Trade Up ?????

[SR24]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

 I hear you, but a couple of things:

1) Yes, OL is our biggest need, but WR is our second biggest need and becomes even weaker if we let Anderson walk. WR is not that much less of a priority than OL if we don't resign Robbie. 

2) We are just not in a position to give up a 3rd round pick (+) to move up in the first round. We need a minimum of three new starters on the OL, 1-2 WRs, at least one corner, and an edge rusher. We need more picks, not fewer picks. 

3) I think Jeudy will very likely be worth taking at 11. I'd be very surprised if he wasn't at least a good NFL WR. 

I’m not advocating we trade up as I think someone will be there OT for us at 11 but I wouldn’t be mad if Joe D moves up to get his guy if the run starts. We’re in a good spot to add a solid player at 11 just hope it’s an OT, we really need NYG to take Simmons and ARI to take Lamb/Jeudy

[RobR]

1 hour ago, JTJet said:

I will give everyone on this board $1000 dollars if 3 OL are gone by the 11th pick. 

I'm holding you to this.

[JTJet]

13 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

Jets are in desperate need of a franchise LT and it'll be a failure if JD doesn't come away with one. Yeah, the top WR's look great and I'd love one but they're a luxury the Jets can't afford this year. Next year we'll be picking mid to late in the first round and franchise LT's will not be available.

1) There is nothing to say we dont completely rework our line in FA. 

2) WR is by no means a luxury we cannot afford. Our only WR who sniffed anything close to 1000 yards will probably be gone in FA. We can argue it may be a more desperate need than OL after we go through FA. 

3) We dont know where we will pick yet next year, and no idea what LT will be top picks either. 

[New York Mick]

1 hour ago, SR24 said:

Not true based on the trade value chart we’d be giving up about 1445 points by trading our later 3rd for a pick that’s valued at 1350. 

What spot are they trading up to?

[Lith]

1 minute ago, New York Mick said:

What spot are they trading up to?

Our 2nd 3 should get us to 8 or 9 -- at least according to the chart.  On draft night, who knows.

[New York Mick]

Just now, Lith said:

Our 2nd 3 should get us to 8 or 9 -- at least according to the chart.  On draft night, who knows.

Then they wouldn’t have a 2nd round pick

[New York Mick]

31 minutes ago, RobR said:

I'm holding you to this.

Please do

[Lith]

Just now, New York Mick said:

Then they wouldn’t have a 2nd round pick

If we trade 11 (1,250) and 79 (195) to move up to 8 (1,400).  We still have a 2nd round pick.

[Big_Slick]

23 minutes ago, JTJet said:

1) There is nothing to say we dont completely rework our line in FA. 

2) WR is by no means a luxury we cannot afford. Our only WR who sniffed anything close to 1000 yards will probably be gone in FA. We can argue it may be a more desperate need than OL after we go through FA. 

3) We dont know where we will pick yet next year, and no idea what LT will be top picks either. 

"1) There is nothing to say we dont completely rework our line in FA. "

I just don't see the Jets having the resources or ability to attract a complete re-build of the OL in FA.

"2) WR is by no means a luxury we cannot afford. Our only WR who sniffed anything close to 1000 yards will probably be gone in FA. We can argue it may be a more desperate need than OL after we go through FA."

The Jets can not afford to come away from this draft without a franchise LT pick in the first round. Yeah, the pick could turn out to be a bust or just a mid-tier LT. The WR's look great at the combine but Sam needs time to throw and the WR's need time to run their routes.

"3) We don't know where we will pick yet next year, and no idea what LT will be top picks either. "

I'm optimistic that the Jets will improve their record next year and true franchise LT's always go early.

[varjet]

The way I see it the top 2 potential LTs could be gone when the Jets pick in the First Round, and the next tier will be gone when they pick in the Second Round.

Thus, trading up could make sense.  

[New York Mick]

2 minutes ago, Lith said:

If we trade 11 (1,250) and 79 (195) to move up to 8 (1,400).  We still have a 2nd round pick.

Yea. I misread it. 
Why would they give up a third to move up three spots? There’s a lot of talent in the third round. They could land a WR, OG, OC, RB etc. There’s too much value to give it away. 

[JTJet]

55 minutes ago, RobR said:

I'm holding you to this.

Lol I will have a signed document notarized in the morning. 

[T0mShane]

I think your professional GM with a background in scouting OL should be able to find you a decent OL at pick 11 and beyond. If you have to trade up to find an OL, you probably just need a better GM. 

