter madness and it is a pattern with Gase before, that is, blame the good players for not “fitting” into his magic scheme. 

Well I for one don’t buy it.  Miami played better last year trying to literally tank games than in Gase’s last year there. 

Next Gase  will be leaking how he didn’t want Sam Darnold as draft prospect, oh wait,——— it has been rumored that this was the case....

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11 hours ago, KRL said:

If Bell isn't here next year it will be nothing but a HUGE stain on Gase.  To have
a RB of Bell's production and not being able to do anything with him is ridiculous.
Granted the OLine wasn't good, but Bell should have been used more in the screen game
and running WR routes

Or Bell gets traded, performs similarly wherever he goes and Gase/JD look pretty damn smart for dumping him.  

Curious, what can a HC do with a RB behind an OL as bad as the Jets OL?  Never sees holes so what can be done to get consistent positive runs?  Seems go me whenever the line opened a hole Bell hit a gainer. 

Nothing was going to change the production 

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13 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I'm not a football expert, but I believe Adam Gase wants a running back who runs in a forward direction, toward the opponent's end zone. 

then explain why he benched Drake in Miami?  I just think he has no clue what he is doing.  Could be the biggest NFL farce in many years.

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13 hours ago, Samtorobby47 said:

One that isn’t slow and doesn’t cry when the game plan doesn’t go his way?

any truth to the unsubstantiated twitter rumor (same time as the Wyatt garbage) he showed up at the facility reeking of alcohol?

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12 hours ago, T0mShane said:

Your reminder that Leveon Bell averaged a meager 4.0 yards per carry behind an offensive line featuring three pro-bowlers in Pittsburgh in 2016-17.

I love how you think this means something.  And I love how you full on ignore the fact that all 3 Rb's who were carrying the Football for the NY Jets had the worst season of their careers this year.  Powell, Montgomery and Bell all had the worst ypc of their career.

 

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9 hours ago, CTM said:

 

Not really accurate

1) Thats a pre June 1 figure,  post June 1 has a cap savings. Sportrac has below which doesn't really match OTC for pre June 1, but regardless there is a league year benefit to waiting after 6/1 resulting in cap savings (OTC doesn't have post 6/1 cut figure for some reason). I haven't kept up on cap rule intricacies but I'm almost certain this still exists and Sportrac seems to confirm.

2) Further, both sites agree there is a cap saving in a trade scenario, regardless of whether or not that trade occurs before or after 6/1. This is due to not all of the money being a pro rated signing bonus and some of the guaranteed money being in the form of a guaranteed base salary (which gets traded with Bell, but accelerates if cut)

As usual ape the only one with egg on his hairy face is you. At some point it becomes good money after bad, particularly if you are of the mindset that the dude is shot. 

Sportrac

 

image.png.3d83eb9c25e84faf507bfc03ae1ee3e1.png

OTC

image.thumb.png.19031252acf8a443b83fa32d409d945d.png

A respectful argument. I knew you had it in you, you cur.

I personally don't believe he's shot. I think he, along with Sam, were the most negatively impacted by the poor play of the offensive line - and the inferior coaching staff they're working with.

That said, I am happy to walk back my comments about it not being a cost savings move if I misinterpreted the data. No harm in that. 

Honestly, both things can be true here. Either way, I do stand by the tongue in cheek part of what I said... which is it's typical Jets to create more holes to fill, before filling the existing holes. Oh well, I guess.

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1 hour ago, greenwichjetfan said:

Naturally that settles it! Bell is a cancerous disease who sucks at football and naturally it has nothing to do with Gase! In fact, Gase has nothing to do with any of Gase’s other failures as a HC or OC over the last 6 years because naturally it’s all maccccccs fault!

Naturally..

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12 hours ago, SAR I said:

Gase is a smart NFL guy, Bell was once the best RB in the league, and the Jets have a big shortage of offensive talent.

It's not hard to see what's going on here.  Bell requires a certain set of offensive linemen and we don't have them.  Gase knew it, he did what he could to give him carries, but in the end he was ineffective.  It's either that or Bell is shot.  Took a year off, lost his focus, lost his game.

Either way, this isn't on Gase.  It's on Maccagnan.  Or Bell for not adjusting his style to hit a hole quickly and stop sliding around.

SAR I

No SAR.  It is not "on Bell".  It's on Gase.  Gase calls the plays and sets the offense.  You're trying to blame it all on personnel and that is pure bullcrap.  Gase's offense is amorphous and it cannot be blamed exclusively on personnel.

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52 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

I was open to your point of view until you stated 'we have our QB' ... If we are being completely honest we don't really know what we have in Darnold.yet.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

Hey, we disagree about Darnold. You don't end up ranked 10th in QBR when your Oline ends up ranked at 32 without skills. 

There is no doubt in my mind watching this team that Sam Darnold dealt with more 2nd & 3rd & longs than any QB in this league. Our running game was abysmal. 

Anyone who watches the NFL agrees that the Jets have one of the worst offensive rosters in football & that was B4 they lost Quincy & Herndon, then Griffin. 

Unlike you, I can't wait to see Sam play confidently behind a solid Oline & all of his weapons available to him. He played with a clock in his head & the ball would explode in 2 seconds after the snap. That's a tough way to play QB.

