Pretend it's 1983: Would you trade Ken O'Brien for Dan Marino?

[Dunnie]

Seems like a no brainer. . . .  but, then again, OB did have a winning record vs Marino.

Some amazing games.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[Savage69]

16 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

@T0mShane bath tub in the shared rooming house bathroom has more rings than Dan Marino. 

Ken O'Brien played In some wild games, he too no rings so NO. 

No rings?? Hell Kenny never won a playoff game something his back up Ryan did..Kenny also never had even 1 rushing td Namath had 7 wearing braces..

[JetsFanatic]

2 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

No rings?? Hell Kenny never won a playoff game something his back up Ryan did..Kenny also never had even 1 rushing td Namath had 7 wearing braces..

To put Marino and O'Brien in the same category is absolutely laughable.  I'm assuming that  @TuscanyTile2 was too young to see them play.

[Dunnie]

To put Marino and O'Brien in the same category is absolutely laughable.  I'm assuming that  [mention=27657]TuscanyTile2[/mention] was too young to see them play.

I just remember a few awesome Monday night battles.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[JetsFanatic]

1 minute ago, Dunnie said:

I just remember a few awesome Monday night battles.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

Ken O'Brien had some great games against Miami. I was at the 51-45 game, one of the most exciting games I've ever seen.  Ken O'Brien had some talent and had his moments, but he was not in Marino's class.

[Jetsfan80]

18 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

This thread was intended to be a joke in reference to another post.

If you have to explain the joke, it's not that funny.  

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, CTM said:

Not my work nor have I read it in over a decade:

Myth: Dan Marino had no defense.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Marino played 17 seasons in the NFL. Twice, he had the luxury of playing with the league's No. 1 scoring defense: his rookie year of 1983 (15.6 points per game), and again in 1998 (16.6 points per game). That's a pretty enviable ratio in a league that had 28 and then 30 teams in Marino's playing days.

Consider this: Terry Bradshaw played 14 seasons in Pittsburgh and won four Super Bowls. The famed Steel Curtain defense that he played with led the league in scoring just twice in those 14 years. Of Bradshaw's four title teams, only one boasted the league's best scoring defense.

In Marino's record-setting 1984 season, the Dolphins had the No. 1 scoring offense in football and the No. 6 scoring defense (18.6 points per game). The 1990 Dolphins, meanwhile, boasted the league's No. 4 scoring defense, surrendering just 15.1 points per game.

There's no doubt Marino played with some poor defenses in his day, but that's the price of playing in the league 17 years. But the Cold, Hard Football Facts show that he also played with several defenses more than strong enough to win Super Bowls.

Myth: Marino had no running game.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Marino joined Miami at a time when it had a reputation of being the best ground team in football. In fact, the year before Marino was drafted, the Dolphins made it all the way to the Super Bowl on the strength of a great running game and great defense.

In Marino's rookie year, 1983, the Dolphins racked up 2,150 yards on the ground. In 1984, Marino set single-season records with 48 touchdowns and 5,084 yards passing. The Dolphins still managed 1,918 rushing yards and averaged 4.0 yards per carry.

It would be disingenuous to say that the Dolphins were a great running team later in Marino's career. Of course, much of that can be attributed to too few rushing attempts and a misguided faith placed in Marino's arm.

But consider this: The New England Patriots went 17-2 and won the Super Bowl last year while averaging a woeful 3.4 yards per rushing attempt. The Dolphins averaged more than 3.4 yards per rushing attempt 14 times in Marino's 17 seasons. In other words, Marino's Dolphins ran the ball more than well enough to win Super Bowls.

Myth: Marino had to carry the Dolphins himself.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Few quarterbacks in NFL history have been surrounded by more talent than Marino.

In his 17-year career, Marino played with 55 players named to the Pro Bowl. Marino himself was named a Pro Bowler nine times. That's a remarkable 64 Pro Bowl players, or nearly four for every season Marino spent in the NFL. Four times in Marino's career, the Dolphins boasted five or more Pro Bowl players in a single season. Compare that with New England's two Super Bowl teams, which had a total of just five Pro Bowl players.

Marino also had the rare luxury of joining a team that had played in the Super Bowl the year before he arrived. He also played most of his career for the winningest coach in NFL history, Don Shula.

Shula has quite a resume. Working with quarterbacks Bob Griese, Earl Morrall and Johnny Unitas, he led the Colts and Dolphins to five Super Bowls in 15 years. Over the next 13 seasons, working with Marino, he appeared in just one more Super Bowl. He lost.

If any quarterback in NFL history walked into an ideal situation in which to win a Super Bowl, it was Dan Marino.

