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PFF took a dump on our OL rebuilding efforts


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2 hours ago, LIJetsFan said:

...and we should take this guys word for it why?  I'd guess many of the fans who post here understand and know more about what Joe D is up to and what choices he's (correctly for the most part) had to make up to now.  It's nice for this talking head guy to have a job and earn some $ but does he REALLY know any better than anyone else?     

This is the new normal in reporting whether it's News or Sports, you have to be blunt & have no objectivity. Is this guy reporting about anything? Or is he attacking both Joe Douglas, stupid signing & Fant, bad player? Both & do you know why? 

Because it get a rise out of everybody! Works everytime, generates views, and now he's a winner because everyone wants to watch the asshat Brit tells us he's right, Joe Douglas is wrong. 

So, pro Douglas fans respond WTF! SOJFs say, " TOLD YOU SO", The players themselves, " F*ck that little twerp" 

Winner? Little Twerp, his stupid video which really wasn't even correct information regarding Fants contract will be watched by many. 

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2 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I mean, the line was so bad last year that if they can even get to average, which most of the additions are, it’s a start. They had to do something and there is still a whole draft. They didn’t get any of the top tier free agents, but we knew they wouldn’t for the most part. So JD moved to second and third tier guys who are slight upgrades and none of them really broke the bank. It still likely won’t be a good offensive line but it won’t be a terrible one either. 

Do you think they are slight  upgrades? I mean I feel like with the center alone, but all the moves so far I feel like our line in middle of the road. Meaning sam will get more than 1 second to throw  and the run game could actually get some movement now. Relative to last year, I fell like this is huge success. Even though sure not top 10 line but we wont be the worst. And that is right now I fully expect at least two more guys added during the draft. 

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33 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Baldinger is saying the exact opposite. I tend to think he has more credibility than either you OR PFF. 

Baldinger said trevon  westco was an uber beast great player last year.

This line of thinking goes well with the 3 years of "Mike McCaganan is a better judge than you!" comments.

We shall see who is right, I'll stick by my opinion of this player.

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Analytics are good, but they are just one piece of the puzzle.  

And there is performance analytics, which is PFF does, and athletic analytics, which is what Seahawks, etc. do.

The Jets have basically tried to do the opposite of the James Carpenter signing.  There they took a guy who could not block in zone and created a short-term revelation by asking him to block man.

In the case of the Jets signing, they tried to find guys with the athletics and smarts to play in Gase's scheme.  

As much as they like Winters personally, it seems like his profile is the opposite of the OL they are looking for. 

It would not surprise me to see the Jets "reach" for a T at 11-Jones or Cleveland.  I don't know whether Thomas fits their profile.  Wills likely does.

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51 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Baldinger is saying the exact opposite. I tend to think he has more credibility than either you OR PFF. 

I think it's a bit of both.

PFF sucks

At the same time, Fant gave up 8 pressures in the game Baldy is reviewing.

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2 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

Why in the world are these guys more valued than this analyst???

 

Answer they don't know more football.....

So maybe it isn't the Titanic after all in the middle of the Off season!!

 

Thanks for that! Wasn’t Baldinger an OL ?

Going against Garret is no simple task. I did like Fant’s release to get outside and how he kept his balance and feet on some quick powerful moves. Coach him up, put a solid left guard to help protect the inside and line him up on the left side. Draft a LT in the draft, let him sit and learn at RT for a year and compete with Fant for ‘21 season. 
If Fant can excel, you have a dirt cheap LT for 2 more years and a young RT waiting to take over. 

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2 hours ago, Beerfish said:

I do not think Fant was a panic move but I also take issue with having your LT on a prove it deal.  If he does not 'prove it' your QB is on injured reserve.  This guy has to at least be semi serviceable, from what I have seen of him in Seattle he was not serviceable.

There's about a 75% chance they are going to draft a stud LT and Fant will end up competing for the RT position.  It's not the end of the world.

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If you haven’t watched Fant play in a game, your opinion means squat so just keep it to yourself. 
 

Last year he started in 6 games: 

week5: ARI

week6: CLE

week7: BAL

week12: MIN

week13: LAR

week14: CAR

week16: SF

Check out this clip of the Browns game, he starts off weak, then after the first series, looks legit. He HANDLES Myles Garret, and at 4:50 you see him in an outside zone look, (the play doesn’t go his way) but he looks SCARY good. At 3:50 you see impressive pass sets. 

I’m not going to pretend that I spent more than 10 minutes looking at clips, but I CAN tell that that is 10 minutes more than a lot of the poo-poo’ers around here. 

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2 hours ago, Lurker89 said:

Its a 1 year deal with team options for two years, if JDs gamble pays off he got a starting tackle at $10M a year for three years. . .. if the gamble doesn't pay off he cuts bait after one year. 

I don't like the deal because Fant is all potential, completely unproven but this is JD shooting his shot, it's his shot to shoot. I would have rather given the same deal to Beachum. I like (don't love) Beachum, obviously JD feels differently.