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37 minutes ago, slats said:

OTC is right. There’s no post June 1 designation because it’s the last year of the current CBA. 

Ahh that explains it, I'd assume it will return in one form or another though and dont think Bells contract prevents us from moving him

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9 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

I personally don't believe he's shot. I think he, along with Sam, were the most negatively impacted by the poor play of the offensive line - and the inferior coaching staff they're working with.

This is really the issue, I think he's closer to shot than elite and if our immature autistic head coach isnt going to use him better to see if we can recoup a mid round pick. I believe he'd be easy to upgrade as a runner, less so as a receiver but again he wasnt really used that way 

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9 hours ago, Skeptable said:

See, I thought it was more play design and scheming that got him the job and that Manning did the play calling... But maybe your right. Tough to tell with what this team dealt with this year

I can understand fans who criticize an offensive coordinators inability to get the QB going or a WR going.  That's all about scheme, deception, personnel, pre-snap reads, etc.  Very sophisticated.  Extremely scientific.  No question there.  OC earns his money.

But a running back?  You've got 5 fat guys up front who can slide left, slide right, or pull.  There's an A gap and a B gap, sometimes a C.  The ball goes to the RB and the fat guys either make their blocks or they don't, the RB either bursts through the hole or he doesn't.  RB is like a tennis player, it's an individual sport at that point, he's either talented enough with his vision and body control or he isn't. 

You blame a weak passing game on the OC.  But a weak ground game?  That's on the GM and the RB. 

SAR I

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2 hours ago, Ghost said:

Bell is NOT the issue. Are you guys crazy? Our sh*tty offensive line is the damn issue. Put him behind the Titans OL and I promise you Bell will get 1,500 all purpose yards. 

You might be right.  Thing is, its going to take 2-3 years to have an elite OL and by the time we have that, by the time we have what Bell needs, he will be 30 years old and we'll be out $52 million dollars on a player that isn't going to be a part of our growth towards the playoffs.  He'll actually stand in our way.  Hurts us financially, can't hit a hole with authority and get a measly 4 yards per carry, puts us in 3rd and long all the time.

SAR I

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1 hour ago, KRL said:

If Bell isn't here next year it will be nothing but a HUGE stain on Gase.  To have
a RB of Bell's production and not being able to do anything with him is ridiculous.
Granted the OLine wasn't good, but Bell should have been used more in the screen game
and running WR routes

thank you.  

There is NO EXCUSE... none...nada for Gase not using Bell as a pass catcher.  It was absolutely ridiculous.  Gase ignores, for a full f-ing season no less, one of Bell's strongest skills.

Explain that.  You can't.  It can't be blamed exclusively on a bad OL.  It is on the coach's offensive play calling and design.  ANd with repsect to that Gase has been horrible in both Miami and NY.  And we all know Manning called the plays in Denver.

I'm sorry.  Stop defending Gase.  He is horrible. The more I see these absurd excuses (not reasons), absurd after-the-fact reasoning defending him.   

Edit:  The more people defend Gase, the more hostile these threads are going to become.  Every shred of evidence points to Gase being a BAD OC, a BAD play caller and a BAD play designer that suits the skill players he has.  The defending posts have concocted an absurd narrative that tries to blame everything on personnel.    Sorry guys, but you fail with that.  

If Gase sucks again next season, he is gone.  Or should be.  To date, he has been an abominable HC.

 

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30 minutes ago, JiF said:

I love how you think this means something.  And I love how you full on ignore the fact that all 3 Rb's who were carrying the Football for the NY Jets had the worst season of their careers this year.  Powell, Montgomery and Bell all had the worst ypc of their career.

 

It means that he averaged 4.0 YPC running behind three pro bowlers in Pittsburgh 

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19 minutes ago, CTM said:

This is really the issue, I think he's closer to shot than elite and if our immature autistic head coach isnt going to use him better to see if we can recoup a mid round pick. I believe he'd be easy to upgrade as a runner, less so as a receiver but again he wasnt really used that way 

Yup, agree. It's possible that he looked crumby because he took time off, or he's old. Hard to really assess, and I don't trust Gase's evaluation - purely because he's made it fact that he's failed to evaluate properly in the past. 

I mean, I was reading something the other day totally unrelated to the Jets or Gase, and as a means of emphasizing a point, it referenced Gase's reputation for mis-evaluating his players. 

At the end of the day, Bell wasn't a good $$$ signing by Macc = dud, shocker. Now, we have a situation where we're not sure what the truth is, because the Gase hire by Macc also = dud, shocker.

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12 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Maybe the bigger questions is why the great Brian Flores traded Drake for peanuts in October, or why Drake couldn’t beat out TJ Yeldon at Alabama, or why Drake will be on his third team in less than a year in a few weeks.

and why did Flores trade Tunsil when the OL was allegedly so bad?  To clean the up the stench of the Gase house, that's why.  Gase got rid of Drake because the fans were screaming for him to use Drake.  It's Gase's way or the highway apparently.  Gase sucks and always has.  He was a huge mistake.  Thank the Johnsons for more years of misery.

It looks like there will be a spring full of mindless, illogical defenses of Gase.  The more I see that nonsense the more I want to retort and point out just how lame and pathetic the reasoning is behind it.  We are going to be very disappointed if we adhere to the "close my eyes and wish it to come true" approach for Adam Gase.   

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