Jump to content

OBJ wants to come to the Jets


Rhg1084
 Share

Recommended Posts

38 minutes ago, long time suffering Jets f said:

There's no denying OBJ is a great talent. The problem is he's a ticking time bomb. If I had to make a deal for him I would offer a 3rd rounder. Nothing more. Cleveland seems desperate to trade him and OBJ wants out. Maybe the Browns will bite.

He’s not even that great of a talent. His athleticism carried him as a receiver prior to his injury. He is an undisciplined route runner, especially compared to the true elite players at the position, has terrible hands and is always hurt. He legit sucked in Cleveland last year and Mayfield was forced to keep throwing his way because the coach had no control of the team. Would be no different in NY.

  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

As usual, your response is reasonable, very much so.

Just remember though, if this report is true, we have a unique opportunity to add an elite talent to a position where we desperately need talent.

We don't know what it would take to get him, and I can see arguing about the cost of acquiring him, but not the course of paying him. His contract is uniquely advantageous for a team that wants to add him. He can be cut after one, two or however many years left with zero cap ramifications.

To me, it's a win-win scenario. Add the elite WR you hoped to in FA or the draft, you can always draft another if you like, or you have the chance to draft another player for the OL, CB or ER position then you would have prior.

What exactly is the downside except he's (shudder) eccentric?

The downside could be the compensation the Browns would want to trade him. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, GREENBEAN said:

Heeeeeeey now..... That's taken out of context man. :) 

My point was in response to a specific quote. We're talking about impact. The quote said something to the effect of Odell being able to have a great impact on the team should we trade for him and that he's worth the headaches etc. The Browns were 7-8-1 in 2018. They added obj among others to the mix. Then were 6-10 the in 2019. We can look deeper into it and I'm sure there are other reasons outside of obj, who had 7 drops and 4 TD's, but he did not have the impact you would want from trading a very good safety and a 1st rd pick for. 

I'm never going to say that he's not a top tier receiver, but the point that he does not have the desired results for a team can be argued and argued well. And we haven't even gotten into the 14x he was fined.

 

Thanks. Your explanation is exactly what I was driving at and why these types of discussions are basically a chicken-or-egg exercise in circular futility. 
 

One’s narrative around the same set of facts is totally driven to support the desired conclusion. 
 

Like a QB who performs well: “he’s really elevating his team.”

Like a QB who performs poorly: “he has no weaponz.”

Don’t like a QB who performs well: “he’s in the perfect situation and being carried by his supporting cast.”

Don’t like a QB who performs poorly: “BUUUUUUUST!”

Not a knock on you, but it’s pretty obvious that people who already think OBJ is an overrated cancer will never change their opinion. Just like we still have people who defend Sanchez and (albeit to a lesser extent) Geno, saying their failure to launch was not their fault but “no weaponz, “bad coaching,” or a dozen other reasons.

Good players find a way to shine. We should judge these guys by their feats and accomplishments and not always try to explain away good performance or excuse bad performance. And comparing Browns win record from 2018 and 2019 and then attributing the difference to OBJ is ridiculous, no offense, and would mean everyone on a losing team automatically sucks because they didn’t elevate their team to more wins.

  • Upvote 1
  • Post of the Week 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, IndianaJet said:

Could you imagine OBJ with a coach like Gase?

 

I'm sure Jarvis Landry has had nothing but good things to say to OBJ about ole Googley Eyes.

BINGO!

OBJ and Bell would drive GASE to the loony bin.  On second thought....hmmmmmm

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, prime21 said:

Besides being a whack job, OBJ is a me first guy and is showing that by being interested in NY.  The only way he could get to NY for his own selfish reasons is to play for the Jets.   Puff puff pass.

 

So you only want players of pure heart? I dunno like 90%+ of players go for the highest dollar. Which is what most of us do, by the way. My employer’s competitor offers me a 20% raise, I’m out lol.

  • Upvote 1
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I’m offering the later third rounder and a conditional pick next year based on production. That’s it. 

