Untouchable Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, choon328 said: Bad teams don't pay Strong Safeties $17 million when they have a young QB and holes all over the offense. And Superstars get traded all of the time. Usually to teams who think that player can put their team over the top. The Jets are not close to being in that situation. We just saw arguably the best WR in football, in his prime, get traded along with a 4th round pick in exchange for a 2nd round pick and a broken down David Johnson... And fans act like the Jets would be nuts to accept anything less than multiple 1st round picks for a mouthy SS who generates 2 turnovers a year? If a team like Dallas offers #17 and a 3rd, then Douglas needs to take that sh*t and run. 5 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 5 hours ago, jgb said: Trade Jamal Argument: "Trade him because the Jets record has been bad with him in the lineup (no impact)." All you have to do to retort is ask this follow-up question: "How do you feel about Darnold? The Likely Response: "Darnold is a stud held back by his poor team." Then you smile and say, "Oh, I see." And walk away. I'm not sold on Darnold at all. It's not mutually exclusive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 4 hours ago, Viermoo said: So to you he’s just another safety? He doesn’t make the defense better as a whole? Not enough to call him a "transformative defensive force". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 36 minutes ago, choon328 said: Bad teams don't pay Strong Safeties $17 million when they have a young QB and holes all over the offense. And Superstars get traded all of the time. Usually to teams who think that player can put their team over the top. The Jets are not close to being in that situation. Now that's a different, better argument! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 42 minutes ago, T0mShane said: I agree. One player doesn’t make the difference in team stats, so why would trading one player cause our points-allowed to skyrocket? Should dump Darnold for picks, then. In fact, should completely refresh your roster every year! Cut busts, trade contributors for picks. At one point in the future we'll have a draft with 30 picks and then we can finally have some stars on our team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 31 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: I'm not sold on Darnold at all. It's not mutually exclusive. I didn't actually mean what I wrote. It was all a ruse to get you on the record about Darnold. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, jgb said: I didn't actually mean what I wrote. It was all a ruse to get you on the record about Darnold. @14 in Green supports this. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 6 minutes ago, jgb said: Should dump Darnold for picks, then. In fact, should completely refresh your roster every year! Cut busts, trade contributors for picks. At one point in the future we'll have a draft with 30 picks and then we can finally have some stars on our team. QB's impact the game. SS's do not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post slats Posted April 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted April 20, 2020 6 minutes ago, jgb said: Should dump Darnold for picks, then. In fact, should completely refresh your roster every year! Cut busts, trade contributors for picks. At once point in the future we'll have a draft with 30 picks and then we can finally have some stars on our team. Ah, the good ol' false equivalency! 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 40 minutes ago, Untouchable said: We just saw arguably the best WR in football, in his prime, get traded Two years in a row. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 10 minutes ago, jgb said: Should dump Darnold for picks, then. In fact, should completely refresh your roster every year! Cut busts, trade contributors for picks. At one point in the future we'll have a draft with 30 picks and then we can finally have some stars on our team. Flimsy, pal. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 10 minutes ago, slats said: Ah, the good ol' false equivalency! Shane's absurd argument called for an equally absurd retort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 7 minutes ago, T0mShane said: Flimsy, pal. Flimsy argument doesn't call for my best effort. Try harder if you want to dance with the pros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: QB's impact the game. SS's do not. An SS who gets to All Pro level on a bad team is a lot more impressive than a QB who looks bad on a bad team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BettyBoop Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Oh for Pete's sake (Pete who?) just trade Adams already so the Chief Bloviating Officer(s) can finally shut up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 53 minutes ago, Untouchable said: We just saw arguably the best WR in football, in his prime, get traded along with a 4th round pick in exchange for a 2nd round pick and a broken down David Johnson... And fans act like the Jets would be nuts to accept anything less than multiple 1st round picks for a mouthy SS who generates 2 turnovers a year? If a team like Dallas offers #17 and a 3rd, then Douglas needs to take that sh*t and run. "Adams doesn't impact the game or help a team win." "We should be able to get two firsts and a 3rd rounder for him." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 4 minutes ago, jgb said: Shane's absurd argument called for an equally absurd retort. That was your argument repeated back to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 minute ago, jgb said: An SS who gets to All Pro level on a bad team is a lot more impressive than a QB who looks bad on a bad team. The former is a luxury. Many, many Super Bowl participants have gotten there with a mediocre SS. Everybody needs a capable QB. If Darnold is indeed not the answer, we'll still need to invest heavy draft capital on the next one. We can replace Jamal with a mid/late round pick and/or a street free agent and be just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, jgb said: "Adams doesn't impact the game or help a team win." "We should be able to get two firsts and a 3rd rounder for him." I'd take a 2nd rounder for Adams if the alternative is paying him. The hope is there's a team dumb enough to cough up a 1st rounder and then some, but its not a requirement for me to make the deal. Option B is letting him walk when he hits free agency and taking the comp pick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, T0mShane said: That was your argument repeated back to you. Imitation is the sincerest form of drunkeness. The Shane I know would go for the juglar, not reflect a perceived weak argument back at its source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, Jetsfan80 said: I'd take a 2nd rounder for Adams if the alternative is paying him. Option B is letting him walk when he hits free agency and taking the comp pick. 2nd -- you are the ultimate Adams bear on the board. I don't think anyone else would take that little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 minute ago, jgb said: 2nd -- you are the ultimate Adams bear on the board. I don't think anyone else would take that little If JD holds firm and doesn't trade him, I'll take Option B too. In no scenario should the Jets pay Adams $15M+ per season, let alone $17M+. If JD does the latter, he isn't the guy at GM, and there's no real point in investing emotionally in this team for the forseeable future. