Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 36 minutes ago, Wonderboy said: Did you see Adams on NFL network at the combine? The prez was so self promoting it was nauseating. “I’m not just a box safety I can do it all”. I was waiting for the self proclaimed prez to declare he would next end world hunger. ^^^^^^^^^ This is what it's really about. Folks into the soap opera aspect of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 20 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: Douglas took the calls, yet had a price. That price was more than what other teams were willing to give. Douglas didnt cave. Seems like Douglas holds Adams at high value. Anyone can pick up a telephone when it's your job to pick up the telephone. Your may be right that other teams don't think he has as much value as the Jets (CJ) may think he does. Do you know for sure that Douglas made the decision not to accept the offer? Or did CJ over ride him? Myself, IDK, but the power structure of the Jets indicates that CJ considers himself the top football power. Seems like he placated a petulant player with an assurance that he would be a Jet forever, and Douglas would no longer be answering the phones because CJ is the boss. Your also correct that it's Douglas' job to answer the phone when another GM calls. Obiviously a prima donna player on the Jets doesn't understand that. He thinks he's in charge. Glad to see we agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 15 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: ^^^^^^^^^ This is what it's really about. Folks into the soap opera aspect of the game. If you don't think Jamal's endless self-promotion won't play into his contract demands and offseason behavior you're out of your mind. It's only a soap opera because Jamal wants it to be. Don't shoot the messengers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said: Well, since he's still a Jet and has not been traded..... Says absolutely nothing. The league year hasn't even begun in earnest yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE BARON Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 On 2/27/2020 at 9:52 AM, Jetsfan80 said: Is his only value tied to his sacks though? He strikes me as a Calvin Pace type, helping to set the edge. Pair him with a pure pass rusher on the other side and our defense looks a ton better. High quality of thinking here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonderboy Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: ^^^^^^^^^ This is what it's really about. Folks into the soap opera aspect of the game. Soap operas are the deal! Chiun from Remo Williams: What are you watching? Your country's one and only contribution to the art. It concern family... Iove, honor, and courage. All that is noblest in the human spirit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 53 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: If you don't think Jamal's endless self-promotion won't play into his contract demands and offseason behavior you're out of your mind. It's only a soap opera because Jamal wants it to be. Don't shoot the messengers. Im not interested in that. Im saying that the man is worth keeping around at top SS prices. He's the best in the game. Im not shooting the messengers, just amazed at how men eat this stuff up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said: Says absolutely nothing. The league year hasn't even begun in earnest yet. Says more than what the haters say. JD took calls and decided not to pull the trigger before last year ended. It's not like the opportunity hasnt presented itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 hour ago, THE BARON said: High quality of thinking here... Is this sarcasm? lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: Says more than what the haters say. JD took calls and decided not to pull the trigger before last year ended. It's not like the opportunity hasnt presented itself. What opportunities have presented themselves since the trade deadline? What exactly has changed? JD with some meaningless quotes? None of that means a thing if Jamal starts demanding a lot more than we're willing to pay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: Im saying that the man is worth keeping around at top SS prices. Jamal will laugh at top SS prices. He's going to be after well above that. If you're going to call JD's quotes meaningful, then the ones where Jamal compares himself to Aaron Donald are meaningful too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: What opportunities have presented themselves since the trade deadline? What exactly has changed? JD with some meaningless quotes? None of that means a thing if Jamal starts demanding a lot more than we're willing to pay. It doesnt matter what opportunities have presented themselves since the trade deadline ended given that there is no trading after the trade deadline. What matters are the opportunities that presented themselves during the trade window that JD clearly declined given Adams value. Folks can damage control that narrative until the cows come home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Jamal will laugh at top SS prices. He's going to be after well above that. If you're going to call JD's quotes meaningful, then the ones where Jamal compares himself to Aaron Donald are meaningful too. He's going to set that SS market price because he's clearly the best SS in the game and is arguably the best safety in all of football. Of course he should laugh at that price, when the cap continues to inflate, you continue to ask for more nominally in order to maintain your worth percentage wise in regards to the cap. You know this 80. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE BARON Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 24 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Is this sarcasm? lol. lolz... no... an honest reaction... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker89 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 On 2/27/2020 at 11:46 AM, Villain The Foe said: Jenkins is averaging 1 sack more than Jamal Adams...a Safety How the hell are we putting up Jenkins appreciation threads, yet looking to trade the Adams? Insanity. It's the optics on the players situation compared to their draft slot, compared to their production along with perceived positional importance. Adams can't produce enough to justify his pick at #6, that's not his fault. People advocating for a trade are focusing on the perceived positional value and gaping holes elsewhere at positions that are "more" important. People advocating for holding onto him want to keep some of the only home grown talent we have. Neither side is completely wrong. The people who look foolish are those entrenching themselves on either side, turning every thread into the same Jamallpro debate. Those who want to dump him for any sort of compensation and those who want to keep him at 20+ Million a year can both be wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 24 minutes ago, Lurker89 said: It's the optics on the players situation compared to their draft slot, compared to their production along with perceived positional importance. Adams can't produce enough to justify his pick at #6, that's not his fault. True, but it's been 4 years now. Folks need to finally let it go. Quote People advocating for a trade are focusing on the perceived positional value and gaping holes elsewhere at positions that are "more" important. People advocating for holding onto him want to keep some of the only home grown talent we have. Neither side is completely wrong. Here's my problem with this. We have tons of cash and high draft picks in every round, including two 3rd round picks. The Jets are also in position at #11 to possibly trade down in order to get more draft capital. I wouldnt say neither side is completely wrong. One side is dealing with trading a guy based on perception, yet we're not lacking in salary cap or draft picks in order to justify going this positional value route, when we have tons of resources to focus on our areas of need. Quote The people who look foolish are those entrenching themselves on either side, turning every thread into the same Jamal pro debate. I wouldnt say guys like @Jetsfan80 looks foolish. Quote Those who want to dump him for any sort of compensation and those who want to keep him at 20+ Million a year can both be wrong. Yeah, but there's a difference. Paying him top dollar for his top play is no more riskier than paying any other player top dollar for their top play. However, dumping him for any sort of compensation is wrong no matter how you put it. That would be pretty foolish, which is why I dont agree with that "neither side is completely wrong" comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker89 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 40 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: However, dumping him for any sort of compensation is wrong no matter how you put it. That would be pretty foolish, which is why I dont agree with that "neither side is completely wrong" comment. 100% agree, to clarify the only way I see trading him as a viable option is if we are getting the equivalent of two firsts at a minimum coupled with the big variable of his contract demands being prohibitive to the team. If his demands are in line with fair market value I don't see any way we don't resign him. I'm all for keeping Jamal but I don't like the idea of sinking 15%+ of the cap at that position. Either way I still think he gets signed. Not my money, not my decision I just get to see how it plays out. Trading him for a couple second round picks is the wrong answer... Paying him 25 mil per is the wrong answer. But I don't think anyone is really arguing towards either end of that spectrum. Most opinions lay somewhere in the middle. The biggest factor making any of this an issue are the bad contracts of the past and mountain of dead money we have to carry. Pay Robby instead of Enunwa and don't sign Tru to that albatross of a contract and the things that have been heavily debated fiscally regarding the Jets would be non issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 48 minutes ago, Lurker89 said: 100% agree, to clarify the only way I see trading him as a viable option is if we are getting the equivalent of two firsts at a minimum coupled with the big variable of his contract demands being prohibitive to the team. If his demands are in line with fair market value I don't see any way we don't resign him. I'm all for keeping Jamal but I don't like the idea of sinking 15%+ of the cap at that position. Either way I still think he gets signed. Not my money, not my decision I just get to see how it plays out. Trading him for a couple second round picks is the wrong answer... Paying him 25 mil per is the wrong answer. But I don't think anyone is really arguing towards either end of that spectrum. Most opinions lay somewhere in the middle. The biggest factor making any of this an issue are the bad contracts of the past and mountain of dead money we have to carry. Pay Robby instead of Enunwa and don't sign Tru to that albatross of a contract and the things that have been heavily debated fiscally regarding the Jets would be non issues. I dont mind sinking top money into a Safety who's clearly the best SS in the league (not even close) and is arguably the best Safety in the league period. However, my problem is the excessiveness in which folks will go to try to make resigning Adams seem like something ridiculous...such as allocating 15% of the salary cap. With that said, when it comes to the top dollar contract Adams is requesting, it's really not that bad for these reasons. We have a QB on a rookie contract so we're not paying a QB Franchise money. We dont have an edge rusher so we're not paying a rusher top dollar. The salary