I'd go as far as giving up our #2 this year. Instant starting #1 WR? With Crowder in the slot here? Add a guy like Pittman (A big strong #2), Herndon back, Bell splitting with a guy like Hellaire? 

Its f*cking chancy but damn, seeing OBJ dancing in the Patriots endzone is pretty freaking appealing. A Sam to OBJ back shoulder would be virtually IMPOSSIBLE to stop with Crowder, Pittman, Herndon, Bell slipping out of the backfield. 

I saw a lot of Cleveland games, I have no idea what happened to Baker but there were a lot of times OBJ was wide open & he watched the ball sail over his head & just shook his after. Whether they weren't on the same page or what, I don't know, but a scramble drill by Sam Darnold with OBJ out there is a scary proposition for a secondary. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, prime21 said:

BINGO!

OBJ and Bell would drive GASE to the loony bin.  On second thought....hmmmmmm

I don't think so. Bell was a model citizen. Bell wants to win with all the criticism he got for leaving Pittsburgh. I bet that win was pretty satisfying to him last year, that loss ended up knocking the Steelers out of the playoffs. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Browns used OBJ wrong last year.  His value comes from his RAC ability but they tried making him a route runner, which he's not.  He should get about 3 slants and 3 screens per game and you hope he breaks one. If you can bring him in and utilize him that way it's worth the late 3rd. I would still address WR in the draft as well. His presence makes the offense much more explosive and harder to defend as soon as he steps onto the field. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jets need to model the Patriots and take on players that can help them win regardless of their perceived “baggage.” Then if it’s doesn’t work out worst case scenario you move on. I respect the Pats in that aspect they’re not afraid to go after guys like Antonio Brown if they think it will benefit their team

  • Upvote 2
  • Post of the Week 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Matt39 said:

He’s not even that great of a talent. His athleticism carried him as a receiver prior to his injury. He is an undisciplined route runner, especially compared to the true elite players at the position, has terrible hands and is always hurt. He legit sucked in Cleveland last year and Mayfield was forced to keep throwing his way because the coach had no control of the team. Would be no different in NY.

Totally get what you’re saying this. To mentally prepare yourself for when Jets don’t land him. We have a new regime now though. Let’s give them a shot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Remind me why the Browns would trade a Top 5 WR away from a team that's trying to develop its own young QB?

Jets:  He'd be a great weapon for Darnold.

Browns:  Let's get him away from Mayfield.

Jamal Adams - come back to the big apple dog. Darnold won 7 games with  no weaponz. Big D is far better than that dwarf Baker Mayflower. Let's make it happen. 

Odell Beckham Jr. - Get me out of cLeaveLand in a New York minute. Baker is a scrub. I will let my agent know I want to play with the Jets. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, jgb said:

And comparing Browns win record from 2018 and 2019 and then attributing the difference to OBJ is ridiculous, no offense, and would mean everyone on a losing team automatically sucks because they didn’t elevate their team to more wins.

No offense huh?  Then why the hell am I in tears over here then? I'm incredibly offended. ;-) 

In my wordy way I can actually debate most of your points quite effectively but I'll try to make it succinct.  Interestingly I am actually making my way around to considering the obj thing from the other angle. There are differing reasons for that switch, but the idea that people are too rigid to change their mind is silly town... cuz I'm tedering on it right now. So there! :) 

 Comparing the two things is actually not that hard to do. But it's not exactly what I'm saying. It's more about the assumed impact he would have to the Jets using the examples of obj's prior impact. There are many variables of course and it's always easy to cherry pick what ever you need to support whichever stance you're on.  I try my best to just look at the ground level facts. When the Browns traded for obj, they wanted more of an impact. Fair enough?  He had over 1000 yds so that's pretty good. He had 4 TD's. Not so good. He had 7 drops. Not that bad, but for what they gave up, I'm sure they envisioned less. And drops are hard to blame on the QB. Then again he had 74 catches on 133 targets. That's hard to blame on him when only 7 drops were logged. 