Myth: Marino was a big-game quarterback.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Want to know the real reason why Marino never won a Super Bowl? Sadly, the answer sits with Dan Marino himself.

Simply put, Marino did not elevate his game in the playoffs. In fact, his played dropped off quite noticeably. Marino has a career regular season passer rating of 86.4. His postseason passer rating was just 77.1. He played in 18 playoff games, and won just eight of them.

In his one Super Bowl appearance (a 38-16 loss to the 49ers in Super Bowl XIX), Marino completed 29 of 50 passes for 318 yards, 1 TD and 2 INTs. It adds up to a weak 66.9 passer rating. One wonders what might have happened had his two Super Bowl drives that ended in interceptions ended in touchdowns instead.

Remember that 1998 Miami team that had the best defense in football? It made the playoffs, but Marino failed to hold up his end of the bargain. The season ended in the second round of the playoffs, with Marino coughing up two interceptions against Denver and posting a passer rating of just 65.5. Yet another opportunity for Marino to win a Super Bowl tossed into the hands of an opposing defender.

 

In fact, Marino threw at least one interception in 13 of his 18 career playoff games. He threw two or more interceptions 10 times. The Dolphins went just 1-9 in those 10 Marino multi-interception playoff games.

 

So, DollFans, if you're looking for a reason why Miami never won a Super Bowl in the 1980s or 90s, look no further than the faded Dan Marino poster still taped to the ceiling over your bed.

 

I laughed it up after the first paragraph where the author tried to sell the number 1 scoring defense with being a good defensive team.  Then doubles down on the mistake by comparing a great defensive team, the Steelers with the Fins because they not only were a great defense but had a top scoring defense, therefore its the same thing.  Or brings up the ground game the year before Marino was a fin.  When they had Davis Woodly at QB who threw for all of 1000 yards?  Thats all they did but run.   The more you read the funnier the selective use of numbers are.  Its like a HOF QB, who was the best QB, greatest player,  I ever saw as a STH from 1977,  actually sucked reading this.  

Dan Marino was a great, great QB.  I get it, long time fans, we hate the Dolphins more that the Pats.  Brady is the modern day Marino.  Its what we do

[TuscanyTile2]

58 minutes ago, JetsFanatic said:

Is this a joke? O'Brien and Marino don't belong in the same category.

It actually was intended to be a joke but it definitely didn't work - lol.  I was trying to play off the "would you trade Darnold for Burrow" posts.

[mrcoops]

Absolutely not. 

Marino had stupid hair. O'Brien had a sensible haircut you could set your watch by.

[TuscanyTile2]

1 hour ago, mrcoops said:

Absolutely not. 

Marino had stupid hair. O'Brien had a sensible haircut you could set your watch by.

Plus the Isotoners

[Charlie Brown]

Ummmmmm only Jets fans would compare Ken O'Brien against Dan Marino.

Lets make this simple NO NFL PLAYER or SANE FAN of another NFL team besides Jets Fan would even think of comparing O'Brien to Marino.

Marino was the HERO of the Manning and Farve  -  O'Brien isn't even the Hero of all Jets fans.

Mario is a HOF player - Ken O'Brien whom I liked, will have to buy tickets to visit the HOF ---- comparing the two is a form of INSANITY...

Come on Now!

[TuscanyTile2]

41 minutes ago, Charlie Brown said:

Ummmmmm only Jets fans would compare Ken O'Brien against Dan Marino.

Lets make this simple NO NFL PLAYER or SANE FAN of another NFL team besides Jets Fan would even think of comparing O'Brien to Marino.

Marino was the HERO of the Manning and Farve  -  O'Brien isn't even the Hero of all Jets fans.

Mario is a HOF player - Ken O'Brien whom I liked, will have to buy tickets to visit the HOF ---- comparing the two is a form of INSANITY...

Come on Now!

Fully agree.  Though Chad Pennington is still better than Tom Brady

[JPPT1974]

Wished he could had been elite like Marino and a Hall of Fame like #13!

[Charlie Brown]

10 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Fully agree.  Though Chad Pennington is still better than Tom Brady

I actually erased that line of Jet fan foolishness in my original response.....But I appreciate your post!! 

Thank you for putting sanity somewhere in the thread........ 

[Sonny Werblin]

6 hours ago, JetsFanatic said:

To put Marino and O'Brien in the same category is absolutely laughable.  I'm assuming that  @TuscanyTile2 was too young to see them play.

IDK about that. Kenny and his JAG HCs were 8-7 vs Marino and his HOF coach.