Acting like he gave Fant $30M guaranteed makes you look.... How you look.

It’s tough to take that kind of shot for $10mm...but more importantly banking on him being your starting LT.

If he ends up being the 57th ranked LT in the NFL again Sam may not get through the season.

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3 hours ago, Skeet Ulrich said:

Seahawks OL was horrible last year, barely better than the Jets... and Fant couldn't start for them.

The Jets give him 30M and he's good because.... reasons.

 

He's really only been healthy for 3 years and came in with almost no football experience.  He's got 24 starts under his belt.  I wouldn't put too much into he couldn't start for them.  Clearly he was plugged in as the starting LT in 2017 before he blew out his knee.  When that happened Seattle traded for LT Duane Brown which took Fant out of that roll when he came back healthy in 2018.  24 Starts for an undrafted FA in 3 years is pretty decent for NFL OL.  

I'm going to trust Douglas on this one and say PFF analytics are backwards looking on a very small sample size on an OL that was rarely healthy.

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14 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

It’s tough to take that kind of shot for $10mm...but more importantly banking on him being your starting LT.

If he ends up being the 57th ranked LT in the NFL again Sam may not get through the season.

Agreed, why not just give the same deal to Beachum. 10 mil per with team friendly options for the next two years. I would have been happy with that.

Hoping for the best expecting the worst. Only time will tell.

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3 hours ago, Skeet Ulrich said:

Seahawks OL was horrible last year, barely better than the Jets... and Fant couldn't start for them.

Ryan Kalil started at C for the Jets. Jonatthan Harrison was better and didn't start. So, kinda NOT a persuasive argument.

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48 minutes ago, 32EBoozer said:

Thanks for that! Wasn’t Baldinger an OL ?

Going against Garret is no simple task. I did like Fant’s release to get outside and how he kept his balance and feet on some quick powerful moves. Coach him up, put a solid left guard to help protect the inside and line him up on the left side. Draft a LT in the draft, let him sit and learn at RT for a year and compete with Fant for ‘21 season. 
If Fant can excel, you have a dirt cheap LT for 2 more years and a young RT waiting to take over. 

Thank you!!

But according to some of the geniuses out here we shouldn't ever listen to Baldinger because not every pick or analysis of his worked out!!

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56 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said:

If you haven’t watched Fant play in a game, your opinion means squat so just keep it to yourself. 
 

Last year he started in 6 games: 

week5: ARI

week6: CLE

week7: BAL

week12: MIN

week13: LAR

week14: CAR

week16: SF

Check out this clip of the Browns game, he starts off weak, then after the first series, looks legit. He HANDLES Myles Garret, and at 4:50 you see him in an outside zone look, (the play doesn’t go his way) but he looks SCARY good. At 3:50 you see impressive pass sets. 

I’m not going to pretend that I spent more than 10 minutes looking at clips, but I CAN tell that that is 10 minutes more than a lot of the poo-poo’ers around here. 

1 correction.

He started 4 games at OT. 2 of his starts were as a blocking TE.

 

 

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a few things

* Fant is the LT...   there will be no experimenting at RT, no matter how mant JetNation people keep saying it, imo.

* PFF analysts vs. NFL scouts...    WHO are the NFL scouts? Have tHEY ever played football? Its not exact, but you get the idea...   you still get guys making judgements on players....   but WE have no idea what their fotball acumen is, what they are calling a block win or loss really looks like

* Joe D said something about getting his grading system in place, training the scouts up on HIS system...

* The moves made at OL are a product of the scouting and Joe D himself saying we grade the guys we are signing as upgrades on what we have...   we are selecting them to form a UNIT, we know what we expect from each part of that UNIT. 

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remember?

Douglas laid out a mission statement for them to follow and the core traits the Jets want in players overall, then specifically for each position. Douglas’ philosophy is a blend of different influences in his career. Ozzie Newsome’s Ravens, where he scouted for 15 years, is the biggest influence. But he also brought some Eagles with him from his time there, some Saints from working with Bears GM Ryan Pace, who was in New Orleans for years, and some Broncos from his time with former Denver coach John Fox in Chicago. There is also some Colts influence from Hogan after two years in Indianapolis.

In August, the scouting department did some mock scouting exercises to get used to the new philosophy and grading system. It gave the scouts a jump-start on the process that hit full stride this past week.

https://nypost.com/2020/01/25/joe-douglas-effect-is-palatable-as-jets-overhaul-gets-underway/

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27 minutes ago, Charlie Brown said:

Thank you!!

But according to some of the geniuses out here we shouldn't ever listen to Baldinger because not every pick or analysis of his worked out!!

No, the reason you shouldn't take any of Baldys Breakdowns seriously is because he only talks about the positive and hypes up every single player he does a breakdown on. He could watch tape and the guy would be lousy for 20 snaps in a row and then have one good one. Guess which one is going to be the Baldy Breakdown? He's even worse than PFF because at the very least they judge without bias.