So is it odell's fault that they were 6-10?  Not entirely of course, but I can safely say that he did not have the impact toward success that trading a very solid safety and a 1st rd pick elicits. It's actually pretty difficult to argue against that point and sound logical. obj was not the reason they sucked. That's just dumb. But he did not have the impact that everyone here imagines he would directly bring to the jets. That's really my only point other than the BS attitude and propensity for fines he has which is another story. 

And that was me trying Not to be wordy. Ugh. 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GREENBEAN said:

No offense huh?  Then why the hell am I in tears over here then? I'm incredibly offended. ;-) 

In my wordy way I can actually debate most of your points quite effectively but I'll try to make it succinct.  Interestingly I am actually making my way around to considering the obj thing from the other angle. There are differing reasons for that switch, but the idea that people are too rigid to change their mind is silly town... cuz I'm tedering on it right now. So there! :) 

 Comparing the two things is actually not that hard to do. But it's not exactly what I'm saying. It's more about the assumed impact he would have to the Jets using the examples of obj's prior impact. There are many variables of course and it's always easy to cherry pick what ever you need to support whichever stance you're on.  I try my best to just look at the ground level facts. When the Browns traded for obj, they wanted more of an impact. Fair enough?  He had over 1000 yds so that's pretty good. He had 4 TD's. Not so good. He had 7 drops. Not that bad, but for what they gave up, I'm sure they envisioned less. And drops are hard to blame on the QB. Then again he had 74 catches on 133 targets. That's hard to blame on him when only 7 drops were logged. 

So is it odell's fault that they were 6-10?  Not entirely of course, but I can safely say that he did not have the impact toward success that trading a very solid safety and a 1st rd pick elicits. It's actually pretty difficult to argue against that point and sound logical. obj was not the reason they sucked. That's just dumb. But he did not have the impact that everyone here imagines he would directly bring to the jets. That's really my only point other than the BS attitude and propensity for fines he has which is another story. 

And that was me trying Not to be wordy. Ugh. 

Love your response. I actually don’t think we are that far off. The issue is, as I see it, that we (Jets fans) are clinging to the lack of weaponz/line as the reason Darnold has graded out as a bottom 5 QB two years into his career. In that context, it totally makes sense why so many think/wish/hope a talent like OBJ can be what the team needs to prove this wish that Darnold is an elite player in disguise and not yet another Jets QB bust.

So... I promised you we are not far off and here it is. I don’t think Darnold is all that good. I think his absolute ceiling (perfect world) is Romo and that looks more unlikely each year. His floor.. well he is already there.. is Sanchez. So because I don’t think he’s that good, I agree OBJ will not be a magic wand. However, if we have a chance at a guy like that we still have to take our shot because of horrendous roster mismanagement and to either validate that Darnold is the man or prove conclusively that he is not. 

We cannot finish another season with question marks around Darnold. We have to know, and that requires surrounding him with some talent and seeing whether he steps up or he does not.

tldr; Jets have to take a chance on a guy like OBJ and it’s all Macc’s fault!

  • Post of the Week 1
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, jetstream23 said:

OBJ sucked in part because he was injured all season apparently.  The positive is that you'd have to expect him to heal and be better in 2020.  The negative is that this guy is like a Ferrari.....he goes 150mph....but he also spends a ton of time in the garage getting repaired.

OBJ and Baker played up the injuries because they are both fragile b-tches 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Philc1 said:

OBJ and Baker played up the injuries because they are both fragile b-tches 

Hmm, sounds definitive. Until... (see below)

2 hours ago, Philc1 said:

If all it takes a second round pick plus a couple mid round picks it’s a literal no brainer for the jets

Ok, so if I’m reading all this right, NOW you think getting Sam a “fragile b-tch is a literal no brainer for the Jets, if all I takes is a second plus a couple of mid round picks”.

Hasn’t Sam gotten into enough trouble with the fragile... ahh, never mind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, jgb said:

Love your response. I actually don’t think we are that far off. The issue is, as I see it, that we (Jets fans) are clinging to the lack of weaponz/line as the reason Darnold has graded out as a bottom 5 QB two years into his career. In that context, it totally makes sense why so many think/wish/hope a talent like OBJ can be what the team needs to prove this wish that Darnold is an elite player in disguise and not yet another Jets QB bust.