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: The former is a luxury. Many, many Super Bowl participants have gotten there with a mediocre SS. Everybody needs a capable QB. If Darnold is indeed not the answer, we'll still need to invest heavy draft capital on the next one. We can replace Jamal with a mid/late round pick and/or a street free agent and be just fine. There are 100 roads to a championship, 95 start with a top 25% QB. But all 100 roads require good players in other positions. Many combinations possible. Right now Jets have about 3.5 top 25% players. Again, my position is not "don't trade Jamal." It's "trade Jamal for the equivalent in players [preferably OL]." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, jgb said: Imitation is the sincerest form of drunkeness. The Shane I know would go for the juglar, not reflect a perceived weak argument back at its source. The Shane you know isn’t taking the bait on Darnold v Adams, hoss. You know better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, jgb said: There are 100 roads to a championship, 95 start with a top 25% QB. But all 100 roads require good players in other positions. Many combinations possible. Right now Jets have about 3.5 top 25% players. Again, my position is not "don't trade Jamal." It's "trade Jamal for the equivalent in players [preferably OL]." You under-value draft picks. We need a lot more good players, and picks are the best route to that. I don't care that you don't trust JD. He's here for the long haul whether you like it or not, and the next GM to come after him will undoubtedly be worse, because the Johnson's will be fully responsible for the hire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, T0mShane said: The Shane you know isn’t taking the bait on Darnold v Adams, hoss. You know better. Should've waited until another drink or two, then I would've gotcha! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 9 minutes ago, jgb said: An SS who gets to All Pro level on a bad team is a lot more impressive than a QB who looks bad on a bad team. Adams is a very good football player, but an even better self-promoter. I'll take the inflated value in a trade. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, Jetsfan80 said: You under-value draft picks. We need a lot more good players, and picks are the best route to that. I don't care that you don't trust JD. He's here for the long haul whether you like it or not, and the next GM to come after him will undoubtedly be worse, because the Johnson's will be fully responsible for the hire. I'm a Jets fan. What exactly do you expect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, slats said: Adams is a very good football player, but an even better self-promoter. I'll take the inflated value in a trade. But he's a non-impact player who doesn't affect the game. What exactly is inflated value? Jets are gonna disappointed in the trade market for Jamal. I was devastated when Macc drafted him. The number of FA safeties that off season was ridiculous. Eric Berry and Honey Badger to name but two. All the reasons we don't want to pay him "$17 mill" or whatever, is the same reason no one is giving up the picks we want for him. 80's mention of a second rounder might be what is comes down too. I can only imagine the day after on here! For a 2nd rounder, I prefer JD roll the dice and squeeze as much Adams as possible out of his rookie contract. If he sits out, you can probably still get a 2nd for him. What is the rush? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, jgb said: But he's a non-impact player who doesn't affect the game. What exactly is inflated value? Jets are gonna disappointed in the trade market for Jamal. I was devastated when Macc drafted him. The number of FA safeties that off season was ridiculous. Eric Berry and Honey Badger to name but two. All the reasons we don't want to pay him "$17 mill" or whatever, is the same reason no one is giving up the picks we want for him. I don't know what the discussions sound like. I don't know what anyone's offering. Rumor at the trade deadline was Dallas' #1+, and that works for me. The fact that Jamal is from the area and would like to return is probably a little extra for Jerry Jones, who would love to bring this self-made star home. A first rounder. Maybe a third? Although, I'm with you in preferring a veteran starting caliber OL from the 'boys there. Plus $10M in cap space next year (estimated 5th year option), and $15M or more after that? That's a lot for a strong safety. In this draft, that's probably going either OT/WR or WR/OT in the first round, and that has the potential to be huge for the Jets pathetic offense. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, slats said: I don't know what the discussions sound like. I don't know what anyone's offering. Rumor at the trade deadline was Dallas' #1+, and that works for me. The fact that Jamal is from the area and would like to return is probably a little extra for Jerry Jones, who would love to bring this self-made star home. A first rounder. Maybe a third? Although, I'm with you in preferring a veteran starting caliber OL from the 'boys there. Plus $10M in cap space next year (estimated 5th year option), and $15M or more after that? That's a lot for a strong safety. In this draft, that's probably going either OT/WR or WR/OT in the first round, and that has the potential to be huge for the Jets pathetic offense. If there rumors are true, I'd love to understand JD's reasoning for rejecting it. He's unlikely to get offered more, so unless something changes with his opinion, it may still not be enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomebodytoAnybody47 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Jamal for Yannick, let’s just do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, jgb said: I'm a Jets fan. What exactly do you expect? I expect you to look at them more objectively since that's not how the league operates, and there's a new GM in house, and we have no choice but to trust that he'll make smart picks. Not worry about it so much that you're willing to sacrifice draft capital for "proven talent" that costs a lot and might not play hard here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Jamal’s Instagram right now. Good luck, Douglas. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, jgb said: If there rumors are true, I'd love to understand JD's reasoning for rejecting it. He's unlikely to get offered more, so unless something changes with his opinion, it may still not be enough. Jones’ offer ended up being a first rounder and Anthony Brown, and that first rounder looked like it was going to be in the high twenties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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