[Greensleeves]

3 hours ago, SR24 said:

Normally I’d agree but with how many teams need an OT ahead of us, and with how terrible our Oline is I’d make the move to secure a quality LT. With how deep this draft is at WR we could easily select 2 WRs with our 2nd and remaining 3rd. 

 

2 hours ago, Lith said:

Ask me this question again after FA. 

As of now, the tackles on our roster are Chuma Edoga, Conor McDermott and Benjamin Braden.  10 starts between them in their careers.  8 of them by Edoga.  If we signficantly upgrade the position in FA, then no way do I want to pay the price to move up from 11.  But if we whiff in FA, we may have little option but to move up.

I agree - and if we do miss out on OT in free agency, it's tough to think another inexperienced Tackle or Guard is going to help out of the gate - it's another guy with NFL experience. We need some experience guys to help the young guys along.

[Lith]

23 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

Yea. I misread it. 
Why would they give up a third to move up three spots? There’s a lot of talent in the third round. They could land a WR, OG, OC, RB etc. There’s too much value to give it away. 

Desperation for a tackle.  I am not saying they should.  Just pointing out the price to do so.

[RobR]

5 minutes ago, Lith said:

Desperation for a tackle.  I am not saying they should.  Just pointing out the price to do so.

Another angle to look at this is would you rather have a Nate Solder and Jordan Jenkins or Jonathon Ogden? If we have to give up a third rounder so we don't have to draft Josh Jones and end up with Wirfs, Becton, or Thomas I'm making that trade every single day.

[SR24]

46 minutes ago, New York Mick said:

What spot are they trading up to?

I’m my scenario we’d be moving up to 9 with Jax. My fear is that 3 OTs are gonna go and I’ll be damned if I let that little dweeb in Cleveland get the last OT the pick before us I also think ARI goes CeeDee Lamb

[Lith]

5 minutes ago, RobR said:

Another angle to look at this is would you rather have a Nate Solder and Jordan Jenkins or Jonathon Ogden? If we have to give up a third rounder so we don't have to draft Josh Jones and end up with Wirfs, Becton, or Thomas I'm making that trade every single day.

I get it.  It is a risky move and if JD does it, he better be right.  Did not work out so well when the Bills traded up for Sammy Watkins when they could have stayed where they were and taken OBJ.  Without giving up the picks.

I would also like to have that 2nd 3rd rounder heading into day 2 if there is an opportunity to move up for a tier 1 WR.

[RobR]

Just now, Lith said:

I get it.  It is a risky move and if JD does it, he better be right.  Did not work out so well when the Bills traded up for Sammy Watkins when they could have stayed where they were and taken OBJ.  Without giving up the picks.

I would also like to have that 2nd 3rd rounder heading into day 2 if there is an opportunity to move up for a tier 1 WR.

I think it all comes down to how the draft fleshes out. If there is a run on the OT's and JD is hell bent on getting a top one you trade up. If other positions get scooped up early you stay at 11 and make the pick without giving up any other assets. 

[PepPep]

2 hours ago, JTJet said:

3 QBs, 1EDGE, 1CB are locks in the top 10

It would be hard to imagine Brown and Simmons falling out of the top 10. I also think theres a good chance someone pulls the trigger on Jeudy or Lamb in the top 10. There's def. more scenarios than not that will have one of the top 4 OTs be there at 11 for the Jets. 

Honestly, I think there are still enough teams to shy away from Becton that he falls to the Jets and ends up being the pick at 11, whether Jet fans like that or not. Wills, Thomas and Wirfs will be off the board.  

[Lith]

11 minutes ago, RobR said:

I think it all comes down to how the draft fleshes out. If there is a run on the OT's and JD is hell bent on getting a top one you trade up. If other positions get scooped up early you stay at 11 and make the pick without giving up any other assets. 

Agreed.  It also depends on what JD has done in FA.  If he has added a couple of OL, incluidng a starting OT, and feels that we can get by with a more developmental prospect, then maybe you either take WR at 11, or potentially trade back.  I could definitely see someone wanting to get in front of the Raiders if only one of Lamb/Jeudy is left on the board.

[RobR]

1 minute ago, Lith said:

Agreed.  It also depends on what JD has done in FA.  If he has added a couple of OL, incluidng a starting OT, and feels that we can get by with a more developmental prospect, then maybe you either take WR at 11, or potentially trade back.  I could definitely see someone wanting to get in front of the Raiders if only one of Lamb/Jeudy is left on the board.

I wouldn't mind taking a WR and then coming back with a Peart in the second. He has all of the skills, athleticism, and length, he just needs to get stronger especially in his lower body.