So... I promised you we are not far off and here it is. I don’t think Darnold is all that good. I think his absolute ceiling (perfect world) is Romo and that looks more unlikely each year. His floor.. well he is already there.. is Sanchez. So because I don’t think he’s that good, I agree OBJ will not be a magic wand. However, if we have a chance at a guy like that we still have to take our shot because of horrendous roster mismanagement and to either validate that Darnold is the man or prove conclusively that he is not. 

We cannot finish another season with question marks around Darnold. We have to know, and that requires surrounding him with some talent and seeing whether he steps up or he does not.

tldr; Jets have to take a chance on a guy like OBJ and it’s all Macc’s fault!

Right. Good post. And it's making me think actually. 

Ya wanna know something?  It's really interesting how close we are while being pretty far away on Darnold. I happen to think Sam is going to be a very good Top QB in this league. The problem is that it may take him a little bit longer than we would like. That's how I see it anyway. He's super young and that is a legit factor. I know many do not like to lean on that one and I don't use it too much as a talking point but its true. And I hear ya on the weapons and protection thing, but that's actually true too. 

You make a great point with getting Sam the weapons he needs so an actual assessment can be made on the guy.  With that concept being the basis for the argument, signing/trading for guys like obj or Diggs etc seems much more logical. I still feel like they, especially Beckham can actually stunt a lung QB's growth with all their bellyaching though. But I get it. 

So let me ask you a question. If Sam is showing slow but steady incremental progress over the next two years, but not top 10 type of stuff, does that mean he is not going to ever be elite? Would you want to cut ties and move on?  Serious question. 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said:

Right. Good post. And it's making me think actually. 

Ya wanna know something?  It's really interesting how close we are while being pretty far away on Darnold. I happen to think Sam is going to be a very good Top QB in this league. The problem is that it may take him a little bit longer than we would like. That's how I see it anyway. He's super young and that is a legit factor. I know many do not like to lean on that one and I don't use it too much as a talking point but its true. And I hear ya on the weapons and protection thing, but that's actually true too. 

You make a great point with getting Sam the weapons he needs so an actual assessment can be made on the guy.  With that concept being the basis for the argument, signing/trading for guys like obj or Diggs etc seems much more logical. I still feel like they, especially Beckham can actually stunt a lung QB's growth with all their bellyaching though. But I get it. 

So let me ask you a question. If Sam is showing slow but steady incremental progress over the next two years, but not top 10 type of stuff, does that mean he is not going to ever be elite? Would you want to cut ties and move on?  Serious question. 

Great conversation between you two, and you just asked a great question.

I’m just going to say my answer would be, of course you try to keep him if he’s improving, but what if he’s then playing at a level like  Dak Prescott is, and like Dak, he’s turning down upwards of 35 mil to sign a second deal?

I think most of us think the Cowboys would be crazy to give Prescott that much money per.I don’t think it’s any different for the Jets. It comes down to what type of deal Sam would be looking to make, don’t you think?

That said, I look forward to reading the rest of your conversation with @jgb

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Matt39 said:

He’s not even that great of a talent. His athleticism carried him as a receiver prior to his injury. He is an undisciplined route runner, especially compared to the true elite players at the position, has terrible hands and is always hurt. He legit sucked in Cleveland last year and Mayfield was forced to keep throwing his way because the coach had no control of the team. Would be no different in NY.

You don’t think this clown had anything todo with it?

8A33B88C-EB31-478A-B213-1C56065C650A.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, 14 in Green said:

Hmm, sounds definitive. Until... (see below)

Ok, so if I’m reading all this right, NOW you think getting Sam a “fragile b-tch is a literal no brainer for the Jets, if all I takes is a second plus a couple of mid round picks”.

Hasn’t Sam gotten into enough trouble with the fragile... ahh, never mind.

OBJ is a fragile b with talent

 

Baker is a fragile b with no talent

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...