cap goes up every single year. The Jets arent paying out at the positions that you generally see teams pay out of. Example. The Ravens let C.J. Mosley walk because they felt like he was too expensive and he wasnt the best ILB in the league. The Jets made Mosley the highest paid ILB in NFL history....though they could have paid Demario Davis a fraction of that money...a guy who went to the Saints and is now a 1st team All-Pro. The Jets constantly draft defensive linemen. We can go back the past 15 years and talk about the about of Dlinemen this team has drafted. With this fact in mind, the Jets decided to pay Henry Anderson even though they were already stacked at interior Dline. To add insult to injury, they then go and draft Quinnen Williams. The Jets give LeVeon Bell a payday (a great player who deserves to be paid), however, the Jets don't have an offensive line so the investment is a wash because there's no one setting up blocks that Bell can take advantage of. Your assessment in regards to bad contracts or signing the wrong receiver is 100% on point. However, are we to make the same mistake by letting go a HOF caliber player because we paid Enunwa and not Anderson, or Mosley and not Davis? What happens if we get a team to trade a 1st and a 3rd and we whiff on both picks? I mean, it's the Jets bro...blowing on draft picks is what they do the majority of the time. My main point is that this Jets team cannot be trusted with trading a future HOF Safety for draft picks as if this franchise has a history of knowing what to do with draft picks. If a team like the cowboys are willing to give up prime Olinemen for Adams, then sure, you make the deal because protecting Sam, creating lanes for Bell and allowing receivers to get open is more important. However, trading Adams for draft picks doesnt mean much when the Jets 1st rounders mostly suck....outside of Jamal Adams. We all know Adams isnt getting a 25 million per contract (or 15% of the cap). C'mon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker89 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Villain The Foe said: I dont mind sinking top money into a Safety who's clearly the best SS in the league (not even close) and is arguably the best Safety in the league period. However, my problem is the excessiveness in which folks will go to try to make resigning Adams seem like something ridiculous...such as allocating 15% of the salary cap. With that said, when it comes to the top dollar contract Adams is requesting, it's really not that bad for these reasons. We have a QB on a rookie contract so we're not paying a QB Franchise money. We dont have an edge rusher so we're not paying a rusher top dollar. The salary cap goes up every single year. The Jets arent paying out at the positions that you generally see teams pay out of. Example. The Ravens let C.J. Mosley walk because they felt like he was too expensive and he wasnt the best ILB in the league. The Jets made Mosley the highest paid ILB in NFL history....though they could have paid Demario Davis a fraction of that money...a guy who went to the Saints and is now a 1st team All-Pro. The Jets constantly draft defensive linemen. We can go back the past 15 years and talk about the about of Dlinemen this team has drafted. With this fact in mind, the Jets decided to pay Henry Anderson even though they were already stacked at interior Dline. To add insult to injury, they then go and draft Quinnen Williams. The Jets give LeVeon Bell a payday (a great player who deserves to be paid), however, the Jets don't have an offensive line so the investment is a wash because there's no one setting up blocks that Bell can take advantage of. Your assessment in regards to bad contracts or signing the wrong receiver is 100% on point. However, are we to make the same mistake by letting go a HOF caliber player because we paid Enunwa and not Anderson, or Mosley and not Davis? What happens if we get a team to trade a 1st and a 3rd and we whiff on both picks? I mean, it's the Jets bro...blowing on draft picks is what they do the majority of the time. My main point is that this Jets team cannot be trusted with trading a future HOF Safety for draft picks as if this franchise has a history of knowing what to do with draft picks. If a team like the cowboys are willing to give up prime Olinemen for Adams, then sure, you make the deal because protecting Sam, creating lanes for Bell and allowing receivers to get open is more important. However, trading Adams for draft picks doesnt mean much when the Jets 1st rounders mostly suck....outside of Jamal Adams. We all know Adams isnt getting a 25 million per contract (or 15% of the cap). C'mon. Looks like we agree. I'm really just trying to paint the picture of the hyperbolic pay him/ trade him debate that seems to be consuming every thread. (While simultaneously getting sucked into it.) He's gonna get paid.... Most likely by us, for somewhere between 18-20Mil per. Hopefully we front load it while we have the flexibility to. Would you be happy with 4 years 80 million, 50 guaranteed 22mill the first 2 followed by 18 the last two, effectively locked in for 3 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wonderboy Posted March 5, 2020 Share Posted March 5, 2020 On 3/2/2020 at 6:57 PM, Lurker89 said: Looks like we agree. I'm really just trying to paint the picture of the hyperbolic pay him/ trade him debate that seems to be consuming every thread. (While simultaneously getting sucked into it.) He's gonna get paid.... Most likely by us, for somewhere between 18-20Mil per. Hopefully we front load it while we have the flexibility to. Would you be happy with 4 years 80 million, 50 guaranteed 22mill the first 2 followed by 18 the last two, effectively locked in for 3 years? Who does he think he is Aaron Donald? Oh yea he does. Add a medication clause to his contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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