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2 hours ago, Jetster said:

This is the new normal in reporting whether it's News or Sports, you have to be blunt & have no objectivity. Is this guy reporting about anything? Or is he attacking both Joe Douglas, stupid signing & Fant, bad player? Both & do you know why? 

Because it get a rise out of everybody! Works everytime, generates views, and now he's a winner because everyone wants to watch the asshat Brit tells us he's right, Joe Douglas is wrong. 

So, pro Douglas fans respond WTF! SOJFs say, " TOLD YOU SO", The players themselves, " F*ck that little twerp" 

Winner? Little Twerp, his stupid video which really wasn't even correct information regarding Fants contract will be watched by many. 

Yes & no. There are plenty like me who usually take all media evaulations with grains of salt. And don't read nor watch them at all ... unless they're positive lol.

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2 hours ago, Maxman said:

No idea who that guy talking is but I have two rules for life:

1. Never fight a Marine

2. Don't take offensive line advice from a guy who weighs less than 150 pounds

3. And lives in his grandma's basement, with a Pornhub subscription.

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13 minutes ago, RobR said:

No, the reason you shouldn't take any of Baldys Breakdowns seriously is because he only talks about the positive and hypes up every single player he does a breakdown on. He could watch tape and the guy would be lousy for 20 snaps in a row and then have one good one. Guess which one is going to be the Baldy Breakdown? He's even worse than PFF because at the very least they judge without bias.

2 seasons ago he said “this Jets OL is doing stuff that playoff o-lines aren’t even doing” our OL was awful.

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I believe Joe D is doing exactly what’s been NEEDED here for a long time. These guys are not stars but as a unit.. working together you do not need all stars.. let’s see this unit whoever it is because the competition in training camp will be intense everyone fighting for a spot. With incredible chips on their shoulders listening to all these media outlets. Just protect our franchise QB. Open up some holes. And be on the same page. And we’ll be ok. With that said I’m still drafting the best tackle available at 11... while we’re at it just give our # 11. 3 years 30 mill and call it a day


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

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57 minutes ago, Biggs said:

He's really only been healthy for 3 years and came in with almost no football experience.  He's got 24 starts under his belt.  I wouldn't put too much into he couldn't start for them.  Clearly he was plugged in as the starting LT in 2017 before he blew out his knee.  When that happened Seattle traded for LT Duane Brown which took Fant out of that roll when he came back healthy in 2018.  24 Starts for an undrafted FA in 3 years is pretty decent for NFL OL.  

I'm going to trust Douglas on this one and say PFF analytics are backwards looking on a very small sample size on an OL that was rarely healthy.

 

This from Seattle newspaper earlier this year. 
 

Offensive lineman George Fant: A valuable player both as a spot starter and regular in his eligible tackle role. It seems Seattle would want him back, and Pete Carroll said Monday that maintaining continuity on the offensive line is a goal for this offseason. But Fant said Monday he also wants to have a legit shot at winning a starting job as a left tackle, which probably won’t happen with Duane Brown around.

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6 minutes ago, 32EBoozer said:

 

This from Seattle newspaper earlier this year. 
 

Offensive lineman George Fant: A valuable player both as a spot starter and regular in his eligible tackle role. It seems Seattle would want him back, and Pete Carroll said Monday that maintaining continuity on the offensive line is a goal for this offseason. But Fant said Monday he also wants to have a legit shot at winning a starting job as a left tackle, which probably won’t happen with Duane Brown around.

Raw physical talent who could easily have been cut out of the league in his first training camp sticks, wins the starting LT job at the end of his first year.  Blows out a knee in training camp and they trade for a starting LT.  Seems like we are getting a guy who has good physical talent, went through a lot to get a shot to start and will make the most of it.  I like the move.  If he doesn't work out as the starting LT he will still play and be productive.  If he does win the job it's a home run.  

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22 minutes ago, Jets0712 said:

I believe Joe D is doing exactly what’s been NEEDED here for a long time. These guys are not stars but as a unit.. working together you do not need all stars.. let’s see this unit whoever it is because the competition in training camp will be intense everyone fighting for a spot. With incredible chips on their shoulders listening to all these media outlets. Just protect our franchise QB. Open up some holes. And be on the same page. And we’ll be ok. With that said I’m still drafting the best tackle available at 11... while we’re at it just give our # 11. 3 years 30 mill and call it a day


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

the amount of plainly broken assigments in the first half of last year was ghastly...

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4 minutes ago, pdxgreen said:

PFF can go ___ itself.  They low rate us in every way.  I don't expect that to change. 

Absolutely.  It’s popular to bash the Jets so that’s all it’s about.  Look nobody is saying the oline is great but Douglas has done a solid job so far concentrating on the line.  There is still time in FA and we have the draft 

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