[Nixhead]

Jets had a great O Line and a really good team around OBrien. It was a no brainer to draft Marino ahead of OB and of course the Jets blew it. Jets could of very possibly won a Super Bowl in the 80s had they drafted Marino. 

[Jet_Engine1]

On 1/17/2020 at 8:31 PM, kevinc855 said:

Marino never won anything 

Yeah! He sucked!! Take that, Dan!

[roscoeword]

OBrien NEVER had a rushing T.D.  Even in those days, when there were mostly pocket qb's, that is a very telling stat.

[Gastineau Lives]

15 hours ago, CTM said:

Not my work nor have I read it in over a decade:

Myth: Dan Marino had no defense.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Marino played 17 seasons in the NFL. Twice, he had the luxury of playing with the league's No. 1 scoring defense: his rookie year of 1983 (15.6 points per game), and again in 1998 (16.6 points per game). That's a pretty enviable ratio in a league that had 28 and then 30 teams in Marino's playing days.

Consider this: Terry Bradshaw played 14 seasons in Pittsburgh and won four Super Bowls. The famed Steel Curtain defense that he played with led the league in scoring just twice in those 14 years. Of Bradshaw's four title teams, only one boasted the league's best scoring defense.

In Marino's record-setting 1984 season, the Dolphins had the No. 1 scoring offense in football and the No. 6 scoring defense (18.6 points per game). The 1990 Dolphins, meanwhile, boasted the league's No. 4 scoring defense, surrendering just 15.1 points per game.

There's no doubt Marino played with some poor defenses in his day, but that's the price of playing in the league 17 years. But the Cold, Hard Football Facts show that he also played with several defenses more than strong enough to win Super Bowls.

Myth: Marino had no running game.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Marino joined Miami at a time when it had a reputation of being the best ground team in football. In fact, the year before Marino was drafted, the Dolphins made it all the way to the Super Bowl on the strength of a great running game and great defense.

In Marino's rookie year, 1983, the Dolphins racked up 2,150 yards on the ground. In 1984, Marino set single-season records with 48 touchdowns and 5,084 yards passing. The Dolphins still managed 1,918 rushing yards and averaged 4.0 yards per carry.

It would be disingenuous to say that the Dolphins were a great running team later in Marino's career. Of course, much of that can be attributed to too few rushing attempts and a misguided faith placed in Marino's arm.

But consider this: The New England Patriots went 17-2 and won the Super Bowl last year while averaging a woeful 3.4 yards per rushing attempt. The Dolphins averaged more than 3.4 yards per rushing attempt 14 times in Marino's 17 seasons. In other words, Marino's Dolphins ran the ball more than well enough to win Super Bowls.

Myth: Marino had to carry the Dolphins himself.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Few quarterbacks in NFL history have been surrounded by more talent than Marino.

In his 17-year career, Marino played with 55 players named to the Pro Bowl. Marino himself was named a Pro Bowler nine times. That's a remarkable 64 Pro Bowl players, or nearly four for every season Marino spent in the NFL. Four times in Marino's career, the Dolphins boasted five or more Pro Bowl players in a single season. Compare that with New England's two Super Bowl teams, which had a total of just five Pro Bowl players.

Marino also had the rare luxury of joining a team that had played in the Super Bowl the year before he arrived. He also played most of his career for the winningest coach in NFL history, Don Shula.

Shula has quite a resume. Working with quarterbacks Bob Griese, Earl Morrall and Johnny Unitas, he led the Colts and Dolphins to five Super Bowls in 15 years. Over the next 13 seasons, working with Marino, he appeared in just one more Super Bowl. He lost.

If any quarterback in NFL history walked into an ideal situation in which to win a Super Bowl, it was Dan Marino.

Myth: Marino was a big-game quarterback.

Cold, Hard Football Facts: Want to know the real reason why Marino never won a Super Bowl? Sadly, the answer sits with Dan Marino himself.

Simply put, Marino did not elevate his game in the playoffs. In fact, his played dropped off quite noticeably. Marino has a career regular season passer rating of 86.4. His postseason passer rating was just 77.1. He played in 18 playoff games, and won just eight of them.

In his one Super Bowl appearance (a 38-16 loss to the 49ers in Super Bowl XIX), Marino completed 29 of 50 passes for 318 yards, 1 TD and 2 INTs. It adds up to a weak 66.9 passer rating. One wonders what might have happened had his two Super Bowl drives that ended in interceptions ended in touchdowns instead.