[ljr]

appreciate the responses for & against.

some good variations on what some are ok with & some aren't

_____

in my hypothetical:

whatever we did in FA didn't answer left tackle for the next decade

my "for instance" had 4 blue-chip with the drop being at 5th best OT ... but the drop could easily be between different #'s ... my thought was if Joe D felt only 1 blue-chip left with Jacksonville on clock at 9 ... (Cleveland def wants to go OT at pick 10) ... and he makes the trade up, can we go with it?

again hypothetically ... there is nothing offered in a trade down scenario that Joe could possibly accept.

_____

the draft charts I looked at had our 4th being "fair" value for the move from 11 to 9 ... so that was what I used as the default compensation needed

interesting to see those of us who felt "definitely no", and  those of us who felt "yes, but at such & such cost only"

(obviously the value of the picks going up make it more & more difficult for any of us to be "ok" with)

_____

trading up is the last thing any of us would possibly want to see us do ... however if a couple of those blue-chip OT names did start coming off the board (please God don't let that happen) I am in the "yes, but at such & such cost only" category.

Even if the compensation needed goes beyond what I can accept I want to see the "semi-reach" OT instead of the top WR

JMO

 

 

[slimjasi]

2 hours ago, SR24 said:

I’m not advocating we trade up as I think someone will be there OT for us at 11 but I wouldn’t be mad if Joe D moves up to get his guy if the run starts. We’re in a good spot to add a solid player at 11 just hope it’s an OT, we really need NYG to take Simmons and ARI to take Lamb/Jeudy

Sure, but we would be better off taking Lamb or Jeudy at 11 instead of trading up for an OL and losing a 3rd round pick (and change). 

[varjet]

1 hour ago, SR24 said:

I’m my scenario we’d be moving up to 9 with Jax. My fear is that 3 OTs are gonna go and I’ll be damned if I let that little dweeb in Cleveland get the last OT the pick before us I also think ARI goes CeeDee Lamb

Arizona just paid for a LT.  They will take Murray's receiver.  They can get a T in the second round.

Brown dropped out of the Top 10.  Nobody wants another Quinnen . 

[GREENBEAN]

6 hours ago, Beerfish said:

That great 7th win is what is making us have this discussion.  Not to mention the huge gap between our 1st and 2nd rounder because we won that 7th game.

 

We had this same conversation last year at #3. It had to do with being able to trade down but we still did this.   It doesn't matter where we sit. We will freak out about it and wish we were 1 pick or whatever higher. Our guy is gonna go 1 pick before us!!!! 

Don't you know the BP in the entire draft is gonna fall right in our laps as he always does anyway?  

 

[GREENBEAN]

1 hour ago, SR24 said:

I’m my scenario we’d be moving up to 9 with Jax. My fear is that 3 OTs are gonna go and I’ll be damned if I let that little dweeb in Cleveland get the last OT the pick before us I also think ARI goes CeeDee Lamb

I really think Zona paying their left tackle for 3 more years indicates that they don't want to use their top pick on o line, or at least left tackle, this year. Not when Murray's college buddy is sitting there to be plucked. See Dee lamb is going to be there at 9 and they want him. That's really good news for us. 

The only concern I have with their move is that Wirfs is a RT and they may want to grab him to stay there.  But I still think they go WR and lamb is the pick. 

[GREENBEAN]

1 hour ago, Lith said:

I get it.  It is a risky move and if JD does it, he better be right.  Did not work out so well when the Bills traded up for Sammy Watkins when they could have stayed where they were and taken OBJ.  Without giving up the picks.

I would also like to have that 2nd 3rd rounder heading into day 2 if there is an opportunity to move up for a tier 1 WR.

You're making entirely too much sense this year man.    You're on fire! 

I honestly think we are going to see quite a few guys that we thought would be sure fire 1st rdr's slip into the second and beyond. Just like last year with Greedy Williams, Cody Ford, Greg little and DK Metcalf among others. It would be nice to have the ammo to move up there after taking one of the top 5 left tackles on the board. 

I'm totally fine with Wills, Wirfs, Thomas, Becton or Jones at 11. Stay put and take one of them. Then get to work in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. 

[SR24]

4 minutes ago, GREENBEAN said:

I really think Zona paying their left tackle for 3 more years indicates that they don't want to use their top pick on o line, or at least left tackle, this year. Not when Murray's college buddy is sitting there to be plucked. See Dee lamb is going to be there at 9 and they want him. That's really good news for us. 

The only concern I have with their move is that Wirfs is a RT and they may want to grab him to stay there.  But I still think they go WR and lamb is the pick. 

True but with how deep OT is idk if they’ll pass on a premium OT if someone like Thomas/Becton are there especially with how deep WR is. It’s more likely they take CeeDee but this time last year Darnold was basically a lock at #1 and we all know how that went down 

[GREENBEAN]

7 minutes ago, SR24 said:

True but with how deep OT is idk if they’ll pass on a premium OT if someone like Thomas/Becton are there especially with how deep WR is. It’s more likely they take CeeDee but this time last year Darnold was basically a lock at #1 and we all know how that went down 

Two years ago but I get the point.   No one saw Mayfield going 1st overall man. 

 KK was saying all the right things about Rosen at this time last year, but everyone knew what he was going to do. Draft Murray at #1 overall.  I think it's not that hard to read them at the moment. Murray's guy is there. He's a dynamic playmaker and fits a need with Fitz on his last season. They signed their left tackle to a 3 year extension at $15 mil per. That's not hold the fort money.  That's premium starter money.  Signing him at that rate and then using the #9 overall pick on the same position is a poor allocation of resources. They would be smarter to take Niang in the second if they wanted to have a good guy developing behind DJ Humphries. 

I'd be surprised if they took one of the left tackles, but if they do it will be Wirfs. 

[GREENBEAN]

1 hour ago, slimjasi said:

Sure, but we would be better off taking Lamb or Jeudy at 11 instead of trading up for an OL and losing a 3rd round pick (and change). 

I agree with this.  The truth is Tega-Wanogho will be a good T in this league too and can be had in the 2nd. If you feel that the T's worth #11 are gone,  you take the blue chip WR there and grab Prince Tega-Wanogho in the 2nd. 

But if JD loves Wills, Wirfs or Thomas and they are there at 9 with the Browns at 10 I can understand pulling the trigger to jump them. 

I would just hope it's Justin Jefferson over Jeudy or lamb but that's just me. 

[Wonderboy]

14 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Jets:

Have another out of the playoffs by mid season year.

Have to trade up to get a non QB because we won a meaningless game or two at year end.

Yeah, that's the jets.

No to a trade up UNLESS, we trade down 1st then trade back up.

We have too many holes and can't afford to lose any, and any trade up in the 1st is going to cost you.

There’s just no way Becton, Willis, Wirfs, Thomas all go in top 10. One of them will be there. My guess is Willis will be since Thomas and Wirfs have been the top rated for quite some time. Becton is a risk but his upside is just too alluring to resist. That leaves Willis. 

[nycdan]

5 hours ago, Wonderboy said:

There’s just no way Becton, Willis, Wirfs, Thomas all go in top 10. One of them will be there. My guess is Willis will be since Thomas and Wirfs have been the top rated for quite some time. Becton is a risk but his upside is just too alluring to resist. That leaves Willis. 

6 OL taken in the top-11 picks.  So yeah, there is a 'way' it can happen.  This was just 7 years ago.

Sadly, almost all of them were busts, too.

1	Kansas City Chiefs	Eric Fisher	OT	Central Michigan
2	Jacksonville Jaguars	Luke Joeckel	OT	Texas A&M
3	Miami Dolphins	Dion Jordan	DE	Oregon
4	Philadelphia Eagles	Lane Johnson	OT	Oklahoma
5	Detroit Lions	Ezekiel Ansah	DE	Brigham Young
6	Cleveland Browns	Barkevious Mingo	OLB	LSU
7	Arizona Cardinals	Jonathan Cooper	OG	North Carolina
8	St. Louis Rams	Tavon Austin	WR	West Virginia
9	New York Jets	Dee Milliner	CB	Alabama
10	Tennessee Titans	Chance Warmack	OG	Alabama
11	San Diego Chargers	D.J. Fluker	OT	Alabama

[ChuckkieB]

No need at all to trade up. The draft is as deep as it's ever been for OL and WR, and the Jets will be able to get a stud at #11.  The only question I have is what they'll do if 3 or 4 OL are off the board and they have a choice between the 4th or 5th OL or the #1 WR.  I've said it before and I'll say it again - they have to go WR in that scenario. 

[Jethead]

15 hours ago, PepPep said:

It would be hard to imagine Brown and Simmons falling out of the top 10. I also think theres a good chance someone pulls the trigger on Jeudy or Lamb in the top 10. There's def. more scenarios than not that will have one of the top 4 OTs be there at 11 for the Jets. 

Honestly, I think there are still enough teams to shy away from Becton that he falls to the Jets and ends up being the pick at 11, whether Jet fans like that or not. Wills, Thomas and Wirfs will be off the board.  

Agree, and if JD really likes one of the big 3 he should go get him.