Remember that 1998 Miami team that had the best defense in football? It made the playoffs, but Marino failed to hold up his end of the bargain. The season ended in the second round of the playoffs, with Marino coughing up two interceptions against Denver and posting a passer rating of just 65.5. Yet another opportunity for Marino to win a Super Bowl tossed into the hands of an opposing defender.

 

In fact, Marino threw at least one interception in 13 of his 18 career playoff games. He threw two or more interceptions 10 times. The Dolphins went just 1-9 in those 10 Marino multi-interception playoff games.

 

So, DollFans, if you're looking for a reason why Miami never won a Super Bowl in the 1980s or 90s, look no further than the faded Dan Marino poster still taped to the ceiling over your bed.

The Case for Marino: Marino is perhaps the most scrutinized quarterback on the face of the earth. It would be expected that the NFL’s all-time leader in most passing categories (until Favre passed him) would have a Super Bowl ring to his name. He doesn’t. Then again, in Marino’s 10 postseason losses, his team rushed for an average of 53 yards per game, while the defense surrendered an average of 34.5 points per game. No one could win with that support.

The Case Against Marino: He will always be known as the best quarterback in history to never win a Super Bowl. His numbers (29-of-50, 318, 1, 2) in the game weren’t great, and he led the Dolphins to just 16 points. In each of his first five playoff losses, he threw two interceptions and posted a passer rating under 80. His career passer rating in the playoffs (77.4) is almost 10 points lower than his career rating in the regular season.

Bottom Line: An 8-10 career playoff record and just a single Super Bowl appearance are certainly less than spectacular, but Pro Football Reference did a detailed study analyzing a quarterback’s rushing and defensive support. The result of this study showed Marino should have won 5.6 playoff games in his career. This means he actually overachieved—significantly—in winning an additional 2.4 games. Put Marino on the Montana 49ers, and they still would have been a dynasty.

The fact that Marino is viewed as a poster boy for guys who couldn’t win the big one rather than one of the five greatest quarterbacks to ever play the game is unfortunate.

[Jet Nut]

6 hours ago, Gastineau Lives said:

His career passer rating in the playoffs (77.4) is almost 10 points lower than his career rating in the regular season.

Wish I knew what Jets, Bills or Colts blog sites contributor put this nonsense together.  Its flawed in every way

Steve Young, who I think at one time was the career QR leader was 11 points below his career average in the playoffs.

Tom Brady, the greatest post season QB, cheats and all is just about 10 its lower in the post season

Given that you don't have some of the cupcakes that you see in the regular season in the playoffs, the much better overall competition and defenses you face in the post season, I would totally expect a drop in QB rankings.

BTW, the case for Montana is no that he had no drop off.

Isn't it a fact that marino never had a 1,00o yard rusher?  Never had a threat of a running game?  In 83 the Dolphins leading rusher was a FB who compiled but didnt scare you.

Watching him we were all awed.  He really was what we all thought Namath would have looked like if he had knees.

[CTM]

7 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Wish I knew what Jets, Bills or Colts blog sites contributor put this nonsense together.  Its flawed in every way

Steve Young, who I think at one time was the career QR leader was 11 points below his career average in the playoffs.

Tom Brady, the greatest post season QB, cheats and all is just about 10 its lower in the post season

Given that you don't have some of the cupcakes that you see in the regular season in the playoffs, the much better overall competition and defenses you face in the post season, I would totally expect a drop in QB rankings.

BTW, the case for Montana is no that he had no drop off.

Isn't it a fact that marino never had a 1,00o yard rusher?  Never had a threat of a running game?  In 83 the Dolphins leading rusher was a FB who compiled but didnt scare you.

Watching him we were all awed.  He really was what we all thought Namath would have looked like if he had knees.

It's from a site called cold hard footbsll facts, I readcthem and not sure if they even still produce content. This article was posted on a Jet forum 10+ years ago.

Marino was clearly an all time great and better than Obrien. My only motive was to get Jet Nut and other jesticles to defend Marino on a jets site. 

[Jet Nut]

9 minutes ago, CTM said:

It's from a site called cold hard footbsll facts, I readcthem and not sure if they even still produce content. This article was posted on a Jet forum 10+ years ago.

Marino was clearly an all time great and better than Obrien. My only motive was to get Jet Nut and other jesticles to defend Marino on a jets site. 

Its not cold hard facts, its twisting numbers.  To compare the fins D to the championship steelers teams because one year the fins led in points off of turnovers?  Thats pure stupid.  Points off of TOs don't prove youre a good or great D.  

So lets get this straight, posting a stupid article, which in almost every point is wrong, to have people explain why its pure nonsense does what for you exactly? 

Sounds like a nice story though.  

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

Screw football ; i would buy stock in I-phones .